For the main article, go here.
For the main WMG page, go here.
- And you'll have to buy both versions and trade between the two to get them all, like in Pokemon, to get the same full final roster in both games.
- Like stages they will be divided between characters from console games (only unlockable on Wii U) and characters from handheld games (only unlockable on 3DS)
- Note all characters revealed so far have been on both consoles and handhelds except for Wii Fit Trainer and Olimar who both only have screenshots from the Wii U version of the game.
- Possibly jossed, if this article is correct. Sakurai wants the "roster experience" to be the same for both versions, so platform-exclusive characters, unlockable or not, are, at best, unlikely. Then again, they could do what Namco did with Soulcalibur IV and have characters exclusive to one version be DLC for the other.
- Officially jossed with the August 21st update seemingly addressing this speculation specifically
- On the other hand, it is technically true that the unlockable characters are different between games... but only because several characters who are unlockable on 3DS are available from the start on Wii U.
- Jossed, in that Greninja was planned for the game from before X and Y coming out
- Double-Jossed, Mewtwo's going to be DLC.
- Because thanks to certain games like the recent Kid Icarus game, Nintendo is becoming more open to voice acting.
- Namco will be involved in the production and Namco often has no problem whatsoever in using voice acting in their games.
- Jossed. There won't be a story mode.
- Super Smash Bros. vs. Capcom.
- This troper feels Smash Bros. VS Dissidia is more likely, given how many people from Square helped out on Brawl.
- Or by extension, Smash Bros. vs Square Enix, containing characters from Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Chrono Trigger, Kingdom Hearts, Xenogears, etc.
- And no-one has even mentioned the fact that Square Enix made the first Mario RPG (before Paper Mario), aptly called Super Mario RPG.
- (Not the op) I was thinking something more like just adding characters that were once on a Nintendo system. This way they can still keep the Nintendo theme, but have more characters. For example: Sora, Leon, Laharl, and Phoenix Wright could all qualify. Hypothetically, of course.
- And Bomberman. Don't forget Bomberman. Or Mega Man, for that matter.
- Street Fighter IV producer Yoshinori Ono wants to pitch a Nintendo X Capcom to Masahiro Sakurai. If there's any time something like this is going to happen, it's now.
- This means that when he saw the Negative Zone, he probably mutterred, "Too Late."
- Or it may be about Raiden, who had to endure similar abuse from AI Colonel.
- Marx from Kirby Super Star has to be in there somewhere. He's got his moves.
- Don't forget Demise.
- Solid Snake appears in Super Smash Bros. Brawl. He previously appeared in another Massive Multiplayer Crossover Fighting Game, DreamMix TV World Fighters, which, among others, featured Optimus Prime and Megatron of Transformers, who were featured in their own Marvel comic book, where they met Spider-Man and Marvel-owned characters like Circuit Breaker. Marvel, of course, has had crossovers with DC (and thus bringing in Mortal Kombat and a bunch of others), Doctor Who, Star Trek and more. It also means that, by way of Marvel vs. Capcom and others, almost all Capcom characters are brought in, as well as The King of Fighters (itself a crossover!) and numerous Tatsunoku anime characters. Capcom also had the crossover with many Namco games in Namco × Capcom, which included characters from Soulcalibur so we can also bring in the Guest Fighter from God of War, Star Wars, and Image Comics. The two main leads of Namco x Capcom originally appeared in Super Robot Wars, opening the door to just about every mecha anime ever made. Image, of course, had the reputation for the horrific Deathmate crossover, which drags Valiant Comics (the only name most people will recognize from there is Turok). Also, since we have established Marvel and DC are part of this mess, we can bring in their parent companies Disney and Warner Brothers. Warner Brothers brings with it Cartoon Network originals and Disney brings Disney Animated Canon and Kingdom Hearts. Naturally, Kingdom Hearts brings along Final Fantasy as well. If you wanted to go even further, you could connect this universe to the Expanded Wold Newton Universe. So, in short, SSB is the lynchpin of one of the biggest crossovers by implication ever.
- Mind = Blown
- If you like that, you'll love this: Fighter Roar appears in Super Robot Wars: Original Generations. He first appeared in another Banpresto, a game called The Great Battle IV, which featured Ultraman and Kamen Rider characters, which brings in those franchises. Kamen Rider Decade crossed over with Samurai Sentai Shinkenger, which brings in Super Sentai! And, if you fudge it a bit, you can also slide in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, due to a crossover between Power Rangers in Space and The Next Mutation. It's also not mentioned above, but, naturally, thanks to Brawl, Sonic the Hedgehog and pals are also included, and any crossovers they may have had. And don't forget Another Century's Episode, Dengeki Gakuen RPG: Cross of Venus, Shin Mazinger, and Jump Super Stars! YEAH GUYS THIS SHIT JUST GOT REAL.
- If Star Trek is in, the entire Tommy Westphall universe is in. Smash just entered the snowglobe.
- OK that was epic, but how do you know all that?
- We probably don't. It's all speculation and implication. Regardless, I'll add more to the list. If Disney AND Warner Brothers are implicated, then Who Framed Roger Rabbit brings in nearly every well-known classic cartoon ever made, save for Hanna-Barbera. Backtracking to the source, Banjo-Kazooie and Conker's Bad Fur Day are brought in via Rare's former work on Diddy Kong Racing and Donkey Kong Country. And according to The Other Wiki, Sabrina the Teenage Witch had a crossover with Sonic in the Archie Comics. I couldn't find any links to Nickelodeon, Bandai (Pokemon vs. Digimon, anyone?), or anything extremely popular that hasn't been mentioned yet.
- Going by the Disney/Warner Bros. route, we have Cartoon All-Stars to the Rescue (although this is dubious at best), which brings (not counting the well-known characters mentioned above) Garfield, The Smurfs, the 1987 Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (and, by TMNT Forever, the 2003 series and the original comics), Muppet Babies, ALF, Alvin and the Chipmunks and The Real Ghostbusters into the mix. Going by the company logic, Nickelodeon is brought in by TMNT's presence as present owner. And if we stretch it, Harry Potter is brought in by the film series being produced by WB. Any bets that we'll run into something like Warhammer 40,000 sooner or later if we keep finding links?
- A-hem. (doesn't include anything from these suggestions... yet.)
- And updated.
- Nickelodeon can also be connected because of Adventure Time, The Fairly OddParents!, and Fanboy and Chum Chum, because the same company (Fredorator Studios) made them. (And Adventure Time is on Cartoon Network, thus the connection!) Also, the entry up there about Who Framed Roger Rabbit, forgot that Hanna-Barbera is owned by Warner Bros., so they're in the connection too. (Quick Draw McGraw with his El Kabong persona would be a good idea for a new character) Newspaper Comic characters would also be in the connection because of Garfield, as mentioned above, who references Peanuts, which is referenced by pretty much every other comic strip in existence, and there you have it, Nickelodeon, Hanna-Barbera, and comic strips are now in the connection.
- But here's the coolest part. Transformers once crossed over with G.I. Joe. G.I. Joe has featured one Sgt. Slaughter as a character. Now, as we all know, Sgt. Slaughter is a real-life pro wrestler, therefore bringing WWE in. But what makes this really cool is that WWE is supposed to take place in the real life world. Therefore, that brings in... THE ENTIRE POPULATION OF EARTH!!!!!!!
- Reinforcing this connection to Earth is Little Mac, who went up against Mike Tyson in Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!
- In addition, Mega Man being in the SSB4 gives a more solid link to all Capcom VS games.
- Sonic now being in the new Lego game directly connects a large number of other series, including Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Back to the Future, DC Comics, Midway Arcade, Ninjago, Portal, Scooby-Doo, The Simpsons, The Wizard of Oz, 2001: A Space Odyssee, The Flintstones, The Jetsons, The A-Team, Adventure Time, Beetlejuice, E.T. the Extraterrestrial, The Goonies, Gremlins, Knight Rider, Mission: Impossible, The Powerpuff Girls, and potentially more.
- Portal takes place in the same universe as Half-Life and Team Fortress, The Simpsons has crossed over with Family Guy and Futurama, and had a couch gag involving Rick and Morty.
- Adventure Time and Powerpuff Girls provide connections to many more Cartoon Network shows - in particular, this troper recalls a crossover episode between Steven Universe and Uncle Grandpa where Uncle Grandpa had a list of characters to visit which included characters from Adventure Time and Powerpuff Girls in addition to Dexter's Laboratory, Ed Edd n Eddy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, The Life and Times of Juniper Lee, SWAT Kats, The Marvelous Misadventures of Flapjack, Clarence, and of course Steven Universe which is the show the crossover took place on.
- I'd like to see someone make a coherent timeline of when all of these games and other shit take place.
The people of the Smashverse wanted entertainment, so their leader (Master Hand) observed other worlds and made copies of their greatest heroes. The thing is, these copies cannot be killed, only turned into trophies. And they have an irresistable urge to fight each other, which explains why characters who were friends in their original 'verse are now beating the crap out of each other.
Anyway, these characters fight in front of crowds, which is why we hear spectator noises throughout the fights, and why there's an announcer.
- This would also explain why Kirby can use some of his powers without eating beasties (am i the only person who dislikes this?), master hand found that those were the powers he used most often
- Eh, sorry to burst your bubble, but this isn't your idea. This is the REAL PLOT.
- The "they're all trophies and not the real ones," yes. The "Master Hand copied them from the real ones" isn't confirmed either way.
So you wanna know what Master Hand is? Here ya go.
In 64, Master Hand pulls toys (the fighters) out of a toybox and makes them fight in a diorama on his desk. Given the description in Melee and Brawl of Master Hand, I believe this to be symbolic of a gamer playing the character in a fictional world.
Melee: Trophy #159: "The Master Hand awaits anyone who survives the long difficult road to the Final Destination. This symbolic link between the real world and the imaginary battlefields of Super Smash Bros. Melee is quite a handful in battle..."
Brawl: "A being tied to the link between this world, where trophies fight, and the world beyond. The meaning of his existence is unknown, as are his goals, but he seems to have obtained (and kept hidden) a power that borders on absolute..."
In Subspace Emissary, Tabuu uses Master Hand as his puppet. Master Hand is described as the link between two worlds, in other words, the game world and ours. Master Hand is the synergy between player and character given form in Smash Bros, which is why Tabuu uses him to reach into all the different worlds of Nintendo.
Everyone else is Emir.
Specially Mr. Game and Watch.
- Then who's Jeane?
- Snake's not dead.
- Maybe he's talking about Big Boss? The Snake in Brawl is seemingly a Composite Character, anyway...
- Snake dies at the end of Guns of the Patriots due to old age. But if he didn't die in battle, what the deuce is he doing in Valhalla?!?
- Speaking as a practitioner of Hinduism, I'm not too keen on this WMG, because that would mean I kicked the crap out of the god I worship...
- Welcome to Klingon nirvana, then.
- How is having no limit of what you can do a bad thing? Just look at LittleBigPlanet.
- Even LittleBigPlanet has its limits. You only get to make platformer type levels, and all your creations must be 3 layers or less. and you have to use the textures that they give you.
- LittleBigPlanet 2 blows a few of those out the window, though.
- Even if what you can do is unlimited (or at least has very large boundaries), people tend to just stick to a few things that work. This is kinda why Scribblenauts got average reviews, despite all the hype. Also, if the game is truly unlimited and has no boundaries, you tend to get sucked into the Quicksand Box.
- Even LittleBigPlanet has its limits. You only get to make platformer type levels, and all your creations must be 3 layers or less. and you have to use the textures that they give you.
- To paraphrase the almighty Pantsman: one always ends up having too much fun screwing around in that vast world they give you, and subsequently getting distracted from any sort of goal and ending up bored.
- Half of this one is confirmed - the trophy for Master Hand calls him the embodiment of creation. Crazy Hand is the embodiment of destruction, though.
- I have been saying this since the original SSB. I love you.
- Alternatively, Sonic was in the Subspace because he was the weakest from his games being awful. Hence, he had to bide his time before making his strike.
- Alternatively alternatively, it was a gambit by Dr. Eggman. After realising the nature of his world (i.e. one that exists based on the popularity of the Sonic games), he realises that the Sonic world is slipping into Subspace, aka video game hell (see the theory further down about Subspace being the place where various genres go once they die), and thus decides that, if he cannot prevent the slide into Subspace, he can at least rule it! Thus, he unleashes Chaos again, who, after his defeat in Sonic Adventure, is far easier to control, but is in far greater control over its powers. After being given the Chaos Emeralds to consume, Dr. Eggman renames it Tabuu, which is just a pseudonym to prevent Sonic from stopping him. The Subspace Army, the Subspace Bombs, and the army of R.O.B's were all created by Dr. Eggman, with the Ancient Magister being the one true R.O.B, who Dr. Eggman based all the copies on after being beaten into submission by Tabuu. The reason we don't see or fight Eggman after Tabuu/Perfect Chaos' defeat is because Sonic's hand in defeating Tabuu/Perfect Chaos is the other half of Eggman's Evil Plan: by appearing in an already successful series, he has brought some good publicity back onto the Sonic series, the proof being the lack of apprehension around Sonic Unleashed, despite the whole werewolf thing. Put simply, Eggman's plan was two pronged: had Tabuu/Perfect Chaos succeeded in pulling the Nintendo universe into Subspace, Eggman can rule with Tabuu/Perfect Chaos as his proxy, whereas if Sonic intervened and helped defeat Tabuu/Perfect Chaos, then the Sonic series gets a second chance at restoring its former glory and pulling it back from the brink of Subspace. Just. As. Planned.
- This sounds more plausible when you remember the tickens, who let a small bird fly away when defeated. Now, who used to lock these poor little animals into machines?
- Yet another alternately is that Tabuu kidnapped/stole the real Sonic about a half decade ago and replaced him with a fake that was intentionally meant to be inferior. The Smash characters gave Sonic enough time to break free from Tabuu's prison and escape.
- OR, Sonic was caught in the Subspace Battleship's shot and pulled into Subspace, where he spent the time the others were getting through the Great Maze trying to find the one responsible for what happened.
- Alternatively alternatively, it was a gambit by Dr. Eggman. After realising the nature of his world (i.e. one that exists based on the popularity of the Sonic games), he realises that the Sonic world is slipping into Subspace, aka video game hell (see the theory further down about Subspace being the place where various genres go once they die), and thus decides that, if he cannot prevent the slide into Subspace, he can at least rule it! Thus, he unleashes Chaos again, who, after his defeat in Sonic Adventure, is far easier to control, but is in far greater control over its powers. After being given the Chaos Emeralds to consume, Dr. Eggman renames it Tabuu, which is just a pseudonym to prevent Sonic from stopping him. The Subspace Army, the Subspace Bombs, and the army of R.O.B's were all created by Dr. Eggman, with the Ancient Magister being the one true R.O.B, who Dr. Eggman based all the copies on after being beaten into submission by Tabuu. The reason we don't see or fight Eggman after Tabuu/Perfect Chaos' defeat is because Sonic's hand in defeating Tabuu/Perfect Chaos is the other half of Eggman's Evil Plan: by appearing in an already successful series, he has brought some good publicity back onto the Sonic series, the proof being the lack of apprehension around Sonic Unleashed, despite the whole werewolf thing. Put simply, Eggman's plan was two pronged: had Tabuu/Perfect Chaos succeeded in pulling the Nintendo universe into Subspace, Eggman can rule with Tabuu/Perfect Chaos as his proxy, whereas if Sonic intervened and helped defeat Tabuu/Perfect Chaos, then the Sonic series gets a second chance at restoring its former glory and pulling it back from the brink of Subspace. Just. As. Planned.
- I always thought it was so he could finally prove that, as a Sega character, he does what Nintendon't.
- The Smash Bros Universe is the heaven Sonic went to when Mephiles killed him in 2006. Sonic 2006 and Brawl occur simultaneously, which is why he doesn't show up until the end, after he's dead in 2006.
- Tabuu is, of course, not a part of the simulation, but a computer program that hacked its way in and is trying to kill Snake with Your Mind Makes It Real, so that he can take Snake's body. He has to kill all the others because they were rewritten by Dedede's badge programs to be firewalls to Snake.
- Or, the Snake in SSE is the real Snake, and the Metal Gear games are just a fictional account of his life story. Hell, let's just assume that ALL the characters in Smash are the 'real' ones.
- Snake's in-game Codec calls seem to contradict this, often specifically referring to events and characters of Metal Gear.
- Likewise troper-canon.
- Jossed. By Word of God, G&W has no sense of right or wrong, so that basically puts him as neutral. Heartless are evil.
- Possibly it was a mistranslation. Or even a purposeful mistranslation as a reference to old games, such as the phrases "Shine Get!" or "I, Garland, will knock you all down!"
- I always figured that it was a reference to the "Minus World" glitch in Mario 1.
- I'd say Whoa Zone. See below.
- I doubt it, the Negative Zone is nothing like Minus World.
- Which would explain why his Final Smash◊ looks so much like the Whoa Zone◊.
- Jossed for Waluigi becoming playable, but confirmed for Luigi having a different Final Smash. Waluigi is still an Assist Trophy and Luigi has the Poltergust as his Final Smash.
- Not to mention it can wall jump — something that Pichu could do, but Melee's Pikachu couldn't.
- Correction: Pikachu could in Melee. Many stories are made up (possibly) because everyone hated Pichu... yet missed him in Brawl.
- Alas, Poor Scrappy.
- Every character could walljump, if you ukemi'd off the wall. But IIRC Pikachu wasn't capable of walljumping normally.
- Perhaps the Pikachu from Melee evolved into Raichu, justifying the need for a replacement Pikachu.
- Various problems — Pichu evolves via happiness. Everyone hated Pichu. Second, Light Balls and Volt Tackle didn't exist in the second generation (or at least Volt Tackle didn't). Pichu couldn't have gotten it anyway, originating from those games.
- OBJECTION! NOT everyone!
- He evolved in between the games with his original trainer, after the attack came out.
- Correction: Pikachu could in Melee. Many stories are made up (possibly) because everyone hated Pichu... yet missed him in Brawl.
- Maybe this can provide some insight?
- I propose a similar theory. The Pikachu has been the same throughout all 4 games, but the Pichu is Pikachu's younger form, similar to the relationship between Link and Young Link.
- Yes, this is probably true.
- I don't have personal experience with this, but doesn't Bowser's trophy shatter in Melee after defeating Giga Bowser?
- Yes, Bowser does disintegrate when defeated, but not only is the Bowser faced in Adventure Mode significantly larger and stronger than the controllable Bowser, but the latter couldn't transform into Giga Bowser until Brawl. Hence, the Bowser faced in Adventure Mode is a different trophy entirely, most likely part of an identical set (which explains how it can be destroyed by all the Melee characters and still be around).
- Yeah that's always bothered me. But the problem with that is Captain Falcon was also tiny. Why would that Captain be a different one than what we use to fight?
- That's because Captain Falcon is a trophy which is about the size of the real Olimar.
Even though the announcer is a different guy in each game, the Master Hand is still voiced by that guy.
- Let's extend it even farther; in the first game, the characters are plushes. In Melee, they are trophies. Why? The Master Hand's friend, the Crazy Hand, brought over a bunch of character trophies from the second series of Nintendo's "Smash Bros." toy line, the successor to the Master Hand's collection of plush dolls. The friend is a bit more destructive (and thus perhaps younger) than the Master Hand, and, of course, left-handed. Their playtime depicted in Melee convinces the Master Hand to start collecting them, but he was unable to find the out-of-print Mewtwo, Roy, Pichu, Young Link, and Dr. Mario trophies in time for Brawl. The Crazy Hand comes back over to play during Classic and Boss Battles, but his absence in SSE means he wasn't playing over that day.
- And the ungloved hand in Melee's opening? Notice how it's the left hand, and how it throws the Mario trophy rather haphazardly. That hand is the Crazy Hand, before Tabuu comes in and tells him that, in their house, they have a rule that you have to wear gloves when playing with toys so you don't hurt yourself. Tabuu is really overprotective.
- Or Master Hand wants to make sure that his stuff doesn't get messed up, or Crazy Hand liked the Gloves and somehow got some (Or might have borrowed them).
- The Fighting Polygon team from the first game is made out of Play-Doh. Metal Mario is a figurine, the first one of the trophy toy line that he collected (probbably as a birthday present from the Crazy Hand).
- The characters which must be "unlocked" are either "lost" (for example, Ness in Brawl) by MH or "new" (as in the case of MK, Sonic, etc.). The "areas" merely represent the aforementioned "playsets." The subspace bombs and "arrow-shootin' guns" in Brawl may represent putting them away in boxes to simplify clean-up. As for the Ancient Minister and Dr. Mario, Mario and R.O.B. just came in regular and "collector's edition" versions.
- Here's an extension of this idea based on the extended description of the SSE storyline given here. All of the events of SSE are because the kid's family is moving to a new house and Tabuu aka the father (since the official website describes Tabuu as male) is forcing the kid to pack up the trophies and playsets — depending on the age of the kid, he may think this is packing them up forever. Paraphrasing from the website, Tabuu is stuck in Subspace and wants to cut up the world the heroes live in: the father has no imagination of the kid's fantasy world, and he wants to reduce it to the discrete inanimate objects. Chains of light force the Master Hand to do Tabuu's bidding, i.e. the father is forcing the kid to pack his toys away. The Master Hand in turn has bad guy characters like Ganon and Bowser do his bidding, i.e. the kid doesn't want to put them away, so he imagines that the bad guys do the work. The circular shockwaves Tabuu emits that KO characters instantly are the father yelling at his kid — doing so snaps the kid back into the real world and the trophies, without his control, fall to the ground lifeless. King Dedede's plan to restore some of the heroes is the kid fighting back against the perceived aggression by taking steps to ensure that not all of them end up in Subspace/the boxes. So instead he puts badges on them, aka slips a few into his pocket so he can play with them later. Tabuu reconstructs elements of the heroes' world into a maze — the father puts the playsets haphazardly into a box. At the end, the heroes win when they get to their new house and the kid sets it all up again. All the parts of the world are restored, except the Isle of the Ancients, which is destroyed because that playset is lost or broken during the move.
- So pretty much the SSBB Subspace Emissary is the Nintendo version of the Toy Story series? That means all the crazy events that the video game character trophies/toys experience is actually the plot line the child imagines as he's packing the toys and moving to a new place. (Akin to the first Toy Story movie, yes?)
- Or perhaps it's the Nintendo version of The LEGO Movie.
Many years later, the elder son had become a film director, and remembering his childhood, he managed to convince the copyright holders of the trophies and the characters to let him direct a movie based on his memories of the toys, although he had forgotten some from the second set and also added some of the video game characters he played in his phase. The movie wasn't selling too well, so he let another person take care of the game adaption, that worked much better. This would explain why SSE includes at least some emotions in the cutscenes, why Master Hand's voice is different in each game — first they joked around with the brother's voice, then Dad's, and finally a professional voice actor's, and the absence of some Melee characters.
- It's also possible that Dedede hired not only Snake, but also Fox, Falco, Captain Falcon, and Samus. Fox and Falco were assigned to try to destroy the guns on the Halberd before boarding it and meet up with Snake to retake it with him. Falco was falling behind a bit because he had to go and get the Great Fox. Captain Falcon and Samus were teamed up on the Isle of Ancients. From there, the two split up and Samus found the Research Facility while Falcon met Olimar, DK, and Diddy.
- I think this is just to make the graphics logical. And allow a sound effect. Frankly, PK Starstorm is appropriate considering the importance of aliens.
- I would have killed to have Ness use PK Rockin', though (since that's the first Don't Care name, much like Ness is).
- The trophies mentioned that they learned it from the person they know who knows PK Starstorm (Poo and Kumatora, respectively.)
Here are my reasons that Cloud was orignially in Brawl:
1. In Brawl, Ike fights alot like you'd expect Cloud to, with slow but powerful attacks, and a BFS.2. Do you see many Ike fans around here? Neither do I.3. Compare Cloud's Omnislash to Ike's Great Aether and tell me you don't see a resemblance.
- The problem with this theory, though, is Cloud is pretty much the biggest anti-Nintendo Final Fantasy character ever. Final Fantasy VII was the first FF not released on a Nintendo console, and putting him in Brawl would just be a bit of a mockery really of why they left. Now stick in one of the Final Fantasy VI cast, and you have yourself a brilliant, deserving-of-their-place third-party FF character. And there are a lot of Ike fans out there.
- Personally, I would've loved FFII/IV's Rydia to be playable; Being a summoner, it would've made for some epic final smashes :)
- Ike, like Roy before him, was included as a representative for the most recent Fire Emblem game. It's the same reasoning that replaced Mewtwo with Lucario.
- Plus, if you've played the game, you realize just how badass Ike is. Badass enough for Smash Bros.
- Not many Ike fans? I beg to differ. I'm totally gay for Ike. Okay, maybe I'm a little extreme, but aside from being in the most recent game, Ike is also, on his own, one of the more popular lords of Fire Emblem. I couldn't give you any sources offhand, but I've heard that Ike has come behind only Marth and Sigurd in Japanese popularity polls.
- Same here! Ike's awesome! Better than Marth, at least.
- On another random unrelated note, Ike's Great Aether is more similar to Squall's Lion Heart, if you ask me.
- From the start, all that had been declared was that the characters would've been on Nintendo consoles. 'sides, Ike was pretty much one of the first brought out. If they were trying to secure the rights to Cloud, they wouldn't've promoted him as early as they had.
- As Cloud is now a playable character in Smash 4, this WMG can be considered a moot point.
He looks like some kind of high-tech... thing, when the Isle of Ancients is destroyed it turns into a very Xboxy-looking X, and his most annoying move involves Red Rings of Death.
- I wold like to move that subspace is the embodiment of games and genres becoming forgotten in the "Current Gen," the place where games are forgotten by all ether by means of time or by the newer game being horrid (Hence why Sonic was in subspace). For example, the Stadium geting Subspaced at the start represents the genre of 2D fighters dying out. It would also explain Jigglypuff, Wolf, and Toon Link being trapped in Subspace (their doors don't appear until Tabuu is destroyed), as Jigglypuff is from the first generation of Pokemon games and then 1 of 493 Monsters to think about, Wolf debuted on the N64, which isn't well received, and Toon Link started in Wind Waker, a game vilified for its art style in the shadow of the Spaceworld 2001 tech demo.
- Sonic survived in subspace because people still remember how good the original Sonic Trilogy, CD, Chaotix, the handhelds, and the adventure games were, and he was waiting for the right moment to strike against Tabuu. Sonic and the Secret Rings, Sonic Rush, and (to a lesser extent) Sonic Rivals gave him the means to fight back, just as he was about to Red Ring everyone a second time.
- Also notice Samus starts off rather weak, and then makes a very explosive and badass comeback during the story. It seems to illustrate the period after Super Metroid until the release of Metroid Prime.
- It could stand for reason, then, that Tabuu might actually be the embodiment of the Video Game Market Crash of 83. He stands for the flood of shovelware that was released and the poor quality games of famous franchises (ET and Pac-Man) and is the spirit of all the quality games that should have been and yet were not ether because people overestimated technology, rushed the game though development, or were never able to develop them due to market conditions.
- Tabuu, cursed to eternally be the embodiment of "what ifs" and "never-nevers," wishes to subject the Smash Brothers world (The embodiment of Nintendo (And Konami and Sega by proxy)) to the horror and despair of the Video Game industry's follies and have the world and its inhabitants consumed into subspace (The video game equivalent of hell, not Super Paper Mario's Underwhere, just so we're clear on that) so it may force all to wallow in its eternal damnation in some sort of sick, condemned, entertainment.
- So, yes, Tabuu is more or less the Video Game equivalent of the Anti-Spirals.
- So if Tabuu is the Anti-Spiral, who's Kamina?
- Captain Falcon!
- Also, Lucas is Simon, Pikachu is Boota (or at least his descendant considering the Pokemon WMG page), Samus is Yoko, and either Master Hand or Ganondorf is Lord Genome
- Furthermore, Peach is Nia, Rossiu is the Ancient Minister who wants to save as many of his people as possible and later realizes the error of his ways, and Bowser is Guame.
- Also, Link is Viral.
- Actually, I think Dedede's Viral. Link might be Kittan.
- Obviously, this means that Tabuu has enacted his subspace plan before (specifically, in 1983). That time, he succeeded in destroying the world. The only survivors of the previous subspace cataclysm were the Pac-family, Frogger, and Pitfall Harry (quick, name a pre-1983 video game character besides those). Pitfall Harry and Frogger both passed on during the PS1 era due to their horrible revival games, but the Pacs are still out there... somewhere. (As shown when Pac became a smasher)
- No, Frogger made an appearance on the Nintendo GameCube. Haven't heard of him after that, though.
- He was around as late as the late Wii era, and Pitfall Harry also survived to that point. Tabuu may have finally gotten them during his last Subspace attack.
- The Pong Paddle.
- #$%^ Qbert, Mother@$%#s!
- What about Evil Otto and the little man with the invincble neck in Berzerk?
- Well, a lot of them didn’t have any new games after that, though, despite being well-remembered. Something akin to The Land of the Remembered is a thing, a paradisiacal afterlife for well-remembered but dead franchises and characters, which can potentially be attacked by the likes of Galleem. It is the new home of series like Frogger. This also explains why Sherrif, for example, is only an ancient sprite; he’s a ghost firing shots from the afterlife, due to his minimal legacy at Nintendo outside of this series. If he was still alive, he would still be a 3D model like everyone else. There may or may not be a Land of the Forgotten as well… or is that Subspace?
- How can you forget Taizo Hori from Dig Dug?
- Also, among the playable characters, Mr. Game and Watch first showed up in 1980, and Donkey Kong debuted in 1981 (along with proto-Mario "Jumpman").
- On reflection, the pre-Crash world is likely the "real world" Mario and Luigi originally hailed from (after all, the original Mario Bros. was from the 2600 era). So they, too, would be survivors of the Great Crash.
- This also explains the ancient R.O.B. civilization, since they saved the world from Tabuu's first attempt.
- Pacman is imprisoned as an exhibit in the Namco Mueseum. (Got freed by the time of Smash 4)
- It is interesting to note that the first Smashers to be targeted by Tabuu were survivors of the Great Crash. Mr. Game and Watch was captured before the game started, Mario was involved in the Halberd's attack on Midair Stadium, and Bowser sent his entire army after Donkey Kong before doing anything else. Dedede probably took Luigi first to keep the last survivor out of Tabuu's hands.
- Tabuu, cursed to eternally be the embodiment of "what ifs" and "never-nevers," wishes to subject the Smash Brothers world (The embodiment of Nintendo (And Konami and Sega by proxy)) to the horror and despair of the Video Game industry's follies and have the world and its inhabitants consumed into subspace (The video game equivalent of hell, not Super Paper Mario's Underwhere, just so we're clear on that) so it may force all to wallow in its eternal damnation in some sort of sick, condemned, entertainment.
- Let me drive this even further. Mario and Kirby were the two first characters, which makes sense since these seemed to be some of the most popular characters around. Zelda and Peach are equally powerful due to their series's popularity. Peach getting captured by Wario (this way makes more sense) signifies Wario getting more popular than Mario, and is also why Mario seems helpless a lot of the time later on. Yoshi was a new series and slowly gaining popularity, which might be why he's shown waking up the first time you see him. Kirby has about the same amount of strength the whole way through. Dedede is revealed pretty early on, which makes sense since he was the first final boss of the Kirby series. And as even MORE "proof", Olimar is quite weak and scared when he first arrives, because at that point in the Nintendo timeline he was a new character. Captain Falcon, on the other hand, was part of a popular racing game series, which is why he's so powerful, plus his Falcon Punch made him permanently famous. Especially with the Metroid Prime area, since about that point, new F-Zero games started getting released on newer consoles. And if you thought that was impressive, Sonic appearing near the end (and quite powerful at that point as well) symbolizes that he could survive in Subspace as mentioned earlier, and also that Nintendo expects the newer sonic games to be a lot better. I am good at this.
- Or, Tabuu is the embodiment of Atari, Intellivision, Sega, and all those dead companies' resentment for Nintendo's amazing survival ability. The reason Sonic shows up is because Sonic games are now on Nintendo platforms, and so Sega's main character wants to help Nintendo, too.
- So, how do Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations fit into this. Will Sonic become a Game-Breaker? Will he bring a friend to the Brawl?
- Hmm, does this all mean that Galeem and Darhkon also represent something? Maybe Galeem, with his bright and angelic exterior hiding the fact he turns everything in sight into Spirits, even franchises in the afterlife, is the embodiment of the worst aspects of mobile gaming, while Dharkon is the embodiment of bloated, faceless Western game corporations that chronically kill their developers and bury franchises under oodles of copyright entanglements? Both have become bigger threats to Nintendo than the Xbox has, which is why they were able to defeat Tabuu, plus why some Microsoft characters even fight alongside the Nintendo ones. If Tabuu embodies dead companies, it would explain why Terry showed up to help.
- Well, duh, everyone knows that!
- She has the balls. He has the box.
- But C. Falcon has one thing Snake doesn't have...
- They have to be the OTP. They're both too hot for anybody else to handle.
- Everyone knows C. Falcon and Snake are gay together. Sure it's gay, but it's AWESOME gay.
- Can you say... "threesome"?
- Well, this brings a whole new meaning to "show me your moves."
- She has the balls. He has the box.
- Personally, this Troper has seen WAY more Pikachu/Samus fanart. And, to be perfectly honest, they DO get more screen-time together and form a powerful connection....
- You're all wrong! It's Samus X Kirby! That was the reason she arrived on dreamland in KD 3!
- Oh you're so imaginative! No one has thought of that pairing before!
The explanation for all of this is simple. The R.O.B. who plays the part of the Ancient Minister is the only R.O.B. who is also a trophy.
How did he come to be this way? I'm not sure. A couple of wild guesses:
- The Ancient Minister has more advanced AI - clearly the other R.O.B.s do have some AI, but perhaps they're more on the level of dogs or something. With sapience comes trophyness.
- The Ancient Minister is the robotic version of Pinocchio. Somewhere along the line, a Great Fairy turned him into a Real Trophy.
- The Ancient Minister is a R.O.B. from Gyromite, and like all the other video game characters in the game, is also a trophy. The others are actual R.O.B.s, upgraded in capacity and apparent intelligence, but still ultimately nothing more than circuits and plastic.
- You mean Shadow Bugs. It's my personal belief that Shadow Bugs are EVERYTHING in Subspace, consdering Tabuu has an unlimited supply.
- This troper believes that all ROBs used to be trophies, but the newer ROBs were built using subspace tools, so they leave no trophies. Maybe there's a big stash of old ROB trophies somewhere in subspace.
- That would explain why some of them are friggin' unkillable in cutscenes.
- Alternatively, if we use the "kid playing with his toys" story, the kid uses his R.O.B. trophy/ies as the army of mooks the heroes need to fight before taking on the "real bad guys." He's imagining it in different colours (or has a couple R.O.B.s in different colours) and keeps putting it on the table to fight the good guys until he gets tired of it and decides to make R.O.B. become one of the good guys.
All this leads up to Knuckles coming back from his vacation and finding a very shiny piece of air where his life's mission used to be. Again.
- Whether you're comparing the Isle of the Ancients against the Floating Island as seen in Sonic & Knuckles or the version in Sonic Adventure, the Isle looks nothing like the Island beyond both being flying rocks. They're completely different shapes.
- At the most I'm betting it'd just be a Shout-Out, sadly.
- I like to think it is at least an equivalent of Angel Island. Maybe in the next game Sonic will visit the island and find the hidden Master Emerald or something.
- Completely different shapes? Really? Compare the Isle of the Ancients, shown here◊, and Angel Island, shown here◊. Now, Angel Island has a few more mountains than the Isle of Ancients, but that's what happens when Robotnik burns and-or takes over your hometown on a regular basis.
- "A few more mountains" is a pretty huge understatement. Angel Island's got a lot more altitude to it. And if you compare it to the Sonic Adventure version, which has a much, MUCH larger 'underside', they look even less alike.
- At the most I'm betting it'd just be a Shout-Out, sadly.
- It's probably Sonic the Hedgehog (Archie Comics)'s Angel Island. All the labs are abandoned ancient Echidna technology, or Dark Legion bases. Nobody uses them, and they were sealed away. Until Dr. Eggman got hired by Ganondorf to conquer Angel Island. He then roboticised all the Echidnas turning them into ROB's, and Knuckles became the Ancient Minister. Then ordered them to bring out all the technology they had. And as soon as Eggman finished taking complete control, Ganondorf betrayed him. And he's never heard from for the rest of the game.
Now, I'm going to randomly switch to talking about Kirby. As far as I know, Kirby has never left his universe, known as Dream Land. (Or Popstar, or whatever planet he's on, but damn it I'm calling the universe Dream Land.) Obviously, this is because he is in the world of dreams. It stands to reason (well, no, it actually doesn't. At all. Let's just say it is.) that, if he were to appear outside of Dream Land, he would not appear as the pink puffball form he's known very well for.
Now, in Super Mario RPG, the Star Road was broken and and its pieces were scattered all over the Mushroom Kingdom. Kirby, the appointed guardian of peoples' dreams — peoples' wishes — realizes he has to go down and help recover them, but he can't take his original form outside of Dream Land (for some random, arbitrary reason that I haven't figured out yet. Someone help me out here.). So he sends his spirit down to inhabit — you guessed it — the body of a powerful-looking wooden puppet that shoots bullets out of his elbows.
Thus, Kirby is Geno, and Geno has been in Super Smash Bros. all along. Take That!.
- Have you considered the possibility that Kirby is a dream and dreams basically can't exist outside Dream Land? I mean, do you see unrealistic things like Kirby in Real Life? Maybe a stretch, but...
- Does that make Kirby Tidus? Would maybe explain why he never drowns...
- Question- why would Kirby degrade himself by becoming something as lame and overhyped / overrated as Geno?
- Because he's a baby.
- Also, isn't the reason Geno calls himself Geno that his actual name is unpronounceable in Mario's language?
- Have you tried pronouncing the name "kirby" in Italian? (Seriously, though, there's probably a fantasy language in play here.)
Also, it is through Miyamoto's power that Sonic et al. became real, because most non-Nintendo video games are fake. (Snake is the exception, his exploits — which happened in OUR world — were covered up.)
- And thus, Tabuu is exposed as an Angel, given that his AT field stops Master Hand.
- This troper will extend it further, the Master Hand is a boy named Nicholas who has an uptight family, he enjoys Nintendo, and usually plays it. He comes across a Genki Girl named Tara (aka. Crazy Hand) who loves videogames in general, but has a soft spot for Nintendo. They get together and play with the figurines they collect. One day, Nicholas' father (aka. Taboo) locks them away in a chest. Tara picks the lock with her Sonic doll, and... okay, can someone write this?
- I thought of another thing! The Ancient Minister is Nicholas' mother, and the subspace bomb are a bag that she throws the toys in. Taboo binding Master Hand was symbolic of Nick's dad grounding him, and the Dedede Brooches were strings that Tara tied to the toys to be able to pull their three favorite figurines out. However, the Peach/Zelda figurines' string broke, so she just grabbed whatever and got Dedede. Also, Tara throws the Sonic Doll at Nicholas' father's head, which results in the final battle, where they ensue in a battle of wits!
- Zombie.
- Would that give him the power to throw maggots at fighters?
- I would love to see a pair of zombie hands in the next game as an optional boss, but it makes more sense that they survive or are revived.
- No. He wouldn't come back as a zombie, but as a Darth Vader-esque form you may already know as... the Power Glove. *cue lightning strike*
- Would that give him the power to throw maggots at fighters?
- Alternatley when Tabuu was killed, Crazy Hand stole Tabuu's power and used it to revive Master Hand. Or just touch him lightly to revive him.
- Who says he was even dead at all? He keeps coming back despite being defeated multiple times and even eaten by Kirby over in his games. He's got Joker Immunity.
Reasons for this guess;
There's more than an hour of cutscenes.
What SSB fans WOULDN'T want a Brawl movie?
There are cutscenes deleted from the game.
All you really have to do is add a little gameplay footage in between each cutscene and release it.
Somebody's already thought of doing it.
This post on the Dojo seems rather suspicious.
- And three years later... still nothing.
- This actually makes sense since the Flash pulled the same trick once (in a Justice League episode I believe).
- My take was this: Sonic was not on the map yet when Tabuu's first red-ring attack happened, as evidenced by the fact that he did not get trophicated. He arrives right afterwards, on the furthest outskirts of Smashworld from the giant Subspace portal, and has to start playing catch-up. While we play through the Luigi/Dedede/Ness and Kirby levels in Subspace, Sonic is running closer. While we play through the Great Maze, Sonic is running closer. Being Sonic, and considering that all of the major enemies have been eliminated by everyone else already, he is able to traverse all of Smashworld, Subspace, & the Great Maze in the same amount of time it takes for Team Dedede to wake everyone and all of them to get through the Maze, hence his arrival at Tabuu's chamber at the same time as the rest of the cast. At that point, he's already moving, so then your idea about built speed does make sense, as he is able to cripple Tabuu's wings to weaken the red-rings.
- This was my theory — he needed to take that big of a run up to hit Tabuu that hard. And since there's no Speed Force in Sonic, he didn't have to worry about that.
- With this logic, the reason why characters turn into trophies instead of actually dying is because all the players are too immature to admit defeat.
- Or the characters do die in game, but this system just has an absurdly lenient revive system.
- I just went with the idea that they turned into trophies on purpose for a dramatic entrance.
- Thanks for ruining Zelda for me, asshole.
- Dude, I hope you're joking. It's just a game and this is (probably) a joke theory.
- Plus, Smash Bros has its own canon. Zelda is still... herself in the LOZ canon.
- This would explain why Lucario is the height of the other fighters in Brawl and 4, but only 3' 11" in the main Pokémon Games
- One problem... A player with a zapper is helping them fight as well, as seen in their smash attacks and the Duck Hunt trailer. My theory would be it was all just a game to them, much like the Smash Bros fights themselves.
- On a side note, the character roster would be even bigger yet again.
- Confirmed, they did put a focus on making gameplay competitive friendly with Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. It also has the largest roster, bringing back every past fighter as well as adding plenty of new ones.