Headscratchers / Ever After High

• One character serves multiple purposes if they're not the protagonist of their own story, the way Hunter is supposed to be the Hunter from both Snow White and Red Riding Hood; does that mean the Big Bad Wolf, who's established as being from the Red Riding Hood story, is the same Big Bad Wolf who blew down the Pigs' houses and tried to eat the Seven Kids? He was supposed to die at the end of all three, but now he's a teacher? The last Evil Queen was particularly nasty, hence the sealed-in-a-mirror thing, but apparently most villains just get a slap on the wrist and can do whatever after their role is done. Is this supposed to be part of the whole 'cycle of keeping the stories going' thing, since most people wouldn't pledge to be a villain if they knew they were going to die, or is this just a Suspension of Disbelief thing because, well, it's a toyline meant to sell dolls?
  • The second book reveals that Red Riding Hood used a smoke bomb to save the Big Bad Wolf's life.
  • In the same book, Raven asks the witch from Hansel and Gretel outright why her breaking the rules by building an escape hatch into her oven was tolerated. Essentially, there's a lot of leeway given to villains who are unique in some way, since they have to survive to reproduce; the candy witch wasn't considered to have broken the rules by escaping as long as she did it "off the page" where it wouldn't have an impact on the story. But there's a whole community of wolves in Hood Hollow, so they're treated as expendable.
  • Another possibility is that EAH-verse versions of the stories differ from ours. Even in the real world, there is no 'true' fairytale canon, just generations of authors expanding and influencing each other's interpretations. Maybe Ever has an objective canon to fulfill and that canon happens to be really G-rated. It could say that the Big Bad Wolf was somehow imprisoned instead of killed, or only imply his death.
  • It would make more sense for many stories to be fulfilled without the antagonist dying, seeing as how their children are supposed to carry on their roles for them in the future. Constantly killing off all of the evil people would eventually leave their lines ended, and thus make their entire story impossible to fulfill, not just for them, but for the heroes as well. Unless that's already happened and there are stories that have ceased to be over the years...
  • Badwolf makes a reference to Three Little Pigs in "A Big Bad Secret" and then blows everyone in the hallway at that time but Ramona and Cerise away, so I think that he does fill that role too.
  Professor Badwolf: What's this lollygagging? Move along, or I'll huff, and I'll puff, and I'll blow you to class!

• Cedar Wood's character doesn't seem to mesh particularly well with the franchise. How is she supposed to relive Pinocchio's fate, by attending school? And how does forcing her into the role of a goody-two shoes, by making it impossible for her to lie help?
  • On a similar note Ashlynn seems a little too cheerful when taking in account that her mother's death (which must've either happened already or be about to happen very soon)is an essential part of her story. Does anyone who read the books know more about Cinderella's fate?
    • My biggest question with the "Cinderella" story is how the story can keep going when Cinderella goes from Rags to Riches. She never starts off as a princess; after all, she's supposed to marry into royalty so she never has to deal with her evil stepfamily again. At best, she's usually the daughter of a low-ranked nobleman. Yet, she always marries a prince. Does this mean that the title of "Cinderella" is cursed, so that she may marry a prince, but they are always destined to lose their royal status at some point just so the story of Cinderella can keep repeating? Does Cinderella die in childbirth to ensure she only has the one child? After all, Cinderella isn't supposed to have any blood siblings. And does this death-by-childbirth mean that Cinderella can only have daughters who will one day die the same way?
    • Cinderella's family in most depictions always seems to be somewhat well-off before her father remarries and dies (or whatever happens to make the stepmother Cinderella's primary carer). My guess is his choice to marry a commoner (the stepmother) demotes him to some kind of lower-ranking royalty, like a baron or a lord. Cinderella is therefor not a commoner when she marries the prince so he's allowed to keep his title until he remarries a commoner after her death. I have to guess this is how that cycle works.
    • In the books Ashlynn confirms and acknowledges that her mother will have an untimely death as well as herself in the future. Its not stated if the deaths are from an illness or an accident or if they are the same at all. She tries 'not to think about it'. If the book of legends is indeed a lie then mayhaps Ever After is behind on heridtery illness knowledge
  • The whole point of Pinocchio was that he was a nice, obedient boy who steadily learned how to lie and disobey. If Cedar Wood starts to stray from being a good girl now then her story has lost a gigantic plot point, that it will be the first time she will have ever lied or disobeyed.
  • You also can't just unleash fairy tale characters into their stories without any briefing about what they're supposed to do. There is also the matter of basic education, for one.
  • Cinderella's fate has been extremely ambiguous. The issue is skirted in favour of more present-day problems, i.e. Ashlynn herself.
  • (First troper again) I guess, the mixture of disneyfied and non-disneyfied versions in one universe had me confused. Going by the original book, where Pinocchio was pretty much a douche, who slowly had to learn his lesson, her character doesn't make much sense. But if you take the Disney movie (and pretty much all adaptions that followed) in account, that are about a naive boy that is lead astray, her characterization borders on Fridge Brilliance.

• Cerise's wolf ears leave me with a question. If they're so small, why not use her hair to hide them as well? It would reduce the need for the hood outside of athletic endeavors.
  • It's possible they can't be hidden in her hair very well and be guaranteed to cover them all day. She's also show to be insecure about them, as she's constantly pulling her hood further down over her head whenever she's on camera. The real question is "How does she keep them hidden from her roomie when she's sleeping?"
    • In Thronecoming, Cerise's pajamas has a hood, so maybe all of her clothes have some sort of hood or head covering?
    • Cedar might be in on the secret*, seeing as how she doesn't act surprised when Cerise growls and rips apart a pillow with her teeth in Thronecoming. *(or at least have sort-of figured it out but hasn't made Cerise tell her outright so she can maintain plausible deniability if anyone asks her about it)

• One of the books mentions Tucker, one of Sparrow Hood's friends and the son of Friar Tuck. Aren't friars supposed to be celibate?
  • Answer: Technically yes, but because The Story Must Repeat, presumably he may have one son, to take up his role.
  • He could be a Friar In Name Only, or stopped being a proper Friar after their story was played out.
  • Or perhaps the Friar adopted a son.
  • Or he became a Friar after his spouse died.
  • Or maybe Friars work differently in that world; it's hardly unprecedented for people with the same title to have vastly different roles. Or the church in that universe could have changed the role, which, again, isn't unprecedented.
  • Maybe "Friar" is just his name and not a religious role?

• Red Riding Hood and Wolf seem to have deviated from the original story QUITE A LOT. If theory of headmaster Grimm was to be correct, both Red Riding Hood and Wolf should have disappeared along with their story. Not only both of them are alive and well, they even have a daughter, Cerise. This could be used as an undisputed proof that Raven and the rebels are right - they don't have to suffer a miserable life just Because Destiny Says So, they can ignore the "main script" and do what they feel is right for them, with no terrifying consequences. How come nobody thought of that yet?
  • Well, there's a few things wrong. Short answer, it's a tradition-based universe and deviating from that tradition, even slightly, is very dangerous and can set off a chain reaction down the line that obliterates the land. Long answer? It's not really the same thing. Red and Badwolf wed after the story was finished, not before. No way for them to disappear if they technically fulfilled the requirements of the story, seeing as Badwolf is likely the same Wolf from other stories and never died in those, either. Second, what Red and Badwolf did is seen as sick and wrong by most denizens of the land because the good and pure heroine fell in love with the evil, nasty villain and visa-versa. Most Villains are seen as incapable of real love so the fact that Badwolf loves Red Riding Hood shakes up the status quo, and in this world ruled by traditions, Status Quo Is God. I mean look at how Ashlynn and Hunter were treated for dating, and they're not even from the same story, and Hunter's not even technically a villain in his story (hell, if he's also the one from Little Red Riding Hood, he's the hero). Red and Badwolf are likely seen as committing something like treason against their story, tainting it, by falling in love. There's a reason, after all, why Cerise and her parents keep everything a huge secret. It's possible both Badwolf and Cerise would be hunted and killed for knocking the story slightly off kilter by going against the moral of the original story (Badwolf; if you buy into the "wolf represents the awakening of sexuality and puberty and sex is bad so don't do it or you'll get pregnant and you will die" thing) or for being an abomination (Cerise). It's very likely the Riding Hoods are supposed to wed their Hunstman, the man who rescued them from the big bad sexuality monster thing.
    • So basically, their marriage and love is equivalent to some Real Life same-sex or interracial marriages. Depending on where you live, some people consider those types of relationships a crime or even a sin. And given the kind of traditionalist attitude the Ever After universe holds, it's no wonder why the Hood-Badwolf Family is so careful about their secret.

• If their version of Swan Lake always ends up with the Swan Princess cursed to live out the rest of her days as a swan, which is what Duchess is afraid of, then how does she have a child? Does she turn back after a while and marry someone who was not the prince from her story? The preview of Duchess' book in the novels seems to indicate she was raised by her grandmother...do the princesses only turn back long enough to have a child and then turn back permanently when their child has a child so that they can raise them?
  • Duchess can turn into a swan so perhaps she actually was born as one (it's certainly much more plausible than a human being born from a swan), and perhaps she was conceived by her (then-human) mother and the prince before the curse went into full effect. I get the sense that a scene like that wouldn't have made it into the story itself, particularly seeing as EAH is a children's franchise.

• In C.A. Cupid's diary, she mentions her aunt Aphrodite. Aphrodite (Greek goddess of love and beauty) is generally depicted as the mother of Eros, so going by this that would technically make her Cupid's grandmother, not her aunt...unless the series canonically chose to go by different interpretations of the myths.
  • Maybe since she's adopted she just refers to all the gods and goddesses that are not her dad as "aunt" and "uncle" to avoid confusion.
    • Given how closely related all the Greek Gods are (thanks a lot, Zeus), yeah, it probably would be easier for Cupid to refer to most of them as aunt/uncle.

• If Darling Charming is the White Knight, how did Ginger and the Knight get back and how does the Knight know so much about Wonderland?
  • Perhaps the White Knight has been missing for a while, and Darling's been posing as him for longer than we think. Depending on how long she's been posing as the White Knight, Darling could be very familiar with Wonderland, having had a lot of experience there and being accustomed to its madness (for the most part). And since Darling doesn't live in Wonderland full-time, she clearly knows the way back to Ever After, and was able to lead Ginger back fairly easily.
  • Way Too Wonderland implies Darling can easily slip between the worlds, and spends a lot of time in Wonderland- she knows the denizens very well, she knows the school rules there (and even knows how to use Loophole Abuse), and while not shown explicitly or stated, she clearly didn't arrive via Raven's magic, but made it look like she did to Bunny and Alistair. So it seems she has some powers that let her use Rabbit Holes even when the worlds are sealed.

• Probably a minor point of confusion, but if Rosabella Beauty is so big on animal rights and such, why does she wear fur? Isn't that kind of an animal-rights taboo? I assume it's faux-fur, but it seems there's no canonical indication of that...
  • There's no indication it's not faux, so I think we can assume that it is.
  • It also could just be fur that was shed off (maybe even off her dad, who she states in Epic Winter "is" a beast, not "was" one). This makes a little more sense than faux fur, I think? Faux fur seems to more imply being kind of okay with taking from animals (as it's all a sheet) where reusing fur that was shedded implies more cohabitation? Wearing shed fur is recycling, fitting in with her Granola Girl image.

• How did Cupid acclimate so well to Ever After? I mean we should hear her use the slang from her old school on accident. All we get is a brief shot of her old form, and then she takes to the place like a duck to water.
  • It is possible that since Cupid probably knew where she was going, she might have gotten at least a bit familiarised before going. Like an exchange student from America learning about Australian culture before going there. That, or Milton Grimm filled her in on what not to do.
  • In her basic diary, she does slip up a few times.
  • Perhaps the world's native magic influenced her mind as well as her body.

• So what was step one of the Evil Queen's plan to escape: making Raven sign and inherit her evil powers, having the Storybook of Legends destroyed, or the Wonderland curse being lifted? Or was it all of the above?
  • She was likely playing Xanatos Speed Chess. If the Jester overthrows the Queen and conquers Wonderland, that serves the Queen's purposes. If Raven signs the book- well, the Queen probably didn't plan for that, but it also serves her purposes.
  • I think it was the fact that Raven signed her mom's page before she gave the others the choice to follow or reject their paths. Like Vader this results in her first steps into the role of villain as she's pledge to become the next Evil Queen and a possible weakening of the current Queen's prison. A sort of Deal with the Devil if you will.

• How is the story of The Little Mermaid going to work in this universe? The character names are trademarked, but the title character merely attending the school completely defies the story, where her first experience with humans is during her story. The only way that can work is if they discard that aspect entirely and she's taken to class in a water tank in her mermaid form, or she loses her memories of being human (which begs the question of why bother letting her attend anyway).
  • Perhaps she attends school during her story, when she spends time on land.
    • Were that the case, she'd have no voice. The very first mention we get of the Little Mermaid's daughter, Meeshell Mermaid, is in Melody Piper's diary. They become friends because Melody hears Meeshell singing and they bond over their love of music. Since she does have her voice, perhaps her story hasn't started, and she's waiting to meet a prince on land to trade her legs for or something?
  • In canon, she turns into a mermaid when she touches water. If we're going by Disney logic (I know that it doesn't everyone but just go with it) this IS alluded to in the actual sequel, when Ariel turns back into a mermaid by Triton's tritan. So maybe, this maybe this magic leaking in. Or maybe Ariel (or this version's Little Mermaid) had her when was human and eventually when was older, showed her mermaid side?
  • I have to guess Meeshell starts to miss the human world that she can eventually no longer visit and starts to long for the world above the sea.

• In Cupid's diary, she laments the fact that she doesn't have a 'fated' lover. But there's a rather well-known myth that describes the romance of Cupid And Psyche (goddess of the soul). How does she not know about that?
  • Psyche is *probably* her adopted mother, but she might think the story doesn't apply to her for several reasons: That she's adopted, that she has siblings(and one of them is destined for a Psyche-like story), that she attended MH first or simply that she is from a myth and not a fairy tale proper.
  • Agreed. Cupid outright states that she's not a fairy tale, and she's not a monster, either. She just goes where she's needed. Thus, Cupid doesn't have a story to fulfill, since she's not part of this world.

• Why is it that the school has satellite dishes and internet, yet students must write with quills?
  • Because quills look so much cooler than just a standard pen or pencil would, even if it's not accurate to the period. Besides, the EAH-verse is likely not on the same timeline as we are. It seems like the era this is set in is some combination of the modern age and the Victorian Era (or somewhere around that time. I'm only giving that particular time period because it's when Alice was written... though I think pens were around before 1865, so that's also not a perfect answer.)
  • I'm gonna go with aesthetics. It's a fairytale-themed world, so things like quills and old books are probably going to stick. And if we're going to extend it to a meta-sense, EAH (the franchise) was created in the 2010s, where things like internet and smartphones are common. If they don't include those in there, then the audience (re: the generation) it's directed towards won't really relate to it as much.

• Something I've always had trouble with about Apple being gung ho about Raven accepting her destiny is does she really want Raven to marry her father? I mean if they are following the fairy tale Raven is Apple's half-aunt as it is.
  • If I recall correctly, Apple's never regarded the Evil Queen as her family member, so I don't think EAH's version of Snow White involves any marriages except Snow White to a prince at the end.
  • In the first book, they actually address that. And... they just sorta shrug it off. Just kind of figure that repeating destiny doesn’t have to be exact. There’s no actual acknowledgement of Raven being Snow White’s half sister, or her father (who we do meet and get to know in this book) being Apple’s grandfather. Something I want to know is how their lives could be so wrapped up in their fairytale in tact and only think twice about a detail as big as ‘stepmother’ as teenagers?
    • She wouldn't be her half-sister, they'd be step-sisters.
    • Except if they’re going by tradition, The evil queen, Raven’s mom married Snow White’s (Apple’s mom) dad, and then had Raven together that makes them half-sisters.
• It seems like, after Dragon Games, the fandom has come to regard Darling as Apple's 'destined' true love. However, they destroyed the Book of Legends in WTW, so my understanding was that nobody is 'destined' for anything anymore. I don't reject the idea of either girl being lesbian, but drawing the conclusion that they're destined to be together doesn't make any sense to me. Am I misunderstanding something?
  • The idea in WTW was that Raven had the pages of the book merge with their respective students so they could choose whether or not to follow their destiny. Thus Apple was hoping to follow hers even though Raven wasn't. Still the shippers will grab on to anything that helps their pairing.
  • Yeah, the solution was essentially "optional destiny". You can now choose to follow your path or change it. Since the whole idea that following is necessary is a lie, there's room for deviation in the next generation of fairy tales.
  • I think essentially, the kiss working meant a relationship 'could' work, and it's certainly a good first step. It doesn't however mean they 'have' to get together (which is kinda the point of the series).

• How does age factor into this universe? In their original fairy tales, Red Riding Hood and Alice were still little girls at their endings, but others ended their stories as adults. How can Cerise and Alistair be the same ages as the other students? For that to be possible, Red and Alice would have had to grow up without the other parents aging.
  • Also, the dynamics between Cerise and Ramona and Farrah and Ashlynn will be odd, too, due to the first pair being sisters, and the latter pair being the same age. Unless this is supposed to highlight the destinies being a lie, then how would the stories work for this generation?
    • To answer your questions, the age of the characters relative to each other would probably depend on how many generations students have been repeating their parents' stories for, as well as when each pair of fairy tale parents had children. For instance, if the upcoming cycle of stories was the seventh one, and the original fairy godmother of the first cycle (as well as its Cinderella)each had children immediately following the story, their children would still be the same age. If the godmother had children immediately after the story and Cinderella waited 15 years or so to have children with her prince, the Godmother's child would be fifteen years older than Cinderella's. Different characters could probably manipulate the age differences between their children by having children at varying times until their kids were the same age. Does that make any sense?
  • I can see how the situation would arise, but how would these stories play out between kids who are either the same age, related, or close friends? Does the fulfillment of a story rely on really good acting, or can the basic plotline be adapted to different time periods and circumstances?
  • Maybe different species age differently? Farrah, for example, is a fairy, and fairies are usually known to age slower than humans. Maybe Farrah was born decades before Ashlynn, but is biologically the same age (hence why she couldn't go to EAH until Ashlynn was of age). Therefore, this could let Farrah be old enough to qualify as Ashlynn's fairy godmother. And since Wonderland has a different school system (and a different way of life, for that matter), maybe the Wonderlandians are allowed to go to EAH because they're the equivalent age of the Ever Afterian students or are somehow the same age due to some strange Wonderlandian age customs or biology? As for the other characters...I got nothin'.

• Why is Apple so angsty about losing her pre-eminence in Dragon Games when she dealt with the same problem months ago (Maddie running for class president)?
  • Maddie is nowhere near the sort of threat Raven is, and even then Apple only really fled off the deep end after manipulation from Snow White and the Evil Queen (and excess trust in adults is one of her biggest flaws).

• Once it is confirmed that nobody is going to go 'poof', why is Apple still so insistent that Raven not playing her part means her fairy-tale ending won't happen? Ok, yes, it changes the events of the tale itself, but the happily-ever-after of inheriting her family's kingdom and marrying Daring is still there - she can just inherit the normal way and have a normal Arranged Marriage. Not my idea of a happy ending, but it's in no way prevented by her not having to be poisoned first.
  • Probably because either way, she wants Raven to poison her so that she can fulfil her own fairy-tale. She's just that much in denial about it.
  • Because even though they won't go poof or anything, Apple wants the security of her own fairy tale coming true. For that, someone has to poison her. Why she doesn't just ask Faybelle is the real mystery- Faybelle is cheesed off that the Evil Queen stole her mother's destiny from her by cursing Briar's mother(?), so it's pretty clear Faybelle could just take Raven's if she wants to.

• What does the word "Mirrorcast" actually refer to? Blondie's reporter vlog/web series is called a Mirrorcast repeatedly, but so is Cupid's radio show. Is Mirrorcast just a word to refer to online shows in general?
  • Also, if Cupid is such a know-how for romance, then why doesn't she seem to take her own advice to get Dexter to notice her? She is still a radio host, so you would expect her to take the advice she gave and still gives to her callers.
    • Truth in Television. Sometimes people who are good advice-givers don't take their own advice. Deep down she may also believe that her own advice may not apply to her since she's a cupid, and fails to realize that she can take her own advice despite her role.
    • As for the Mirrorcast thing, it's likely a brand that's been turned into an actual word such as Google (you Google things, which is a simple term that refers to searching things up on Google). Mirrorcast is just their universe's equivalent of that.
  • I was personally under the impression Cupid's advice piece is just part of Blondie's MirrorCast show, like a lonely hearts column in a newspaper. Alternatively, "MirrorCast" could be like Twitch and YouTube, so them saying "my MirrorCast show" is the same thing as "my Twitch/YouTube channel".

• Why are Snow White and Apple, who are supposed to be heroic, always trying to peer pressure Raven? I know Snow White peer pressured Apple to peer pressure Raven, but if Raven is truly Apple's friend then why doesn't Apple stand up to her mom?
  • The point of everyone peer pressuring Raven is that they don't want to go poof, and also because they believe that Raven is/going to turn out to be evil anyways because of her fairy tale. Also, keep in mind that heroes can be flawed.

• What kind of parent names their kid after a fruit, let alone the same fruit that almost killed said parent???
  • 1) This is a world of magical unicorns and wizards, and you're confused over their names? 2) The family clearly see being poisoned by the apple as a good thing, since it's their destiny.

• So do the Narrators have physical bodies, or are they just disembodied voices?
  • Maybe they're the words and the paper, while their daughter is the pictures? After all, paper and words create pictures in the mind.

• Can't Apple just Pardon Raven after she poisons her?
  • She could, but that won't stop people hating her for trying to kill their beloved queen-to-be.

• How has no one clued in on Ramona and Cerise? The two clearly have history beyond being destined enemies and even with Cerise's hood up, the resemblance is striking between the two.
  • People probably assume they grew up together and ignore the physical resemblance.

• What's the deal with Brother Hood? He's supposed to be Red's brother but is described as elderly? Red is 40s tops.

• Why is there no barrier protecting the mirror the Evil Queen is sealed in to stop it being broken?

• Why is Faybelle the one set to curse Briar? Isn't Briar ALREADY CURSED, since Sleeping Beauty is cursed as a baby? Shouldn't Faybelle be preparing to curse the next Sleeping Beauty? Faybelle is mad that the Evil Queen stole her mother's position in their story... by cursing Briar's mother? Not Briar? How does that work?

• How did the Legacy situation begin? How are there lines of Cinderellas, Little Mermaids, and Pinocchios? Sleeping Beauty and Snow White kind of make sense if one family is determined to curse the other every generation, but Little Mermaid doesn't really make any sense- she was a mermaid who never knew anything of the human world until she fell in love with the prince. Do they all have their memories wiped until their stories are completed?