Discussion Main / FurAgainstFang

When was the first use of the werewolf vs vampire trope? I've come across many works of fiction in which vampires are at war or have a rivalry against werewolves. It just seems like such a weird combination to me.

Attacked The World Of Darkness Fan Wank with a chainsaw. It might have important & enlightening detail, in there somewhere, maybe.

• One should understand that (most of) the werewolves have Knight Templar tendencies, and tend to think with their claws. Their backstory has them doing regular genetic weeding among humans, as well as committing genocide against every other shapeshifter race, as well as their own Australian tribe, driven by the werewolves' own brand of Manifest Destiny. (While yet another werewolf tribe, the Black Spiral Dancers, actually became tainted and joined the enemy, a.k.a. the Wyrm.) The primary way in which vampires differ is that the wolves haven't succeeded at wiping them out.
  • Should be noted that the Australian tribe was wiped out because the Black Spiral Dancers manipulated the werewolf tendency to shred first, ask questions later, specifically to get the "good" werewolves to commit the unthinkable crime of wiping out a tribe.
• On the other hand, one should also understand that werewolves can mystically sense Wyrm-taint, and 90%+ of vampires do indeed have such taint.
  • However, Wyrm Taint isn't like evil; just because you have some doesn't mean you're of the Wyrm. It may merely mean you hang out in/with the wrong places/people. In this case, it's that low-humanity vampires are so corrupt and unnatural and wrong that they are akin to the Wyrm without being of it.
• Also, everyone hates vampires in The World Of Darkness, at least in the old one. The only supernatural factions whose default policy isn't "kill on sight" in Revised edition are those who have very little to no contact with them. That's because vampires generally range from power-mongering, treacherous Manipulative Bastards to depraved psychopaths and every faction with any clue in metaphysics (mages that care, werewolves, changelings, demons) has their own reasons to perceive their very existence as an affront. The werewolf/vampire conflict is simply the most famous as the first and the most fierce.
  • The official fiction has a demon being very curious about a vampire and his supposed link to Cain. Demons have been locked away for millennia, and so aren't exactly up on the current metaphysicals.

  • But even then, werewolves needing hocus-pocus would most likely turn to a Theurge (a shamanic werewolf "job"), especially one from the more mystical tribes, or even a human Mage/Sorcerer before getting in bed with a vampire, the same way most Kindred would sooner call a vampire with Fortitude if they need extra muscle. You're more likely to get cooperation between clans and tribes that share the same goals like the Tremere and Uktena (magic), or the Ventrue and Glass Walkers (business), and the splatbooks often speak of such alliances.
• One of the first 'Sixth Rank' gifts to appear in Werewolf had no purpose but to destroy vampires, and could do so instantly and irrevocably. It was removed from later editions where it became standard for every tribe and some auspices to have an exemplar Sixth Rank power.

• The latter edition keeps some of this. Werewolf blood is far richer and more potent than human blood, reducing the amount that needs to be taken in a feeding. It also adds a downside - werewolf blood brings out the "beast" in the vampire, making them much more likely to succumb to murderous rage when offended or hungry. Similarly, mages can learn powerful healing spells... but mage blood is hallucinogenic, driving the imbiber a little bit insane.

What's with the non-indicative page art?