Discussion History Main / TemptingFate

* The BBC tempted fate during the Moon landing to a horrifying degree that -- thankfully -- never went through. While the astronauts were on the moon, the BBC decided to play [[Music/SpaceOddity \\\'\\\'Space Oddity\\\'\\\']] by Music/DavidBowie. It was a space-y song, which is understandable. However, the last few lines of the song have Major Tom ask Ground Control to tell his wife he loves her, before his circuit dies. This implies he never makes it back to Earth, which was pretty creepy when you realized that no one knew if the Apollo astronauts would make it back alive.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme above all of existence. \'\'\'Above all of existence.\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games he\'s featured in still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. Even in this game, he states his means to his depraved end goal would be just to pull the same \"release all Pokemon\" scam he pulled before but with Giovanni in place of N, which is rather underwhelming, and threatening to murder a child, while horrible, certainly isn\'t unique to him since Lysandre and Lusamine have been homicidal towards children as well, with Lusamine trying to kill her own daughter in \'\'Sun and Moon.\'\' He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence. \'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games he\'s featured in still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. Even in this game, he states his means to his depraved end goal would be just to pull the same \"release all Pokemon\" scam he pulled before but with Giovanni in place of N, which is rather underwhelming, and threatening to murder a child, while horrible, certainly isn\'t unique to him since Lysandre and Lusamine have been homicidal towards children as well, with Lusamine trying to kill her own daughter in \'\'Sun and Moon.\'\' He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence. \'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. Even in this game, he states his means to his depraved end goal would be just to pull the same \"release all Pokemon\" scam he pulled before but with Giovanni in place of N, which is rather underwhelming, and threatening to murder a child, while horrible, certainly isn\'t unique to him since Lysandre and Lusamine have been homicidal towards children as well, with Lusamine trying to kill her own daughter in \'\'Sun and Moon.\'\' He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence. \'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. Even in this game, he states his means to his depraved end goal would be just to pull the same \"release all Pokemon\" scam he pulled before but with Giovanni in place of N, which is rather underwhelming, and threatening to murder a child, while horrible, certainly isn\'t unique to him since Lysandre and Lusamine have been homicidal towards children as well, with Lusamine trying to kill her own daughter in \'\'Sun and Moon.\'\' Ghetsis might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence. \'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl \'\'by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: {{spoiler: the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.}}

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: {{spoilers: the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.}}

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[spoilers: the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[Spoilers:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.

Spoilers for what his role consists of: [[Spoiler:the Ghetsis in this game is from a reality in which he succeeded in his initial plan but was brought into this game\'s reality by Giovanni to be part of Team Rainbow Rocket. Though he TheDragon for Giovanni, Ghetsis has come to rationalize that the reason he was brought from his reality to this reality was so that he could use his perchance for exploitation and skillful manipulations to usurp control of Team Rainbow Rocket for himself and then, using Giovanni as his new \"king\" in N\'s place, along with all of the Aether Foundation\'s resources and an army of Ultra Beasts at Team Rainbow Rocket\'s disposal for good measure, he can travel between worlds pulling his Pokemon Liberation crusade con on all the worlds so that all trainers and all Pokemon in all realities are separated from each other, and as a result, Ghetsis can consolidate more power for himself and dominate all the worlds as he pleases. In his own words, if he can make good use of Giovanni as his pawn, he could reign supreme over all existence.\'\'\'Over all existence.\'\'\'\' This is fully crossing into AGodAmI territory. He\'s seen a way in which he can become supreme god emperor of the entire multiverse, so he\'s going to jump at that opportunity and make the best use of all the pawns, Pokemon, and resources at his disposal in order to realize his twisted ambitions. Then after losing to the PlayerCharacter and undergoing his traditional ThisCannotBe VillainousBreakdown, Ghetsis, refusing to accept his defeat and let the PC and Lillie go ahead to face Giovanni, rushes over to Lillie and physically strikes her down onto the floor, telling the PC \"if you value this girls life, then throw down your Poke\'Balls!\". If the PC says no, Ghetsis scowls \"Then you leave me no choice, the girl must...\". Yeah, he says in no uncertain terms that he\'s going to murder Lillie if the PC doesn\'t surrender to him. He\'s very explicit in his threat, and this murder attempt differs from his prior ones due to not only him physically assaulting Lillie by backhanding her beforehand, but there\'s no way he\'s going to kill her with his Pokemon since they\'ve all just been KO\'D - he\'s going to murder the girl ;;by his own bare hand.\'\' Yet again Ghetsis shows that he has no compunction doing things that other villains in this setting do not and would not typically do, crossing lines that other villains don\'t cross. He has no standards whatsoever since he\'d do anything if the results greatly serviced him and furthered his selfish, power-grabbing schemes, goals, and ambitions. On top of that, Ghetsis is shown to be the single villain in this game devoid of any redeeming qualities or mitigating factors to his villainy, and the ONLY boss among them all to not accept defeat and step aside after losing a battle to TheHero, AND the only one to resort to physical assault and threatening child murder in order to get his way (a show of cruelty that even \'\'Lusamine\'\' would find totally out of line). As such, he has to be sent back to his own dimension by force through Colress\' machine rather than leaving voluntarily. Had this not happened, he would have kept on going with his crimes until he got what he desired. As Colress puts it, Ghetsis is a man with power to match his ambitions, and this makes him a dangerous individual not to be taken lightly.]]

So with Ghetsis setting himself apart from all the other bosses and standing out relative to all the other villains in the core game serious due to how self-serving, exploitative, sadistic, abusive, deranged, dangerous, and utterly wicked a person he continuously proves himself to be, I\'d say, personally, that I feel he\'s definitely the closest thing to a CompleteMonster as the games have got in terms of character. \'\'However\'\', do not for a second think this means his permablock will be undone, because his deeds in all three of the games still come up pretty short compared to how much more heinous he could\'ve been. He might be definitively over the baseline now in terms of goals and deeds, and his characterization is absolutely in line with the trope without a doubt, but if his crimes don\'t quite go the extra mile in their nature, effects and consequences that would be needed to make him a qualifier in spite of the more destructive OmnicidalManiac villains that he shares a setting with, then he can\'t fit the trope 100%. It\'s a verdict that I\'ll never be fully in agreement with but oh well, there\'s still his manga incarnation.