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Marking as Needs Help in lieu of an “actually YMMV” option.

Easily Forgiven Wick Check

The Problem: So, Easily Forgiven is defined as a villain who is forgiven despite committing particularly heinous crimes- in short, a villain who is too vile for the repentance to be believable. The problem is that what qualifies as "too evil to forgive" is subjective- as the wick check will show, it has been used for things ranging from genuinely baffling (genocide, general mass murder, abuse, rape) to more dickish but not particularly heinous things (causing a breakup, firing someone for a dumb reason, insulting someone in public) to Poke the Poodle-level acts and honest mistakes. While the description claims it can be used objectively/in-universe, most wicks read as subjective judgements, and of the 85 wicks checked, only 10 qualified as in-universe judgements. Since basically everyone has a different threshold as to what they will forgive, what one fan may consider too evil or dickish to be forgiven may be seen by another fan as not a big deal or something that can be amended if the person does enough work to atone for it. On top of that, concerns have been raised about this being redundant to Unintentionally Unsympathetic.

Potential Solutions: At minimum, this should be YMMV, possibly merged into Unintentionally Unsympathetic, and I can see value in splitting off an In-Universe Examples Only trope about a character saying or thinking another character was easily forgiven.

Also, if we do make this YMMV, Magolor from Kirby's Return to Dream Land will need to have his Pantheon entry changed as he is currently the god of Easily Forgiven. Luckily, I think Welcome Back, Traitor can serve as a good replacement.

Wick check:

On this page, we will be doing a wick check for Easily Forgiven.

Why? Easily Forgiven is defined as a villain who is forgiven despite committing particularly heinous crimes- in short, a villain who is too vile for the repentance to be believable. The problem is that what qualifies as "too evil to forgive" is subjective- as the wick check will show, it has been used for things ranging from genuinely baffling (genocide, general mass murder, abuse, rape) to more dickish but not particularly heinous things (causing a breakup, firing someone for a dumb reason, insulting someone in public) to Poke the Poodle-level acts and honest mistakes. While the description claims it can be used objectively/in-universe, most wicks read as subjective judgements. On top of that, concerns have been raised about this being redundant to Unintentionally Unsympathetic. At minimum, this should be YMMV, possibly merged into UU, and I can see value in splitting off an In-Universe Examples Only trope about a character saying or thinking another character was easily forgiven.

Wicks checked: 85/85

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    Reads as subjective judgement (58/85) 
  1. Characters.MCU Wanda Maximoff:
    • In Age of Ultron, Tony and Banner leave the team in guilt, while Wanda, an ex-HYDRA agent who mind-raped Tony and Banner into building Ultron and Hulking out, isn't blamed by anyone, for anything, to any degree. Instead, she gets enlisted into the Avengers.
    • Averted in WandaVision. She is fully aware that removing the Hex from Westview and sacrificing her family will not be enough for the people she unintentionally mind-controlled to forgive her, so she leaves the town behind and goes into self-imposed exile to learn how to fully control her abilities.
    • In Multiverse of Madness, her Earth-838 counterpart never gave Wanda any harsh words despite the latter's multiple attempts to ruin her life (hijacking her body, then committing several murders and planning to Kill and Replace her to steal her children, to be specific).
  2. GameOfThrones.Tropes E To F:
    • Robert cemented his control of Westeros by forgiving any remaining Targaryen loyalists who surrendered, including Barristan Selmy, Jaime Lannister, Varys, Pycelle, the Tyrells, and the Martells.
    • In season 8 episode 1, Cersei sends Bronn to kill Jaime. The only reason Jaime is even alive by the end of episode 4 is because Tyrion bribed Bronn with the promise of the castle he yearned for the entire series. Despite this, Jaime returns to King's Landing and comforts Cersei in her last moments, dying in embrace with her. In fact, he shuns Brienne, the woman who actually loved and believed him, in order to be by Cersei's side.
  3. Literature.Tara Duncan: Not Brainwashed: Fabrice, regarding his Face–Heel Turn fueled by his lust for power. Later on, he thus seems Easily Forgiven.
  4. Characters.Everhood: (Pink) At the end of the game, everyone Pink meets in the Waiting Room forgives them for their genocide. Given that, after their deaths, they understand that death is not the end, they come to better understand why Pink did what they did.
  5. Fanfic.The Unity Saga: Not quite, as Han never forgives Luke for killing Chewbacca during his stint on the Dark Side until after his erstwhile friend dies, but it's Played Straight by most of the other characters.
  6. Literature.Anansi Boys: Spider commits rape by fraud with Rosie, and she marries him in the end.
  7. Fridge.Baten Kaitos: In Eternal Wings, while Kalas appears to be Easily Forgiven by his comrades after he comes back from his Face–Heel Turn since they don't mention his part in the current disaster very often. When you think about it makes sense, after all. If they mentioned it to the majority of the populace, they'd have no doubt turned into an angry mob and torn him apart.
  8. Series.Why Women Kill: April is infuriated when she realizes that her new friend "Sheila" was in fact the wife of the married man she's been having an affair with. However, she gets over it very quickly when she reads the love confession letter Mary wrote to bait her abusive husband into killing Rob, as it demonstrates Rob's serial infidelity. In the epilogue April and Beth Ann live together and raise April's daughter.
  9. LovingAShadow.Anime And Manga: Naruto:
  10. Film.Radio Rebel: Stacy, considering that she was ruthlessly mean to Tara from the beginning of the film and even more so when she found out that Tara was Radio Rebel. Luckily for her, Tara isn't the type to hold a grudge.
  11. Series.Jessie: Paranoia Gambit: This is unintentionally pulled in the episode "A Close Shave". Bertram and Zuri fear that Luke will want revenge on them for accidentally shaving the middle of his head, despite Luke having already forgiven them. They even end up destroying their own things thinking Luke was giving them as a prank.
  12. Heartwarming.Arlo The Alligator Boy: After spending the whole film trying to avoid his son, Ansel saves Arlo from Ruff and Stucky by revealing his identity as a bird-man, and getting him out of their clutches. Not long after that, he explains everything to Arlo, and by extension, his audience, outright admitting that he had made the worst mistake of his life abandoning his son. Yet despite everything he did, Arlo still instantly forgives him.
  13. VideoGame.Vs Beepie: Boyfriend doesn't hold a grudge against Beepie for her attempts to steal him from Girlfriend, likely since this isn't the first time their lives have been threatened (and also likely since she's not the only BF fangirl), and sings some more songs with her to cheer her up.
  14. Recap.Cheers S 4 E 8: Given what a complete Jerkass Dave was to Sam and Diane back in Season Two's "Old Flames", it's curious that Sam is now on such friendly terms with Dave. It's even curiouser when he doesn't seem to understand why Diane doesn't like Dave, given how hard Dave worked to break Sam and Diane up.
  15. DubInducedPlotHole.Video Games: The English localization of Kingdom Hearts III has an infamous one near the end by completely mistranslating the motivation of one of the series most important characters. In the original Xehanort, while dying, reveals that he believed the war between Light and Dark had become a futile cycle, and his intent was to end the world and start over from scratch, something which is mutated in the localization into him trying to bring "balance" to light and dark, with zero mention of wanting to start from scratch. This ends up making the entire character incoherent, leads to lots of inconsistencies in the storyline, and makes his Alas, Poor Villain look completely unearned.
  16. Film.City Dragon: Ray, after having an affair with his boss, and generally treating Tina like crap (though unlike John, he never physically hurts her, it's mostly just sniping between the two of them), which causes her to walk out on him he...has Philthy play a song on the radio on the off chance Tina will hear it (she does), and then after she gives birth she calls him from the hospital to come see her. It's a bit more understandable after he stops John from hurting the kid, but Tina had already seemed to forgive him before that.
  17. MoralEventHorizon.William Shakespeare: In the last scene of Two Gentlemen of Verona, Proteus tries to rape Silvia (before being talked down by Valentine) and his being rather suddenly forgiven by both Valentine and Julia does not ring true for many modern viewers.
  18. VideoGame.Star Control:
    • The first time you meet Fwiffo on Pluto, he (in typical Spathi fashion) mistakes your harmless lander crew for a hostile force and, without any provocation, opens fire and kills several people. He blames his ship's automated defences for the incident, but it's pretty clear that he is lying. A few minutes and one conversation later, he becomes your first alien ally, and his ship forms an important part of your fleet, potentially for the rest of the game. You can fight him to avenge your dead crew instead, but he's alone on his ship (meaning it has only one hit point), making the victory feel quite hollow, and failing to ally with him makes the game much harder.
    • Pkunk are pretty eager to forgive you after you insulted them and possibly destroyed several of their ships, as long as you promise to "try" not to blow them up anymore.
  19. Series.Wanda Vision: None other than Wanda at the end of the series. Despite having kidnapped an entire town and forced them to play roles in her weird meltdown, including not letting some of them see their children. After beating Agatha, Wanda simply leaves for a journey of self-discovery.
  20. Manga.Silver Diamond:
    • Touji is sent to kill Chigusa, Narushige, and Rakan and also manages to put some holes in Chigusa while attempting to do just that. Doesn't stop Rakan from saving him from getting shot by Chigusa, giving him dinner, and telling the others to be nicer to him - all in the span of a day. Then he gets added to the team.
    • Rakan is the king of this trope. He later forgives another hitman sent by Kinrei, who almost brought a house down on him; a girl who tried to kill all of his comrades so her village would get to keep him forever; and a group of guards who stubbornly refuse to even consider that someone of the Kingen family might not be telling the truth. They all wind up becoming valuable allies and the first two have already undergone a Heel–Face Turn.
    • The great Aversion happens with Hoshinomikoto. Rakan simply cannot forgive the pain he put Chigusa through.
  21. Wrestling.Cody Rhodes: So, Randy Orton can concuss you, your father, and your best friend, but it's all good in the end and you're willing to join with his new group. Worse still was Orton's treatment of DiBiase and Rhodes in Legacy, which consisted of being outright abusive at times and STILL attacking their family members and such. They did eventually get tired of it…which somehow was a Heel–Face Turn for Randy Orton. It was supposed to be the other way around, but fans decided that they hated Ted and Cody more and made Randy the de facto good guy for kicking their asses. The writers ran with it…until Cody's had time to stew over it, and he came back for Orton's blood.
  22. Characters.Harry Potter Ravenclaw: (Marietta Edgecombe) Played with. Cho defends her against Harry even after she ratted on the D.A., the implied justification being that by this point Marietta is Cho's seemingly last friend.
  23. YMMV.Shakugan No Shana: Desingated Hero: To some people, the Snake of the Festival and/or Snake Yuji is a rare antagonist example- he is clearly intended to be a Hero Antagonist who has the noble goal of wanting to create a world where Flame Haze, Crimson Denizens, and Humans can life in harmony. But the things he does in pursuit of this goal are rather hard-to-swallow: sacrificing millions of innocent lives, human and denizen alike, in the war, driving Margery to the Despair Event Horizon, and outright kidnapping Shana to have her stay with him and holding her down on a bed, all while leaving his other love interests Kazumi and Hecate in the dust. Needless to say, some people view him winning and reconciling with Shana as a prime example of an Easily Forgiven Karma Houdini.
  24. BrokenBase.Steven Universe: In "Barn Mates", many viewers felt that Lapis was being unreasonably cruel to Peridot by refusing to even consider she's changed. However, others felt Peridot was Easily Forgiven and the episode gave a Broken Aesop of how victims aren't allowed to be angry at those who hurt them if it's at the expense of their friends, especially after Peridot apologized to Amethyst for being Innocently Insensitive in an earlier episode.
  25. YMMV.Destiny Of The Shrine Maiden: Esoteric Happy Ending: Depending on whether you consider a permissible happy ending to be a reincarnation as a new person, or strange hints of turning girls into "too much" loving sisters, the end of the series can become that. In addition, if we interpret Himeko's words as a sign of preserving their personality after reincarnation, this makes the ending of the anime completely happy (where the Orochi was destroyed permanently and Himeko and Chikane could finally be together forever no matter how many times they reincarnate), and the end of the manga even more embarrassing. There's also the matter that it's an ending where a rape victim forgives and gets together with her rapist, and they reincarnate together for all eternity, which needless to say makes it downright horrifying for those who don't approve of Chikane and Himeko's relationship. However, future works like Shattered Angels, Zettai Shoujo Seiiki Amnesian and Himegami no Miko show that Chikane and Himeko reincarnated several more times, each time without the threat of the Orochi, and usually have better relationships than in the original manga.
  26. DethroningMoment.Anime And Manga: The ending to Fruits Basket would have been good if it weren't for one thing: Akito being a massive Karma Houdini. I get that Tohru is a Nice Girl and it wouldn't be out of character for her to show compassion to her enemies, but did she honestly forget all the atrocities she did? All of the members of the Sohma clan she emotionally and physically abused? Putting Rin and Kisa in the hospital? Ruining Hattori's life? Attempting to kill her and Kyo during her Villainous Breakdown? Akito doesn't need forgiveness. Akito needed time in prison (or at least some serious therapy). I don't care about her Freudian Excuse. Sasuke Uchiha wasn't this Easily Forgiven. And this is only one of several wicks on the page and on Dethroning Moment pages in general.
  27. JerksAreWorseThanVillains.Video Games: The Shantae series has a fun and colorful cast of both heroes and villains. In fact, series Big Bad Risky Boots is a big fan favorite for her competence, attractiveness, and Hidden Depths, and several other villains are nearly as popular- even the Pirate Master and Empress Siren, two surprisingly evil mass-murderers with no redeeming qualities, are loved for how threatening and cool they are. However, many fans utterly loathe Mayor Scuttlebutt for firing Shantae for little to no reason in almost every game and being completely shameless about it, yet getting off with almost no problem every single time. It should say something that it's widely agreed that one of the best parts of Shantae and the Seven Sirens is the fact he doesn't appear at all.
  28. Recap.Kim Possible S 2 E 11 Exchange: Single Woman Seeks Good Man: In addition to his sense of humor, Yori is also attracted to Ron because he is a Nice Guy, as seen by the look she gives him when he forgives Fukushima after he loudly disrespects him in front of everyone.
  29. Improved Second Attempt: In Persona 5, the character of Goro Akechi and his subplot were considered decent in theory but poorly handled in practice, with the game and its characters telling the player he felt kinship with Joker instead of showing it and having him awkwardly dump his backstory without prompting to make the player sympathize with him. The Updated Re-release Royal changed his Confidant from an automatic story one to a manual one, meaning the player needs to actively go out of their way to bond with him, and re-wrote the Confidant to give Akechi and Joker's bond more natural development and make the backstory drops less forced. While the climactic scenes with him are mostly the same as the original, these changes made them feel much more organic. The new third semester returns him to the party, but alleviated fears he would be Easily Forgiven by making him a Token Evil Teammate who the rest of the Phantom Thieves barely tolerate, while giving him a lot of hilarious Comedic Sociopathy.
  30. ComicBook.Chick Tracts:
    • Quite a few people who change their ways upon being converted, especially abusive parents or spouses (Ahmed in "Is Allah Like You?", Roy Davis in "The Secret", and Henry Walker in "Lisa").
    • Surprisingly, initially averted in Happy Hour. After pushing his wife down and indirectly causing her death of a heart attack, and later spending the grocery money on liquor, Jerry tries to apologize to his children, but his children will have none of it until they go to church and learn the value of forgiveness, forgiving him two panels after the previous incident.
    • Eric in Baby Talk, who breaks up with his pregnant girlfriend, leaving her to either get an abortion or raise the baby alone. Granted, he recognizes his mistake and tries to fix it, but she doesn't seem angry at him at any point, and apparently takes him back.
  31. Literature.Clifford The Big Red Dog: Mac cheats against T-Bone in order to win a race against him. When he confesses, his friends take the news just a tad too well.
  32. Recap.Big City Greens S 3 E 8: Bill quickly forgives Cricket for not listening to him. Justified as Cricket both just nearly died and learned his lesson.
  33. Literature.The Familiar Of Zero: Louise essentially kidnaps Saito from his old life by force, enslaves him, forces him to do her chores, beats him whenever she gets upset, and denies him food as punishment when she's unsatisfied with his work. But despite all this, Saito still ends up falling in love with her.
  34. Recap.Bluey Circus: Hercules is accepted into the game (as the "strongman"), even after trying to force the other kids into playing the game he wanted to play.
  35. Characters.Angel Beats: (Ayato Naoi) Even if Death Is Cheap, his pre-Heel–Face Turn actions were too much, but the SSS seems alright with Naoi casually hanging out with them. It's still downplayed; while the SSS are willing to tolerate him, nobody exactly likes him, and Yuri mainly sees him as useful for his Hypnotic Eyes.
  36. Manga.Boruto: Sumire almost destroys the village near the end of her arc in the anime, but she's brought in and reaccepted into the academy despite this. As Shino himself says, it helps that no one was seriously hurt.
  37. RosarioVampireBrightestDarkness.Tropes D To I: The various members of Tsukune's circle of friends can do such things as nearly kill each other and pick fights for the pettiest of reasons, and by the end of the day, Tsukune will have forgiven them and gotten them to forgive each other.
  38. PlayingWith.Turn The Other Cheek: Exaggerated: Summer has made Danny's life a living hell, beat him up for no reason, crossed the Moral Event Horizon in killing his entire family, and tore up a letter to his best friend, but Danny instantly forgives her anyways.
  39. YMMV.She Ra And The Princesses Of Power: Broken Base:
    • In the same vein as Cassandra's in Tangled: The Series, whether or not Catra's redemption was well done. For some, it was a powerful piece of Character Development that put them through the grinder before successfully redeeming them as intended, making them deeply sympathetic and demonstrating how nobody is beyond atonement. For as many others, it was overly rushed favoritism that robbed the character of moral complexity or straight up turned them a Karma Houdini with no more than a slap on the wrist, by failing to fully acknowledge the scope of some of the terrible things they did, such as causing Angella to sacrifice herself, making them Easily Forgiven.
  40. Literature.Re Zero: Subaru can be surpisingly forgiving about being murdered. Being killed by Rem once doesn't prevent Subaru from falling in love with her. He's also quite happy to see Puck for the first time after the spirit killed him, declared his intention to destroy the world, and killed him again.
  41. Memes.Naruto: Chapter 699: ...Yeah, sorry. Explanation 
  42. Film.The Room: Mark nearly shoves Peter over the edge of the roof, and is forgiven almost instantly in an awkward fashion.
  43. ICarly.Tropes A To E: In iCan't Take It, Sam ruins Freddie's chances of getting into an exclusive science camp that would help him get into any college he wants. Because Freddie didn't know what time it was when Sam asked him. Freddie finds out and gets angry, then, after prodding by Carly, forgives her about 2 minutes after and kisses her again to end the episode.
  44. Film.Maleficent: Aurora very easily forgives Maleficent for cursing her to die on her 16th birthday after Maleficent has a Heel–Face Turn and undoes the curse.
  45. Recap.King Of The Hill S 4 E 14 High Anxiety: Karma Houdini: Buck suffers no repercussions after trying to frame Hank, even as he confessed it to the Sheriff (something that's actually illegal) and is Easily Forgiven by Hank (although that's no surprise considering his fervent worship of Buck).
  46. Webcomic.The Bikini Bottom Horror:
    • Gary bears no ill will against the guilty Patrick for killing his owner. As it turns out, it's because he knew SpongeBob didn't really die.
    • Guilty!Patrick is also forgiven, or at least left alone by the remaining citizens of Bikini Bottom as they rebuild. The only one who doesn't, and thinks he got off too easy is Pearl, because Mr. Krabs is dead and she could've stopped the Tortured One due to being a sperm whale. She also derides Patrick (all of them) for being cowardly by waiting to attack until she was on a school trip. Unfortunately, she's the only one who wants revenge for Mr. Krabs, as Sandy points out that the greedy man started the whole thing and got what he deserved.
  47. Fanfic.Wreck It Ralph 2: Vanellope accepts the Sugar Rush II racers' apologies for what Princess Vanellope forced them to do, and invites them to be racers in Sugar Rush to boot.
  48. Characters.Tangled Cassandra: After attempting to kill Rapunzel several times, enslaving people, and taking over Corona in Season 3, the finale has Rapunzel readily forgiving her without holding a grudge, even telling her she loves her after Cassandra's Heel–Face Turn. Eugene is also fine with her despite how rude she was to him and the fact that she tried to kill him, too (even pulling her in for a hug). Justified, as it was made plain how Zhan Tiri had urged Cassandra on, and Cassandra had owned up to her misdeeds enough to shed Tears of Remorse and beg Rapunzel not to forgive her, thinking she doesn't deserve it, helped Rapunzel defeat Zhan Tiri, and temporarily died while doing so.
  49. OnceUponATime.Tropes E To F:
    • Neal seemingly puts his father killing his mother behind him, but isn't over the whole abandoning thing. He also doesn't have a grudge against Hook after selling him out to the Lost Boys.
    • Regina murdered a whole village among other things but apparently that's fine since she wants to be good now.
    • Hook killed David's father but is almost immmediately forgiven because "it was a long time ago" and he's "not that man anymore".
  50. Implied Rape: Futurama: Midway through the second movie, "The Beast with a Billion Backs," it's revealed that Yivo, the monster who had been brainwashing every adult in the universe by sticking tentacles in their necks, was actually mating with them without consent. Despite a few jokes alluding to Black Comedy Rape ("It touched me in a bad place — my spinal cord!" and Yivo claiming "Your universe dresses provocatively"), it's never actually stated to be rape explicitly. This is likely because of Double Standard: Rape, Sci-Fi; Yivo is Easily Forgiven and the entire universe is willing to go on dates with shklim and even live on top of shklim.
  51. Seinfeld.Tropes A To H: Jerry has this in a couple episodes.
  52. NotMeThisTime.Video Games: In Psychonauts, Coach Oleander tries to kidnap everyone at the camp in order to create an army of psychic-powered war machines. As soon as he's thwarted and subsequently reformed, news comes in that the head of the Psychonauts has also been kidnapped. Oleander makes it clear that he had nothing to do with this one, stating "I was here the whole time, you saw me!"
  53. Heartwarming.A Christmas Carol: Some adaptations contain this exchange when Scrooge arrives at Fred's dinner. Never has Easily Forgiven been any sweeter.
    Scrooge: Can you forgive this stubborn, misguided fool?
    Fred: My dear uncle, there's nothing to forgive.
  54. Quotes.Angst Dissonance:
    Another thing among Destiny of the Shrine Maiden's ten thousand sins is codifying that godawful cliche of unrequited lesbian love being the deepest and most undeniable misery there is. It’s so godawfully painful that you're not only justified for murder/rape/deicide/general douchery, but all your stupid friends who've lost their family and friends, or have actually had legitimately awful things happen to them, just CAN'T UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH OF YOUR FEELINGS. And thus you are automatically both way more badass and way more sympathetic than they are. You know. Because.
    Like seriously, Chikane's raped her best friend and murdered all the punch-clock badguys under the pretense of joining them, and their boss is totally cool with it, because her heart is so awash in an ocean of tears that she's capable of becoming the god of grief and loathing. Their team had a rape victim, two political exiles, a eugenics victim, and someone who had to give up their life's dream, but HOLY CRAP CHIKANE. You had a crush on a girl you had Algebra I with, and she didn't like you like that! YOUR GRIEF DOTH OVERSHADOW US ALL.
  55. FandomSpecificPlot.My Hero Academia: In fanfics that have Bakugou's bullying revealed it's fairly common to Izuku being one of his defenders to the point that fics have Izuku convincing the likes of Aizawa or Nedzu to not expel Bakugou on the grounds that he was a product of his environment and deserves a chance to change.(Ex: Deku? I think he's some pro..., Blank Canvas)
  56. Manga.Shitsurakuen: While it is somewhat understandable that some of the guys went along with the system, it still doesn't excuse how extremely cruel they have been treating the girls. The most egregious example of this might be between Koharu and Shinji. He tried to rape her and she is the one who apologizes first (for reasons no mortal could comprehend).
  57. Literature.Dragonkeeper: Kai forgives the emperor for torturing him.
  58. UnintentionallyUnsympathetic.Western Animation: Castlevania (2017):
    • Lenore ultimately came off as this for some viewers. She’s treated as the Token Good Teammate among the four vampire sisters and is meant to be seen as the most sympathetic for the compassion she gives to Hector as well as briefly mentioning a tragic past where her parents were murdered. But her actions in Season 3 i.e manipulating Hector while he’s imprisoned, giving him a Disproportionate Retribution for trying to escape and then tricking Hector by slipping a soul binding ring on him while having sex with him so he’ll obey, comes off as too much of a Moral Event Horizon. In the Season 4 ending, having genuinely bonded with Hector (off-screen) she gives a token apology and is Easily Forgiven by the guy who needed to cut his own finger off to be free of her power. Some even found Lenore’s suicide viva sunlight unsympathetic since said she hates feeling trapped, yet was perfectly okay with her Love Interest being held captive by her for months.

    In-Universe Judgement (10/85) 
  1. Characters.Megalo Box: (Santa, Bonjiri, and Oicho) Averted. When Joe returns, the only one of them and Sachio who could be seen as this is Bonjiri, and even then he's rather awkward about it until Joe gets the deed to his restaurant back and Sachio admits to his role in him leaving. Santa's next to do so, and that's only because his attempt at writing an article about him sparring with Liu left an impression on him and prompted him to give him a chance. Oicho takes the longest of the three to do so, showing up in time help him, Bonjiri, Santa and Aragaki stop the gym he was rebuilding from collapsing in a typhoon, and even then she's somewhat prickly.
  2. Characters.Rosenkreuzstilette: (Grolla Seyfarth)
    • And then after that, her second and saddest Shoot the Dog moment is when she's forced to take on the undead form of her own grandfather and mentor, Raimund Seyfarth. To her, being made to slay her grandpa and lay him back to rest again is Easily Forgiven. But, in her words, the fact that Graf Zeppelin interrupted his peaceful slumber by bringing him Back from the Dead... not so much.
  3. Fanfic.Twice Upon An Age:
    • Invoked by Varric in one of his author's notes, after the Inquisitors make amends following their large disagreement; he remarks that it might seem to the reader like they were too quick to forgive each other. But as he points out, the big problem with their argument was that they were both wrong and they were also both right, and since they're willing to acknowledge that, it's easy for them to forgive.
    • Varric invokes this in his opening notes on Agents Acquired, observing that "Scholar" is quite irritated with him for giving her more work to do; but the reader shouldn't worry, because she always forgives him. The author's own notes more or less confirm this, much to her bemusement.
  4. WebOriginal.Mushroom Land: Berserk Button: You better not call Maggie a retard. Subverted, as Agatha is easily forgiven
    Maggie: YOU are the retard! But I love you anyway.
  5. Funny.Bart Baker: In "Sorry", Justin Bieber acts like a jerk because as long as he "feels regret", he can always go back to act like a douchebag.
  6. DidntThinkThisThrough.Fan Works: For His Own Sake:
    • Naru angrily accuses her family of not really caring about her and cuts them out of her life. After Granny Hina cuts her off for good, she turns around and expects to be Easily Forgiven for her outburst.
  7. HonestTrailers.Tropes E To M: The Honest Trailer for Black Widow (2021) suggests that Malina gets forgiven too easily for her part in forcibly recruiting a multitude of young girls into becoming assassins.
  8. HardTruthAesop.Bojack Horseman: A theme that's returned to many times is that awareness of a problem and feeling contrite about it is not enough to redeem you as a person, particularly when it doesn't stop you from making the same mistakes over and over again. The show is also not shy about insinuating that redemption, as far as Hollywoo imagines it, may not be possible for some people if their victims decide that they're too far gone to accept help anymore. Best exemplified by Todd in "It's You", who sums this up to Bojack by saying "You can't keep doing shitty things and then feel bad about yourself like that makes it okay! You need to be better!"
  9. Film.Undercover Brother: White She Devil, much to Conspiracy Brother's chagrin - especially when she's made an official Agent.
  10. BittersweetEnding.Fan Works: While Heartbreak intially ended on a Downer Ending, it's sequel chapter concludes on a more softer, if still somber, note. Yang reaffirms her love for Garnet and is able to get back together with him, but she will have to live with the fact that she basically broke his heart for nothing, and that Garnet's trust in her is at an all time low, coupled with the fact that she won't be so Easily Forgiven by most of Garnet's friends and family, especially his mother.

    Involves Both (3/85) 
  1. Characters.Friendship Is Magic Starlight Glimmer:
    • True to the nature of the show, the Mane Six forgive Starlight Glimmer for all of the trouble she caused. In the same episode they show it is a downplayed trope. They point out that even though Starlight has turned over a new leaf and is very remorseful, she is still a volatile mixture of friendless, insane power and talent. Worst of all, Starlight has No Social Skills whatsoever; letting her go free would be a mistake. Princess Twilight takes Starlight in as a student in the study of friendship, starting with the Mane Six and Spike. Starlight herself lampshades this in "The Crystalling", still surprised that Twilight Sparkle was able to forgive her so quickly.
    • Downplayed in "Every Little Thing She Does", where Starlight makes a catastrophic mistake mind-controlling her friends with a magic spell. The Mane Six are rightfully pissed off at her, and Starlight has to really work to earn their forgiveness, which she manages to pull off.
  2. Fanfic.Crimson AU:
    • Subverted between Akira and Mishima. While he says he forgives Mishima, he reveals he didn't mean it, and he is still pissed despite understanding the circumstances.
    • Haru has no issue forgiving Makoto for lying to her twice even though she used her as a means to investigating Akira.
  3. Manga.A Silent Voice:
    • When Shoya meets Shoko again after five years, she forgives him and even wants to be his friend after initially running away from him. The problem is the girl's mother, sister and Ishida himself aren't so forgiving of his actions.
    • Despite being one of the main people who caused his bullying back in elementary school, Ishida decides after talking to her a few times in high school that Kawai seems to be pretty nice person. Later on she joins his group of friends. However, after the Drama Bomb, he's far less forgiving of Kawai.
    • While he wasn't nearly as harsh to Nagatsuka, Ishida still insulted him and pushed him away during the Drama Bomb. Nagatsuka's response was to say that Shouya just had a bad day, and he was the one who tried to get everyone back together first after Shoya's coma.

    Flat-out misuse (6/85) 
  1. DarthWiki.A Ko Project: Somewhat, as he goes to jail for what he's done, only seeing people to use his A-Shi-Mode spell on them. Example says the villain goes to jail- doesn't sound like he was forgiven.
  2. Manga.Nononono: Shingu sabotages Shiriya's run in revenge for being sabotaged, and also to be allowed into a prestigious training institution. It turns out that the revenge was purely a very bad misunderstanding and that Shiriya purposely ignored the fact that Shingu sabotaged his skies for Shingu's sake, and to challenge Nonomiya and Amatsu to stretch themselves (they had to make up for his fall in their own jumps). Shingu breaks down, admits his crime, and says he will turn himself in to the police. The team manager and his associate interrupt him and ask him not to do that. Whilst not exactly forgiving him, they understand his anger, and they do not want to disrespect Shiriya's decision. Not forgiven
  3. Characters.Marios Mystery Meat: He quickly gets over his frustration of Sponge popping out of his expensive spaghetti. This hardly seems bad enough to qualify...
  4. Fanfic.Aimless: Averted for Joshua after what happened at the gates of Warfang. Many of the natives are not exactly fond of the guy who killed 60 people, to put it lightly.
    • The aversion also applies to Cynder for her actions while she was under Malefor's control as the infamous Terror of the Skies. So much so that a few of the dragon guards, one of them being Rimeer, schemed to kill her despite all of her efforts to atone. Kilat attacks her as well and only barely tolerates her afterwards at Joshua's behest. Not forgiven.
  5. Fanfic.Syngenesophobia: Averted hardly. The sisters are well aware that what they did to Lincoln is unforgivable, and it may take months or even years before Lincoln is willing to forgive them, if at all. Doesn't stop them from trying, though. Despite this, it's unknown if their friends and classmates would ever forgive them at all. Whether or not they'll come to terms with this is currently unknown. Chapter 27 pretty much confirms that the sisters have accepted that they're outcasts and they have lost most of their friends, only caring that Lincoln recovers. Chapter 37 has Lincoln contemplating if he should forgive his sisters or not, despite feeling remorse or even because of. Mostly, because he fears what will stop them from repeating if they lose their tempers again. By chapter 40, he's at least started the process of reconciliation towards some of the sisters, making forgiveness even more possible.
    • In chapter 41, we see Lori threaten Lincoln after he chastises her. Despite this and being scared of her outburst, Lincoln handles it better than he would have earlier in the story, even taking the time to listen to Lori's apology and explanation, suggesting he may be much further along the process of forgiveness than even he realizes. Example claims to be aversion.
  6. Series.How I Met Your Mother: Averted after Stella leaves Ted at the altar. The gang actively encouraged Ted to let her have it afterwards. Not forgiven, according to the example.

    ZCE (8/85) 
  1. Characters.Princess Sarah: After all that she's been put through, Sarah not only lets Miss Minchin off the hook, but makes a donation of several thousand pounds to the Seminary. Doesn't say what she did, or which one as put through troubles
  2. Fanfic.The Just Series: Flamiken.
  3. WebAnimation.Cops Skyrim: Somehow, against all odds, he managed to get his job back in Season 6. Who? What? Huh?
  4. WesternAnimation.As Told By Ginger: No other way to explain for Dodie and Macie who tried to break Ginger and Darren up.
  5. Manga.Fairy Tail Blue Mistral: Being Fairy Tail yeah. Most of the people who wrong them are usually forgiven if they had some good intentions behind their actions.
  6. Recap.Steven Universe S 5 E 28 Change Your Mind: Steven, Blue, and Yellow don't hold it against White despite everything she's done to them.
  7. Characters.Monster House: (Mr. Nebbercracker) Despite his acts, he ends up being forgiven by the heroes at the end. It probably helps that everyone soon learned he had a fake persona for 45 years and up until that point.
  8. KarmaHoudini.Anime And Manga: The Twelve Kingdoms has Yuka and Kouya, both of whom are Easily Forgiven.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 12th 2023 at 3:43:06 AM

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#1: Jun 28th 2023 at 6:00:01 PM

To-do list:

    Original post 
Marking as Needs Help in lieu of an “actually YMMV” option.

Easily Forgiven Wick Check

The Problem: So, Easily Forgiven is defined as a villain who is forgiven despite committing particularly heinous crimes- in short, a villain who is too vile for the repentance to be believable. The problem is that what qualifies as "too evil to forgive" is subjective- as the wick check will show, it has been used for things ranging from genuinely baffling (genocide, general mass murder, abuse, rape) to more dickish but not particularly heinous things (causing a breakup, firing someone for a dumb reason, insulting someone in public) to Poke the Poodle-level acts and honest mistakes. While the description claims it can be used objectively/in-universe, most wicks read as subjective judgements, and of the 85 wicks checked, only 10 qualified as in-universe judgements. Since basically everyone has a different threshold as to what they will forgive, what one fan may consider too evil or dickish to be forgiven may be seen by another fan as not a big deal or something that can be amended if the person does enough work to atone for it. On top of that, concerns have been raised about this being redundant to Unintentionally Unsympathetic.

Potential Solutions: At minimum, this should be YMMV, possibly merged into Unintentionally Unsympathetic, and I can see value in splitting off an In-Universe Examples Only trope about a character saying or thinking another character was easily forgiven.

Also, if we do make this YMMV, Magolor from Kirby's Return to Dream Land will need to have his Pantheon entry changed as he is currently the god of Easily Forgiven. Luckily, I think Welcome Back, Traitor can serve as a good replacement.

Wick check:

On this page, we will be doing a wick check for Easily Forgiven.

Why? Easily Forgiven is defined as a villain who is forgiven despite committing particularly heinous crimes- in short, a villain who is too vile for the repentance to be believable. The problem is that what qualifies as "too evil to forgive" is subjective- as the wick check will show, it has been used for things ranging from genuinely baffling (genocide, general mass murder, abuse, rape) to more dickish but not particularly heinous things (causing a breakup, firing someone for a dumb reason, insulting someone in public) to Poke the Poodle-level acts and honest mistakes. While the description claims it can be used objectively/in-universe, most wicks read as subjective judgements. On top of that, concerns have been raised about this being redundant to Unintentionally Unsympathetic. At minimum, this should be YMMV, possibly merged into UU, and I can see value in splitting off an In-Universe Examples Only trope about a character saying or thinking another character was easily forgiven.

Wicks checked: 85/85

    open/close all folders 

    Reads as subjective judgement (58/85) 
  1. Characters.MCU Wanda Maximoff:
    • In Age of Ultron, Tony and Banner leave the team in guilt, while Wanda, an ex-HYDRA agent who mind-raped Tony and Banner into building Ultron and Hulking out, isn't blamed by anyone, for anything, to any degree. Instead, she gets enlisted into the Avengers.
    • Averted in WandaVision. She is fully aware that removing the Hex from Westview and sacrificing her family will not be enough for the people she unintentionally mind-controlled to forgive her, so she leaves the town behind and goes into self-imposed exile to learn how to fully control her abilities.
    • In Multiverse of Madness, her Earth-838 counterpart never gave Wanda any harsh words despite the latter's multiple attempts to ruin her life (hijacking her body, then committing several murders and planning to Kill and Replace her to steal her children, to be specific).
  2. GameOfThrones.Tropes E To F:
    • Robert cemented his control of Westeros by forgiving any remaining Targaryen loyalists who surrendered, including Barristan Selmy, Jaime Lannister, Varys, Pycelle, the Tyrells, and the Martells.
    • In season 8 episode 1, Cersei sends Bronn to kill Jaime. The only reason Jaime is even alive by the end of episode 4 is because Tyrion bribed Bronn with the promise of the castle he yearned for the entire series. Despite this, Jaime returns to King's Landing and comforts Cersei in her last moments, dying in embrace with her. In fact, he shuns Brienne, the woman who actually loved and believed him, in order to be by Cersei's side.
  3. Literature.Tara Duncan: Not Brainwashed: Fabrice, regarding his Face–Heel Turn fueled by his lust for power. Later on, he thus seems Easily Forgiven.
  4. Characters.Everhood: (Pink) At the end of the game, everyone Pink meets in the Waiting Room forgives them for their genocide. Given that, after their deaths, they understand that death is not the end, they come to better understand why Pink did what they did.
  5. Fanfic.The Unity Saga: Not quite, as Han never forgives Luke for killing Chewbacca during his stint on the Dark Side until after his erstwhile friend dies, but it's Played Straight by most of the other characters.
  6. Literature.Anansi Boys: Spider commits rape by fraud with Rosie, and she marries him in the end.
  7. Fridge.Baten Kaitos: In Eternal Wings, while Kalas appears to be Easily Forgiven by his comrades after he comes back from his Face–Heel Turn since they don't mention his part in the current disaster very often. When you think about it makes sense, after all. If they mentioned it to the majority of the populace, they'd have no doubt turned into an angry mob and torn him apart.
  8. Series.Why Women Kill: April is infuriated when she realizes that her new friend "Sheila" was in fact the wife of the married man she's been having an affair with. However, she gets over it very quickly when she reads the love confession letter Mary wrote to bait her abusive husband into killing Rob, as it demonstrates Rob's serial infidelity. In the epilogue April and Beth Ann live together and raise April's daughter.
  9. LovingAShadow.Anime And Manga: Naruto:
  10. Film.Radio Rebel: Stacy, considering that she was ruthlessly mean to Tara from the beginning of the film and even more so when she found out that Tara was Radio Rebel. Luckily for her, Tara isn't the type to hold a grudge.
  11. Series.Jessie: Paranoia Gambit: This is unintentionally pulled in the episode "A Close Shave". Bertram and Zuri fear that Luke will want revenge on them for accidentally shaving the middle of his head, despite Luke having already forgiven them. They even end up destroying their own things thinking Luke was giving them as a prank.
  12. Heartwarming.Arlo The Alligator Boy: After spending the whole film trying to avoid his son, Ansel saves Arlo from Ruff and Stucky by revealing his identity as a bird-man, and getting him out of their clutches. Not long after that, he explains everything to Arlo, and by extension, his audience, outright admitting that he had made the worst mistake of his life abandoning his son. Yet despite everything he did, Arlo still instantly forgives him.
  13. VideoGame.Vs Beepie: Boyfriend doesn't hold a grudge against Beepie for her attempts to steal him from Girlfriend, likely since this isn't the first time their lives have been threatened (and also likely since she's not the only BF fangirl), and sings some more songs with her to cheer her up.
  14. Recap.Cheers S 4 E 8: Given what a complete Jerkass Dave was to Sam and Diane back in Season Two's "Old Flames", it's curious that Sam is now on such friendly terms with Dave. It's even curiouser when he doesn't seem to understand why Diane doesn't like Dave, given how hard Dave worked to break Sam and Diane up.
  15. DubInducedPlotHole.Video Games: The English localization of Kingdom Hearts III has an infamous one near the end by completely mistranslating the motivation of one of the series most important characters. In the original Xehanort, while dying, reveals that he believed the war between Light and Dark had become a futile cycle, and his intent was to end the world and start over from scratch, something which is mutated in the localization into him trying to bring "balance" to light and dark, with zero mention of wanting to start from scratch. This ends up making the entire character incoherent, leads to lots of inconsistencies in the storyline, and makes his Alas, Poor Villain look completely unearned.
  16. Film.City Dragon: Ray, after having an affair with his boss, and generally treating Tina like crap (though unlike John, he never physically hurts her, it's mostly just sniping between the two of them), which causes her to walk out on him he...has Philthy play a song on the radio on the off chance Tina will hear it (she does), and then after she gives birth she calls him from the hospital to come see her. It's a bit more understandable after he stops John from hurting the kid, but Tina had already seemed to forgive him before that.
  17. MoralEventHorizon.William Shakespeare: In the last scene of Two Gentlemen of Verona, Proteus tries to rape Silvia (before being talked down by Valentine) and his being rather suddenly forgiven by both Valentine and Julia does not ring true for many modern viewers.
  18. VideoGame.Star Control:
    • The first time you meet Fwiffo on Pluto, he (in typical Spathi fashion) mistakes your harmless lander crew for a hostile force and, without any provocation, opens fire and kills several people. He blames his ship's automated defences for the incident, but it's pretty clear that he is lying. A few minutes and one conversation later, he becomes your first alien ally, and his ship forms an important part of your fleet, potentially for the rest of the game. You can fight him to avenge your dead crew instead, but he's alone on his ship (meaning it has only one hit point), making the victory feel quite hollow, and failing to ally with him makes the game much harder.
    • Pkunk are pretty eager to forgive you after you insulted them and possibly destroyed several of their ships, as long as you promise to "try" not to blow them up anymore.
  19. Series.Wanda Vision: None other than Wanda at the end of the series. Despite having kidnapped an entire town and forced them to play roles in her weird meltdown, including not letting some of them see their children. After beating Agatha, Wanda simply leaves for a journey of self-discovery.
  20. Manga.Silver Diamond:
    • Touji is sent to kill Chigusa, Narushige, and Rakan and also manages to put some holes in Chigusa while attempting to do just that. Doesn't stop Rakan from saving him from getting shot by Chigusa, giving him dinner, and telling the others to be nicer to him - all in the span of a day. Then he gets added to the team.
    • Rakan is the king of this trope. He later forgives another hitman sent by Kinrei, who almost brought a house down on him; a girl who tried to kill all of his comrades so her village would get to keep him forever; and a group of guards who stubbornly refuse to even consider that someone of the Kingen family might not be telling the truth. They all wind up becoming valuable allies and the first two have already undergone a Heel–Face Turn.
    • The great Aversion happens with Hoshinomikoto. Rakan simply cannot forgive the pain he put Chigusa through.
  21. Wrestling.Cody Rhodes: So, Randy Orton can concuss you, your father, and your best friend, but it's all good in the end and you're willing to join with his new group. Worse still was Orton's treatment of DiBiase and Rhodes in Legacy, which consisted of being outright abusive at times and STILL attacking their family members and such. They did eventually get tired of it…which somehow was a Heel–Face Turn for Randy Orton. It was supposed to be the other way around, but fans decided that they hated Ted and Cody more and made Randy the de facto good guy for kicking their asses. The writers ran with it…until Cody's had time to stew over it, and he came back for Orton's blood.
  22. Characters.Harry Potter Ravenclaw: (Marietta Edgecombe) Played with. Cho defends her against Harry even after she ratted on the D.A., the implied justification being that by this point Marietta is Cho's seemingly last friend.
  23. YMMV.Shakugan No Shana: Desingated Hero: To some people, the Snake of the Festival and/or Snake Yuji is a rare antagonist example- he is clearly intended to be a Hero Antagonist who has the noble goal of wanting to create a world where Flame Haze, Crimson Denizens, and Humans can life in harmony. But the things he does in pursuit of this goal are rather hard-to-swallow: sacrificing millions of innocent lives, human and denizen alike, in the war, driving Margery to the Despair Event Horizon, and outright kidnapping Shana to have her stay with him and holding her down on a bed, all while leaving his other love interests Kazumi and Hecate in the dust. Needless to say, some people view him winning and reconciling with Shana as a prime example of an Easily Forgiven Karma Houdini.
  24. BrokenBase.Steven Universe: In "Barn Mates", many viewers felt that Lapis was being unreasonably cruel to Peridot by refusing to even consider she's changed. However, others felt Peridot was Easily Forgiven and the episode gave a Broken Aesop of how victims aren't allowed to be angry at those who hurt them if it's at the expense of their friends, especially after Peridot apologized to Amethyst for being Innocently Insensitive in an earlier episode.
  25. YMMV.Destiny Of The Shrine Maiden: Esoteric Happy Ending: Depending on whether you consider a permissible happy ending to be a reincarnation as a new person, or strange hints of turning girls into "too much" loving sisters, the end of the series can become that. In addition, if we interpret Himeko's words as a sign of preserving their personality after reincarnation, this makes the ending of the anime completely happy (where the Orochi was destroyed permanently and Himeko and Chikane could finally be together forever no matter how many times they reincarnate), and the end of the manga even more embarrassing. There's also the matter that it's an ending where a rape victim forgives and gets together with her rapist, and they reincarnate together for all eternity, which needless to say makes it downright horrifying for those who don't approve of Chikane and Himeko's relationship. However, future works like Shattered Angels, Zettai Shoujo Seiiki Amnesian and Himegami no Miko show that Chikane and Himeko reincarnated several more times, each time without the threat of the Orochi, and usually have better relationships than in the original manga.
  26. DethroningMoment.Anime And Manga: The ending to Fruits Basket would have been good if it weren't for one thing: Akito being a massive Karma Houdini. I get that Tohru is a Nice Girl and it wouldn't be out of character for her to show compassion to her enemies, but did she honestly forget all the atrocities she did? All of the members of the Sohma clan she emotionally and physically abused? Putting Rin and Kisa in the hospital? Ruining Hattori's life? Attempting to kill her and Kyo during her Villainous Breakdown? Akito doesn't need forgiveness. Akito needed time in prison (or at least some serious therapy). I don't care about her Freudian Excuse. Sasuke Uchiha wasn't this Easily Forgiven. And this is only one of several wicks on the page and on Dethroning Moment pages in general.
  27. JerksAreWorseThanVillains.Video Games: The Shantae series has a fun and colorful cast of both heroes and villains. In fact, series Big Bad Risky Boots is a big fan favorite for her competence, attractiveness, and Hidden Depths, and several other villains are nearly as popular- even the Pirate Master and Empress Siren, two surprisingly evil mass-murderers with no redeeming qualities, are loved for how threatening and cool they are. However, many fans utterly loathe Mayor Scuttlebutt for firing Shantae for little to no reason in almost every game and being completely shameless about it, yet getting off with almost no problem every single time. It should say something that it's widely agreed that one of the best parts of Shantae and the Seven Sirens is the fact he doesn't appear at all.
  28. Recap.Kim Possible S 2 E 11 Exchange: Single Woman Seeks Good Man: In addition to his sense of humor, Yori is also attracted to Ron because he is a Nice Guy, as seen by the look she gives him when he forgives Fukushima after he loudly disrespects him in front of everyone.
  29. Improved Second Attempt: In Persona 5, the character of Goro Akechi and his subplot were considered decent in theory but poorly handled in practice, with the game and its characters telling the player he felt kinship with Joker instead of showing it and having him awkwardly dump his backstory without prompting to make the player sympathize with him. The Updated Re-release Royal changed his Confidant from an automatic story one to a manual one, meaning the player needs to actively go out of their way to bond with him, and re-wrote the Confidant to give Akechi and Joker's bond more natural development and make the backstory drops less forced. While the climactic scenes with him are mostly the same as the original, these changes made them feel much more organic. The new third semester returns him to the party, but alleviated fears he would be Easily Forgiven by making him a Token Evil Teammate who the rest of the Phantom Thieves barely tolerate, while giving him a lot of hilarious Comedic Sociopathy.
  30. ComicBook.Chick Tracts:
    • Quite a few people who change their ways upon being converted, especially abusive parents or spouses (Ahmed in "Is Allah Like You?", Roy Davis in "The Secret", and Henry Walker in "Lisa").
    • Surprisingly, initially averted in Happy Hour. After pushing his wife down and indirectly causing her death of a heart attack, and later spending the grocery money on liquor, Jerry tries to apologize to his children, but his children will have none of it until they go to church and learn the value of forgiveness, forgiving him two panels after the previous incident.
    • Eric in Baby Talk, who breaks up with his pregnant girlfriend, leaving her to either get an abortion or raise the baby alone. Granted, he recognizes his mistake and tries to fix it, but she doesn't seem angry at him at any point, and apparently takes him back.
  31. Literature.Clifford The Big Red Dog: Mac cheats against T-Bone in order to win a race against him. When he confesses, his friends take the news just a tad too well.
  32. Recap.Big City Greens S 3 E 8: Bill quickly forgives Cricket for not listening to him. Justified as Cricket both just nearly died and learned his lesson.
  33. Literature.The Familiar Of Zero: Louise essentially kidnaps Saito from his old life by force, enslaves him, forces him to do her chores, beats him whenever she gets upset, and denies him food as punishment when she's unsatisfied with his work. But despite all this, Saito still ends up falling in love with her.
  34. Recap.Bluey Circus: Hercules is accepted into the game (as the "strongman"), even after trying to force the other kids into playing the game he wanted to play.
  35. Characters.Angel Beats: (Ayato Naoi) Even if Death Is Cheap, his pre-Heel–Face Turn actions were too much, but the SSS seems alright with Naoi casually hanging out with them. It's still downplayed; while the SSS are willing to tolerate him, nobody exactly likes him, and Yuri mainly sees him as useful for his Hypnotic Eyes.
  36. Manga.Boruto: Sumire almost destroys the village near the end of her arc in the anime, but she's brought in and reaccepted into the academy despite this. As Shino himself says, it helps that no one was seriously hurt.
  37. RosarioVampireBrightestDarkness.Tropes D To I: The various members of Tsukune's circle of friends can do such things as nearly kill each other and pick fights for the pettiest of reasons, and by the end of the day, Tsukune will have forgiven them and gotten them to forgive each other.
  38. PlayingWith.Turn The Other Cheek: Exaggerated: Summer has made Danny's life a living hell, beat him up for no reason, crossed the Moral Event Horizon in killing his entire family, and tore up a letter to his best friend, but Danny instantly forgives her anyways.
  39. YMMV.She Ra And The Princesses Of Power: Broken Base:
    • In the same vein as Cassandra's in Tangled: The Series, whether or not Catra's redemption was well done. For some, it was a powerful piece of Character Development that put them through the grinder before successfully redeeming them as intended, making them deeply sympathetic and demonstrating how nobody is beyond atonement. For as many others, it was overly rushed favoritism that robbed the character of moral complexity or straight up turned them a Karma Houdini with no more than a slap on the wrist, by failing to fully acknowledge the scope of some of the terrible things they did, such as causing Angella to sacrifice herself, making them Easily Forgiven.
  40. Literature.Re Zero: Subaru can be surpisingly forgiving about being murdered. Being killed by Rem once doesn't prevent Subaru from falling in love with her. He's also quite happy to see Puck for the first time after the spirit killed him, declared his intention to destroy the world, and killed him again.
  41. Memes.Naruto: Chapter 699: ...Yeah, sorry. Explanation 
  42. Film.The Room: Mark nearly shoves Peter over the edge of the roof, and is forgiven almost instantly in an awkward fashion.
  43. ICarly.Tropes A To E: In iCan't Take It, Sam ruins Freddie's chances of getting into an exclusive science camp that would help him get into any college he wants. Because Freddie didn't know what time it was when Sam asked him. Freddie finds out and gets angry, then, after prodding by Carly, forgives her about 2 minutes after and kisses her again to end the episode.
  44. Film.Maleficent: Aurora very easily forgives Maleficent for cursing her to die on her 16th birthday after Maleficent has a Heel–Face Turn and undoes the curse.
  45. Recap.King Of The Hill S 4 E 14 High Anxiety: Karma Houdini: Buck suffers no repercussions after trying to frame Hank, even as he confessed it to the Sheriff (something that's actually illegal) and is Easily Forgiven by Hank (although that's no surprise considering his fervent worship of Buck).
  46. Webcomic.The Bikini Bottom Horror:
    • Gary bears no ill will against the guilty Patrick for killing his owner. As it turns out, it's because he knew SpongeBob didn't really die.
    • Guilty!Patrick is also forgiven, or at least left alone by the remaining citizens of Bikini Bottom as they rebuild. The only one who doesn't, and thinks he got off too easy is Pearl, because Mr. Krabs is dead and she could've stopped the Tortured One due to being a sperm whale. She also derides Patrick (all of them) for being cowardly by waiting to attack until she was on a school trip. Unfortunately, she's the only one who wants revenge for Mr. Krabs, as Sandy points out that the greedy man started the whole thing and got what he deserved.
  47. Fanfic.Wreck It Ralph 2: Vanellope accepts the Sugar Rush II racers' apologies for what Princess Vanellope forced them to do, and invites them to be racers in Sugar Rush to boot.
  48. Characters.Tangled Cassandra: After attempting to kill Rapunzel several times, enslaving people, and taking over Corona in Season 3, the finale has Rapunzel readily forgiving her without holding a grudge, even telling her she loves her after Cassandra's Heel–Face Turn. Eugene is also fine with her despite how rude she was to him and the fact that she tried to kill him, too (even pulling her in for a hug). Justified, as it was made plain how Zhan Tiri had urged Cassandra on, and Cassandra had owned up to her misdeeds enough to shed Tears of Remorse and beg Rapunzel not to forgive her, thinking she doesn't deserve it, helped Rapunzel defeat Zhan Tiri, and temporarily died while doing so.
  49. OnceUponATime.Tropes E To F:
    • Neal seemingly puts his father killing his mother behind him, but isn't over the whole abandoning thing. He also doesn't have a grudge against Hook after selling him out to the Lost Boys.
    • Regina murdered a whole village among other things but apparently that's fine since she wants to be good now.
    • Hook killed David's father but is almost immmediately forgiven because "it was a long time ago" and he's "not that man anymore".
  50. Implied Rape: Futurama: Midway through the second movie, "The Beast with a Billion Backs," it's revealed that Yivo, the monster who had been brainwashing every adult in the universe by sticking tentacles in their necks, was actually mating with them without consent. Despite a few jokes alluding to Black Comedy Rape ("It touched me in a bad place — my spinal cord!" and Yivo claiming "Your universe dresses provocatively"), it's never actually stated to be rape explicitly. This is likely because of Double Standard: Rape, Sci-Fi; Yivo is Easily Forgiven and the entire universe is willing to go on dates with shklim and even live on top of shklim.
  51. Seinfeld.Tropes A To H: Jerry has this in a couple episodes.
  52. NotMeThisTime.Video Games: In Psychonauts, Coach Oleander tries to kidnap everyone at the camp in order to create an army of psychic-powered war machines. As soon as he's thwarted and subsequently reformed, news comes in that the head of the Psychonauts has also been kidnapped. Oleander makes it clear that he had nothing to do with this one, stating "I was here the whole time, you saw me!"
  53. Heartwarming.A Christmas Carol: Some adaptations contain this exchange when Scrooge arrives at Fred's dinner. Never has Easily Forgiven been any sweeter.
    Scrooge: Can you forgive this stubborn, misguided fool?
    Fred: My dear uncle, there's nothing to forgive.
  54. Quotes.Angst Dissonance:
    Another thing among Destiny of the Shrine Maiden's ten thousand sins is codifying that godawful cliche of unrequited lesbian love being the deepest and most undeniable misery there is. It’s so godawfully painful that you're not only justified for murder/rape/deicide/general douchery, but all your stupid friends who've lost their family and friends, or have actually had legitimately awful things happen to them, just CAN'T UNDERSTAND THE DEPTH OF YOUR FEELINGS. And thus you are automatically both way more badass and way more sympathetic than they are. You know. Because.
    Like seriously, Chikane's raped her best friend and murdered all the punch-clock badguys under the pretense of joining them, and their boss is totally cool with it, because her heart is so awash in an ocean of tears that she's capable of becoming the god of grief and loathing. Their team had a rape victim, two political exiles, a eugenics victim, and someone who had to give up their life's dream, but HOLY CRAP CHIKANE. You had a crush on a girl you had Algebra I with, and she didn't like you like that! YOUR GRIEF DOTH OVERSHADOW US ALL.
  55. FandomSpecificPlot.My Hero Academia: In fanfics that have Bakugou's bullying revealed it's fairly common to Izuku being one of his defenders to the point that fics have Izuku convincing the likes of Aizawa or Nedzu to not expel Bakugou on the grounds that he was a product of his environment and deserves a chance to change.(Ex: Deku? I think he's some pro..., Blank Canvas)
  56. Manga.Shitsurakuen: While it is somewhat understandable that some of the guys went along with the system, it still doesn't excuse how extremely cruel they have been treating the girls. The most egregious example of this might be between Koharu and Shinji. He tried to rape her and she is the one who apologizes first (for reasons no mortal could comprehend).
  57. Literature.Dragonkeeper: Kai forgives the emperor for torturing him.
  58. UnintentionallyUnsympathetic.Western Animation: Castlevania (2017):
    • Lenore ultimately came off as this for some viewers. She’s treated as the Token Good Teammate among the four vampire sisters and is meant to be seen as the most sympathetic for the compassion she gives to Hector as well as briefly mentioning a tragic past where her parents were murdered. But her actions in Season 3 i.e manipulating Hector while he’s imprisoned, giving him a Disproportionate Retribution for trying to escape and then tricking Hector by slipping a soul binding ring on him while having sex with him so he’ll obey, comes off as too much of a Moral Event Horizon. In the Season 4 ending, having genuinely bonded with Hector (off-screen) she gives a token apology and is Easily Forgiven by the guy who needed to cut his own finger off to be free of her power. Some even found Lenore’s suicide viva sunlight unsympathetic since said she hates feeling trapped, yet was perfectly okay with her Love Interest being held captive by her for months.

    In-Universe Judgement (10/85) 
  1. Characters.Megalo Box: (Santa, Bonjiri, and Oicho) Averted. When Joe returns, the only one of them and Sachio who could be seen as this is Bonjiri, and even then he's rather awkward about it until Joe gets the deed to his restaurant back and Sachio admits to his role in him leaving. Santa's next to do so, and that's only because his attempt at writing an article about him sparring with Liu left an impression on him and prompted him to give him a chance. Oicho takes the longest of the three to do so, showing up in time help him, Bonjiri, Santa and Aragaki stop the gym he was rebuilding from collapsing in a typhoon, and even then she's somewhat prickly.
  2. Characters.Rosenkreuzstilette: (Grolla Seyfarth)
    • And then after that, her second and saddest Shoot the Dog moment is when she's forced to take on the undead form of her own grandfather and mentor, Raimund Seyfarth. To her, being made to slay her grandpa and lay him back to rest again is Easily Forgiven. But, in her words, the fact that Graf Zeppelin interrupted his peaceful slumber by bringing him Back from the Dead... not so much.
  3. Fanfic.Twice Upon An Age:
    • Invoked by Varric in one of his author's notes, after the Inquisitors make amends following their large disagreement; he remarks that it might seem to the reader like they were too quick to forgive each other. But as he points out, the big problem with their argument was that they were both wrong and they were also both right, and since they're willing to acknowledge that, it's easy for them to forgive.
    • Varric invokes this in his opening notes on Agents Acquired, observing that "Scholar" is quite irritated with him for giving her more work to do; but the reader shouldn't worry, because she always forgives him. The author's own notes more or less confirm this, much to her bemusement.
  4. WebOriginal.Mushroom Land: Berserk Button: You better not call Maggie a retard. Subverted, as Agatha is easily forgiven
    Maggie: YOU are the retard! But I love you anyway.
  5. Funny.Bart Baker: In "Sorry", Justin Bieber acts like a jerk because as long as he "feels regret", he can always go back to act like a douchebag.
  6. DidntThinkThisThrough.Fan Works: For His Own Sake:
    • Naru angrily accuses her family of not really caring about her and cuts them out of her life. After Granny Hina cuts her off for good, she turns around and expects to be Easily Forgiven for her outburst.
  7. HonestTrailers.Tropes E To M: The Honest Trailer for Black Widow (2021) suggests that Malina gets forgiven too easily for her part in forcibly recruiting a multitude of young girls into becoming assassins.
  8. HardTruthAesop.Bojack Horseman: A theme that's returned to many times is that awareness of a problem and feeling contrite about it is not enough to redeem you as a person, particularly when it doesn't stop you from making the same mistakes over and over again. The show is also not shy about insinuating that redemption, as far as Hollywoo imagines it, may not be possible for some people if their victims decide that they're too far gone to accept help anymore. Best exemplified by Todd in "It's You", who sums this up to Bojack by saying "You can't keep doing shitty things and then feel bad about yourself like that makes it okay! You need to be better!"
  9. Film.Undercover Brother: White She Devil, much to Conspiracy Brother's chagrin - especially when she's made an official Agent.
  10. BittersweetEnding.Fan Works: While Heartbreak intially ended on a Downer Ending, it's sequel chapter concludes on a more softer, if still somber, note. Yang reaffirms her love for Garnet and is able to get back together with him, but she will have to live with the fact that she basically broke his heart for nothing, and that Garnet's trust in her is at an all time low, coupled with the fact that she won't be so Easily Forgiven by most of Garnet's friends and family, especially his mother.

    Involves Both (3/85) 
  1. Characters.Friendship Is Magic Starlight Glimmer:
    • True to the nature of the show, the Mane Six forgive Starlight Glimmer for all of the trouble she caused. In the same episode they show it is a downplayed trope. They point out that even though Starlight has turned over a new leaf and is very remorseful, she is still a volatile mixture of friendless, insane power and talent. Worst of all, Starlight has No Social Skills whatsoever; letting her go free would be a mistake. Princess Twilight takes Starlight in as a student in the study of friendship, starting with the Mane Six and Spike. Starlight herself lampshades this in "The Crystalling", still surprised that Twilight Sparkle was able to forgive her so quickly.
    • Downplayed in "Every Little Thing She Does", where Starlight makes a catastrophic mistake mind-controlling her friends with a magic spell. The Mane Six are rightfully pissed off at her, and Starlight has to really work to earn their forgiveness, which she manages to pull off.
  2. Fanfic.Crimson AU:
    • Subverted between Akira and Mishima. While he says he forgives Mishima, he reveals he didn't mean it, and he is still pissed despite understanding the circumstances.
    • Haru has no issue forgiving Makoto for lying to her twice even though she used her as a means to investigating Akira.
  3. Manga.A Silent Voice:
    • When Shoya meets Shoko again after five years, she forgives him and even wants to be his friend after initially running away from him. The problem is the girl's mother, sister and Ishida himself aren't so forgiving of his actions.
    • Despite being one of the main people who caused his bullying back in elementary school, Ishida decides after talking to her a few times in high school that Kawai seems to be pretty nice person. Later on she joins his group of friends. However, after the Drama Bomb, he's far less forgiving of Kawai.
    • While he wasn't nearly as harsh to Nagatsuka, Ishida still insulted him and pushed him away during the Drama Bomb. Nagatsuka's response was to say that Shouya just had a bad day, and he was the one who tried to get everyone back together first after Shoya's coma.

    Flat-out misuse (6/85) 
  1. DarthWiki.A Ko Project: Somewhat, as he goes to jail for what he's done, only seeing people to use his A-Shi-Mode spell on them. Example says the villain goes to jail- doesn't sound like he was forgiven.
  2. Manga.Nononono: Shingu sabotages Shiriya's run in revenge for being sabotaged, and also to be allowed into a prestigious training institution. It turns out that the revenge was purely a very bad misunderstanding and that Shiriya purposely ignored the fact that Shingu sabotaged his skies for Shingu's sake, and to challenge Nonomiya and Amatsu to stretch themselves (they had to make up for his fall in their own jumps). Shingu breaks down, admits his crime, and says he will turn himself in to the police. The team manager and his associate interrupt him and ask him not to do that. Whilst not exactly forgiving him, they understand his anger, and they do not want to disrespect Shiriya's decision. Not forgiven
  3. Characters.Marios Mystery Meat: He quickly gets over his frustration of Sponge popping out of his expensive spaghetti. This hardly seems bad enough to qualify...
  4. Fanfic.Aimless: Averted for Joshua after what happened at the gates of Warfang. Many of the natives are not exactly fond of the guy who killed 60 people, to put it lightly.
    • The aversion also applies to Cynder for her actions while she was under Malefor's control as the infamous Terror of the Skies. So much so that a few of the dragon guards, one of them being Rimeer, schemed to kill her despite all of her efforts to atone. Kilat attacks her as well and only barely tolerates her afterwards at Joshua's behest. Not forgiven.
  5. Fanfic.Syngenesophobia: Averted hardly. The sisters are well aware that what they did to Lincoln is unforgivable, and it may take months or even years before Lincoln is willing to forgive them, if at all. Doesn't stop them from trying, though. Despite this, it's unknown if their friends and classmates would ever forgive them at all. Whether or not they'll come to terms with this is currently unknown. Chapter 27 pretty much confirms that the sisters have accepted that they're outcasts and they have lost most of their friends, only caring that Lincoln recovers. Chapter 37 has Lincoln contemplating if he should forgive his sisters or not, despite feeling remorse or even because of. Mostly, because he fears what will stop them from repeating if they lose their tempers again. By chapter 40, he's at least started the process of reconciliation towards some of the sisters, making forgiveness even more possible.
    • In chapter 41, we see Lori threaten Lincoln after he chastises her. Despite this and being scared of her outburst, Lincoln handles it better than he would have earlier in the story, even taking the time to listen to Lori's apology and explanation, suggesting he may be much further along the process of forgiveness than even he realizes. Example claims to be aversion.
  6. Series.How I Met Your Mother: Averted after Stella leaves Ted at the altar. The gang actively encouraged Ted to let her have it afterwards. Not forgiven, according to the example.

    ZCE (8/85) 
  1. Characters.Princess Sarah: After all that she's been put through, Sarah not only lets Miss Minchin off the hook, but makes a donation of several thousand pounds to the Seminary. Doesn't say what she did, or which one as put through troubles
  2. Fanfic.The Just Series: Flamiken.
  3. WebAnimation.Cops Skyrim: Somehow, against all odds, he managed to get his job back in Season 6. Who? What? Huh?
  4. WesternAnimation.As Told By Ginger: No other way to explain for Dodie and Macie who tried to break Ginger and Darren up.
  5. Manga.Fairy Tail Blue Mistral: Being Fairy Tail yeah. Most of the people who wrong them are usually forgiven if they had some good intentions behind their actions.
  6. Recap.Steven Universe S 5 E 28 Change Your Mind: Steven, Blue, and Yellow don't hold it against White despite everything she's done to them.
  7. Characters.Monster House: (Mr. Nebbercracker) Despite his acts, he ends up being forgiven by the heroes at the end. It probably helps that everyone soon learned he had a fake persona for 45 years and up until that point.
  8. KarmaHoudini.Anime And Manga: The Twelve Kingdoms has Yuka and Kouya, both of whom are Easily Forgiven.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 12th 2023 at 3:43:06 AM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
#2: Jun 28th 2023 at 6:02:35 PM

The title got glitched. Can a mod fix it?

EDIT: They did.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Jun 28th 2023 at 9:02:52 AM

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#5: Jun 28th 2023 at 6:29:08 PM

I'm currently leaning toward keeping this separate from Unintentionally Unsympathetic and making it YMMV without splitting off in-universe examples (we can just mark them as in-universe during wick cleanup if we don't split them off).

I wonder if the TRS thread for Insane Forgiveness affected Easily Forgiven's current state, since the former was The Same, but More to the latter (of the "done badly" variant due to the complaining it attracted). I skimmed the beginning of the subjective section of the wick check and didn't really see complaining, so maybe the complaining was cleaned up, leaving subjectivity as the main issue here.

Edit: After thinking about the in-universe examples a bit more, I suppose we could sandbox in-universe examples to see how many examples we'd have if we split an IUEO counterpart off (to have an idea of what the wick count would be after crosswicking), similarly to what we did with Gold Tooth having two tropes spun off it and Formal Characters Use Keigo being made to house non-Chairsy Keigo examples.

Edit: Oh, right, and regarding the Pantheon, are YMMV items not allowed? I've been told indexes are allowed, so not everything has to be a trope (which this wouldn't be if we mark it as YMMV), though I was also told Sugar Wiki pages aren't allowed when Surprisingly Good Foreign Language was removed from the Pantheon.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 28th 2023 at 8:35:26 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
wootzits Since: Apr, 2010
#6: Jun 28th 2023 at 6:50:04 PM

The Pantheon does use YMMV items. It's fine.

Edited by wootzits on Jun 28th 2023 at 2:50:19 PM

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#7: Jun 28th 2023 at 6:58:23 PM

Alright, but even if this isn’t necessarily complainy, it is still a little too inherently subjective to be on Main.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#8: Jun 28th 2023 at 7:06:22 PM

The easiest fix I can think of will be to rename it "Instantly Forgiven".

Tropes are fictional, oft unrealistic, conventions used as a tool to serve a story. "Instantly Forgiven" keeps the tool (skipping the need to add a realistic redemption arc) while removing the subjective part (if audiences think they deserve such quick forgiveness).

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#9: Jun 28th 2023 at 7:13:13 PM

That can work for the In-Universe version, as long as we define what exactly is the scope for this (like, someone stealing from the cookie jar, getting caught, saying sorry, and then instantly being forgiven wouldn’t strike me as noteworthy as instantly forgiving, say, a supervillain).

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Adept (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
#10: Jun 28th 2023 at 8:06:08 PM

[up][up]I feel like whether or not the instant forgiveness is "realistic" is also subjective.

Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
#11: Jun 28th 2023 at 8:25:54 PM

YMMV split Too Easily Forgiven and retool current trope as Quickly Forgiven? So it can cover examples of instant forgiveness for any level of badness and for any character or story-given reason while the subjective judgment thing becomes YMMV?

Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the Retromancer
#12: Jun 28th 2023 at 10:06:36 PM

It may be subjective what is subjective (or examples lack context), but I'd consider how many examples are

  • Main characters being forgivng people in general
  • Karma Houdini
  • Villain pulling a Heel–Face Turn without the need of being beaten up
  • Anger disappears quickly
  • Audience commenting on a lack of Karma

Edited by Amonimus on Jun 29th 2023 at 2:49:15 PM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
#13: Jun 29th 2023 at 12:31:43 AM

I personally feel like this is different enough from Unintentionally Unsympathetic for them not to be merged, partly because the character who's Easily Forgiven doesn't have to be UU. Currently, I'm leaning on the suggestions on[up][up].

MorganWick (Elder Troper)
#14: Jun 29th 2023 at 4:47:23 AM

Oldest Internet Archive copy. I don't know when the Insane Forgiveness thread was, so here's the copy from ten years after the first one.

themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
MorganWick (Elder Troper)
#16: Jun 29th 2023 at 4:50:15 AM

Okay, so here's the state of the page before that thread got going.

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#17: Jun 29th 2023 at 8:37:26 AM

I agree with the name idea Tabs came up with for the IUEO version (Quickly Forgiven) since strikes me as putting more emphasis on the character doing the forgiving instead of the character being forgiven (at least to a greater extent than the current name), and while I like the name suggested for the YMMV move (Too Easily Forgiven), I do feel that the Easily Forgiven name may still work for the YMMV page. We could vote for whether to rename, anyway (and we'd do a name crowner anyway if we split this between YMMV and IUEO without TLP).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 29th 2023 at 10:38:20 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#18: Jun 29th 2023 at 11:14:07 AM

[up]If we make it YMMV, how would (Too) Easily Forgiven be worth keeping separate from Unintentionally Unsympathetic or Why Would Anyone Take Him Back?

Keep in mind Karma Houdini must be intentional (it's not YMMV) by the work and only applies to unrepentant villains, as repentance means they're owning up to karma. Cleanups I took it to agreed. Easily Forgiven is different than KH in that those forgiven are portrayed as done something karmically deserving of forgiveness, even if just show due remorse (I've practically never seen EF used when they were portrayed as wrong for forgiving them, more argument for being redundant with UU).

Karmic Overkill is separate from unintentionallySympathetic as they can be as unsympathetic as intended but still find their punishment, portrayed as just by the work, as unfairly excessive. YMMV Easily Forgiven seems like the equivalent for UU, "Karmic Underkill", where audiences agree that they deserved their redemptions/forgiveness but felt what they did to so deserve it was too little/their reward too much.

That sound viable? (This would answer the UU debate on Anakin/Vader that came up repeatedly.)

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Jun 29th 2023 at 11:17:36 AM

selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#19: Jun 29th 2023 at 11:21:15 AM

I was gonna suggest the same as 𝕋𝕒𝕓𝕤 proposed.

We shouldn't stop a tropeable and viable concept from being its own trope just because it might catch some complaining. The problem, to me, seems that it's a bit too subjective for a non-YMMV entry.

Should we make a separate trope for In-Universe acknowledgment of easy forgiveness, or does it not have enough examples?

WarJay77 Big Catch, Sparkle Edition from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
#20: Jun 29th 2023 at 11:34:11 AM

I don't mind a split. I think this can be handled by having the IUEO version focus on the forgiveness being immediate, instead of it happening too easily. Of course, there will still have to be some restrictions; forgiving a kid who accidentally scratched the car while playing is much different from forgiving the former villain who tried to kill you every Tuesday, and I don't think the first one should really count.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Captain of USS Bajor
#21: Jun 29th 2023 at 11:41:52 AM

Just to get some idea of what people think is and isn't an objective use of the trope, here's one that I wrote a while back for Trapped in a Dating Sim: The World of Otome Games is Tough for Mobs:

  • Loic Leta Batrielle: After stalking, kidnapping, beating, and attempting to forcibly marry Noelle [one of the haremettes], it seems a bit of a stretch that Marie [the deuteragonist], whose own abusive boyfriend killed her in her previous life and who identified the signs on Noelle to Leon [the MC], would willingly have him anywhere within ten miles of her. And yet for some bizarre reason she doesn't kick him right back to the curb when he starts trying to date her.

What do you guys think?

Edited by StarSword on Jun 29th 2023 at 2:42:14 PM

WarJay77 Big Catch, Sparkle Edition from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
#22: Jun 29th 2023 at 11:59:52 AM

That's subjective, it injects too much emotion and judgement into the situation. An objective example wouldn't use language like the one that example uses, and it'd be focused less on how bizarre it is and more on the basic facts of how easily the character was forgiven.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 29th 2023 at 3:01:00 PM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#23: Jun 29th 2023 at 12:18:33 PM

Ok, but does the example not count at all regardless of how it's written, or it counts, but it just needs to be rephrased more objectively? I haven't used the trope before, but I write in the same way as Star.

So, which one would fit your redefinition, "Amy was abused by her husband for years, but when it comes to testifying against him in court, she forgives him and covers up for his violence with her" OR "Amy immediately forgives her husband every time he beats her up to the point where she doesn't ask for a compensation from him and refuses to testify against him in court"? Or maybe neither?

Note that these are hypothetical cases.

WarJay77 Big Catch, Sparkle Edition from The Void (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
#24: Jun 29th 2023 at 12:22:22 PM

The second one is more in-line with what I'm thinking, though that's pretty extreme.+; the only reason I think it may count is because it fits the "immediate forgiveness" idea, assuming the husband at least attempts to apologize in between. Anyway, I can't say if it actually counts for the objective version since IDK the work, and I was only trying to answer the "is this objective" question — any examples that take on an audience perspective and make value judgements over what happens are inherently subjective, and that's the only thing I was trying to say.

A hypothetical example of the objective trope, IMO, would read something like:

"Captain Evulz burned down Bob's planet and enslaved all of the Tropelings to work in his coal mines. Despite this, when he seeks forgiveness in the final episode, all of the heroes accept him into the team immediately."

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 29th 2023 at 3:23:12 PM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#25: Jun 29th 2023 at 12:51:31 PM

Hmm, thinking about it a bit more, the ''Trapped in a Dating Sim" example doesn't count bc it's not about the character's forgiveness or how quick it is, it's more about how she didn't do anything in general to get rid of him, which obviously isn't what we're focusing on here. I watched the anime but I'm not caught up with any side material so I can't tell if it really counts or not. I'm just going by the context.

Trope Repair Shop: Easily Forgiven
9th Jul '23 3:21:29 AM

Crown Description:

Easily Forgiven was made In Universe Examples Only and limited to examples involving explicit in-universe judgment, the requirement that the person being forgiven is a villain was removed, and the trope is being renamed. What should Easily Forgiven's new name be?

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