History Main / RomanticismVersusEnlightenment

** Enlightenment advocates will usually believe that "widespread ignorance causes Dystopia" (sometimes bringing up the era that they called the "[[TheDungAges Dark Ages]]") and [[AWorldHalfFull squabble about how education will save us all from it]]. They also point out that for all that romanticists trump up non-conformity, their glorification of "a lost GoldenAge" rather than building something new, is conforming to the past, which was in most cases a {{Dystopia}} for a greater portion of the population who were kept ignorant, oppressed and stiffled. While Enlightenment will confess to a FullCircleRevolution and other failures, they will also try and invoke WhatTheRomansHaveDoneForUs.

* Some kind of this also existed in the society of the Russian Empire, starting from about the middle of the 19th century, due to uncertainty about the future path of Russia's development. Slavophiles insisted on the uniqueness of both the culture and traditions of Russia itself and its historical path, condemning the reforms of UsefulNotes/PeterTheGreat and considering monarchy (autocratic tsarism) a natural form of government for a country like Russia. Another philosophical trend, Westernizers, on the contrary, believed that Russia was significantly lagging behind Western Europe and should have caught up as quickly as possible through reforms, both socio-cultural and political-economic, and transformation into either a constitutional monarchy or a parliamentary democratic republic. However, both of them understood the need for technological modernization (especially after the Crimean War) and the abolition of serfdom. Also, both trends opposed any revolutionary transformations, and had a somewhat negative attitude towards the policy of the Russian Empire itself, since the tsarist regime had features of both worldviews, not ultimately inclining towards either of them.

* Some kind of this also existed in the society of the Russian Empire, starting from about the middle of the 19th century due to uncertainty about the future path of Russia's development. Slavophiles insisted on the uniqueness of both the culture and traditions of Russia itself and its historical path, condemning the reforms of UsefulNotes/PeterTheGreat and considering monarchy (autocratic tsarism) a natural form of government for a country like Russia. Another philosophical trend, Westernizers, on the contrary, believed that Russia was significantly lagging behind Western Europe, and should have caught up as quickly as possible, through reforms, both socio-cultural and political-economic, and transformation into either a constitutional monarchy or a parliamentary democratic republic. However, both of them understood the need for technological modernization (especially after the Crimean War) and the abolition of serfdom. Also, both trends opposed any revolutionary transformations, and had a somewhat negative attitude towards the policy of the Russian Empire itself, since the tsarist regime had features of both worldviews, not ultimately inclining towards either of them.

* The original seven factions in ''VideoGame/SidMeiersAlphaCentauri'' fall under this trope to one degree or another. [[AlternativeCharacterInterpretation Due to the various interpretations]] [[GreyAndGrayMorality and practical implementations of their philosophical aspirations]], it is impossible to look at any of the factions from just one angle. But, nevertheless, all factions definitely take their position on this spectrum (from most romantic to most enlightened):

** Spartan Federation consists mainly of [[TheSocialDarwinist darwinist-leaning survivalists]] who believe that humanity must completely turn into a [[ProudWarriorRace race of warriors]] in order to survive [[DeathWorld in this new world]]. Also, as the name suggests, they are inspired by Ancient Sparta, [[FantasyCounterpartCulture taking its society as a model]], [[TheSpartanWay while creating strictly hierarchical and militarized state]].

** Human Hive reflects the ideas of the Enlightenment in a slightly [[TotalitarianUtilitarian more utilitarian]] way. From the perspective of [[TheStoic Chairman Sheng-Ji]] [[TheSociopath Yang]], [[TheNeedsOfTheMany the benefit of each individual is measured by their ability to help the entire collective]]. [[HumanResources Even after their death]]. Most of Hive bases are underground, and in general, the Hive is more likely to try to subjugate nature than try to find a common language with it, since the environment of Chiron is perceived as the same opponent as other human factions. [[NatureIsNotNice Not too unreasonably, however]].

[[quoteright:300:https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/delacroix-paganini1_7610.jpg]][[quoteright:300:https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/ingres-paganini2_9075.jpg]]

** Morgan Industries is a faction of all those who believe that capitalism is ideal or simply the most natural form of economy. [[PrivatelyOwnedSociety Everything has a price]], and a prosperous society must inexorably grow and expand at the expense of both other factions and even the Planet itself. [[GaiasLament The latter is particularly unhappy with the Morganites]], due to their consumerist philosophy and love of the free market economy, but in general the Morganites are not too interested in moral dilemmas, [[TheHedonist being in fact more materialistic than anyone else]].

** Lord's Believers ideology basis is Christianity, [[TheFundamentalist with an ambiguous degree of fundamentalism]]. [[ScienceIsWrong They are highly skeptical of science as a method of understanding reality]], [[AppealToTradition turning instead to traditions]]. And of course, they are extreme conservatives [[AIIsACrapshoot who will never accept AI]] or [[ScaleOfScientificSins other such perversions as the norm]].
** Gaia's Stepdaughters are [[NatureHero environmentalists]] [[InHarmonyWithNature who seek understanding with the nature of]] [[GeniusLoci Chiron]], [[AppealToNature accepting it as the only correct source of wisdom]]. If someone dares to challenge the Planet and its ecology, [[GaiasVengeance they will be more than happy to become an incarnation of its revenge]]. With no apparent disregard for progress and technology, Stepdaughters' ideal society is something like {{Arcadia}}.

** Morgan Industries is a faction of all those who believe capitalism is ideal, or just a natural form of economy. [[PrivatelyOwnedSociety Everything has a price]], and a prosperous society must inexorably grow and expand at the expense of both other factions and even the Planet itself. [[GaiasLament The latter is particularly unhappy with the Morganites]], due to their consumerist philosophy and love of the free market economy, but in general the Morganites are not too interested in moral dilemmas, [[TheHedonist being in fact more materialistic than anyone else]].

** Spartan Federation are mostly [[TheSocialDarwinist darwinist-leaning survivalists]] who believe that humanity must completely turn into a [[ProudWarriorRace race of warriors]] in order to survive [[DeathWorld in this new world]]. Also, as the name suggests, they are inspired by Ancient Sparta, [[FantasyCounterpartCulture taking its society as a model]], [[TheSpartanWay while creating strictly hierarchical and militarized state]].

* The {{Myth/Arthurian Legend}}s, while predating both movements by centuries, can be considered Proto-Enlightenment in that they involve efforts by Arthur and his Round Table to create a more perfect society, Camelot, in a time of [[CrapsackWorld Chaos]] and [[DarkAges Darkness]] that followed the collapse of the Roman Empire. This is especially applicable to the early Chronicles (e.g. Geoffrey of Monmouth's Historia Regum Britainniae) as a way of showing what authors believed to be [[{{Utopia}} model societies]] in the face of [[RapePillageAndBurn ravages of Barbarians]] and other afflictions in the Post-Roman era.\\\

** Lord's Believers ideology basis is Christianity, [[TheFundamentalist with an ambiguous degree of fundamentalism]]. [[ScienceIsWrong They are highly skeptical of science as a method of understanding the world]], [[AppealToTradition turning instead to the traditions]]. And of course, they are extreme conservatives [[AIIsACrapshoot who will never accept AI]] or [[ScaleOfScientificSins other such perversions as the norm]].

** Spartan Federation are mostly [[TheSocialDarwinist darwinist survivalists]], who believe that humanity must completely turn into a [[ProudWarriorRace race of warriors]] in order to survive [[DeathWorld in this new world]]. Also, as the name suggests, they are inspired by Ancient Sparta, [[FantasyCounterpartCulture taking its society as a model]], [[TheSpartanWay while creating strictly hierarchical and militarized state]].

** Human Hive reflects the ideas of the Enlightenment in a slightly [[TotalitarianUtilitarian more utilitarian]] way. From the perspective of [[TheStoic Chairman Sheng-Ji]] [[TheSociopath Yang]], [[TheNeedsOfTheMany the benefit of each individual is measured by their ability to help the entire collective]]. [[HumanResources Even after their death]]. Most of Hive bases are underground, and in general, the Hive is more likely to try to subjugate nature than try to find a common language with it, since the environment of Chiron is perceived as the same opponent as other human factions. [[NatureIsNotNice Not too unreasonable, however]].
** University of Planet's main beliefs are that ScienceIsGood, {{Technocracy}} is the best form of government, [[OutgrownSuchSillySuperstitions while religious fundamentalism is a dead end, from a moral and social point of view]]. They are more than willing to take some risky experiments and [[EvilLuddite see the enemies of progress as the main threat]]. Moreover, they are ready to find answers to any question, [[LackOfEmpathy often sacrificing the emotional aspect]], if necessary.

** University of Planet's main beliefs are that ScienceIsGood, {{Technocracy}} is the best form of government, [[OutgrownSuchSillySuperstitions while religious fundamentalism is a dead end, from a moral and social point of view]]. They are more than willing to take some risky experiments and [[EvilLuddite see the enemies of progress as the main threat]]. Even more, they are ready to find answers to any question, [[LackOfEmpathy often sacrificing the emotional-sensual aspect]], if necessary.

** Gaia's Stepdaughters are [[NatureHero environmentalists]] [[InHarmonyWithNature who seek understanding with the nature of]] [[GeniusLoci Chiron]], [[AppealToNature accepting it as the only correct source of wisdom]]. If someone dares to challenge the Planet and its ecology, [[GaiasVengeance they will be more than happy to become an incarnation of its revenge]]. With no apparent disregard for progress and technologies, Gaia's ideal society is something like {{Arcadia}}.

** Gaia's Stepdaughters are [[NatureHero environmentalists]] [[InHarmonyWithNature who seek understanding with the nature of]] [[GeniusLoci Chiron]] [[AppealToNature accepting it as the only correct source of wisdom]]. If someone dares to challenge the Planet and its ecology, [[GaiasVengeance they will be more than happy to become an incarnation of its revenge]]. With no apparent disregard for progress and technologies, Gaia's ideal society is something like {{Arcadia}}.
** Spartan Federation are mostly [[TheSocialDarwinist darwinist survivalists]], they believe that humanity must completely turn into a [[ProudWarriorRace race of warriors]] in order to survive [[DeathWorld in this new world]]. Also, as the name suggests, they are inspired by Ancient Sparta, [[FantasyCounterpartCulture taking its society as a model]], [[TheSpartanWay while creating strictly hierarchical and militarized state]].

** Morgan Industries is a faction of all those who believe capitalism is ideal, or just a natural form of economy. [[PrivatelyOwnedSociety Everything has a price]], and a prosperous society must inexorably grow and expand at the expense of both other factions and even the Planet itself. [[GaiasLament The latter is particularly unhappy with the Morganites]], due to their consumer philosophy and love of the free market economy, but in general the Morganites are not too interested in moral dilemmas, [[TheHedonist being in fact more materialistic than anyone else]].

* In ''Fanfic/{{Nosflutteratu}}'', Pinkie Pie helps Twilight resolve her dilemma by tricking her into thinking with her heart not her head.

** Finally, the powers demonstrated by the beings worshiped on the show are never described in divine or supernatural terms. All of them exist either a result of technology, or, in the case of godlike beings like the Ancients and the Ori, evolution.
-->'''Daniel Jackson''': Just because I don't know how the trick is done doesn't make it magic.

** More common among the Enlightenment figures, but war involves the tragic deaths of the noble, the splitting of families by death or divided loyalties, and [[WorthyOpponent Worthy Opponents]] who could have been friends killing each other simply for being on opposite sides - all causes for misery for Romantics. In Enlightenment stories, the emphasis is on WhatASenselessWasteOfHumanLife and resources, due to war exacting a high cost on a nations wealth and the civilian population.

* SlidingScaleOfFreeWillVersusFate: Generally speaking, Enlightenment argues in favor of ScrewDestiny, with its focus on progression, idealism and science, while Romanticism favors BecauseDestinySaysSo, with its focus on mythology, and philosophers like Schopenhauer emphasizing how humans are driven by non-rational motives that make any long term improvement at best temporary, at worst an illusion, but there's a ''lot'' of variation, with some Enlightenement philosophers such as d'Holbach and some scientists arguing that free will is an illusion, and many Romanticists like Byron glorifying political or individual rebellions, and philosophers like Creator/SorenKierkegaard giving incredible weight to the subject of individual responsibility.

* Andrew Miller's ''Literature/{{Pure}}'' is set just before the French Revolution, before the days of Romanticism, but deals with basically this conflict. Should we sweep away the past and look rationally towards a better future, or is history too much a part of us, societally and emotionally?

** Despite being a communist nation, the USSR actually had extensively Romantic undertones, albeit underlined in the rhetoric of communism. Given the dominance of Romanticism in Russian culture around the rise of communism and not having undergone the same level of Enlightenment-based reforms as western Europe (a very prominent example is how Russian serfdom was abolished in ''1861'' when having done so several decades if not centuries prior in the west though a large part of that was serfdom being introduced much later in Eastern Europe than Western Europe.)

* Analytic Philosophy (Enlightenment) and Continental Philosophy (Romanticism) at least in the eyes of UsefulNotes/BertrandRussell. Continental philosophers on the other hand see themselves very much in the spirit of Enlightenment, and their emphasis on argument from first principles and constant engagement with society lead them to form the social sciences.

* You would think that software developers would tilt completely toward Englightenment, but this thing also crops up there with the free and open source movements on the Romantic side and proprietary developers on the Enlightened. Open source developers generally avoid things like detailed software designs, documentation (when they can get away with it) and testing. Proprietary developers produce a lot of useful software as well, but their development processes tend to be very bureaucratic and their programs very large.
* The phrase "Everything's A Remix" is definitely Romantic along with works like ''RIP: A Remix Manifesto'' and so on.
* Russian occultist and Putin advisor Alexander Dugin's ideology is heavily romanticist mixing technology pessimism with strong emphasis on tradition and lore about ancient conspiracies.

* The american neoreactionary movement and the french archeofuturist movement both break the dichotomy. Both envision a cross between extreme traditionalism and scientific rationalism, which often results in a fantasy of a new middle ages where kingdoms use modern tech like nuclear power and genetic engineering. In case of the archeofuturists, it has to be said, that, like the name suggests, they see themselves as the successors of the futurist art movement rather than the enlightenment. Futurism can be seen a a form of romanticism embracing technology.

* John F Kennedy's Rice University Moon Effort oozes Enlightenment. Seriously, you could make an enlightenment motto out of the iconic lines: "We choose to go to the Moon! We choose to go to the Moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard; because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one we intend to win, and the others, too." The sheer pomp and circumstance, idealism, and unwavering courage gives it the Enlightenment stamp of approval.

* Some kind of this also existed in the society of the Russian Empire, starting from about the middle of the 19th century due to uncertainty about the future path of development of Russia. Slavophiles insisted on the uniqueness of both the culture and traditions of Russia itself and its historical path, condemning the reforms of UsefulNotes/PeterTheGreat and considering monarchy (autocratic tsarism) a natural form of government for a country like Russia. Another philosophical trend, Westernizers, on the contrary, believed that Russia was significantly lagging behind Western Europe, and should have caught up as quickly as possible, through reforms, both socio-cultural and political-economic, and transformation either into a constitutional monarchy or into a parliamentary democratic republic. However, both of them understood the need for technological modernization (especially after the Crimean War) and the abolition of serfdom. Also, both trends opposed any revolutionary transformations, and had a somewhat negative attitude towards the policy of the Russian Empire itself, since the tsarist regime had features of both worldviews, not ultimately inclining towards either of them.

Some Eighteenth century people believed that reason and science are good and therefore things would just go on improving forever. This optimism characterized a period that came to be known as [[UsefulNotes/TheEnlightenment the Age of Enlightenment]]. At the end of this period, mass movements in America and France, and the UsefulNotes/IndustrialRevolution in England, changed the world forever, making people realize that society in the 19th Century was the first that could conceive itself to be radically different from the past. This led to a sense of disillusionment and alienation began to spread, and the {{Romanticis|m}}t movement rose up as a backlash. Romanticists believed that the advances made by UsefulNotes/TheEnlightenment were creating an [[{{Dystopia}} oppressive, and conformist society]] - and that science and rationality could never hope to truly understand the world and the human personality and that the modern world's progress came at the price of [[YeGoodeOldeDays cherished values from the distant past]] which was slowly dying out. Though the Enlightenment and Romanticist movements are long gone, the general ideas behind each - the dialectic, if you will - survives to this present day.

Bear in mind that contemporary invocations of the Enlightenment and Romanticist theme does not quite conform to the original Englightenment and Romanticist movements. The works of Rousseau, Voltaire, Locke, Hume, Gibbon, Wordworth, Byron, Keats and Shelley have greater instances of continuity, UnbuiltTrope and nuance than the modern perception of that era. The general perception is that writers and artists gravitate towards Romanticism, while scientists favor the Enlightenment. Politicians (in most places) favor the Enlightenment while appealing to Romantic sentiments of nationalism, traditions (real and invented) and culture. Seeing as MostWritersAreWriters, Romanticism is generally overrepresented in media, with the exception of ScienceFiction writers (and even there most well-known classics usually have a Romanticist message).

* ''LightNovel/ACertainMagicalIndex'' has this as one of the central themes of the series and takes it to [[MagicVersusScience near-literal levels]], with the Magic Side being Romanticism and the Science Side being Enlightenment. It reaches its pinnacle during World War III, and ultimately [[spoiler:the Science Side wins, making the series more towards Enlightenment]].

* ''LightNovel/BlackBullet'' leans heavily towards the enlightenment side. One of the main themes is that humanity lives in a CrapsackWorld where Gastrea destroyed most of humanity and cursed children live with constant discrimination and racism. The protagonist wish to destroy the Gastrea and want to reform society to create a better life for both humanity and cursed children. In particular, Seitenshi serves as a Martin Luther King Jr. type figure who wants to implement civil rights for the cursed children and wishes to reunite humanity and cursed children in society to defeat the Gastrea. The protagonist, Rentaro Satomi, also share the same goals with Seitenshi, as he's a [[TheNeedsOfTheMany utilitarian]] who does not want to see anyone suffering and want to bring happiness to the cursed children's lives that they never had. Interestingly enough, Rentaro's partner and cursed child Initiator, Enju Aihara, falls into both sides of the spectrum [[note]]Enju also shares the same goals with Rentaro and Seitenshi and wanted to use her abilities to defeat the Gastrea, but she [[AllLovingHero has strong beliefs of love and forgiveness]] and that hope that one day, [[ThePowerOfLove her love and compassion for everyone]] will hope that humanity will accept her kind.[[/note]]

** [[spoiler:Edelgard primarily stands for the Enlightenment ideals, pushing for dismantlement of [[SuperpowerfulGenetics Crest-powered]] nobility order, [[OutgrownSuchSillySuperstition de-emphasizing the role]] [[BeliefMakesYouStupid of organized religion]] and establishment of a more egalitarian society, greater inclusion of commoners and judging others by their own skills and merits rather than anything. Personality-wise, [[TheWomanWearingTheQueenlyMask she displays a cool, calculated, dignified air with her personal feelings hidden]]. Sadly, [[WellIntentionedExtremist the ways she uses to bring her dream to reality include a lot of bloodshed and disorder]], and [[TheUnfettered she will even overcome the attachments to her friends to achieve the ends]]; consequently, in routes other than her own she will have to be killed to stop the war. On the other hand, in her own route Edelgard has a more expressed ByronicHeroine personality, which is associated with Romanticism, and develops stronger emotional connections to her teammates.]]

* The only time where Creator/AlexandreCabanel rebelled against the StrictlyFormula of the [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academic_art Academic Art]] (the Enlightenment's artistic spring off) was during his formative years. When he painted ''Art/TheFallenAngel'' as a student, his technique was not yet the absolute perfection the Academy demanded and his imprinting of emotions was deemed more appropriate for {{Romanticism}} than for Academicism (aka, UsefulNotes/TheEnlightenment). Mind you, the [[https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idealismo_art%3C!--C3--%3EADstico idealization]] of emotions meant some degree of dispassion.

* ''Music/{{Rush|Band}}'': "Cygnus X-1 Book II: Hemispheres", from the album ''Music/{{Hemispheres}}'', is about this conflict nearly tearing the Greco-Roman pantheon apart until [[spoiler:the explorer from "Cygnus X-1 Book I: The Voyage" appears out of nowhere, the eponymous UnrealisticBlackHole having ripped his soul out of his body, and advocates the coexistence of both, with Apollo and Dionysus tasking him to maintain this balance as Cygnus]].

-->-- '''Music/{{Rush|Band}}''', arguing that the conflict is folly and that ''[[TakeAThirdOption both]]'' are necessary, "Cygnus X-1 Book II: Music/{{Hemispheres}}"