Follow TV Tropes

Following

History Main / MyCountryRightOrWrong

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


*** Eldigan of Nordion, best friends with Sigurd and Quan, and the brother of Princess Raquesis, who fought because Agustrian usurper King Chagall threatened to smear mud on his name. And if you don't fight him and, instead, get Raquesis the Earth Sword, Eldigan will still be executed by Chagall and the Cross Knights will continue to battle you.

to:

*** Eldigan of Nordion, best friends with Sigurd and Quan, and the brother of Princess Raquesis, Lachesis, who fought because Agustrian usurper King Chagall threatened to smear mud on his name. And if you don't fight him and, instead, get Raquesis Lachesis the Earth Sword, Eldigan will still be executed by Chagall and the Cross Knights will continue to battle you.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** This trope also applies to [[spoiler:Reiner's 12-year-old cousin Gabi]], who is likewise [[spoiler:a {{Child Soldier|s}} under the same military program. Gabi's hoping to inherit Reiner's Armored Titan]]. Part of her character growth is [[eventually realising that she's been brainwashed and that those living within the walls aren't the devils she's been taught about]]. A catalyst for this is [[spoiler:her friend Falco, who realises this before Gabi does, and tries to tell her that her views are wrong. Gabi doesn't take kindly to that.]]

to:

** This trope also applies to [[spoiler:Reiner's 12-year-old cousin Gabi]], who is likewise [[spoiler:a {{Child Soldier|s}} under the same military program. Gabi's hoping to inherit Reiner's Armored Titan]]. Part of her character growth is [[eventually [[spoiler:eventually realising that she's been brainwashed and that those living within the walls aren't the devils she's been taught about]]. A catalyst for this is [[spoiler:her friend Falco, who realises this before Gabi does, and tries to tell her that her views are wrong. Gabi doesn't take kindly to that.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** This trope also applies to [[spoiler:Reiner's 12-year-old cousin Gabi]], who is likewise [[spoiler:a {{Child Soldier|s}} under the same military program. Gabi's hoping to inherit Reiner's Armored Titan]].

to:

** This trope also applies to [[spoiler:Reiner's 12-year-old cousin Gabi]], who is likewise [[spoiler:a {{Child Soldier|s}} under the same military program. Gabi's hoping to inherit Reiner's Armored Titan]]. Part of her character growth is [[eventually realising that she's been brainwashed and that those living within the walls aren't the devils she's been taught about]]. A catalyst for this is [[spoiler:her friend Falco, who realises this before Gabi does, and tries to tell her that her views are wrong. Gabi doesn't take kindly to that.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** One Cardassian tried to pass himself off as [[spoiler:Gul Darhe'el]], the commander in charge of a brutal Bajoran concentration camp, and be arrested and charged with war crimes which he gleefully admitted to and showed great pleasure in. In truth, he was a simple file clerk that was stationed there and was tortured by the inhumanity of the situation and haunted about his inability to do anything. He only played up on the role in the hopes that he would be prosecuted, all For the Good of Cardassia.

to:

** One A complex version occurs in an episode where a high-ranking Cardassian tried to pass himself off as [[spoiler:Gul Darhe'el]], the commander in charge officer guilty of a brutal Bajoran concentration camp, and be arrested and charged with terrible war crimes which he gleefully admitted to is captured, and showed great pleasure in. In truth, he proudly justifies his crimes as being necessary for the good of Cardassia. [[spoiler: Turns out, the war criminal was a simple file clerk that was stationed there and was tortured already dead. Their captive had been horrified by the inhumanity of the situation war crimes and haunted about assumed his inability to do anything. He only played up on the role in the hopes identity so there could be a public trial and punishment. The kicker was that he would be prosecuted, all For was ''still'' entirely loyal to Cardassia, and considered the Good public reckoning to be part of Cardassia.setting his society right.]]

Added: 269

Removed: 312

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Book 3 of inverts this with Azula. She is surprisingly sisterly with her brother Zuko when he returns home with her and fiercely antagonistic towards him [[spoiler:upon learning of his defection]]. If you're against the Fire Nation, hope you don't have to cross her.



* Book 3 of ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'' inverts this with Azula. She is surprisingly sisterly with her brother Zuko when he returns home with her and fiercely antagonistic towards him [[spoiler:upon learning of his defection]]. If you're against the Fire Nation, hope you don't have to cross her.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* ''Series/{{Zorro}}'', in the 1957 series, is shown fighting for his beloved Spain, even against revolutionaries... even though it is repeatedly shown to be a totalitarian regime that cares more about its own petty wars than its citizens. The sequels made sure to rectify this.

to:

* ''Series/{{Zorro}}'', in ''Series/{{Zorro|1957}}'': In the 1957 series, Zorro is shown fighting for his beloved Spain, even against revolutionaries... even though it is repeatedly shown to be a totalitarian regime that cares more about its own petty wars than its citizens. The sequels made sure to rectify this.



* WebVideo/{{Decker}}: Decker is always willing to save America from danger even though he hates President Davidson's policies.

to:

* WebVideo/{{Decker}}: ''WebVideo/{{Decker}}'': Decker is always willing to save America from danger even though he hates President Davidson's policies.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* It's a given, considering the series, but several countries in ''Webcomic/AxisPowersHetalia'' are portrayed as this, especially WWII Germany, who expresses open disgust at some of the orders he's been given, but has to follow them anyway. Or Russia's growing anger at Stalin despite being more or less fine with communism. Considering that all of the characters are [[AnthropomorphicPersonification personifications]] of their countries. They aren't bound to a particular government, leader, or ideology as they represent their people as a whole. Which includes their ideas/cultures/beliefs/what-have-you in general. Plus, autocratic governments can hardly be considered representative of their people in the same way as democratic ones, so it makes sense for their countries to hold different opinions to their rulers - and also to be unable to stop them. Dictators don't hold elections unless they know they will win.

to:

* It's a given, considering the series, but several countries in ''Webcomic/AxisPowersHetalia'' ''Webcomic/HetaliaAxisPowers'' are portrayed as this, especially WWII Germany, who expresses open disgust at some of the orders he's been given, but has to follow them anyway. Or Russia's growing anger at Stalin despite being more or less fine with communism. Considering that all of the characters are [[AnthropomorphicPersonification personifications]] of their countries. They aren't bound to a particular government, leader, or ideology as they represent their people as a whole. Which includes their ideas/cultures/beliefs/what-have-you in general. Plus, autocratic governments can hardly be considered representative of their people in the same way as democratic ones, so it makes sense for their countries to hold different opinions to their rulers - and also to be unable to stop them. Dictators don't hold elections unless they know they will win.



* ''FanFic/ABriefHistoryOfEquestria'': This is the traditional view of the pegasus' Celestine Junta. However, once it becomes clear that Commander Sullamander is [[TheCaligula bugnuts crazy]], standards start slipping dramatically for the first time in the Junta's hundreds of years-long history.

to:

* ''FanFic/ABriefHistoryOfEquestria'': ''Fanfic/ABriefHistoryOfEquestria'': This is the traditional view of the pegasus' Celestine Junta. However, once it becomes clear that Commander Sullamander is [[TheCaligula bugnuts crazy]], standards start slipping dramatically for the first time in the Junta's hundreds of years-long history.



* In ''Fanfic/MementoVivere'', a VideoGame/FinalFantasyX fanfiction, Auron’s initial loyalty to the Church of Yevon causes a bit of conflict within the group.

to:

* In ''Fanfic/MementoVivere'', a VideoGame/FinalFantasyX ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyX'' fanfiction, Auron’s initial loyalty to the Church of Yevon causes a bit of conflict within the group.



* Thrawn in ''FanFic/TheUnitySaga'' says this word for word when justifying his actions.

to:

* Thrawn in ''FanFic/TheUnitySaga'' ''Fanfic/TheUnitySaga'' says this word for word when justifying his actions.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* ''Fanfic/ChildrenOfRemnant'': James dislikes the Atlas Council pulling him out of Vale and getting ready to start a war, yet in the end this isn't enough to compromise his sense of duty and he ends up leaving the Kingdom.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* In ''VideoGame/Persona5'', one class lecture in ''[[UpdatedRerelease Royal]]'' touches on this term and its actual meaning, as shown in the trope description, with Kawakami using it as an example of a misused term[[note]]In the original game, she'd asked about "kakushinan," which is erroneously believed to refer to cases in which people know what they're doing is wrong, but is actually about people who believe they're in the right[[/note]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'', many of the Covenant's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Elites]] feel this way about their genocidal war against humanity.

to:

* In ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'', many of the Covenant's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Elites]] feel this way about their genocidal war against humanity.humanity, mostly because they respect humans as {{Worthy Opponent}}s and believe incorporating them would be the honorable thing to do.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Added another Fire Emblem example

Added DiffLines:

** Subverted, however, with Lorenz from the same country (and the same map). Caeda is able to persuade him that if the king's actions are hurting the people of his country, then he has a duty to overthrow the king to protect his people, an argument he is not able to find a counter for.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* ''TabletopGame/PrincessTheHopeful:'' This is the fundamental philosophy of the Court of Tears. Their guiding philosophy is that the city of Alhambra, the last remnant of the Kingdoms of Light, must be preserved at any cost, no matter what risks or Compromises of Belief are necessary.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Most of the cast of ''Manga/FullmetalAlchemist'' are rank-and-file soldiers of the evil Amestris. The average soldier only cares about fighting for their country and the good of the people, and to their misfortune their leaders are total sociopaths who have pulled out all the stops in ritual sacrifice to obtain godhood / immortality, and will gleefully order their army to massacre civilians under the false crime of revolution. Roy Mustang's entire storyline is about derailing the chain of command until he can get enough of the army on his side to perform a ''real'' revolution against the corrupt government.

to:

* Most of the cast of ''Manga/FullmetalAlchemist'' are rank-and-file soldiers of the evil Amestris. The average soldier only cares about fighting for their country and the good of the people, and to their misfortune misfortune, their leaders are total sociopaths who have pulled out all the stops in ritual sacrifice to obtain godhood / immortality, and will gleefully order their army to massacre civilians under the false crime of revolution. Roy Mustang's entire storyline is about derailing the chain of command until he can get enough of the army on his side to perform a ''real'' revolution against the corrupt government.



** The Zabi family was large and varied, producing not only scheming villains like Giren and Kycilia, but also such people as their AntiVillain brothers, a WideEyedIdealist Garma and [[VillainousValor valiant]] and [[NobleDemon noble]] FourStarBadass Dozle. Whose daughter just so happens to be the protagonist in the ''Anime/MobileSuitGundamUnicorn'' series.

to:

** The Zabi family was large and varied, producing not only scheming villains like Giren and Kycilia, Kycilia but also such people as their AntiVillain brothers, a WideEyedIdealist Garma and [[VillainousValor valiant]] and [[NobleDemon noble]] FourStarBadass Dozle. Whose daughter just so happens to be the protagonist in the ''Anime/MobileSuitGundamUnicorn'' series.



* It's a given, considering the series, but several countries in ''Webcomic/AxisPowersHetalia'' are portrayed as this, especially WWII Germany, who expresses open disgust at some of the orders he's been given, but has to follow them anyway. Or Russia's growing anger at Stalin despite being more or less fine with communism. Considering that all of the characters are [[AnthropomorphicPersonification personifications]] of their countries. They aren't bound to a particular government, leader or ideology as they represent their people as a whole. Which includes their ideas/cultures/beliefs/what-have-you in general. Plus, autocratic governments can hardly be considered representative of their people in the same way as democratic ones, so it makes sense for their countries to hold different opinions to their rulers - and also to be unable to stop them. Dictators don't hold elections unless they know they will win.
* The Britannians in ''Franchise/CodeGeass'', even if their rulers oppress others and promote racial supremacy. Also, Suzaku, who fights for the lawful authority of a region, even if it he obtained that authority by brutally conquering his own country.

to:

* It's a given, considering the series, but several countries in ''Webcomic/AxisPowersHetalia'' are portrayed as this, especially WWII Germany, who expresses open disgust at some of the orders he's been given, but has to follow them anyway. Or Russia's growing anger at Stalin despite being more or less fine with communism. Considering that all of the characters are [[AnthropomorphicPersonification personifications]] of their countries. They aren't bound to a particular government, leader leader, or ideology as they represent their people as a whole. Which includes their ideas/cultures/beliefs/what-have-you in general. Plus, autocratic governments can hardly be considered representative of their people in the same way as democratic ones, so it makes sense for their countries to hold different opinions to their rulers - and also to be unable to stop them. Dictators don't hold elections unless they know they will win.
* The Britannians in ''Franchise/CodeGeass'', even if their rulers oppress others and promote racial supremacy. Also, Suzaku, who fights for the lawful authority of a region, even if it he obtained that authority by brutally conquering his own country.



* Gajeel of ''Manga/FairyTail'' is this, which [[spoiler:is what makes the members of Fairy Tail eventually accept him after the events of the Phantom Lord Arc]]. Gajeel is also majorly AxCrazy, which translates to something like having a really mean guard dog that will do everything possible to protect it's owner.

to:

* Gajeel of ''Manga/FairyTail'' is this, which [[spoiler:is what makes the members of Fairy Tail eventually accept him after the events of the Phantom Lord Arc]]. Gajeel is also majorly AxCrazy, which translates to something like having a really mean guard dog that will do everything possible to protect it's its owner.



** Byakuya Kuchiki [[ToBeLawfulOrGood sided with the law]] when his sister Rukia was arrested and scheduled for execution. Despite disagreeing with the situation, he was bound by his social position, his military position and a promise he had once made over his dead parents' honor. As an aristocratic role-model for society in general, he was trapped by the fact that he could not expect others to uphold the law if he broken the law whenever it personally inconvenienced him. As a captain in the Gotei 13, he was expected to obey the orders of the Central 46 without question or hesitation. And, in his past, after having thrown his family into chaos by breaking the rules to both marry a commoner and then honour her deathbed request to adopt and protect her sister (Rukia) as his own, he made a promise to his parents' tomb that he would never break the rules again. Rukia's execution forced him to choose between those two conflicting vows but the sheer weight behind the vow to uphold the law meant that was the vow he had to choose no matter what his personal feelings may have been about it.

to:

** Byakuya Kuchiki [[ToBeLawfulOrGood sided with the law]] when his sister Rukia was arrested and scheduled for execution. Despite disagreeing with the situation, he was bound by his social position, his military position position, and a promise he had once made over his dead parents' honor. As an aristocratic role-model for society in general, he was trapped by the fact that he could not expect others to uphold the law if he broken broke the law whenever it personally inconvenienced him. As a captain in the Gotei 13, he was expected to obey the orders of the Central 46 without question or hesitation. And, in his past, after having thrown his family into chaos by breaking the rules to both marry a commoner and then honour her deathbed request to adopt and protect her sister (Rukia) as his own, he made a promise to his parents' tomb that he would never break the rules again. Rukia's execution forced him to choose between those two conflicting vows but the sheer weight behind the vow to uphold the law meant that was the vow he had to choose no matter what his personal feelings may have been about it.



** [[spoiler:Uchiha Itachi as well. Even in death he is loyal to Konoha]]. Most of his plans were devoted to imparting this mindset on [[spoiler:his brother Sasuke]] as well. Things didn't exactly turn out that way.

to:

** [[spoiler:Uchiha Itachi as well. Even in death death, he is loyal to Konoha]]. Most of his plans were devoted to imparting this mindset on [[spoiler:his brother Sasuke]] as well. Things didn't exactly turn out that way.



* General Boscone from ''Manga/{{Berserk}}'' is this to the Chuder Empire in the Golden Age Arc. While the two other major villains in this arc -- [[DepravedHomosexual Governor Gennon]] and [[MilesGloriosus General Adon Coborlwitz]] -- are particularly unlikeable, [[PunchClockVillain Boscone is merely a patriot fighting for his country]], merely obeying Gennon because he represent Chuder's authority.

to:

* General Boscone from ''Manga/{{Berserk}}'' is this to the Chuder Empire in the Golden Age Arc. While the two other major villains in this arc -- [[DepravedHomosexual Governor Gennon]] and [[MilesGloriosus General Adon Coborlwitz]] -- are particularly unlikeable, [[PunchClockVillain Boscone is merely a patriot fighting for his country]], merely obeying Gennon because he represent represents Chuder's authority.



** This is what happens to the character in ''ComicBook/TheDarkKnightReturns'', though that was not in canon, where he's frequently refused to do favors for the U.S. government if he feels they are wrong, especially when ComicBook/LexLuthor was President. His attitude towards the city of Metropolis however, is closer to this trope.

to:

** This is what happens to the character in ''ComicBook/TheDarkKnightReturns'', though that was not in canon, where he's frequently refused to do favors for the U.S. government if he feels they are wrong, especially when ComicBook/LexLuthor was President. His attitude towards the city of Metropolis Metropolis, however, is closer to this trope.



--->'''Superman:''' The world will '''never''' know how I struggled with the decision to '''stay out''' of the electoral process. Should I have gone on television and told the voters '''not''' to elect this man? And what then? If I use my '''influence''' -- my '''character''' and my '''reputation''' -- to tell people how to vote, what does that make me? I choose to fight for Truth, Justice and the American Way. And for all it's flaws, American democracy ''does'' work... The United States doesn't need me to dictate, or worse, '''deprive''' her people of that most precious gift. The freedom of ''choice''. Even when I knew in my heart that choice was '''wrong'''.

to:

--->'''Superman:''' The world will '''never''' know how I struggled with the decision to '''stay out''' of the electoral process. Should I have gone on television and told the voters '''not''' to elect this man? And what then? If I use my '''influence''' -- my '''character''' and my '''reputation''' -- to tell people how to vote, what does that make me? I choose to fight for Truth, Justice Justice, and the American Way. And for all it's its flaws, American democracy ''does'' work... The United States doesn't need me to dictate, or worse, '''deprive''' her people of that most precious gift. The freedom of ''choice''. Even when I knew in my heart that choice was '''wrong'''.



* ''FanFic/ABriefHistoryOfEquestria'': This is the traditional view of the pegasus' Celestine Junta. However, once it becomes clear that Commander Sullamander is [[TheCaligula bugnuts crazy]], standards start slipping dramatically for the first time in the Junta's hundreds of years long history.

to:

* ''FanFic/ABriefHistoryOfEquestria'': This is the traditional view of the pegasus' Celestine Junta. However, once it becomes clear that Commander Sullamander is [[TheCaligula bugnuts crazy]], standards start slipping dramatically for the first time in the Junta's hundreds of years long years-long history.



* In ''Fanfic/CodeGeassThePreparedRebellion'', General Darlton is opposed to Operation Snake Pit, but goes along with it anyway because of his loyalty to both Britannia and Princess Cornelia.

to:

* In ''Fanfic/CodeGeassThePreparedRebellion'', General Darlton is opposed to Operation Snake Pit, Pit but goes along with it anyway because of his loyalty to both Britannia and Princess Cornelia.



* Many Starfleet characters in ''Fanfic/TheWarOfTheMasters'' take the "if wrong, to be set right" side of this, since the Federation is dealing with a significant amount of high-level corruption. In ''Fanfic/CreateYourOwnFate'', for example, Kanril Eleya remarks to Sheri Walford (a recently separated {{Child Soldier|s}} from a group of colonies that seceded from the Federation) that she stays in Starfleet ("and keep telling them ''exactly'' what I think of them") despite questions about her loyalty because she believes she can still make a difference.

to:

* Many Starfleet characters in ''Fanfic/TheWarOfTheMasters'' take the "if wrong, to be set right" side of this, this since the Federation is dealing with a significant amount of high-level corruption. In ''Fanfic/CreateYourOwnFate'', for example, Kanril Eleya remarks to Sheri Walford (a recently separated {{Child Soldier|s}} from a group of colonies that seceded from the Federation) that she stays in Starfleet ("and keep telling them ''exactly'' what I think of them") despite questions about her loyalty because she believes she can still make a difference.



* Seen in ''Film/DasBoot'', where the submariners, except for the 1st Lieutenant, disliked the Nazis and were just doing their job. Arguably necessary for the audience to be able to sympathize with people fighting for Nazi Germany, and to some extent TruthInTelevision, as many in the ''Kriegsmarine'' resented the fact that the Nazi hierarchy paid more attention to the ''Heer'' (army) and ''Luftwaffe'' (air force). (A purported but plausible quote from [[UsefulNotes/AdolfHitler the Führer]] in real life: "I've got a Nazi air force, a conservative army and a communist navy.")

to:

* Seen in ''Film/DasBoot'', where the submariners, except for the 1st Lieutenant, disliked the Nazis and were just doing their job. Arguably necessary for the audience to be able to sympathize with people fighting for Nazi Germany, and to some extent TruthInTelevision, as many in the ''Kriegsmarine'' resented the fact that the Nazi hierarchy paid more attention to the ''Heer'' (army) and ''Luftwaffe'' (air force). (A purported but plausible quote from [[UsefulNotes/AdolfHitler the Führer]] in real life: "I've got a Nazi air force, a conservative army army, and a communist navy.")



** It wasn't just Imperials, either. Han Solo had a bad case of "My planet, right or wrong" that alienated his whole family and ended up sparking a second civil war in the ''Literature/LegacyOfTheForce'' series. It started to show up during the first Corellian insurrection, when Thrackan first sized power, but disaster was averted until later on, despite its leader, his cousin, not being killed when someone had the chance. He hated Thrackan and his humanocentric policies, but let his loyalty to Corellia itself cause a LOT of trouble. He finally did come to his senses and repair the family rift, and work with Boba Fett to get rid of Thrackan, but the damage was already done and the war underway.

to:

** It wasn't just Imperials, either. Han Solo had a bad case of "My planet, right or wrong" that alienated his whole family and ended up sparking a second civil war in the ''Literature/LegacyOfTheForce'' series. It started to show up during the first Corellian insurrection, insurrection when Thrackan first sized power, but disaster was averted until later on, despite its leader, his cousin, not being killed when someone had the chance. He hated Thrackan and his humanocentric policies, but let his loyalty to Corellia itself cause a LOT of trouble. He finally did come to his senses and repair the family rift, and work with Boba Fett to get rid of Thrackan, but the damage was already done and the war underway.



* Oberst Kurt Steiner from ''The Eagle Has Landed''. He actually risked his life trying to save a Jewish girl from death. He is then court-martialed, along with a platoon of his men. They are then given the job of kidnapping Churchill. One of them rescues a local girl from a water wheel and is killed in the process. So it is obvious that they are good guys, yet they still fight for Nazi Germany. In an aversion, it is hinted that [[spoiler:Steiner hesitates when he has a chance to shoot Churchill because he knows it is wrong, and is himself then shot and apparently killed]].

to:

* Oberst Kurt Steiner from ''The Eagle Has Landed''. He actually risked his life trying to save a Jewish girl from death. He is then court-martialed, along with a platoon of his men. They are then given the job of kidnapping Churchill. One of them rescues a local girl from a water wheel and is killed in the process. So it is obvious that they are good guys, yet they still fight for Nazi Germany. In an aversion, it is hinted that [[spoiler:Steiner hesitates when he has a chance to shoot Churchill because he knows it is wrong, wrong and is himself then shot and apparently killed]].



* ''Literature/{{Biggles}}'' antagonist Erich von Stalhein: "Germany meant more to me than Hitler ever did. It still does." He is quite explicitly a German nationalist, and seems listless whenever not serving its interests, even working for the Soviets, despite being a monarchist to the core himself.

to:

* ''Literature/{{Biggles}}'' antagonist Erich von Stalhein: "Germany meant more to me than Hitler ever did. It still does." He is quite explicitly a German nationalist, nationalist and seems listless whenever not serving its interests, even working for the Soviets, despite being a monarchist to the core himself.



* Captain Laurence from the ''Literature/{{Temeraire}}'' series is deeply devoted to Britain, and his sense of duty is what constantly drives the plot -- he hated the thought of taking on a dragon, but did it because he thought it was right. However, he finally draws the line when he hears of a British plan to [[spoiler: infect every French dragon with a fatal disease, and let to spread and kill every non-British dragon in the world despite them being sentient beings]], which finally prompts him to turn traitor.

to:

* Captain Laurence from the ''Literature/{{Temeraire}}'' series is deeply devoted to Britain, and his sense of duty is what constantly drives the plot -- he hated the thought of taking on a dragon, dragon but did it because he thought it was right. However, he finally draws the line when he hears of a British plan to [[spoiler: infect every French dragon with a fatal disease, and let to spread and kill every non-British dragon in the world despite them being sentient beings]], which finally prompts him to turn traitor.



** Lefcourt's mindset does invite the question whether he would have followed an immoral order and allowed the [[spoiler: orbital defense grid]] to kill millions of people.

to:

** Lefcourt's mindset does invite the question of whether he would have followed an immoral order and allowed the [[spoiler: orbital defense grid]] to kill millions of people.



** Despite knowing what Aerys did to Lyanna's father and brother, and that he planned to have her entire family wiped out, Rhaegar still fought for his father during Robert's rebellion.
** Tyrion Lannister. "My dear brother, you wound me. You know how much I love my family." Of course, while he's being entirely sarcastic when he says it, he does tend go along with what's expected of him in the end — if not exactly in a manner the rest of his family approves of. This becomes a source of conflict for him after Sansa's HeroicBSOD following the Red Wedding and when he meets Oberyn Martell. Both of them lost family members to atrocities ordered and/or enabled by his father and King Joffrey and he's torn between obvious sympathy and compassion for their plight and his loyalty to Lannister hegemony. This ends up backfiring on him spectacularly since his public disapproval of his nephew leads people to accuse him of disloyalty in his KangarooCourt trial. He then decides once and for all that he will no longer be a loyal Lannister retainer and shoots his father's plans to save face and send him to the Wall. When the trial by combat ends in failure for him, he's released by Jaime so as to flee Westeros, but before he leaves he burns his final bridge by killing his father. Of course it's one thing for Tyrion to fight Lannisters he dislikes (Tywin and Cersei) but another for him to fight against Lannisters he likes, namely Jaime, and in Season 7, Dany rebukes him for suggesting a softball strategy rather than a ruthless one because he doesn't want to go against Jaime. This becomes obvious when after Dany listens to his suggestion to lay siege and encircle the capital, they come upon the Lannister train carrying the pillage of the Reach back to the city near Blackwater, and the resulting battle sees Jaime charging at Dany with a spear all the while Tyrion watches in horror muttering "No" to his brave, foolish, Cersei-serving brother.

to:

** Despite knowing what Aerys did to Lyanna's father and brother, brother and that he planned to have her entire family wiped out, Rhaegar still fought for his father during Robert's rebellion.
** Tyrion Lannister. "My dear brother, you wound me. You know how much I love my family." Of course, while he's being entirely sarcastic when he says it, he does tend to go along with what's expected of him in the end — if not exactly in a manner the rest of his family approves of. This becomes a source of conflict for him after Sansa's HeroicBSOD following the Red Wedding and when he meets Oberyn Martell. Both of them lost family members to atrocities ordered and/or enabled by his father and King Joffrey and he's torn between obvious sympathy and compassion for their plight and his loyalty to Lannister hegemony. This ends up backfiring on him spectacularly since his public disapproval of his nephew leads people to accuse him of disloyalty in his KangarooCourt trial. He then decides once and for all that he will no longer be a loyal Lannister retainer and shoots his father's plans to save face and send him to the Wall. When the trial by combat ends in failure for him, he's released by Jaime so as to flee Westeros, but before he leaves he burns his final bridge by killing his father. Of course it's one thing for Tyrion to fight Lannisters he dislikes (Tywin and Cersei) but another for him to fight against Lannisters he likes, namely Jaime, and in Season 7, Dany rebukes him for suggesting a softball strategy rather than a ruthless one because he doesn't want to go against Jaime. This becomes obvious when after Dany listens to his suggestion to lay siege and encircle the capital, they come upon the Lannister train carrying the pillage of the Reach back to the city near Blackwater, and the resulting battle sees Jaime charging at Dany with a spear all the while Tyrion watches in horror muttering "No" to his brave, foolish, Cersei-serving brother.



* Bryce from ''Series/MaxHeadroom'' is loyal to the TV company Network XXIII, to the point of trying to kill Edison Carter in the first episode. But Bryce is doing it only because it was ordered of him, and he bears no genuine malice. He just wants to play with computers. This is only true of Bryce in the American version, however; in the original British Made-for-TV movie, Bryce is not only wholly unsympathetic, but killing Carter ''is his idea in the first place''.
* In a very early ''Series/MissionImpossible'' episode, "The Reluctant Dragon", the main villian, played marvelously by character actor John Colicos, is well aware of the evils of his country's oppressive policies, but carries on as Security Minister because he's loyal to his country, and insulates himself in cultural pursuits. It's not hard to imagine that things would be much worse with someone else in his place, and he ends up being probably the most sympathetic villian in the series' history; as he lies shot at the end, he even generates a degree of compassion and respect from Rollin, who takes time to help staunch the bleeding before making his escape.

to:

* Bryce from ''Series/MaxHeadroom'' is loyal to the TV company Network XXIII, to the point of trying to kill Edison Carter in the first episode. But Bryce is doing it only because it was ordered of him, and he bears no genuine malice. He just wants to play with computers. This is only true of Bryce in the American version, however; in the original British Made-for-TV movie, Bryce is not only wholly unsympathetic, unsympathetic but killing Carter ''is his idea in the first place''.
* In a very early ''Series/MissionImpossible'' episode, "The Reluctant Dragon", the main villian, played marvelously by character actor John Colicos, is well aware of the evils of his country's oppressive policies, but carries on as Security Minister because he's loyal to his country, and insulates himself in cultural pursuits. It's not hard to imagine that things would be much worse with someone else in his place, and he ends up being probably the most sympathetic villian villain in the series' history; as he lies shot at the end, he even generates a degree of compassion and respect from Rollin, who takes time to help staunch the bleeding before making his escape.



** This trope is Gul Dukat's explanation for switching his allegiance to the new, democratic Cardassian government in an earlier season. In a rare moment of direct honesty he admits that this quasi-HeelFaceTurn took place shortly after it became obvious that the old regime was going to lose.

to:

** This trope is Gul Dukat's explanation for switching his allegiance to the new, democratic Cardassian government in an earlier season. In a rare moment of direct honesty honesty, he admits that this quasi-HeelFaceTurn took place shortly after it became obvious that the old regime was going to lose.



** Damar goes so far as to form the resistance inside of Cardassia because the Dominion stopped treating them as equals. He was willing to kill his trusted right hand man because the guy was ready to quit after the Dominion [[ItsPersonal made it personal]]. Damar eulogizes that the deceased was a good and loyal citizen to a Cardassia that no longer exists.

to:

** Damar goes so far as to form the resistance inside of Cardassia because the Dominion stopped treating them as equals. He was willing to kill his trusted right hand right-hand man because the guy was ready to quit after the Dominion [[ItsPersonal made it personal]]. Damar eulogizes that the deceased was a good and loyal citizen to a Cardassia that no longer exists.



** Really, this trope is more the central theme of ''Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine'' as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in a political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses his loyalty to friends and family.

to:

** Really, this trope is more the central theme of ''Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine'' as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in a political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses versus his loyalty to friends and family.



* ''Series/{{Blackadder}}'': Sir Talbot, a loyalist Lord cheerfully tells Prince George that he doesn't care that the Prince is an utter buffoon, or that his royal father is a senile, inbred madman, as far as Talbot is concerned, they were annointed by God, and have his unquestioning loyalty in opposing the anti-royal sentiments in Parliament. Unfortunately, he dies of old age a few seconds after making that speech, forcing Blackadder to come up with a new plan.

to:

* ''Series/{{Blackadder}}'': Sir Talbot, a loyalist Lord cheerfully tells Prince George that he doesn't care that the Prince is an utter buffoon, or that his royal father is a senile, inbred madman, as far as Talbot is concerned, they were annointed anointed by God, and have his unquestioning loyalty in opposing the anti-royal sentiments in Parliament. Unfortunately, he dies of old age a few seconds after making that speech, forcing Blackadder to come up with a new plan.



** Outcasts are the Eldar that grew tired of their Craftworld and leave to roam the galaxy on their own. Yet when Craftworld needs them, they return to fight, usually as infiltrators, scouts and snipers. In "Retribution", even while acting Craftworld Autarch and Seers, Rohan endlessly complains about archaic ways of his companions, but follows their orders nonetheless.
* One quality in ''TabletopGame/{{Shadowrun}}'' is named this. In exchange for swearing a fanatical loyalty to your faction, to the point of that betraying them in any way is unthinkable, a character receives the ability to ignore damage penalties in combat.

to:

** Outcasts are the Eldar that grew tired of their Craftworld and leave to roam the galaxy on their own. Yet when Craftworld needs them, they return to fight, usually as infiltrators, scouts scouts, and snipers. In "Retribution", even while acting Craftworld Autarch and Seers, Rohan endlessly complains about archaic ways of his companions, companions but follows their orders nonetheless.
* One quality in ''TabletopGame/{{Shadowrun}}'' is named this. In exchange for swearing a fanatical loyalty to your faction, to the point of that betraying them in any way is unthinkable, a character receives the ability to ignore damage penalties in combat.



*** Ishtar from the same game's second generation. She's kind hearted enough to be the best friend of Teeny/Linda, despite Ishtar's mother abusing them, she seriously questions the Child Hunts promoted by her country and tries to minimize the damage as best as she can, but she's too duty-bound with the honor of her family and country (and being in love with pre-possession Julius), in which Seliph's army has caused many casualties on, that she cannot be recruited and made her last stand in the name of those she's bound to, dying in process.
*** Subverted, meanwhile, with Jamke of Verdane. He's unable to persuade his father not to follow the advice of the ObviouslyEvil Sandima, and takes to the battlefield on their orders. But when Edain (whom he'd helped escape from his brothers) asks him [[ArmorPiercingQuestion why he fights knowing it's wrong]], he decides that he'd rather deal with being called a traitor than fight a war he knows is wrong, joining Sigurd's side.

to:

*** Ishtar from the same game's second generation. She's kind hearted kind-hearted enough to be the best friend of Teeny/Linda, despite Ishtar's mother abusing them, she seriously questions the Child Hunts promoted by her country and tries to minimize the damage as best as she can, but she's too duty-bound with the honor of her family and country (and being in love with pre-possession Julius), in which Seliph's army has caused many casualties on, that she cannot be recruited and made her last stand in the name of those she's bound to, dying in the process.
*** Subverted, meanwhile, with Jamke of Verdane. He's unable to persuade his father not to follow the advice of the ObviouslyEvil Sandima, Sandima and takes to the battlefield on their orders. But when Edain (whom he'd helped escape from his brothers) asks him [[ArmorPiercingQuestion why he fights knowing it's wrong]], he decides that he'd rather deal with being called a traitor than fight a war he knows is wrong, joining Sigurd's side.



** Zelgius himself may count. [[spoiler:Zelgius is loyal to the Begnion Senate only because he's loyal to [[TheChessmaster Sephiran]], who wants him to help incite a war that will swallowing the world, which is the same reason the Black Knight served Daein]].

to:

** Zelgius himself may count. [[spoiler:Zelgius is loyal to the Begnion Senate only because he's loyal to [[TheChessmaster Sephiran]], who wants him to help incite a war that will swallowing swallow the world, which is the same reason the Black Knight served Daein]].



* While not a soldier in any way, the character Nathaniel Vargas from ''VideoGame/{{Fallout 3}}'' believes all the Enclave (former Éminence grise of the U.S. federal government) propaganda he hears and seems adverse to questioning the government in general if you talk to him about it. It can be entertaining to argue with him using examples from the U.S. Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights; he'll eventually cut off the discussion for the explicit reason that you might convince him. [[spoiler:Ultimately though, he may warn you, if still alive during The American Dream quest, to get away from the Enclave before they catch you, as he was taken captive by the Enclave and is in the Raven Rock base cells. His exact words: ''"They're not who they say they are... Get out while you can, before they get you too."'']]
* In ''VideoGame/{{Fallout New Vegas}}'', Veronica is loyal to the Brotherhood of Steel, despite believing that they will slowly die out if they don't change their isolationist and xenophobic ways. At the end of her personal quest, she'll either choose to stay with them or leave them, [[spoiler:where she will see just how fanatical they can be when it comes to those with progressive thoughts.]] The current Elder, Nolan [=McNamara=], has similar beliefs, but is hindered by his fear of the NCR and an unwillingness to go against tradition and commit outright heresy.

to:

* While not a soldier in any way, the character Nathaniel Vargas from ''VideoGame/{{Fallout 3}}'' believes all the Enclave (former Éminence grise of the U.S. federal government) propaganda he hears and seems adverse averse to questioning the government in general if you talk to him about it. It can be entertaining to argue with him using examples from the U.S. Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights; he'll eventually cut off the discussion for the explicit reason that you might convince him. [[spoiler:Ultimately though, he may warn you, if still alive during The American Dream quest, to get away from the Enclave before they catch you, as he was taken captive by the Enclave and is in the Raven Rock base cells. His exact words: ''"They're not who they say they are... Get out while you can, before they get you too."'']]
* In ''VideoGame/{{Fallout New Vegas}}'', Veronica is loyal to the Brotherhood of Steel, despite believing that they will slowly die out if they don't change their isolationist and xenophobic ways. At the end of her personal quest, she'll either choose to stay with them or leave them, [[spoiler:where she will see just how fanatical they can be when it comes to those with progressive thoughts.]] The current Elder, Nolan [=McNamara=], has similar beliefs, beliefs but is hindered by his fear of the NCR and an unwillingness to go against tradition and commit outright heresy.



** Rose of Sharon Cassidy or "Cass" has similar sentiments, and provides the page quote. She's an NCR citizen and proud of it, but she realizes that the NCR is an overextended bureaucracy that just can't help the people of the Mojave in their current state, even if they do mean well. She prefers the Courier to side with the NCR for the game's central conflict, but doesn't mind the Courier being the WildCard, [[UndyingLoyalty mostly out of loyalty to them]] (Though it's implied that she's secretly horrified at the Courier for defeating three armies at once).

to:

** Rose of Sharon Cassidy or "Cass" has similar sentiments, sentiments and provides the page quote. She's an NCR citizen and proud of it, but she realizes that the NCR is an overextended bureaucracy that just can't help the people of the Mojave in their current state, even if they do mean well. She prefers the Courier to side with the NCR for the game's central conflict, conflict but doesn't mind the Courier being the WildCard, [[UndyingLoyalty mostly out of loyalty to them]] (Though it's implied that she's secretly horrified at the Courier for defeating three armies at once).



** Actually he defected prior to it, as he would have been one of the pilots tasked with carrying out the strike mission. Killing millions of your countries citizens, and thousands of soldiers from both sides, will make you question your boss, that for sure.

to:

** Actually he defected prior to it, as he would have been one of the pilots tasked with carrying out the strike mission. Killing millions of your countries citizens, and thousands of soldiers from both sides, will make you question your boss, that that's for sure.



** [[spoiler:Teo [=McDohl=]]] from the first ''Suikoden''. However, [[spoiler:he sends his two right hand men to fight for his son against his emperor.]]

to:

** [[spoiler:Teo [=McDohl=]]] from the first ''Suikoden''. However, [[spoiler:he sends his two right hand right-hand men to fight for his son against his emperor.]]



** Sasarai in ''III'' is this. He's not all that elated with seeking out the True Runes in the grasslands, but follows through until the issue becomes much larger. Then he finds out that he [[spoiler:is an ArtificialHuman cloned from the dear leader as a placeholder for a true rune]]. Despite this, he still goes back to his position once the war is over.

to:

** Sasarai in ''III'' is this. He's not all that elated with seeking out the True Runes in the grasslands, grasslands but follows through until the issue becomes much larger. Then he finds out that he [[spoiler:is an ArtificialHuman cloned from the dear leader as a placeholder for a true rune]]. Despite this, he still goes back to his position once the war is over.



* Sam Carter from ''VideoGame/DeusEx''. He remains loyal to UNATCO [[spoiler:even after it is revealed that the organization is just a front for Majestic Twelve.]] As he puts it, "We've got our share of crooked bureaucrats -- fact -- but this is still UNATCO, and by and large the people in this building are twenty-four carat gold." He does eventually join you against the BigBad anyway, but only after UNATCO kicks him out, because they ''don't think he's loyal enough'' (or rather, not blindly loyal and able to recognise UNATCO's faults, which is what they don't want).
* This is the attitude of Baldus in ''VideoGame/BlazeUnion.'' In the A route, he's the last general left defending the capital against Gulcasa's revolution, and ([[PuzzleBoss so long as you follow Nessiah's directions to the letter]]) is persuaded into a neat little HeelFaceTurn when Gulcasa points out that the revolution has Bronquia's best interests in mind. Having gotten to know Gulcasa earlier and thus being familiar with his struggles to protect the civilians, Baldus not only joins up enthusiastically, but winds up [[ParentalSubstitute developing a great deal of paternal affection for him]] after this.

to:

* Sam Carter from ''VideoGame/DeusEx''. He remains loyal to UNATCO [[spoiler:even after it is revealed that the organization is just a front for Majestic Twelve.]] As he puts it, "We've got our share of crooked bureaucrats -- fact -- but this is still UNATCO, and by and large large, the people in this building are twenty-four carat twenty-four-carat gold." He does eventually join you against the BigBad anyway, but only after UNATCO kicks him out, out because they ''don't think he's loyal enough'' (or rather, not blindly loyal and able to recognise UNATCO's faults, which is what they don't want).
* This is the attitude of Baldus in ''VideoGame/BlazeUnion.'' In the A route, he's the last general left defending the capital against Gulcasa's revolution, and ([[PuzzleBoss so long as you follow Nessiah's directions to the letter]]) is persuaded into a neat little HeelFaceTurn when Gulcasa points out that the revolution has Bronquia's best interests in mind. Having gotten to know Gulcasa earlier and thus being familiar with his struggles to protect the civilians, Baldus not only joins up enthusiastically, enthusiastically but winds up [[ParentalSubstitute developing a great deal of paternal affection for him]] after this.



* Quite common in VideoGame/StarWarsTheOldRepublic, especially among Imperial faction companions, but appearing on the Republic side too. You can role play an Imperial player character as this; being fiercely loyal and placing high value on Imperial lives while being disdainful of Sith follies.
* Jonathan's attitude towards the [[CrapsaccharineWorld Eastern Kingdom of Mikado]] in ''VideoGame/ShinMegamiTenseiIV''. He rationalizes his actions as a Samurai as for the betterment of his country and optimistically believes the best of the current rulers, while choosing to turn a blind eye to the social problems that threaten to destroy it.

to:

* Quite common in VideoGame/StarWarsTheOldRepublic, especially among Imperial faction companions, but appearing on the Republic side too. You can role play role-play an Imperial player character as this; being fiercely loyal and placing high value on Imperial lives while being disdainful of Sith follies.
* Jonathan's attitude towards the [[CrapsaccharineWorld Eastern Kingdom of Mikado]] in ''VideoGame/ShinMegamiTenseiIV''. He rationalizes his actions as a Samurai as for the betterment of his country and optimistically believes the best of the current rulers, rulers while choosing to turn a blind eye to the social problems that threaten to destroy it.



* ''VideoGame/WorldOfWarcraft'': General Nazgrim. Despite having adventured with the PlayerCharacter previously, and not believing in what Garrosh was doing, he says he is honor bound to defend his warchief, and fights you to the death. As he dies, he says ItHasBeenAnHonor and tells you he is glad that you were the one to finish him.
* ''VideoGame/WayOfTheSamurai4'': This is Hikaru Kotobuki's most defining character trait and his biggest flaw. He is a really well meaning man, but his duty as a samurai forces him to follow orders to the letter. Even when his superior, the BigBad Chief Minister Kinugawa, does very cruel things to his subjects, Kotobuki is unable to defy the man. [[spoiler: He does find the guts to defy his superiors near the ending of the hidden path, as he can't stand by and watch how IncorruptiblePurePureness Laura Rita gets slowly executed.]]

to:

* ''VideoGame/WorldOfWarcraft'': General Nazgrim. Despite having adventured with the PlayerCharacter previously, and not believing in what Garrosh was doing, he says he is honor bound honor-bound to defend his warchief, warchief and fights you to the death. As he dies, he says ItHasBeenAnHonor and tells you he is glad that you were the one to finish him.
* ''VideoGame/WayOfTheSamurai4'': This is Hikaru Kotobuki's most defining character trait and his biggest flaw. He is a really well meaning well-meaning man, but his duty as a samurai forces him to follow orders to the letter. Even when his superior, the BigBad Chief Minister Kinugawa, does very cruel things to his subjects, Kotobuki is unable to defy the man. [[spoiler: He does find the guts to defy his superiors near the ending of the hidden path, as he can't stand by and watch how IncorruptiblePurePureness Laura Rita gets slowly executed.]]



* ''WesternAnimation/BeastWars'' has a heroic example of this. Rattrap is quite the CombatPragmatist, can be a jerkass to his teammates, and is not above dirty tricks and schemes. There is nothing too dirty for hims, as long as it benefits the Maximals ([[DoubleAgent even joining the Predicons]]). He finds a bizarre friendship with [[TokenEvilTeammate Dinobot]] who like Rattrap is loyal to Predicon ideals, but defects from Megatron's Predicons because he believes Megatron's Predicons are not reflective of those ideals. Boiled down, Rattrap is "my country right or wrong" and dinobot is "If the country is wrong, I must right it".
* What seems to be going on (due largely to extremely intense propaganda starting in elementary education) with a large portion of the Fire Nation military in ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'', since while they get a lot of use as FacelessMooks and the pacifist kid heroes are killing them before the end of season one, we also get brief characterization. Jeong Jeong's band of deserters decided that the wrong was ''too'' wrong and scarpered, and Zuko eventually [[HeelFaceTurn decides to operate the "to be set right" part]]. Iroh, significantly, appears to have decided this and then waited passively for five years for the right opportunity; before this he seems to have been a poster child for this trope.

to:

* ''WesternAnimation/BeastWars'' has a heroic example of this. Rattrap is quite the CombatPragmatist, can be a jerkass to his teammates, and is not above dirty tricks and schemes. There is nothing too dirty for hims, him, as long as it benefits the Maximals ([[DoubleAgent even joining the Predicons]]). He finds a bizarre friendship with [[TokenEvilTeammate Dinobot]] who like Rattrap is loyal to Predicon ideals, but defects from Megatron's Predicons because he believes Megatron's Predicons are not reflective of those ideals. Boiled down, Rattrap is "my country right or wrong" and dinobot is "If the country is wrong, I must right it".
* What seems to be going on (due largely to extremely intense propaganda starting in elementary education) with a large portion of the Fire Nation military in ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'', since while they get a lot of use as FacelessMooks and the pacifist kid heroes are killing them before the end of season one, we also get brief characterization. Jeong Jeong's band of deserters decided that the wrong was ''too'' wrong and scarpered, and Zuko eventually [[HeelFaceTurn decides to operate the "to be set right" part]]. Iroh, significantly, appears to have decided this and then waited passively for five years for the right opportunity; before this this, he seems to have been a poster child for this trope.

Added: 380

Changed: 1

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Toward the end of ''VideoGame/MassEffect1'', Tali even notes that it'd be difficult for quarians to do what Shepard does (namely, steal the ''Normandy'' against orders for the greater good of every living thing) because they're raised with this mentality. [[spoiler:Which is what can get them wiped out in ''3'', since they're unable to go against the GeneralRipper's orders.]]



* When Vinnie Doombats from ''Webcomic/{{Erfworld}}'' is ordered to prepare a plan to betray and conquer the city he's serving as laiason to - and whose ruler he is in love with - he does so with trepidation but no hesitation, and stands ready to carry it out if and when the order comes down. His side is his side, and his personal feelings don't enter into it.

to:

* When Vinnie Doombats from ''Webcomic/{{Erfworld}}'' is ordered to prepare a plan to betray and conquer the city he's serving as laiason liason to - and whose ruler he is in love with - he does so with trepidation but no hesitation, and stands ready to carry it out if and when the order comes down. His side is his side, and his personal feelings don't enter into it.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Moving to My Master Right Or Wrong instead


* ''VideoGame/ConvictionSRPG'': Generals Grace and Stan are honorable warriors, but they both follow Emperor Abyss despite the evidence showing that their liege is responsible for the recent monster attacks. [[spoiler:Subverted for Grace in the B route, who joins the party to fight both the emperor and Landar Kingdom.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* ''VideoGame/ConvictionSRPG'': Generals Grace and Stan are honorable warriors, but they both follow Emperor Abyss despite the evidence showing that their liege is responsible for the recent monster attacks. [[spoiler:Subverted for Grace in the B route, who joins the party to fight both the emperor and Landar Kingdom.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Okoye in ''Film/BlackPanther'' is "Loyal to the throne, no matter who sits on it," even when she visibly disagrees with the policies of the king. That said, when she has a choice between following either [[T'Challa or Killmonger]], who at this point both have equal claims to the throne, she doesn't hesitate to choose the leader she feels is right for her country.

to:

* Okoye in ''Film/BlackPanther'' is "Loyal to the throne, no matter who sits on it," even when she visibly disagrees with the policies of the king. That said, when she has a choice between following either [[T'Challa [[spoiler:T'Challa or Killmonger]], who at this point both have equal claims to the throne, she doesn't hesitate to choose the leader she feels is right for her country.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
added an example

Added DiffLines:

* Okoye in ''Film/BlackPanther'' is "Loyal to the throne, no matter who sits on it," even when she visibly disagrees with the policies of the king. That said, when she has a choice between following either [[T'Challa or Killmonger]], who at this point both have equal claims to the throne, she doesn't hesitate to choose the leader she feels is right for her country.

Added: 159

Changed: 491

Removed: 161

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* A major theme in the ''Literature/VorkosiganSaga''. The main characters understand perfectly well why Barrayar is viewed by many as TheEvilEmpire and are doing the best they can to be just in an unjust world. Miles, despite having command of a mercenary fleet that could take him anywhere in the galaxy, remains loyal to a planet that reviles him as a mutant (as he frequently points out, he's actually just a cripple), to the consternation of his female partners who have no desire to settle down with him in a NoWomansLand.

to:

* A major theme in the ''Literature/VorkosiganSaga''. The main characters understand perfectly well why Barrayar is viewed by many as TheEvilEmpire and are doing the best they can to be just in an unjust world. Miles, despite having command of a mercenary fleet that could take him anywhere in the galaxy, remains loyal to a planet that reviles him as a mutant (as he frequently points out, he's actually just a cripple), to the consternation of his female partners who have no desire to settle down with him in a NoWomansLand.NoWomansLand, and cannot fathom why his mother (who shows a similar loyalty to her adopted home) would choose to ''immigrate'' there.



%%
%%[[folder:Web Comics]]
%%* Major Noggos' character from ''Webcomic/{{Cloudscratcher}}''.
%%[[/folder]]

[[folder:Web Videos]]
* WebVideo/{{Decker}}: Decker is always willing to save America from danger even though he hates President Davidson's policies.

to:

%%
%%[[folder:Web Comics]]
%%* Major Noggos' character from ''Webcomic/{{Cloudscratcher}}''.
%%[[/folder]]


[[folder:Web Videos]]
Comics]]
* WebVideo/{{Decker}}: Decker is always willing to save America When Vinnie Doombats from danger even though ''Webcomic/{{Erfworld}}'' is ordered to prepare a plan to betray and conquer the city he's serving as laiason to - and whose ruler he hates President Davidson's policies.is in love with - he does so with trepidation but no hesitation, and stands ready to carry it out if and when the order comes down. His side is his side, and his personal feelings don't enter into it.


Added DiffLines:

[[folder:Web Videos]]
* WebVideo/{{Decker}}: Decker is always willing to save America from danger even though he hates President Davidson's policies.
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* A major theme in the ''Literature/VorkosiganSaga''. The main characters understand perfectly well why Barrayar is viewed by many as TheEvilEmpire and are doing the best they can to be just in an unjust world. Miles, despite having command of a mercenary fleet that could take him anywhere in the galaxy, remains loyal to a planet that reviles him as a mutant (as he frequently points out, he's actually just a cripple), to the consternation of his female partners who have no desire to settle down with him in a NoWomansLand.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Camus the Sable from ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemAkaneia Shadow Dragon]]'' is somewhat tragic as he was a kind-hearted and brilliant man but valued his country above all else. He exemplifies the trope well enough that in the fandom, the "Camus Archetype" refers to antagonists with sympathetic personalities and motives who nonetheless cannot be convinced to join your army and must be defeated. Fortunately, [[spoiler:he survives and is recruitable in the 3rd game.]]

to:

** Camus the Sable from ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemAkaneia ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemShadowDragonAndTheBladeOfLight Shadow Dragon]]'' is somewhat tragic as he was a kind-hearted and brilliant man but valued his country above all else. He exemplifies the trope well enough that in the fandom, the "Camus Archetype" refers to antagonists with sympathetic personalities and motives who nonetheless cannot be convinced to join your army and must be defeated. Fortunately, [[spoiler:he survives and is recruitable in the 3rd game.]]



** In ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemElibe Sword of Seals]]'', Miledy's lover Gale is a Wyvern Lord (and subsequent Dragon General) whose allegiance belongs to King Zephiel and General Murdock, while Miledy fights for Zephiel's half-sister Guinevere, who is on a different side of the conflict. Gale tells her that he cannot be with her, despite spending so much time together. He also tells Miledy's brother Zeiss that, no matter what, they must fight. What makes it worse is that [[spoiler:Gale is considered dead even if you don't kill him.]]
** Another ''Sword of Seals'' example is Brenya, who is portrayed much like Selena would later be. Despite [[spoiler:King Zephiel's death]] in the last chapter, she still carries out his orders, even if it means death. Even after being told that surrender is an option, she won't take it.
** And again in ''Sword of Seals'' is the Etrurian Generals, especially Douglas, since he downright refuses to join you even if you talk to him with General Cecilia, General Percival, Vice-General Klein, AND his adopted daughter Lalam/his liege Prince Mildain (Elphin). He only joins you later when Etruria officially accepts your army, AKA when you defeat the chapter with Douglas still alive, allowing you access to 16x.
** Vaida in ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemElibe Blazing Blade]]'' was a noble soldier and former Dragon General of Bern who was forced to desert along with her subordinate Heath, because her group attempted to prevent the murder of innocent civilians, which had been part of a plot by a Bernese general aiming for grandeur and promotion. She was recruited in the Shrine of Seals battle so as to keep loyal to her liege, Prince Zephiel. More specifically, she states that she serves Bern, and joins Eliwood's army because they saved the life of Prince Zephiel, who is the future ruler of her country. She embodies this trope perfectly whilst employing LoopholeAbuse out of a sense of honour.

to:

** In ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemElibe Sword of Seals]]'', ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTheBindingBlade The Binding Blade]]'', Miledy's lover Gale is a Wyvern Lord (and subsequent Dragon General) whose allegiance belongs to King Zephiel and General Murdock, while Miledy fights for Zephiel's half-sister Guinevere, who is on a different side of the conflict. Gale tells her that he cannot be with her, despite spending so much time together. He also tells Miledy's brother Zeiss that, no matter what, they must fight. What makes it worse is that [[spoiler:Gale is considered dead even if you don't kill him.]]
** Another ''Sword of Seals'' ''The Binding Blade'' example is Brenya, who is portrayed much like Selena would later be. Despite [[spoiler:King Zephiel's death]] in the last chapter, she still carries out his orders, even if it means death. Even after being told that surrender is an option, she won't take it.
** And again in ''Sword of Seals'' ''The Binding Blade'' is the Etrurian Generals, especially Douglas, since he downright refuses to join you even if you talk to him with General Cecilia, General Percival, Vice-General Klein, AND his adopted daughter Lalam/his liege Prince Mildain (Elphin). He only joins you later when Etruria officially accepts your army, AKA when you defeat the chapter with Douglas still alive, allowing you access to 16x.
** Vaida in ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemElibe ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTheBlazingBlade Blazing Blade]]'' was a noble soldier and former Dragon General of Bern who was forced to desert along with her subordinate Heath, because her group attempted to prevent the murder of innocent civilians, which had been part of a plot by a Bernese general aiming for grandeur and promotion. She was recruited in the Shrine of Seals battle so as to keep loyal to her liege, Prince Zephiel. More specifically, she states that she serves Bern, and joins Eliwood's army because they saved the life of Prince Zephiel, who is the future ruler of her country. She embodies this trope perfectly whilst employing LoopholeAbuse out of a sense of honour.

Added: 141

Changed: 201

Removed: 201

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Bryce from ''Series/MaxHeadroom'' is loyal to the TV company Network XXIII, to the point of trying to kill Edison Carter in the first episode. But Bryce is doing it only because it was ordered of him, and he bears no genuine malice. He just wants to play with computers.
** This is only true of Bryce in the American version, however; in the original British Made-for-TV movie, Bryce is not only wholly unsympathetic, but killing Carter ''is his idea in the first place''.

to:

* Bryce from ''Series/MaxHeadroom'' is loyal to the TV company Network XXIII, to the point of trying to kill Edison Carter in the first episode. But Bryce is doing it only because it was ordered of him, and he bears no genuine malice. He just wants to play with computers.
**
computers. This is only true of Bryce in the American version, however; in the original British Made-for-TV movie, Bryce is not only wholly unsympathetic, but killing Carter ''is his idea in the first place''.



* ''Series/MotherlandFortSalem'': Tally is the most gung-ho member of her unit, and genuinely believes that the military is a force for good.



** Really, this trope is more the central theme of ''Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine'' as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses his loyalty to friends and family.

to:

** Really, this trope is more the central theme of ''Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine'' as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in a political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses his loyalty to friends and family.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In ''Discworld/MonstrousRegiment'', this is the attitude that Corporal Strappi preaches. Sergeant Jackrum also follows this, but at the end, retires to find out, as he put it, "what I've been fighting for" his entire life.

to:

* In ''Discworld/MonstrousRegiment'', ''Literature/MonstrousRegiment'', this is the attitude that Corporal Strappi preaches. Sergeant Jackrum also follows this, but at the end, retires to find out, as he put it, "what I've been fighting for" his entire life.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


[[folder:Comic Strips
* Played with in the strip by Argentinian cartoonist {{Creator/Quino}} titled [[http://www.ghira.mistral.co.uk/mipais.gif "Mi Pais (My Country)"]].

to:

[[folder:Comic Strips
Strips]]
* Played with in the strip by Argentinian cartoonist {{Creator/Quino}} Creator/{{Quino}} titled [[http://www.ghira.mistral.co.uk/mipais.gif "Mi Pais (My Country)"]].

Added: 3209

Changed: 6003

Removed: 1300

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


->'''Cass''': NCR's my country, and I support it. Anyone says otherwise... I'll feed 'em my knee. I know which side of the firing line I'm on in the Mojave, just so you know.\\
'''The Courier''': There's a "but" in there.\\
'''Cass''': Yeah, there is. I'm not some blind, flag-saluting, do-as-they-will NCR lover. They're like family, but let me tell ya what family means. You ever had a brother? Some dumbass younger brother, say, who knocked up the pastor's daughter, can't hold down a job and his home-away is a jail cell? ''That'' is NCR. Their compass is spinning. All the time.

to:

->'''Cass''': ->'''Cass:''' NCR's my country, and I support it. Anyone says otherwise... I'll feed 'em my knee. I know which side of the firing line I'm on in the Mojave, just so you know.\\
'''The Courier''': Courier:''' There's a "but" in there.\\
'''Cass''': '''Cass:''' Yeah, there is. I'm not some blind, flag-saluting, do-as-they-will NCR lover. They're like family, but let me tell ya what family means. You ever had a brother? Some dumbass younger brother, say, who knocked up the pastor's daughter, can't hold down a job and his home-away is a jail cell? ''That'' is NCR. Their compass is spinning. All the time.






*** Ramba Ral is a particularly stand-out example. Despite the fact that the Zabi family ''had his father killed'' as part of a nasty CycleOfRevenge that began with the death of Zeon's former leader, at the end of the day he's still a Zeon soldier and they're still the royal family (it does help that he works for the comparatively decent Dozle Zabi, who probably had nothing directly to do with the whole mess). This comes back to bite him when he comes to Earth to fight the Gundam, since the Earth Attack Force command, under Kycilia's authority continually stiff him on supplies and support, possibly because they don't believe he could really be that loyal, more likely due to simple JurisdictionFriction, and he continues to soldier on with what he knows to be a suicide mission regardless.
** Many characters from various ''Gundam'' series are examples, though countries seldom matter and it's often loyalty to other institutions, e.g. ''Anime/MobileSuitGundam00'' has Sergei Smirnov, who dislikes actions such as the HRL's Supersoldier project or the world government's A-Law's actions, but he stays loyal to them.
*** Except that he quite openly schemes behind the A-Laws' backs and leaks intel on them to Celestial Being.

to:

*** ** Ramba Ral is a particularly stand-out example. Despite the fact that the Zabi family ''had his father killed'' as part of a nasty CycleOfRevenge that began with the death of Zeon's former leader, at the end of the day he's still a Zeon soldier and they're still the royal family (it does help that he works for the comparatively decent Dozle Zabi, who probably had nothing directly to do with the whole mess). This comes back to bite him when he comes to Earth to fight the Gundam, since the Earth Attack Force command, under Kycilia's authority continually stiff him on supplies and support, possibly because they don't believe he could really be that loyal, more likely due to simple JurisdictionFriction, and he continues to soldier on with what he knows to be a suicide mission regardless.
** Many characters from various ''Gundam'' series are examples, though countries seldom matter and it's often loyalty to other institutions, e.g. ''Anime/MobileSuitGundam00'' has Sergei Smirnov, who dislikes actions such as the HRL's Supersoldier project or the world government's A-Law's actions, but he stays loyal to them.
***
them. Except that he quite openly schemes behind the A-Laws' backs and leaks intel on them to Celestial Being.



* The Britannians in ''Franchise/CodeGeass'', even if their rulers oppress others and promote racial supremacy.
** Also, Suzaku, who fights for the lawful authority of a region, even if it he obtained that authority by brutally conquering his own country.
* Bunchuu, from ''Manga/SoulHunter''.

to:

* The Britannians in ''Franchise/CodeGeass'', even if their rulers oppress others and promote racial supremacy.
**
supremacy. Also, Suzaku, who fights for the lawful authority of a region, even if it he obtained that authority by brutally conquering his own country.
* %%* Bunchuu, from ''Manga/SoulHunter''.



* ''Manga/{{Bleach}}'': Byakuya Kuchiki [[ToBeLawfulOrGood sided with the law]] when his sister Rukia was arrested and scheduled for execution. Despite disagreeing with the situation, he was bound by his social position, his military position and a promise he had once made over his dead parents' honor. As an aristocratic role-model for society in general, he was trapped by the fact that he could not expect others to uphold the law if he broken the law whenever it personally inconvenienced him. As a captain in the Gotei 13, he was expected to obey the orders of the Central 46 without question or hesitation. And, in his past, after having thrown his family into chaos by breaking the rules to both marry a commoner and then honour her deathbed request to adopt and protect her sister (Rukia) as his own, he made a promise to his parents' tomb that he would never break the rules again. Rukia's execution forced him to choose between those two conflicting vows but the sheer weight behind the vow to uphold the law meant that was the vow he had to choose no matter what his personal feelings may have been about it.

to:

* ''Manga/{{Bleach}}'': ''Manga/{{Bleach}}'':
**
Byakuya Kuchiki [[ToBeLawfulOrGood sided with the law]] when his sister Rukia was arrested and scheduled for execution. Despite disagreeing with the situation, he was bound by his social position, his military position and a promise he had once made over his dead parents' honor. As an aristocratic role-model for society in general, he was trapped by the fact that he could not expect others to uphold the law if he broken the law whenever it personally inconvenienced him. As a captain in the Gotei 13, he was expected to obey the orders of the Central 46 without question or hesitation. And, in his past, after having thrown his family into chaos by breaking the rules to both marry a commoner and then honour her deathbed request to adopt and protect her sister (Rukia) as his own, he made a promise to his parents' tomb that he would never break the rules again. Rukia's execution forced him to choose between those two conflicting vows but the sheer weight behind the vow to uphold the law meant that was the vow he had to choose no matter what his personal feelings may have been about it.



* Gladiator, of the Shi'ar Imperial Guard from ''ComicBook/XMen'', has explicitly stated that his loyalty is to the Imperium itself, regardless of who's holding the throne (ultimately, he turned out to be very right to support Deathbird: she turned out to be a very capable majestrix. [[OmnicidalManiac The mad emperor D'Ken]], on the other hand...), going as far as serving [[TheCaligula Vulcan]] while showing distaste for having to fight Lilandra, the previous majestrix, and his long-time BodyguardCrush. Eventually, however, Vulcan finally pushes Gladiator a bridge too far (capturing Lilandra and preparing to have her executed), leading Gladiator to defy this trope for the first (and almost certainly last) time.
** By the end of the ComicBook/WarOfKings event, [[spoiler:Gladiator is the one holding the Throne, what with everyone else in charge either being dead or MIA]].

to:

* Gladiator, of the Shi'ar Imperial Guard from ''ComicBook/XMen'', has explicitly stated that his loyalty is to the Imperium itself, regardless of who's holding the throne (ultimately, he turned out to be very right to support Deathbird: she turned out to be a very capable majestrix. [[OmnicidalManiac The mad emperor D'Ken]], on the other hand...), going as far as serving [[TheCaligula Vulcan]] while showing distaste for having to fight Lilandra, the previous majestrix, and his long-time BodyguardCrush. Eventually, however, Vulcan finally pushes Gladiator a bridge too far (capturing Lilandra and preparing to have her executed), leading Gladiator to defy this trope for the first (and almost certainly last) time.
**
time. By the end of the ComicBook/WarOfKings event, [[spoiler:Gladiator is the one holding the Throne, what with everyone else in charge either being dead or MIA]].



* Former stand-in for ComicBook/CaptainAmerica, [=USAgent=], is a perfect example of the self-righteous and overly jingoistic approach to this trope (as opposed to the actual Captain, who considers his duty to be to America's ideals themselves rather than their leaders or political parties).

to:

* ''ComicBook/CaptainAmerica'':
**
Former stand-in for ComicBook/CaptainAmerica, Cap, [=USAgent=], is a perfect example of the self-righteous and overly jingoistic approach to this trope (as opposed to the actual Captain, who considers his duty to be to America's ideals themselves rather than their leaders or political parties).



*** Ironically, Nuke's ComicBook/UltimateMarvel counterpart ''averts'' this; he was created as the Captain America for the Vietnam War, but became so disgusted with American atrocities and moral ambiguities that he went rogue and now he wants to punish America for not being the "good guy" as it claimed to be when it went into Vietnam.

to:

*** ** Ironically, Nuke's ComicBook/UltimateMarvel counterpart ''averts'' this; he was created as the Captain America for the Vietnam War, but became so disgusted with American atrocities and moral ambiguities that he went rogue and now he wants to punish America for not being the "good guy" as it claimed to be when it went into Vietnam.



* This is what happened to the character of {{Franchise/Superman}} in ''ComicBook/TheDarkKnightReturns'', though that was not in canon, where he's frequently refused to do favors for the U.S. government if he feels they are wrong, especially when ComicBook/LexLuthor was President. His attitude towards the city of Metropolis however, is closer to this trope.
** Superman doesn't believe in MyCountryRightOrWrong when it comes to governments, he will usually follow the wishes of the American people, even if he doesn't agree with them. For example, in the "Public Enemies'' arc of ComicBook/SupermanBatman, he says:
--->"The world will '''never''' know how I struggled with the decision to '''stay out''' of the electoral process. Should I have gone on television and told the voters '''not''' to elect this man? And what then? If I use my '''influence''' -- my '''character''' and my '''reputation''' -- to tell people how to vote, what does that make me? I choose to fight for Truth, Justice and the American Way. And for all it's flaws, American democracy ''does'' work... The United States doesn't need me to dictate, or worse, '''deprive''' her people of that most precious gift. The freedom of ''choice''. Even when I knew in my heart that choice was '''wrong'''."

to:

* ''Franchise/{{Superman}}'':
**
This is what happened happens to the character of {{Franchise/Superman}} in ''ComicBook/TheDarkKnightReturns'', though that was not in canon, where he's frequently refused to do favors for the U.S. government if he feels they are wrong, especially when ComicBook/LexLuthor was President. His attitude towards the city of Metropolis however, is closer to this trope.
** Superman doesn't believe in MyCountryRightOrWrong when it comes to governments, he will usually follow the wishes of the American people, even if he doesn't agree with them. For example, in the "Public Enemies'' Enemies" arc of ComicBook/SupermanBatman, ''ComicBook/SupermanBatman'', he says:
--->"The --->'''Superman:''' The world will '''never''' know how I struggled with the decision to '''stay out''' of the electoral process. Should I have gone on television and told the voters '''not''' to elect this man? And what then? If I use my '''influence''' -- my '''character''' and my '''reputation''' -- to tell people how to vote, what does that make me? I choose to fight for Truth, Justice and the American Way. And for all it's flaws, American democracy ''does'' work... The United States doesn't need me to dictate, or worse, '''deprive''' her people of that most precious gift. The freedom of ''choice''. Even when I knew in my heart that choice was '''wrong'''."



[[/folder]]

[[folder:Comic Strips



-->'''Clerk''': Citizenship?\\
'''Man''': Put "contradictory"...

to:

-->'''Clerk''': -->'''Clerk:''' Citizenship?\\
'''Man''': '''Man:''' Put "contradictory"...



[[folder:Film]]

to:

[[folder:Film]][[folder:Films -- Live-Action]]



** In ''Film/FortyNinthParallel'', Vogul is an interesting example. He’s the only one who shows compassion or shame for his fellow Nazis' actions. It doesn’t excuse his passiveness, however.
* Centauri 7's attitude in ''Film/HunterPrey''.

to:

** In ''Film/FortyNinthParallel'', Vogul is an interesting example. He’s the only one who shows compassion or shame for his fellow Nazis' actions. It doesn’t doesn't excuse his passiveness, however.
* %%* Centauri 7's attitude in ''Film/HunterPrey''.



--> '''Rudolf Abel''': The boss is not always right, but he is always the boss.

to:

--> '''Rudolf Abel''': -->'''Rudolf Abel:''' The boss is not always right, but he is always the boss.



* Captain Laurence from the Literature/{{Temeraire}} series is deeply devoted to Britain, and his sense of duty is what constantly drives the plot- he hated the thought of taking on a dragon, but did it because he thought it was right. However, he finally draws the line when he hears of a British plan to [[spoiler: infect every French dragon with a fatal disease, and let to spread and kill every non-British dragon in the world despite them being sentient beings]], which finally prompts him to turn traitor.

to:

* Captain Laurence from the Literature/{{Temeraire}} ''Literature/{{Temeraire}}'' series is deeply devoted to Britain, and his sense of duty is what constantly drives the plot- plot -- he hated the thought of taking on a dragon, but did it because he thought it was right. However, he finally draws the line when he hears of a British plan to [[spoiler: infect every French dragon with a fatal disease, and let to spread and kill every non-British dragon in the world despite them being sentient beings]], which finally prompts him to turn traitor.



---> '''Dukat''': As a loyal officer of the Cardassian Military, I am pledged to serve the legitimate ruling body of the Empire, whoever that may be.\\
'''Sisko''': In other words, you saw which way the wind was blowing and switched sides.\\
'''Dukat''': [[ItSeemedLikeAGoodIdeaAtTheTime It seemed like a good idea at the time...]]

to:

---> '''Dukat''': --->'''Dukat:''' As a loyal officer of the Cardassian Military, I am pledged to serve the legitimate ruling body of the Empire, whoever that may be.\\
'''Sisko''': '''Sisko:''' In other words, you saw which way the wind was blowing and switched sides.\\
'''Dukat''': '''Dukat:''' [[ItSeemedLikeAGoodIdeaAtTheTime It seemed like a good idea at the time...]]



--->'''Garak''': Children without parents have no status in Cardassian society. The situation is most unfortunate, but ''I don't make the rules''.

to:

--->'''Garak''': --->'''Garak:''' Children without parents have no status in Cardassian society. The situation is most unfortunate, but ''I don't make the rules''.



*** One Cardassian tried to pass himself off as [[spoiler:Gul Darhe'el]], the commander in charge of a brutal Bajoran concentration camp, and be arrested and charged with war crimes which he gleefully admitted to and showed great pleasure in. In truth, he was a simple file clerk that was stationed there and was tortured by the inhumanity of the situation and haunted about his inability to do anything. He only played up on the role in the hopes that he would be prosecuted, all For the Good of Cardassia.
---->'''Kira''': ''(after exposing his true identity)'' Why are you doing this?\\
'''[[spoiler:Aamin Marritza]]''': For Cardassia! The only way Cardassia will survive is if it stands before Bajor and admits the truth! My trial will force Cardassia to acknowledge its guilt, and we're guilty, all of us! My death is necessary.

to:

*** ** One Cardassian tried to pass himself off as [[spoiler:Gul Darhe'el]], the commander in charge of a brutal Bajoran concentration camp, and be arrested and charged with war crimes which he gleefully admitted to and showed great pleasure in. In truth, he was a simple file clerk that was stationed there and was tortured by the inhumanity of the situation and haunted about his inability to do anything. He only played up on the role in the hopes that he would be prosecuted, all For the Good of Cardassia.
---->'''Kira''': ''(after --->'''Kira:''' ''[after exposing his true identity)'' identity]'' Why are you doing this?\\
'''[[spoiler:Aamin Marritza]]''': Marritza]]:''' For Cardassia! The only way Cardassia will survive is if it stands before Bajor and admits the truth! My trial will force Cardassia to acknowledge its guilt, and we're guilty, all of us! My death is necessary.



** The [[SuperSoldier Jem'Hadar]] are bred to be unquestioningly obedient to [[TheEmpire the Dominion]], even obeying orders to go to their deaths because "it is the order of things."
*** In one case, a Jem'hadar realizes that the unusually poor strategy of the Vorta would lead to his entire unit being killed in the attack and expressly recognizes that they were betrayed by the Vorta, but still conducts the attack as planned.
** Really, this trope is more the central theme of Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses his loyalty to friends and family.

to:

** The [[SuperSoldier Jem'Hadar]] are bred to be unquestioningly obedient to [[TheEmpire the Dominion]], even obeying orders to go to their deaths because "it is the order of things."
***
" In one case, a Jem'hadar realizes that the unusually poor strategy of the Vorta would lead to his entire unit being killed in the attack and expressly recognizes that they were betrayed by the Vorta, but still conducts the attack as planned.
** Really, this trope is more the central theme of Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine ''Series/StarTrekDeepSpaceNine'' as a whole. It's simpler to name the people who don't wrestle with it in the series. Kira, whose actions during the occupation were explicitly terroristic, found herself at odds with her new role as a soldier of a legitimate government. Julian Bashir was often at odds with Starfleet's own brand of this Trope. Sisko had to struggle with complacency in political assassination for the good of the Federation. Worf had to wrestle with his ideals of what it means to be Klingon with the fact that not all Klingons are paragons of Klingon virtue. Quark faced conflicts against Ferengi society verses his loyalty to friends and family.



-->''"I hear you say the truth must take a beating\\

to:

-->''"I -->''I hear you say the truth must take a beating\\



My country going wrong."''
** As do Levellers in a few of theirs, most interestingly, in England My Home
--->''"Oh, what happened to\\
My green and pleasant land?"''
** German punk band Music/DieTotenHosen's "Tausend gute Gründe" lists "a thousand good reasons to be proud of this country" only to admit that at the moment, they can't actually come up with a single one.

to:

My country going wrong."''
**
''
*
As do Levellers in a few of theirs, most interestingly, in England "England My Home
--->''"Oh,
Home".
-->''Oh,
what happened to\\
My green and pleasant land?"''
**
land?''
*
German punk band Music/DieTotenHosen's "Tausend gute Gründe" lists "a thousand good reasons to be proud of this country" only to admit that at the moment, they can't actually come up with a single one.



-->''"My country right or wrong\\
Let the devil take the hindmost."''

to:

-->''"My -->''My country right or wrong\\
Let the devil take the hindmost."''''



-->''"This is no time for my country Right or Wrong\\
Remember what that brought."''

to:

-->''"This -->''This is no time for my country Right or Wrong\\
Remember what that brought."''''



[[folder:Professional Wrestling]]
* Used to justify the HeelFaceTurn of Jack Swagger, through his manager, Zeb Coulter, in a feud against ForeignWrestlingHeel Alexander Rusev and Lana. Despite Zeb's heel gimmick being borderline (ahem) racist, very right-wing politically (including criticizing Obama), and being particularly chilly towards illegal immigrants (i.e. Mexicans, documented or otherwise), Coulter managed to get a decent portion of the crowd on the side of him and Swagger with the help of a CrowdChant CatchPhrase ("We the People!") and by pointing out that, yes, they had their issues with the President's policies, but he is still ''America's'' president, and it's for Americans to work out among themselves, not for arrogant foreigners to criticize.

to:

[[folder:Professional Wrestling]]
[[folder:Podcasts]]
* Used to justify In the HeelFaceTurn of Jack Swagger, through his manager, Zeb Coulter, in a feud against ForeignWrestlingHeel Alexander Rusev and Lana. Despite Zeb's heel gimmick being borderline (ahem) racist, very right-wing politically (including criticizing Obama), and being particularly chilly towards illegal immigrants (i.e. Mexicans, documented or otherwise), Coulter managed ''Podcast/WelcomeToNightVale'' episode "Old Oak Doors" when [[TheNarrator Cecil]] is attempting to get a decent portion of rally the crowd on the side of him and Swagger with the help of populace, he acknowledges that [[EldritchLocation Night Vale]] is a CrowdChant CatchPhrase ("We the People!") and by pointing out that, yes, they had their issues with the President's policies, horrifying place, but he is still ''America's'' president, and it's for Americans to work out among themselves, not for arrogant foreigners to criticize.still better than living under the thumb of [[EvilInc [=StrexCorp=]]].



[[folder:Pro Wrestling]]
* Used to justify the HeelFaceTurn of Jack Swagger, through his manager, Zeb Coulter, in a feud against ForeignWrestlingHeel Alexander Rusev and Lana. Despite Zeb's heel gimmick being borderline (ahem) racist, very right-wing politically (including criticizing Obama), and being particularly chilly towards illegal immigrants (i.e. Mexicans, documented or otherwise), Coulter managed to get a decent portion of the crowd on the side of him and Swagger with the help of a CrowdChant CatchPhrase ("We the People!") and by pointing out that, yes, they had their issues with the President's policies, but he is still ''America's'' president, and it's for Americans to work out among themselves, not for arrogant foreigners to criticize.
[[/folder]]



* A common depiction of the Imperial Guard in ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'' has very strong tones of this, especially when they're the antagonists. Otherwise, they actually believe what they're doing is right in itself.
** Outcasts are the Eldar that grew tired of their Craftworld and leave to roam the galaxy on their own. Yet when Craftworld needs them, they return to fight, usually as infiltrators, scouts and snipers. In Retribution, even while acting Craftworld Autarch and Seers, Rohan endlessly complains about archaic ways of his companions, but follows their orders nonetheless.

to:

* ''TabletopGame/Warhammer40000'':
**
A common depiction of the Imperial Guard in ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'' has very strong tones of this, especially when they're the antagonists. Otherwise, they actually believe what they're doing is right in itself.
** Outcasts are the Eldar that grew tired of their Craftworld and leave to roam the galaxy on their own. Yet when Craftworld needs them, they return to fight, usually as infiltrators, scouts and snipers. In Retribution, "Retribution", even while acting Craftworld Autarch and Seers, Rohan endlessly complains about archaic ways of his companions, but follows their orders nonetheless.



* In the Freedom in the Galaxy boardgame, Grand Marshal Barca. He's the finest commander of the whole game and has been serving the Empire at that post for forty years, never mind who the current Emperor is or what his policies are. ( Then again, he belongs to a race of bulldog-like aliens noted for unwavering loyalty ).

to:

* In the Freedom ''Freedom in the Galaxy Galaxy'' boardgame, Grand Marshal Barca. He's the finest commander of the whole game and has been serving the Empire at that post for forty years, never mind who the current Emperor is or what his policies are. ( Then again, he belongs to a race of bulldog-like aliens noted for unwavering loyalty ).



%%[[folder:Webcomics]]

to:

%%[[folder:Webcomics]]%%[[folder:Web Comics]]



[[folder:Web Original]]

to:

[[folder:Web Original]]Videos]]



* In the ''Podcast/WelcomeToNightVale'' episode "Old Oak Doors" when [[TheNarrator Cecil]] is attempting to rally the populace, he acknowledges that [[EldritchLocation Night Vale]] is a horrifying place, but it's still better than living under the thumb of [[EvilInc [=StrexCorp=]]].



* Book 3 of WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender inverts this with Azula. She is surprisingly sisterly with her brother Zuko when he returns home with her and fiercely antagonistic towards him [[spoiler: upon learning of his defection]]. If you're against the Fire Nation, hope you don't have to cross her.

to:

* Book 3 of WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'' inverts this with Azula. She is surprisingly sisterly with her brother Zuko when he returns home with her and fiercely antagonistic towards him [[spoiler: upon [[spoiler:upon learning of his defection]]. If you're against the Fire Nation, hope you don't have to cross her.



Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** The Zabi family was large and varied, producing not only scheming villains like Giren and Kycilia, but also such people as their AntiVillain brothers, a WideEyedIdealist Garma and [[VillainousValor valiant]] and [[NobleDemon noble]] FourStarBadass Dozle. Whose daughter just so happens to be the protagonist in the [[Anime/MobileSuitGundamUnicorn UC latest series so far]].

to:

** The Zabi family was large and varied, producing not only scheming villains like Giren and Kycilia, but also such people as their AntiVillain brothers, a WideEyedIdealist Garma and [[VillainousValor valiant]] and [[NobleDemon noble]] FourStarBadass Dozle. Whose daughter just so happens to be the protagonist in the [[Anime/MobileSuitGundamUnicorn UC latest series so far]].''Anime/MobileSuitGundamUnicorn'' series.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* Nords loyal to the remains of the Empire in ''VideoGame/TheElderScrollsVSkyrim'' display some of this: they're dealing with a civil war where the other side is led by a secessionist whose grievances against the Emprire are genuine in spite of his [[FantasticRacism "Skyrim for the Nords!"]] beliefs and many will adknowledge that the Nords have got a raw deal from them - scores of them killed in a war the Empire lost to the Thalamor, worship of their favorite deity, Talos, outlawed as part of the peace treaty, and heavy taxation to pay the war debts wrecking the economy. But as the first Imperial loyalist you could befriend in the game states, Skyim has always supported the Empire (Talos/Tiber Septim the first Emperor was a Nord) and "The Nords have never been fair-weather friends."

to:

* Nords loyal to [[VestigialEmpire the remains of the Empire Empire]] in ''VideoGame/TheElderScrollsVSkyrim'' display some of this: they're dealing with a civil war where the other side is led by a secessionist whose grievances against the Emprire are genuine in spite of his [[FantasticRacism "Skyrim for the Nords!"]] beliefs and many will adknowledge acknowledge that the Nords have got a raw deal from them - scores of them killed in a war the Empire lost to the Thalamor, Thalmor, worship of their favorite deity, Talos, outlawed as part of the peace treaty, and heavy taxation to pay the war debts wrecking the economy. But as the first Imperial loyalist you could befriend in the game states, Skyim Skyrim has always supported the Empire (Talos/Tiber Septim the first Emperor was a Nord) and "The Nords have never been fair-weather friends."
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Linked to the single game page.





** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTellius Path of Radiance]]'' actually [[LampshadeHanging hangs a lampshade on this]] when Ashnard tells Bryce, the last of his Four Riders, that yes, he '''is''' a complete bastard (the specifics are technically spoilers, but everyone who played at least halfway through can probably figure them out). Bryce is appalled at what Ashnard says but is still loyal enough to go out to die, and Ashnard breaks out into a fit of laughter, mocking his notion of chivalry.

to:

** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTellius ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemPathOfRadiance Path of Radiance]]'' actually [[LampshadeHanging hangs a lampshade on this]] when Ashnard tells Bryce, the last of his Four Riders, that yes, he '''is''' a complete bastard (the specifics are technically spoilers, but everyone who played at least halfway through can probably figure them out). Bryce is appalled at what Ashnard says but is still loyal enough to go out to die, and Ashnard breaks out into a fit of laughter, mocking his notion of chivalry.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* ''Series/{{Blackadder}}'': Sir Talbot, a loyalist Lord cheerfully tells Prince George that he doesn't care that the Prince is an utter buffoon, or that his royal father is a senile, inbred madman, as far as Talbot is concerned, they were annointed by God, and have his unquestioning loyalty in opposing the anti-royal sentiments in Parliament. Unfortunately, he dies of old age a few seconds after making that speech, forcing Blackadder to come up with a new plan.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


---->'''Garak''': Children without parents have no status in Cardassian society. The situation is most unfortunate, but ''I don't make the rules''.

to:

---->'''Garak''': --->'''Garak''': Children without parents have no status in Cardassian society. The situation is most unfortunate, but ''I don't make the rules''.

Top