History Main / GoodIsOldFashioned

ThoseWackyNazis often have a tendency to express sentiments of this fashion; whilst they may not actually identify themselves as evil, they will often sneer to their more democratic foes that their beliefs are 'outdated', and that the pure Aryan way is the inevitable way of the future. Given what the judgment of history ended up [[AcceptablePoliticalTargets being against the Nazis and their followers]], a Nazi who makes this assertion will usually be played for the historical irony, especially if they're making it any time pre-1945. Similarly, villains associated with the Soviet Union, or Communism in general, are likewise likely to be treated like this, with lines about the obsolescence of freedom and democracy and the inevitability of Communist world revolution.

* In ComicBook/UltimateMarvel, at some point Ultimate Cap, who like all characters in that universe is somewhat less good, is taken aback and disturbed by the Ultimate incestuous relationship between Ultimate Quicksilver and Ultimate Scarlet Witch. Ultimate Wasp berates him for having "20th Century morals". Because BrotherSisterIncest is so modern and awesome, apparently. Not all the Ultimates actually felt that way, though--Hawkeye did call the relationship sick.

---> '''Jason:''' ''I don't know what clouds your judgment worse. Your guilt or your antiquated sense of morality.''

---> ComicBook/{{Robin|Series}}: The old Batman would never [[PayEvilUntoEvil descend to their level!]]\\
ComicBook/{{Azrael}}: The old Batman was created for older times. There's no place for kid gloves now. Evil has lost its patience. Obeying rules and codes the other side has trashed is ''stupid.''

* Shane of ''Series/TheWalkingDead'' runs on this concept, insisting that the heroes cannot survive the apocalypse while holding onto virtue. Dale adamantly opposes this belief.

* In Philip Reeve's ''Mortal Engines'', the Engineers, about to fight with the Historians, sneer at them because the Engineers represent the future. [[spoiler:The Historians win.]]

Contrast SillyRabbitIdealismIsForKids -- which often carries the same implication that "you are ignorant of the real world of today." See also CoolPeopleRebelAgainstAuthority, GoodIsNotDumb, and the AppealToNovelty Fallacy; of which this trope is an example of the latter.

** Parodied in ''ComicBook/GrantMorrisonsJLA'', when Superman tells such a group (the Ultramarines) that "these 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel".

** Notably, in "What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American Way?", in which he fights some very obvious [[{{Expy}} Expies]] of ComicBook/TheAuthority.

* In ''Comicbook/{{Supergirl}}'' story ''Comicbook/TheSupergirlFromKrypton'' it's defied by Batman, who states that people who think Superman is an outdated boy-scout are unable to see him for the hero he is.
* In DC's miniseries ''ComicBook/Trinity2008'', Morgaine Le Fey tells Superman, during the climactic battle, that she is looking to the future, while he, Batman, and Franchise/WonderWoman cling to the past.

** Parodied in ''Comicbook/GrantMorrisonsJLA'', when Superman tells such a group (the Ultramarines) that "these 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel".

** In ''ComicBook/SupermanAndTheAuthority'', Manchester Black responds to Superman's ThouShaltNotKill order by sarcastically saying they're about to get a speech about how much better things were in the old days and what's wrong with heroes today. Superman replies that, on the contrary, he thinks young people today are doing just fine; it's people the same age as him that are cynical. (A bit of LeaningOnTheFourthWall; it had, after all, been twenty years since the heyday of the NinetiesAntiHero.)

** In ''ComicBook/SupermanAndTheAuthority'', Manchester Black responds to Superman's ThouShaltNotKill order by sarcastically saying they're about to get a speech about how much better things were in the old days and what's wrong with heroes today. Superman replies that, on the contrary, he thinks young people today are doing just fine; it's people the same age as him that are cynical.

* ''Series/TheTwilightZone1959'': "[[Recap/TheTwilightZoneS2E65TheObsoleteMan The Obsolete Man]]". The title man, Romney Wordsworth, is prosecuted for being an (illegal) librarian and (illegally) believing in God, which they deem obsolete and thus wrong. He on the other hand upholds them to the point of death (everyone "obsolete" is killed). Wordsworth's a courageous martyr who stands up against this tyranny even if it means his life.

* Since the days of ancient Greece, debates about the morality and practicality of democracy versus tyranny have often been framed in these terms. Creator/{{Plato}}'s ''Literature/TheRepublic'' describes an ideal government ruled by "philosopher-kings" who would rule in the people's best interests without regard for themselves, treating contemporary democracy as outdated and inferior. "Sed quid custodiaret ipsos custodes?" (But who shall oversee the overseers?) These debates, in which [[DemocracyIsBad democracy was portrayed as aimless, inefficient mob rule]] and enlightened tyranny as more efficient and forward-thinking, were repeated among intellectuals at the turn of the 20th century, with UsefulNotes/FriedrichNietzsche being the {{Trope Maker|s}}. Many average people believed it too, feeling that a strong nationalistic leader who would put the good of the people first was preferable to elected bodies that would squabble at best and line their own pockets at worst. Fascist parties came to power in Italy, [[ThoseWackyNazis Germany]], and beyond by arguing that things like liberal democracy and individual rights were outdated concepts and that only through totalitarian dictatorship could the [[TheNeedsOfTheMany "greater good"]] of the nation as a whole be tended to. One of UsefulNotes/BenitoMussolini's favorite words was, in fact, "pragmatic". Communist tracts of the time also made use of this trope, though they tended to portray themselves as 'true' democrats and the liberal democracies of the West as being undemocratic because they didn't permit unlimited power to the majority. A favorite of Communist propagandists of the 1930s in the USA was that the Constitution was outdated, obsolete, and a 'barrier to democracy'. It took World War II to demolish these perspectives.

* ''Series/TheTwilightZone1959'': "[[Recap/TheTwilightZoneS2E65TheObsoleteMan The Obsolete Man]]". The title man, Romney Wordsworth, is prosecuted for being an (illegal) librarian and (illegally) believing in God, which they deem obsolete and thus wrong. He on the other hand upholds them to the point of death (everyone "obsolete" is killed). He is a courageous martyr who stands up against this tyranny even if it means his life.

* ''Series/TheTwilightZone1959'': "The Obsolete Man." The title man is prosecuted for being an (illegal) librarian and (illegally) believing in God. The government in that episode also admittedly espouses philosophies similar to those of Mussolini (see below).

[[folder:Webcomics]]
* ''Webcomic/DominicDeegan'': [[http://www.dominic-deegan.com/view.php?date=2005-03-06 Now I will destroy the spiteful old zombie and all the outdated ideals he holds so dear]]
* In ''Webcomic/{{Sinfest}}'',
** [[http://www.sinfest.net/view.php?date=2009-02-16 God's music]] is [[http://www.sinfest.net/view.php?date=2009-02-17 scorned by Lil' E, who prefers modern raucousness.]]
** [[http://www.sinfest.net/view.php?date=2012-07-27 Squigley, on finding conflict, quickly terms porn-disapproving feminists "old-fashioned."]]
* In ''Webcomic/DocRat'', [[http://www.docrat.com.au/default.asp?thisItem=885 Doc disapproves of the casual attitude toward pregnancy]] and phrases it as a question about whether he's old-fashioned.
* In ''Webcomic/BlueYonder'', [[http://www.blueyondercomic.net/comics/1610977/blue-yonder-chapter-2-page-28/ a robot was reprogrammed and is no longer "restricted by outmoded concepts of morality."]]
* In ''Webcomic/TalesOfTheQuestor'', [[http://www.rhjunior.com/totq/00779.html Rosad the Monster-maker held that "old" moral and ethical codes held back the progress of the Racconan race.]]
[[/folder]]

* ''Manga/AyakashiTriangle'': In a strange example, it's pointed out that most "traditional" [[OurSpiritsAreDifferent ayakashi]] (kinds that have been around of hundreds of years and are mostly based on existing {{yokai}} folklore) are peaceful or can be handled non-violently, whereas the only specifically modern ones are variants of ikon--bizarre, [[HorrorHunger ravenous]] monstrosities. This may be because most of the "bad" traditional ones were exterminated and not replaced, skewing the results of the survivors, but it still seems urbanization has resulted in a higher share of violent ayakashi.

* Not only is this trope never played straight in Creator/{{Greg Egan}}'s stories, it is always {{inverted}}, often with gratuitous scenes of human cruelty justified by conservatism or religion in order to contrast its tyranny with the benefits of enlightened scientific freethought. But his novella "Literature/{{Oracle}}" goes so far as to have a character who believes this trope, and whose [[WrongGenreSavvy Wrong Genre Savviness]] is played for DramaticIrony: Jack Hamilton is an old-fashioned Cambridge don and Christian apologist [[BornInTheWrongCentury who longs for the days of natural theology]], but clearly has no understanding of why the rest of academia has moved on. Even though his apologetics arguments have been refuted by fellow Christians, who [[StopBeingStereotypical care about intellectual honesty more than they care about sticking it to the materialists]], he still insists that they are correct, and not only that, but skeptics cannot see this because they are so biased that they cannot possibly understand why his arguments are [[IgnorantOfTheirOwnIgnorance self-evidently]] correct. So he interprets his absence from the intellectual scene not as evidence that he is a bit of a crank, but instead that the scientific establishment is uncritically adopting philosophical naturalism because [[AppealToNovelty it is fashionable]], and that it is only a matter of time before the fickle winds of trendiness make them go for full-on [[HollywoodSatanism devil-worship]]. Naturally, he is portrayed as a complete buffoon, and [[ArkhamsRazor jumps to the conclusion that Robert Stoney is a Satanist]] after seeing his advanced technology and that he was able to disarm an attacker without Hamilton noticing. His fondness for medieval philosophy means that [[ScienceHero Stoney]] is genuinely shocked when he actually makes a decent argument based on then-modern understanding of science and mathematics in their televised debate. [[spoiler:In an alternate universe, he eventually comes around and realizes how foolish he is being, but that doesn't happen in the "main" timeline]].

* Not only is this trope never played straight in Creator/{{Greg Egan}}'s stories, it is always {{inverted}}, often with gratuitous scenes of human cruelty justified by conservatism or religion in order to contrast its tyranny with the benefits of enlightened scientific freethought. But his novella "Literature/{{Oracle}}" goes so far as to have a character who believes this trope, and whose [[WrongGenreSavvy Wrong Genre Savviness]] is played for DramaticIrony: Jack Hamilton is an old-fashioned Cambridge don and Christian apologist [[BornInTheWrongCentury who longs for the days of natural theology]], but clearly has no understanding of why the rest of academia has moved on. Even though his apologetics arguments have been refuted by fellow Christians, who [[StopBeingStereotypical care about intellectual honesty more than they care about sticking it to the materialists]], he still insists that they are correct, and not only that, but skeptics cannot see this because they are so biased that they cannot possibly understand why his arguments are [[IgnorantOfTheirOwnIgnorance self-evidently]] correct. So he interprets his absence from the intellectual scene not as evidence that he is a bit of a crank, but instead that the scientific establishment is uncritically adopting philosophical naturalism because [[AppealToNovelty it is fashionable]], and that it is only a matter of time before the winds of trendiness make them go for full-on [[HollywoodSatanism devil-worship]]. Naturally, he is portrayed as a complete buffoon, and [[ArkhamsRazor jumps to the conclusion that Robert Stoney is a Satanist]] after seeing his advanced technology and that he was able to disarm an attacker without Hamilton noticing. His fondness for medieval philosophy means that [[ScienceHero Stoney]] is genuinely shocked when he actually makes a decent argument based on then-modern understanding of science and mathematics in their televised debate. [[spoiler:In an alternate universe, he eventually comes around and realizes how foolish he is being, but that doesn't happen in the "main" timeline]].

* Franchise/{{Superman}} gets this a few time by anti-heroes; needless to say he proves them wrong.

* ''WesternAnimation/TheIncredibles'': After [[spoiler: the Incredibles defeat the Omnidroid and save their city]], we get this exchange from two onlookers:

* ''Manga/AyakashiTriangle'': In a strange example, it's pointed out that most "traditional" [[OurSpiritsAreDifferent ayakashi]] (kinds that have been around of hundreds of years and are mostly based on existing {{yokai}} folklore) are peaceful or can be handled non-violently, whereas the only modern ones are variants of ikon--bizarre, [[HorrorHunger ravenous]] monstrosities. This may be because most of the "bad" traditional ones were exterminated and not replaced, skewing the results of the survivors, but it still seems urbanization has resulted in a higher share of violent ayakashi.

Note that it applies only to characters whose goodness, rather than any other trait, is called old-fashioned. But it can double up with the character [[GoodOldWays actually being old-fashioned]] in some manner, or defending himself as living according to the GoodOldWays.

* Inverted in ''Manga/TheWorldGodOnlyKnows'' where the traditional hierarchy of Hell was overthrown and replaced by the NobleDemon population.
* Even ''kids'' tell poor ''Manga/{{Trigun}}'''s Vash that [[ThouShaltNotKill his code]] is stupid and old-fashioned, because the planet Gunsmoke is a CrapsackWorld where old Earth morals don't apply. Vash [[{{Determinator}} soldiers on regardless]].
* This is the main point of contention between Kotetsu and Barnaby in ''Anime/TigerAndBunny'' -- Kotetsu is an old-fashioned [[WideEyedIdealist idealist]], while Barnaby is a new-age PunchClockHero.
** [[NinetiesAntiHero Lunatic]] considers both types of heroism outdated and opts for a VigilanteExecution approach, killing criminals mercilessly instead of apprehending them for points.
* The titular character of ''Manga/RurouniKenshin'' speaks with a {{Keigo}}, and has his principles questioned repeatedly by other characters.

* Shiki in ''LightNovel/TheGardenOfSinners'' makes almost no use of modern conveniences except for refrigeration and electric light, almost never even answers her telephone (and she hasn't changed the answering machine's message from its default), wears traditional clothing whenever possible, seems most comfortable in Touko's ancient, run-down office, and is utterly disgusted by drugs and casual sex. Although gender is more or less a non-issue for her for personal reasons; she questions Enjou's sexuality in a completely neutral manner and tries to make a vulgar joke when the Kokutou siblings bring up the possibility of her dating Azaka's female classmates.

* Merla, self-styled Queen of Darkness from an old episode of ''Anime/{{Voltron}}''.

* Even ''kids'' tell poor [[Manga/{{Trigun}} Vash]] that [[ThouShaltNotKill his code]] is stupid and old-fashioned, because the planet Gunsmoke is a CrapsackWorld where old Earth morals don't apply. Vash [[{{Determinator}} soldiers on regardless]].

* Shiki in ''Anime/KaraNoKyoukai'' makes almost no use of modern conveniences except for refrigeration and electric light, almost never even answers her telephone (and she hasn't changed the answering machine's message from its default), wears traditional clothing whenever possible, seems most comfortable in Touko's ancient, run-down office, and is utterly disgusted by drugs and casual sex. Although gender is more or less a non-issue for her for personal reasons; she questions Enjou's sexuality in a completely neutral manner and tries to make a vulgar joke when the Kokutou siblings bring up the possibility of her dating Azaka's female classmates.

* The Unlimited Blade Works route of ''[[VisualNovel/FateStayNight Fate/stay night]]'' and the Heaven's Feel route of same are all about this trope.