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Consolidating the "arguing" Yes Minister points into one.
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* Ever wonder why ''Series/YesMinister'' shows nothing from the parliament and first starts as the election results are known? Because, according to the authors, politic is made in the offices, clubs and other discreet meeting points. But okay, with one party having the majority (the usual in Great Britain) the leading people do, of course, not need to care about the opinions of other people than themselves...
** The politicians ''do'' care about the opinions of people; Hacker is constantly going on about opinion polls and the chances of re-election. The trouble is, he just ''thinks'' he's in charge; all the decisions are actually being made by Sir Humphrey. Hacker does have quite a bit of pull (more in later seasons as he gets a better handle on things), but the problem is he is more concerned with opinion polls and elections than with actually running the country in a sensible long term manner. Humphrey, on the other hand, is busy thinking about the government's (and occasionally the country's) best interest long term, but since he doesn't care at all about opinion polls and elections he feels no reason to change the inefficient system that raised him to his current position. As such, both are self interestedly neglecting the greater good, just in different ways. Pure, simple game theory.
** And part of this is the nature of the British system of politics; whilst the party which forms the government may change periodically due to elections, the civil service which enacts the policy is ever-present and in-theory politically neutral, favouring neither party over the other. And they have immensely good job protection; it's frequently asserted that it's nearly impossible for a civil servant to be fired. So whilst politicians usually disappear after a few years, to a Cabinet reshuffle if not a lost election, the bureaucrats are there until they retire.
** All the above being said, Humphrey and Hacker get a roughly equal number of plots when they are portrayed as clearly, unambiguously in the right. There's also a roughly equal number of times where they are attempting to manipulate the situation for their own personal benefit.
** The politicians ''do'' care about the opinions of people; Hacker is constantly going on about opinion polls and the chances of re-election. The trouble is, he just ''thinks'' he's in charge; all the decisions are actually being made by Sir Humphrey. Hacker does have quite a bit of pull (more in later seasons as he gets a better handle on things), but the problem is he is more concerned with opinion polls and elections than with actually running the country in a sensible long term manner. Humphrey, on the other hand, is busy thinking about the government's (and occasionally the country's) best interest long term, but since he doesn't care at all about opinion polls and elections he feels no reason to change the inefficient system that raised him to his current position. As such, both are self interestedly neglecting the greater good, just in different ways. Pure, simple game theory.
** And part of this is the nature of the British system of politics; whilst the party which forms the government may change periodically due to elections, the civil service which enacts the policy is ever-present and in-theory politically neutral, favouring neither party over the other. And they have immensely good job protection; it's frequently asserted that it's nearly impossible for a civil servant to be fired. So whilst politicians usually disappear after a few years, to a Cabinet reshuffle if not a lost election, the bureaucrats are there until they retire.
** All the above being said, Humphrey and Hacker get a roughly equal number of plots when they are portrayed as clearly, unambiguously in the right. There's also a roughly equal number of times where they are attempting to manipulate the situation for their own personal benefit.
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* Ever wonder why ''Series/YesMinister'' shows nothing from the parliament and first starts as the election results are known? Because, according to the authors, politic [[ZigZaggingTrope zig zags]] this trope. The government (represented by Hacker) is made interested in acting in the offices, clubs and other discreet meeting points. But okay, with one party having the majority (the usual in Great Britain) the leading people do, of course, not national interest but its need to care about the opinions of other people than themselves...
** The politicians ''do'' care about the opinions of people; Hacker is constantly going on about opinion polls and the chances of re-election. The trouble is, he just ''thinks'' he's in charge; all the decisions are actually being made by Sir Humphrey. Hacker does have quite a bit of pull (more in later seasons as he gets a better handle on things), but the problem is he is morebe concerned with opinion polls and elections than can conflict with actually running its ability to run the country in a sensible long term manner. Humphrey, on the other hand, is busy thinking about the government's (and occasionally the country's) best interest long term, but since he doesn't care at all about opinion polls and elections he feels no reason to change the inefficient system that raised him to his current position. As such, both are self interestedly neglecting the greater good, just in different ways. Pure, simple game theory.
** And part of this is the nature of the British system of politics; whilstWhilst the party which forms the government may change periodically due to elections, the civil service (represented by Sir Humphrey) which enacts the policy is ever-present and in-theory politically neutral, favouring neither party over holds much of the other. And power which they have immensely good job protection; it's frequently asserted that it's nearly impossible can use to undermine the democratically elected government's decisions (or just for a civil servant to be fired. So whilst politicians usually disappear after a few years, to a Cabinet reshuffle if not a lost election, the bureaucrats are there until they retire.
** All the above being said,its own interests). Humphrey and Hacker get a roughly equal number of plots when they are portrayed as clearly, unambiguously in the right. There's There are also a roughly equal number of times where they are attempting to manipulate the situation for their own personal benefit.
** The politicians ''do'' care about the opinions of people; Hacker is constantly going on about opinion polls and the chances of re-election. The trouble is, he just ''thinks'' he's in charge; all the decisions are actually being made by Sir Humphrey. Hacker does have quite a bit of pull (more in later seasons as he gets a better handle on things), but the problem is he is more
** And part of this is the nature of the British system of politics; whilst
** All the above being said,
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[[caption-width-right:350:[[AtLeastIAdmitIt At least they're honest about it]].]]
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[[caption-width-right:350:[[AtLeastIAdmitIt At least they're honest about it]].]]
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* In ''Film/ThreeHundred'', Leonidas mocks the democratic Athenians as "boy-lovers" who are incapable of defending themselves. Never mind the fact that in real life Athens and its allies drove off Xerxes' father without Sparta's help and the only reason Leonidas joined the fight against the second Persian invasion was so those "boy-lovers" wouldn't show him up again. And Sparta was just as guilty of pederasty (if not more so) as Athens.
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* In ''Film/ThreeHundred'', Leonidas mocks the democratic Athenians as "boy-lovers" who are incapable of defending themselves. Never mind the fact that in real life Athens and its allies drove off Xerxes' father without Sparta's help and the only reason Leonidas joined the fight against the second Persian invasion was so those "boy-lovers" wouldn't show him up again. And Sparta was just as guilty of pederasty (if not more so) as Athens.
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* ''Literature/MistbornTheOriginalTrilogy'' doesn't say that democracy is inherently bad, but as unsuitable in the particular situation[[note]]The [[GodEmperor Lord Ruler]] just got defeated after 1000 years of rule, TheEmpire is split up to multiple factions that each try to reconquer the entire territory[[/note]]. Elend, the idealistic nobleman, tries to establish a constitutional monarchy, giving each social class[[note]]nobility, commoners, and merchants[[/note]] an equal representation in the Assembly. As their capital city is besieged by multiple usurpers, the Assembly promptly dethrones Elend and is ready to surrender to the enemy who is known to be a ruthless ruler who would rule with an iron fist anyway. [[spoiler:At the end, Elend decides to become Emperor himself and reconquer the territories himself.]]
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* ''ComicBook/TheLegendOfKorraRuinsOfTheEmpire'': [[Characters/TheLegendOfKorraKuvira Kuvira]] opposes the concept of a hereditary monarchy, but the comics reveal she was also against the concept of democracy as well, due to the belief people cannot be trusted with their own freedom.
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* In ''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'' episode "Bart's Comet", the town was going to be struck by the eponymous comet, and Congress' bill to evacuate the town was voted down thanks to a pornography rider attached to it. Kent Brockman's response? "I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply doesn't work." This line is echoed by Homer in "Much Apu About Nothing", after a proposition is passed that requires all illegal immigrants to be deported. The former episode also happens to feature an example when Ned Flanders lets everybody in town into his fallout shelter, only for them to ''vote him out'' when they end up with just one too many people to get the door closed. [[NoGoodDeedGoesUnpunished So the only guy in town smart enough to build a shelter, who is also generous enough to open it up to all the other people, is rewarded by the public voting to send him to his doom.]] They do cave in and join him after he graciously accepts this however.
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* ''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'':
** In''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'' episode "Bart's Comet", "[[Recap/TheSimpsonsS6E14BartsComet Bart's Comet]]", when the town was is going to be struck by the eponymous comet, and Congress' bill to evacuate the town was voted down thanks to a pornography rider attached to it. Kent Brockman's response? "I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply doesn't work." This line is echoed by Homer in "Much Apu About Nothing", after a proposition is passed that requires all illegal immigrants to be deported. The former episode also happens to feature an example when Ned Flanders lets everybody in town into his fallout shelter, only for them to ''vote him out'' when they end up with just one too many people to get the door closed. [[NoGoodDeedGoesUnpunished So the only guy in town smart enough to build a shelter, who is also generous enough to open it up to all the other people, is rewarded by the public voting to send him to his doom.]] They do cave in and join him after he graciously accepts this however. this, however.
** In the same episode, Congress' bill to evacuate the town is voted down thanks to a pornography rider attached to it. Kent Brockman's response? "I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply doesn't work." This line is echoed by Homer in "[[Recap/TheSimpsonsS7E23MuchApuAboutNothing Much Apu About Nothing]]", after a proposition is passed that requires all illegal immigrants to be deported.
** In
** In the same episode, Congress' bill to evacuate the town is voted down thanks to a pornography rider attached to it. Kent Brockman's response? "I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply doesn't work." This line is echoed by Homer in "[[Recap/TheSimpsonsS7E23MuchApuAboutNothing Much Apu About Nothing]]", after a proposition is passed that requires all illegal immigrants to be deported.
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* In one of the first episodes of ''WesternAnimation/BeastWars'', Optimus Primal goes missing and the remaining Maximals have to figure out who's going to lead in his absence. Dinobot being a former Predacon believes as the strongest he should be in charge, but Rattrap refuses to let his best frenemy rule and challenges him. Rhinox has the four Maximals put it to a vote, but they come to a tie between Rattrap and Dinobot. The pair almost come to blows to settle things via combat, but luckily Optimus resurfaces and appoints Rattrap leader until he returns to settle things. Funnily enough, the next time Optimus is gone and Dinobot begins trying to take over, Rhinox has ''none'' of it and chokeslams him into submission due to the dire situation they're in.
-->'''Dinobot''': Ha ha, great system, your "democracy." No mechanism to break a tie!
-->'''Dinobot''': Ha ha, great system, your "democracy." No mechanism to break a tie!
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Ryan was referring specifically to FDR's New Deal in that quote, not Democracy as a whole. Also, the accompanying text is irrelevant as this trope isn't a theme present in the game.
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** In the sequel ''VideoGame/DeusExInvisibleWar'', [[PreviousPlayerCharacterCameo J.C.]], having [[AscendToAHigherPlaneOfExistence merged with Helios,]] intends to create the world's "first true democracy" by [[AssimilationPlot forcibly spreading nanomachines to every human on the planet]], and then using Helios' information processing capability to literally keep track of the wishes of every single person, using this information to dictate decisions based on majority in real-time. [[spoiler: If you choose to support him, then ending video shows a perfectly unified world.]]
* ''VideoGame/{{BioShock|1}}'': "Is a man not entitled by the sweat of his brow? No, says the man in Washington, it belongs to the poor!" Andrew Ryan is an Objectivist and naturally doesn't think too highly of other forms of government, either. The overall message of the game, however, is that extremism in any form, be it over Objectivism, capitalism, democracy, etc., is bad.
* ''VideoGame/{{BioShock|1}}'': "Is a man not entitled by the sweat of his brow? No, says the man in Washington, it belongs to the poor!" Andrew Ryan is an Objectivist and naturally doesn't think too highly of other forms of government, either. The overall message of the game, however, is that extremism in any form, be it over Objectivism, capitalism, democracy, etc., is bad.
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** In the sequel ''VideoGame/DeusExInvisibleWar'', [[PreviousPlayerCharacterCameo J.C.]], having [[AscendToAHigherPlaneOfExistence merged with Helios,]] intends to create the world's "first true democracy" by [[AssimilationPlot forcibly spreading nanomachines to every human on the planet]], and then using Helios' information processing capability to literally keep track of the wishes of every single person, using this information to dictate decisions based on majority in real-time. [[spoiler: If you choose to support him, then ending video shows a perfectly unified world.]]
* ''VideoGame/{{BioShock|1}}'': "Is a man not entitled by the sweat of his brow? No, says the man in Washington, it belongs to the poor!" Andrew Ryan is an Objectivist and naturally doesn't think too highly of other forms of government, either. The overall message of the game, however, is that extremism in any form, be it over Objectivism, capitalism, democracy, etc., is bad.world]].
* ''VideoGame/{{BioShock|1}}'': "Is a man not entitled by the sweat of his brow? No, says the man in Washington, it belongs to the poor!" Andrew Ryan is an Objectivist and naturally doesn't think too highly of other forms of government, either. The overall message of the game, however, is that extremism in any form, be it over Objectivism, capitalism, democracy, etc., is bad.
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* In Creator/MelGibson's ''Film/ThePatriot'', Benjamin Martin is cynical about eliminating British rule over the colonies. "Why should I trade one tyrant three thousand miles away for three thousand tyrants one mile away? An elected legislature can trample a man's rights as easily as a King can." Incidentally, this is a paraphrased version of a line spoken by an actual Loyalist named Mather Byles.
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* In Creator/MelGibson's ''Film/ThePatriot'', ''Film/ThePatriot2000'', Benjamin Martin is cynical about eliminating British rule over the colonies. "Why should I trade one tyrant three thousand miles away for three thousand tyrants one mile away? An elected legislature can trample a man's rights as easily as a King can." Incidentally, this is a paraphrased version of a line spoken by an actual Loyalist named Mather Byles.
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** The in continuity Emperor Doom graphic novel also examined this. Essentially, Doom mind controls the world and eliminates war, poverty, and all his former enemies are happy to help.
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** The in continuity in-continuity Emperor Doom graphic novel also examined this. Essentially, Doom mind controls the world and eliminates war, poverty, and all his former enemies are happy to help.
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** Also, ''ComicBook/CivilWar'' is essentially a fight between heroes who are enforcing a law passed by duly elected officials and heroes who believe they should have the right to act however they see fit. Yes ComicBook/CaptainAmerica fought against democracy.
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** Also, ''ComicBook/CivilWar'' 'ComicBook/CivilWar2006'' is essentially a fight between heroes who are enforcing a law passed by duly elected officials and heroes who believe they should have the right to act however they see fit. Yes Yes, ComicBook/CaptainAmerica fought against democracy.
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Not to be confused with DisasterDemocracy, which is about the reinstatement of democracy after a great societal upheaval. Nothing to do with negative opinions of a [[VideoGame/{{Democracy}} a certain video game series]], either.
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Not to be confused with DisasterDemocracy, which is about the reinstatement of democracy after a great societal upheaval. Nothing to do with negative opinions of a [[VideoGame/{{Democracy}} a certain video game series]], either.
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[[caption-width-right:350:At least they're honest about it.]]
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The plutocrats aren't all of the UNS.
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** The United Nations of Sol, the main government for Terra-native species, was originally portrayed as this. It was later retconned to be a Plutocracy with only superficial democratic elements.
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** The United Nations of Sol, the main government for Terra-native species, was originally portrayed as this. It was later retconned As it turns out, it's so complicated that calling it merely a "democracy" is simplifying it to be a Plutocracy with only superficial democratic elements.the point of parody; some seats are elected in ways we would recognize, yes, but others are appointed, and at least some selected by lottery. Our clearest view of the inner workings of the UNS comes when the mercenaries are hired as bodyguards to some ambassadors who want to speak to the plutocrats, those representatives who explicitly and publicly buy their seats.
