Your argument about terraforming, though, only works if the planets were far from earth-like in the first place. It is very possible, even likely, that the area of space in which the story took place (the show was never very clear if it was all in one very large star system or what, but that's SciFiWritersHave.No Sense Of Distance) was chosen for colonization precisely because there were already a large number of planets in the area that were already very close to earth-like, and which could be made earth-like with relatively little work. In other words, before you can say anything about how much mass-movement and time would be required to terraform a planet, you have to know the starting condition of the planet, which you do not. So I think the example should be removed.
On your other point, there is no evidence in the show that the Alliance is a totalitarian dictatorship, or in fact any kind of dictatorship. There is at least one reference in the show to the existence of an elected legislative body (the joke about River being in Congress). In fact, everything we see in the show suggests that the Alliance is a basically free society. The Alliance has many unsavory features, but it is not a dictatorship, or certainly not a totalitarian one. Incidentally, I'm not a big Firefly fan, but I'm not at all convinced that you are right.
Edited by 216.99.32.45
What you're (R Tanker, that is; I'm suddenly unsure as to whom I replied) saying doesn't matter in the slightest because YOU'RE STILL MAKING CONTRIVED JUSTIFICATIONS. Putting ANYTHING that wasn't addressed in the show into an example is natter and therefore not allowed.
To address your actual points, it's scientifically impossible (no, not improbable, impossible) for multiple planets in any star system with stars similar in size to ours (which they clearly are) to have more than a few (and that's a stretch, considering orbiting multiple stars would change a planet's possible habitability to an even greater degree) which are even CLOSE to being like Earth. Even if you account for them being moons, not planets, that only gets them similar in size, not composition.
There is NO WAY that all of these planets and moons would be able to be the right distance from the star to be even remotely survivable, have the right density, and have orbits that make any sense.
So, imagining that the Firefly universe CAN overcome all of this (and way, way more, but I'm not going to spend an hour typing it) is assuming that they can literally CREATE PLANETS AND MOONS, and realistically, stars as well (or at least change their size, orbit etc). If they could do that, there would be no reason for a Generation Ship and they say in the intro that they "found" the system.
All justifications for this example will be A) Scientifically retarded and B) Natter even if they weren't.
Edited by Ganelon
Wow. Don't shout, dude. And this discussion is almost two years old.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Deleted the following irrelevant Natter that violates Example Indentation from the Demolition Man example.
- There is also no information on whether these practices are in use in the rest of the USA, or for that matter the rest of the world. Dr Cocteau seems to only preside over San Angeles, so either it's the new capital or they seceded in the past (which is not entirely unlikely).
Hm about the entry on KBDH, it is not so strange in the line of Japan... the current emperor is formally the 125th. So it is not so implausible that the Tsuruya family traces its heritage back there, IT is a LOT of time but it is well within the realms of legend in story.
Sigh. User Zaptech made some justifying edits to the entry about Firefly's terraforming, trying to claim that it's only implausibly fast "based on current technology". Well, actually, "based on current technology", terraforming (at least controllably) is completely impossible, no matter how long it takes, hence our troubles with climate change.
As for the question of how long it takes to move certain masses, or how much energy it takes to accelerate them, that's not even a question of "current technology"; "current technology" is a bunch of contemptible little chemical rockets. But no matter the tech, a civilization that can move X amount of mass at Y acceleration has to be able to produce XY amount of force to do that. That can't change, it's literally an immutable law; that is the act of moving things, expressed scientifically. (I've seen some people try to argue the Firefly setting uses its artificial-gravity for a reactionless drive, but trust me, that's worse: reactionless drives, if possible at all, would have to use at least as much energy as accelerating the same mass by means of a reaction engine.)
If a civilization has the mass-moving capabilities demonstrated by the Alliance in the terraforming, then the rest of their energy capabilities will be roughly comparable. I.e., they would be approximately a Kardashev II civilization. That means forget the Reavers, they'd probably be able to hold their own with the Reapers.
Similarly, it is simply unrealistic that the "penniless vagabonds" of the Serenity can own a spaceship. As mentioned on the Energy page under "General", the "tramp spaceship captain" trope in Space Opera is simply a Space Is an Ocean trope, copied unreflectively from the other 1930s pulp-adventure stories with which Space Opera shares an origin, namely the "tramp steamer captain". Nobody that a given government wouldn't trust with nuclear weapons would be trusted, by that government, with spaceships; therefore the Alliance wouldn't trust anyone with spaceships, they're a totalitarian dictatorship. Mal is the last person they'd trust, he's a known dissident—who even went and named the thing after a battle in the insurrection he fought in against the government!
I'm not saying Firefly is a bad show, and its fans need to stop being so defensive. I'm saying that it's more concerned with being entertaining than with being scrupulously scientifically accurate (or with having a completely consistent, realistic totalitarian super-state—a realistically-portrayed Alliance means no show happens, because nobody not strictly overseen by the state would own the Serenity).
Edited by Wagahai Hide / Show Replies