Discussion Recap / MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagicS2E14TheLastRoundup

Maybe it's a nickname, since it started out as a Fandom nickname.

Pinkie Pie's name is Pinkamena but she goes by Pinkie.

So maybe Derpy is Wonderpinning or something like that.

I can go with that.

Her official name could be Bonecrusher and she would still be Derpy to me. I can understand the weirdness of having it actually said in the show, though.

Sane people were PLEASED that they gave a nod to the fanbase. Whiny complainomatics and cowardly execs had to ruin it for everyone though.

And the screaming hypocrisy of it is that if Derpy was "offensive" (you were not put on this earth to never be offended, people!) What the hell does that make Snails? Or Screwloose, or Screwball? Or senile old Granny Apple? We could add Zecora to the list but the incredible Ethnically Sensitive Humor Impaired already bitched about her as a "racist stereotype of Africans"— then bitched about her again when she wore a long white wig and dress on Nightmare Night, saying they were "Caucasianizing her."

Moral of the story, Political Correctness is a festering cancer. DON'T LET IT SPREAD.

I know this reply is from March, but all I have to say is

"Moral of the story, Political Correctness is a festering cancer. DON'T LET IT SPREAD."

This, so damn much.

According to the writer of the episode, after the episode aired, both she and Hasbro received about a dozen complaints from viewers about the 'insensitive portrayal' and 'insulting name'. Whilst the writer herself was unaware that the term 'Derpy' can be taken to mean 'retarded' (indeed, it was one of the original meanings of the word in its internet usage), she was understandably upset about the complaints, especially since she has a son who is himself 'severely disabled'.

Correspondence went back and forth between the Fi M team and Hasbro, but in the end Hasbro made the decision to remove mention of the name and change the voice in response to the complaints.

Cue massive raging from the fanbase, but personally I think they were just being a decent company.

Full story here: http://www.equestriadaily.com/2012/02/amy-keating-rogers-response-to-derpy.html

Call him Special Delivery. That's what I refer to him as.

It seems to be a Running Gag with the show's makers to not give Applejack or Fluttershy their own episodes, excepting "Applebuck Season" and "Dragonshy" respectively. (And possibly "Look Before You Sleep" and "Green Isn't Your Color" as well, though those also mainly focus on Rarity and Twilight.)

I'd give Stare Master and a Bird in the Hoof to Fluttershy. Applejack has Sisterhoof Social, and that's a split ticket with Rarity.

I always considered "Stare Master" to be a Cutie Mark Crusaders episode, but you're right, "Bird in the Hoof" probably counts as a Fluttershy episode. And "Sisterhooves Social" was technically a Rarity episode with Applejack as a major supporting character.

Still, I'm pretty sure Twilight, Rarity, Rainbow Dash, and...maybe Pinkie Pie (my memory's not that good right now) have gotten more than three of "their" episodes. So the show makers don't really favor AJ or 'Shy.

A Bird In The Hoof is easily a Fluttershy episode. Sisterhooves Social is really geared towards Sweetie Belle, then Rarity, then Applejack.

I get that. What I'm getting at is that AJ and Shy haven't had nearly as many of "their" episodes as the others (Spike excluded).

Fluttershy hasn't had focus? Really? I consider "Dragonshy", "The Stare Master", "Green Isn't Your Color" and "A Bird in the Hoof" to be Fluttershy episodes. Admittedly she doesn't have as many as Twilight, Rarity or Rainbow Dash, but it's nowhere near the deprivation Applejack has experienced. Apple Bloom has more episodes than her big sister.

Applejack features in more episodes than practically any other pony (excluding Twilight). She's usually the Straight Man of the group. Many writers have difficulties working such characters into any other role.

Fluttershy has been a major character in several episodes, but usually alongside another character. "Dragonshy" is all her, yes, but she shared "The Stare Master" with the CMC, "Green Isn't Your Color" with Rarity, and "A Bird in the Hoof" with Twilight.

But Fluttershy hasn't had one at all for Season Two yet. There are still eight unconfirmed episodes to go, so she might have a sudden string of them like AJ is getting now.

As for AJ, aren't you forgetting Look Before You Sleep, Fall Weather Friends and Over A Barrel? They count as AJ episodes, even if she shared the first one with Rarity and both of the last two with RD. Bridle Gossip might count as another shared one, given the AJ-Apple Bloom dynamic was quite prominent in that episode.

I wonder if someone somewhere is keeping a list to track who gets how many episodes.

I did one for season 1:

Mare in the Moon: TWILIGHT Elements of Harmony: ENSEMBLE Ticket Master: TWILIGHT Applebuck Season: APPLEJACK Griffon the Brush Off: PINKIE/RAINBOW Boast Busters: TWILIGHT Dragonshy: FLUTTERSHY Look Before You Sleep: APPLEJACK/RARITY Bridle Gossip: ENSEMBLE Swarm of the Century: ENSEMBLE Winter Wrap-Up: TWILIGHT Call of the Cutie: APPLEBLOOM Fall Weather Friends: APPLEJACK/RAINBOW Suited For Success: RARITY Feeling Pinkie Keen: TWILIGHT/PINKIE Sonic Rainboom: RAINBOW/RARITY The Stare Master: FLUTTERSHY/CMC The Show Stoppers: CMC A Dog and Pony Show: SPIKE/RARITY Green Isn't Your Color: RARITY/FLUTTERSHY Over a Barrel: ENSEMBLE A Bird in the Hoof: FLUTTERSHY The Cutie Mark Chronicles: ENSEMBLE Owl's Well That Ends Well: SPIKE/TWILIGHT Party of One: PINKIE The Best Night Ever: ENSEMBLE

I mostly just went by how much screen time a character got, as well as how prominent they are to the dynamic of the story, although I did fudge a bit with Twilight in episodes like Applebuck Season and A Bird in the Hoof, simply because she's the viewpoint character and somepony needs to act as a plot motivator.

Curiously, in season 1, Applejack is dead even with Pinkie Pie and Applebloom (1 centric, 2 double bills), and ahead of Rainbow Dash, whose episodes are all shared with another character. It's just that all of Applejack's episodes are front-loaded, i.e. when bronies would watch a whole string of them after getting addicted to the show. Now that we actually have to wait for new episodes, it seems more unfair than it actually is.

I actually keep track of episodes by writers and focus. Before "The Last Roundup", the ponies with the most focus are Twilight and Rarity, very closely followed by Rainbow Dash. Pinkie Pie has several episodes with a minor focus, but few with a major focus, so she ranks below Rainbow Dash. Then comes Fluttershy, who hasn't had focus since the first season but had a decent number of episodes in that season, and lastly Applejack who of course had almost nothing before this episode.

Yeah, I agree with that, actually. I still think Fluttershy should have more of "her" episodes as much as Applejack, but then again that may be because she's my favourite character.

This episode was a months waiting worth.

And the only best part of Derpy was when Derpy cheered for Applejack.

Until we get more ample proof that she is handicapped, we can't call her more than ditzy just based off of her connotation and actions

Tumblr was arguing earlier over whether or not her portrayal/voice was ableist or not. I've seen arguments for both.

I think her portrayal is somebody who is kinda klutzy (and who maybe needs glasses all the time like Twist) and who maybe lives in her own little world a bit, but not necessarily handicapped/differently abled.

Given how this show tries with a sincere heart to be sensitive to certain topics, I can't see that they're using Derpy as a "let's mock the disabled" object.

Could that qualify as an example of "Unfortunate Implications?" Or perhaps it's more YMMV.

I'm mentally handicapped (to an extent) and I don't necessarily act like Derpy. I prefer to assume that she is like Pinkie Pie, but with derpy eyes and wings.

Honestly, I'm somewhat mentally handicapped, and I know several bronies who are as well, to a much greater extent than I, and we all loved Derpy. In fact, I tend to get more annoyed with people who try to be offended on my behalf than I do at characters like Derpy. I thought she was adorable before, and I think she's even more adorable now. She was klutzy, not retarded.

She has funny eyes, a low, slow voice, and is clumsy, but that's it. That's not conclusive evidence that she's mentally handicapped. A bit uncoordinated, maybe, but when your eyes point in two directions at once, who wouldn't be?

Personally, I thought the voice was just to make her sound adorable. Which it does.

Would we even be having this argument if Derpy was male?

We've had characters on the show that have acted even stupider ("Bringing a house-sized bear right into into town is an awesome idea!"). So the idea that a klutzy female one being deemed offensive just comes off as promoting the Double Standard and Positive Discrimination that Lauren Faust had been trying to avert.

I think Canon!Derpy is a great addition.

Yes, we would be having this argument if Derpy was male. Derpy is monumentally important to the fandom, as evidenced by the enormous reaction her appearance garnered, and each fan that watched the episode had a different portrayal of the character in their mind, which implied different expectations. Derpy's gender had nothing to do with that. There were no expectations of Snips or Snails, so seeing them act stupid is really just establishing character. But the expectations heaped on Derpy come from mountains of fan material, which is not entirely fair on the studio or the character, but predictably, they have conflicted with Derpy's actual appearance. I believe that the "offense" that fans are perceiving is less about the portrayal and more about the conflict it creates with fan works used to build the image of Derpy in the fandom's head. Claiming that Derpy was portrayed as mentally handicapped, or as the less charitable put it, retarded, is just how those fans are expressing their displeasure at having their expectations crushed. The truth of the matter is that Derpy was not portrayed as a mentally handicapped pony, just as a flying and sitting disaster area. I also like to think of her as a younger mare, younger than the Mane Six but just barely full-grown. I know they all have vague ages, but the voice sounds very young to me.

tl;dr Fan Dumb is dumb, Derpy is still awesome. Also, if you still think her name should be Ditzy Doo... eh, her last name hasn't been mentioned yet? *shrug*

Perhaps they did go a little overboard, but it was nothing that Applejack did not consent to or initiate herself. They didn't particularly interfere with her job, just talked to her while working alongside her. Applejack caused the conveyor belt to go out of control on her own, though Twilight, Rarity and Rainbow Dash should have stayed by the sorting belt. The chase was something that Applejack started by taking a carriage, and judging from the way Fluttershy avoided the bunny in their path, I doubt the Mane group would have caused any real harm with their carriage. Besides Rarity failing to catch Pinkie Pie, I mean.

As far as the intensity of their actions goes, think about this: Applejack has rarely ever strayed from her home in Ponyville, and even got her cutie mark from realizing she belonged on the apple orchard. She has demonstrated a resounding dedication to her job and home in Ponyville, to a point where asking for help is extremely difficult for her, and abandoning her job, home or family for any reason is virtually out of the question. Applejack suddenly running away from Ponyville indicates that something has gone seriously wrong, and the Mane group are, understandably, very concerned as her friends and on behalf of her family.

Respecting your friend's wishes is important, but you should also recognize when a friend is seriously troubled by something, and when it interferes with your friend's life, it is responsible to help him or her any way you can.

It ignores the first encounter with her - during which the rest of the mane cast, after expressing relief and concern, ask her directly what's going on, and she refuses to speak. It's established in canon (see Applebuck season) that once Applejack decides something, it's very difficult to persuade her to change her mind. While it's surprising that they didn't try reassuring her that they were her friends and thus get her to open up that way, it's not Idiot Ball material: it's possible that this was implied to be the case anyway. If she's not willing to tell even her closest friends, then it must be serious and they needed other strategies. They didn't even know what kind of problem it was.

The "disturbing her during work" was their getting employed so that they had a chance to talk to AJ. The "torture" wasn't exactly thumbscrews - it was Pinkie being annoying until AJ got the message that they weren't going away without an explanation. And the "haunt"... well, she was trying to run away after promising to tell them.

AJ could have saved herself a lot of trouble if she'd just been honest during their first encounter, but she was too ashamed to talk.

Let's not get carried away. Carrot Top is still a background pony, and she has talked in more episodes than Derpy has. Just based on the show, not the fandom, Derpy is still a background pony.

Well, Cheerilee and the Mayor are classified as minor characters, but they have far more scenes than Derpy, and are more prominent in the stories they appear in than Derpy ever has been (except for this episode). If Derpy has more scenes like this one in future episodes, though, she might be promoted to minor character.

It was Tabitha St Germain, as per Jayson Thiessen.

That'd qualify as Word of God all right.

Yes.

The same could be said of the pic for "Hearth's Warming Eve". But I agree. Might I suggest a picture of the scene where Applejack's note is read?

That would probably be the best idea. The one we have now is too blurry if nothing else.

I can go dig up the reading the note image. I was looking for a pic that highlighted applejack since she was the star.

Hmm. If we'd rather place the focus on Applejack, can we get a good picture of her during the Ponyville ceremony or at the train station before she leaves?

I replaced the blurry one with Twilight reading the note. I can get one during the ponyville ceremony.

UPDATE: There. Got one with Applejack getting on the train as everypony looks on. I actually like this one better now that I've had time to watch the episode a few more times, because it highlights how Mayor Mare is putting all that pressure on AJ to bring home the money.

I'm not sure what sort of trope you're going for here. Are you pointing out the old-fashioned style of the photo? That might be another example of Schizo Tech if anything, but we saw a camera capable of color photography in "May the Best Pet Win!" so I don't think that's justifiable.

It was weird that they were using an old school black and white Polaroid, yes, especially when we have seen color photography is available. Maybe it was an old photo they just magic-copied or something. Dash is more concerned with looking good and looking awesome than the practical, down to earth Apples, so it makes sense now that you got me thinking about it more deeply. Thanks!

Actually, I'm more in the dark than I was before. Their color photography isn't all that vibrant; the colors on each of Rainbow Dash's photos are a little faded. If I recall correctly, however, the black and white photo of Applejack didn't look like it had aged all that much, though I didn't pay that much attention to the details.

Possibly it was a sepia-toned photograph, the kind that are so popular at many Old West themed events. Exactly the kind of event that Applejack would go to. Maybe so posed for an old-timey photo as a souvenir, and gave copies to her friends as gifts.