Discussion Main / YokoOhNo

Wouldn't it be possible to file real-life examples (not here, of course) of this trope under YMMV? After all, Yoko's influence on John did provide fodder enough to become this trope, but IRL she's far from the only culprit even if a lot of people still think so - and it's a phenomenon that extends to other bands, such as Sepultura, Nightwish and even Nirvana, if the conspiracy theories about Courtney having had Kurt killed instead of him killing himself are any indication.

Per TRS, this is now In-Universe Examples Only and No Real Life Examples, Please!:

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1565748352053726600&page=1#comment-25

Cut request declined. A single troper does not decide if a trope should be removed or not. If it's valid of TRS, it should be taken to TRS.

Any one think culling the Real Life non-Trope Naming examples as a bad mixture of Thread Mode and complaining about ComplainingAboutPeopleYouDontLike.

Is there a side trope, or should some note be included, about the tendency in some areas for the backlash to go the other way? In particular, Japanese idols and stars often seem to wind up rejected, ostracized and slandered if they reveal they have a love life. Yes, the boyfriend/girlfriend will also receive a more direct version of this as well once identified, but that doesn't change the fact that the star him/herself will often suffer a lot of personal attacks for "cheating". Some stories imply an idol could be labeled a "slut" and lose all her fandom simply because she was caught holding a boy's hand once.

Really, there's no trope page for a woman breaking up a group? Well, whatever, I'm altering the line about "sister trope" because this is not a trope page.

There IS a reason why fans of Journey's Steve Perry hate his ex-girlfriend Sherry—he loved her deeply, and she cheated on him with (if I remember the story correctly) her personal trainer. The breakup led to the song "Oh, Sherry", so YMMV on the whole fiasco. (I heard this directly from a former Journey roadie who saw the breakup firsthand, and saw what Perry went through afterward. Even so, to still hate the woman 10 years after the fact is carrying a grudge a little too far...)

This seemed to be getting a bit Thread Mode-y — in particular, we probably don't need the tangental discussion about which Beatle had the biggest ego — so I tried to summarise it and moved the excess here.

• It should be noted that hours of bootlegged studio chatter portray Yoko as very quiet during the Let It Be sessions. The "group dynamic" at this stage sounds a lot like Paul loudly telling the other three exactly what to do, then loudly claiming he doesn't care what they do.
• While she may not have been egregious, Yoko still had a role in John's distancing from the Beatles near the end of their run. John was distant as it was during their time as best mates, and Yoko's introduction led to him devoting himself almost entirely to her. Paul gets a lot of flak for "trying to take over", but at the time he had no choice. The band was collapsing in on itself and the band was drifting apart. John was devoted to Yoko, and George and Ringo were getting huge egos about themselves.
• To say nothing of the size of Paul's ego from the very beginning.
  • Paul's ego was later dwarfed by the egos that George(though George does deserve an ego, to an extent) and Ringo(it boggles this troper's mind how Ringo suddenly thought he was "the shit") grew.
• An extra complication would have been, that Yoko Ono was a performance artist, whose pieces were all but incomprehensible to a sixties, western public. And that she "sung" in a jarring, weird and nonconformistic manner.
• The other Beatles have since admitted that Yoko probably doesn't deserve all the blame she receives for breaking up the Beatles, and that the eventual meltdown was more a combination of the band members naturally growing apart personality-and-interest wise, tiring a bit of each other's company after so many years of almost enforced closeness, and being threatened by and irritated at Yoko's increased presence where previously recordings had been 'no girlfriends' territory. She was reportedly not the easiest person to get along with, however, and made little effort to actually endear herself to them, which probably affected matters as well.
• It should also be noted that there was more than a hint of racism in some of this blame as well; in 1960s Britain, wounds from the Second World War were still raw, and even discounting this, attitudes towards Asians were not at their most enlightened.
  • John and Yoko once expressed surprised pleasure when some female fans gave Yoko a bouquet of roses. They didn't realize at first that they still had the thorns on and that it was significant that they were yellow.
• There was also a hint of moral outrage unrelated to race. John was still married to Cynthia (albeit separated) when he began living with Yoko. At the time, most people, even social liberals, didn't believe that being separated gave the parties the freedom to date, let alone enter into new relationships.
• A rather common Black Comedy joke about this: "How do you know Mark David Chapman was insane? Yoko was right there!"
  • Denis Leary has piled on here. "John Lennon takes six bullets to the chest; Yoko Ono's standing right next to him, and not one fuckin' bullet!!! Explain that to me!"
    • Yet another one goes: What did Yoko say when John was shot? "Oh, No!"
      • The guys at Harmonix got a taste of Yoko Ono themselves.

Do we have a separate trope where the Yoko is actually part of the group? Or does that fall into this one?

Adam C: Yeah, the page image refers to John's first wife, not Yoko. Could we put up a picture of them together instead? Maybe in that bed conference they had or something?