Discussion Main / WhatMeasureIsANonHuman

So I'm thinking of adding a Real Life folder for one reason: I recently learned about the Tilikum v. Sea World case, in which PETA attempted to sue Sea World on behalf of Tilikum, an orca whose alleged mistreatment led to the deaths of several trainers over the years. The U.S. District Court in Southern California ruled that the 13th Amendment cannot apply to non-human individuals, so the case was thrown out. This doesn't list "No Real Life Examples, Please!" anywhere, but I want to make sure it would be all right for me to put that on here first.

Edited by PhyrexianAjani95

Don't kill the cute little weed monster!

Where do we put Yukkuri comics?

Embrace the Insanity, Nonsense Man’s Activities are about to begin

The index "starting from least likely" is in a very random order. Are robots and vampires really less likely to be granted right to life than bacteria?

I'm a Troper!!!

Shouldn't having a soul make something MORE expendable, since they would continue existing after death?

Why the question mark in the title?

Another green world. Hide / Show Replies

Patrolling The Pit Of Voles gives me a potential Meta example dealing with the Ninety Percent within Mons series. I am going to need some Brave Souls to perform some independent verification, though...

If a Mons series has a high quantity of Fanfic, the vast majority of it deals with the Human Controllers and barely gives mention of the Mons themselves. This is especially prevalent in Shipping fics.

The one exception that I've found thus far is the Mega Man Battle Network series, where the mons are... wait for it... humanoid internet programs! Granted, Pokemon seems to have transcended this lately due, in part, to the Mystery Dungeon series, but the ficdom is still so large that the Mons share is still quite small. (Compare the number of MD fics to the number of Special-based fics, let along Anime-based ones...)

Edited by DonaldthePotholer Ketchum's corollary to Clarke's Third Law: Any sufficiently advanced tactic is indistinguishable from blind luck.

Pulled natter

• Science Marches On. Not only have we discovered that plants can express distress over being damaged, humans can 'smell' the pheromone that they release. Research is ongoing as it seems unlikely the plants are yelling to their comrades to run away. It's not the same thing as having internal experience, anyway.
  • Wait... Now what are vegans going to eat?
    • Coma Patients?
  • The idea that plants have emotions and can think is a conclusion some people have drawn based on what plants do when they're damaged, exposed to certain environmental conditions, or otherwise stimulated. It is likely a false conclusion since plants don't have brains or nervous systems. Also see here and this Scientific American article.

Sen here, because the Avatar example in the "Meta" section got me thinking. I have no idea if it's this trope in action 100%, but I think some people might have gone the "just nuke 'em" way because of either:

1. being annoyed by having the Navi shoved down their throats

2. Return of the Jedi-ish ridiculous asspull ending.

For the annoyance thing, I guess it's understandable that some people might be annoyed by the Na'vi for various reasons (but chiefly: Screw You, Elves!). Hell, I was too at some points, but not completely (I did get the Screw You, Elves! reaction eventually). In that case, I don't know if I can jump on the "WMIANH" bandwagon - I'd rather invoke Twenty Minutes with Jerks, except stretched to movie-length. But here, instead of wanting some kaiju monster to show up and squelch the annoying twits, you keep waiting for the humans to lay the smackdown.

I personally reviewed Avatar for some website after getting home from the cinema and did argue that the Sequel Baity ending with the non-technologically-advanced natives winning over the army with machine guns, planes and nukes was simply impossible/ridiculous - if things worked that way, Africa and America would've never been colonized now, would it? Then again, I always find these sort of examples are prone to being Wall Bangeriffic because lots of directors don't at least try to make them look plausible somehow. I did mention the "nuke" scenario, but more as a hypothetical - if the company wanted the material THAT bad, they wouldn't have no qualms about nuking an entire planet to get it. After all, this is a film from the guy who introduced Weyland-Yutani as willing to kill an entire colony just for some aliens. Wasn't a stretch for me to expect the same kind of ruthless behaviour (note: I didn't actually agree with this, I just said that this would've been the predictable course of action).

So, I don't really know if the What Measure Is a Non-Human? thing applies to all the mentions of "shoulda nuked 'em". Some, undoubtedly. Others... er, it doesn't strike me as that easy.

And I have no experience with the zoophiliac overtones, so I'm going to stay out of that.

Edited by Sen Probably should get working on that essay now... Hide / Show Replies