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434411423124222344 Complete Arse(nal) Since: Jan, 2015
Complete Arse(nal)
Sep 23rd 2015 at 12:59:52 PM •••

If Shirou follows this, it can lead to an infamous bad end in the Heaven's Feel route of Fate/stay night.

And yet what he did was objectively right.

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MagBas Since: Jun, 2009
Sep 23rd 2015 at 2:20:22 PM •••

Objectively right following utilitarism. Many persons in real life do not follow/believe in utilitarism.

NicTyn Since: Nov, 2013
Nov 14th 2014 at 10:34:50 AM •••

For an example from one medium, that gets properly adapted into another, get a double entry in separate folders, e.g. Watchmen?

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Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010
Nov 14th 2014 at 11:16:09 AM •••

Yes.

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Yamikuronue SoYeah Since: Aug, 2009
SoYeah
May 24th 2010 at 3:05:16 PM •••

I removed the following, it needs to be made FAR more concise:

As far as Well Intentioned Extremists go, The Principles Zealot is the Mirror Trope of a Totalitarian Utilitarian. Both have a good cause that they push too far, but while the Totalitarian Utilitarian only care about results, the The Principles Zealot only care about a certain principle - be it truth, religious piety, the rule of law, or something completely different. Philosophically speaking, the Principles Zealot is a deontologist while the Totalitarian Utilitarian is a teleologist.

And just like the Totalitarian Utilitarian, some Principles Zealots go so far that they can no longer be called "well intentioned" in any reasonable meaning of the phrase. Not even if the principle they adhere to is a decent one. Caring only about the principle behind your actions without any regard whatsoever for the concequenses of your actions easily drifts into Complete Monster territory.

A Principles Zealot can be a Knight Templar or a Knight in Sour Armor, but doesn't have to be: Taking hir principles too far is enough for a character to qualify for this trope, even if the principles don't dominate his life or actions most of the time. However, the zealotous outlook have to be a fairly consistent character trait. If a character is zealotous about one principle and act or argue like a zealot in the rare cases when that principle is relevant, then he's a Principles Zealot. If he's suddenly zealoutous about something just because it's convenient for the plot and it isn't worked into his character, then it's just a specialized case of Idiot Ball.

In a fantasy setting, a Knight Templar is almost always a Principles Zealot. In a Science Fiction setting on the other hand, a Knight Templar is just as likely to be a Totalitarian Utilitarian as a Principles Zealot.

Not To Be Confused With a Straw Hypocrite who twists a principle to fit wantever is convenient for hir: A true Principles Zealot is honest about hir beliefs. Or with a Principled Zealot: A Principles Zealot is not just a zealot who, like all other zealots, have principles. Instead it is a person who focus on a certain deontological principle. While every Principles Zealot is a zealot, zealots come in other flavors as well.

However, a Principles Zealot can lack both empathy or deeper understanding of either the principle that he is following or the situation he's applying the principles to. For example, if you lack a basic understanding of the fact that Your Mileage May Vary, then the golden rule can be misapplied to either condone sexual harassment/abuse (if I would like a certain thing done to me, then I am free to do it to anyone) or condemn activities between consensual adults who both enjoy it (either the same reasoning as abouve but turned around, or simply disregarding consent and going "if this was done without consent then it would be rape, so it must be condemn it it even if it is consensual".)

BTW, I'm a chick. Hide / Show Replies
Xzenu Since: Apr, 2010
May 24th 2010 at 3:20:31 PM •••

Less is more, huh? :-)

You are right that it was too long, but you removed a lot of content that Ithink should remain. I returned it in this condensed form:

Not To Be Confused With a Straw Hypocrite who pretends to be a Principles Zealot whenever is convenient. Likely to be a Well-Intentioned Extremist, Knight Templar and/or Knight in Sour Armor. Contrast Totalitarian Utilitarian, who is the other kind of Well-Intentioned Extremist - caring only about results instead of only about principles.

Fireblood Since: Jan, 2001
Jul 12th 2013 at 2:25:41 AM •••

A Totalitarian Utilitarian could be one form of Principles Zealot though.

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.-Philip K. Dick
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