With the release of the new 2014 Godzilla movie, maybe a quote change may be in order in favor of this?
Dr. Serizawa: The arrogance of man is thinking nature is in our control... and not the other way around. Let them fight.
This quote relates to when the army considers letting Godzilla fight the M.U.T.O. in the middle of a populated city while they take care of a nuke.
Edited by 67.246.132.100
Right now the page has a comment at the top: "No quotes, please." Is there a reason for that? Most tropes pages have a page quote—why is it inappropriate here?
I was going to suggest this one:
...which I think would be appropriate and concise.
Edited by 69.172.221.6
We may get a kick out of calling Godzilla a "her".
- It makes you look like a hard core fan.
- Godzilla lays eggs.
- It helps break down social constraints on identity for about half the population.
There is a disturbing tenancy in some story telling traditions to depict women as inherently nurturing supportive peacemakers.
Characters like Admiral Cain from Battlestar Galactica who use brutality, intimidation and force to accomplish big things are less common than characters like Leia or her mom who use cleverness and social skills (leadership) to get stuff done. (For this discussion let's just pretend that characters like Orihime from Bleach don't exist.)
Female anger is often depicted as cute or highly emotional and rarely as a terrifying thing that will end up butchering millions of people.
Everyone should be allowed to be whatever they want to be.
But it's a destructive identity:
First: Not all stories need to illuminate some deeper truth about the "human condition". That's just something people who go see movies based on critical reviews often like. It's not going to get you very far at a Spike and Mike's Gauntlet style animation screening. The study of ascetics is complicated but personally I think any time someone gives form to though in a way that lets an audience play with a new idea it's a good thing.
Second: People shouldn't have limits or constraints on identity, positive or negative. We shouldn't be afraid to put a character like Marge Simpson in situations where she's being just as goofy or dumb as Homer. This sort of double standard forces some people to spend their lives living up to cultural norms while others are given the freedom to play with My Little Ponies with little or no shame. I think everyone should be able to play with MLP if they feel like it and they aren't hurting others.
But Godzilla is "King" of the monsters:
That's just her job it's not who she is. If the tagline was "Queen of the monsters" it would have ruined the surprise when she laid eggs. If Hillary Clinton becomes the U.S. President people are not going to start calling her "Presedentess" or something. There is no rule that you need to indicate a person's gender in a title. The rules for formal titles are complicated, it's best to just ask.
But this is just a silly nerd-war in which we don't need to get involved:
Granted, Godzilla's sex isn't clearly established in the movies and there are actually lots of Godzillas. So, whether you call Godzilla a "he" or a "she" is pretty much you're own preference. But this is 2012, the internet is not just a bunch of basement dwelling Trekkies fighting over canonical minutia. I say this is where the culture battles will be fought and this is a fight worth fighting.
I would like to close with an idea I learned in art class which I enjoy promoting:
"You don't need to put a weapon in a female character's hand to make her look strong."
Edited by patrickstaight Hide / Show Replies
Wait, what does this have to do with this trope?
What's precedent ever done for us?
Specifically I am suggesting the last line: "in contrast to his heroic characterizations during the late '50s, as well as the '60s and '70s) but people were still happier to see him because he was usually fighting something far worse."
Be changed to: "in contrast to her heroic characterizations during the late '50s, as well as the '60s and '70s) but people were still happier to see her because she was usually fighting something far worse."
Sorry, but the films have always referred to Godzilla as a 'he' despite the many biological weirdnesses that implies, and we always prioritise canon over Fan Wank. If it makes you feel better, maybe he's a transman? Sure don't see many transgendered characters kicking ass and taking names in mid-twentieth-century Japanese cinema.
Edited by Iaculus What's precedent ever done for us?
I do understand your point and I do agree that keeping Fan Wank out of tvtropes is very important. However, I don’t see “biological weirdness” as a cannon element ever established in the source.
At no point did a character like Dr. Kawaji say something to the effect of: “Similar to clown fish, Godzilla exhibits sequential hermaphroditism. During her life cycle she is at points male and at other points female.”
Godzilla being female is a fundamental biological fact. There is nothing weird about it.
There is a point in the story where it is clearly established that she is female and at no point does she have a transformation scene establishing that she is now male.
Most of the characters never saw Godzilla lay eggs so they wouldn't have known.
The only time Godzilla ever lays eggs is in the 1998 American remake. Even then, Godzilla is not female, but reproduces asexually.
In the Japanese incarnations, Godzilla is consistently referred to as a male. In three separate continuities, Godzilla has had offspring, yes. But in two of those times, it was specified that the offspring is not actually Godzilla's, but is adopted. The third continuity leaves this vague, along with practically everything else.
So no, calling Godzilla a female does NOT make you look like a hardcore fan, nor will something so trivial help toss out sexism.
I admit I am wrong. I was under the impression that the egg laying had happened in more classic films. I guess I just wish there were more female characters like this…
I try my best to live in a reality where Cassy Herkelman and Hillary Clinton get the respect they deserve but you’re right, this attempt is kind of trivial…
I'm sorry If I've caused any trouble...
Edited by patrickstaight
Someone should add Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann to the list of anime. The whole series is absolutely soaked in this trope.
Though the scene where they have to destroy that anti-spiral energy conversion thing that's creating super dense space is probably the most notable. Probably.
Almafeta: Should we name this the "Godzilla Protocol," knowing how so many instances of this trope have the name 'protocol' in them somewhere?
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No, because that's the *response* to crossing the Godzilla Threshold, not the Threshold itself. Also, thank God there's no Real Life section.
Can anyone here think of a Real Life crossing of the Godzilla Threshold? It occurred to me that none have sprung to mind, and I notice the page has no examples.
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No examples now, at any rate. It's quite possible that they got nuked by the Law Of Cautious Editing Judgment.
What's precedent ever done for us?
speaking of nukes...
also, the CAPTCHA for this comment is "grieving" creepy.
I believe there used to be a real life example about the revocation of professional licenses. What happened to it, and is it OK to restore it?
Direct all enquiries to Jamie B Good