Tsundere Fan
Teana Lanster from Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Striker S really counts? I know it's says downplayed but she still has magical powers.
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Nope!
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So I've been looking at the character sheet for The Avengers Earths Mightiest Heroes and I've been thinking. Is Tony truly a Badass Normal in said setting? He has no fantastic powers outside of his Armor, but has faced larger foes when his armor hasn't been available and won through ingenuity.
But I'm still thinking, would he truly count as a Badass Normal? I'm not thinking so.
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It would. The trope includes people who need equipment to function on the same level as everyone else; being able to outwit more powered opponents makes him a Guile Hero as well as a Badass Normal.
What rises must fall, what falls may rise again.
I think the general Imperial Guard from the Warhammer 40k universe should be removed. Not the individuals, because those listings fully qualified, but the group as a whole. Yes, those guys do fight some megapowerful shit, and they sometimes win, but they do so with EXTREME casualties. I once had a friend who played the Warhammer tabletop game say to me "The Imperial Guard: the only military unit where a million dead is considered 'acceptable casualties.'" That's not badass, thats a meat swarm. Put them in a trope that includes Zerg.
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In the 40K universe, that is being a Badass Normal. The fact that they're capable of holding their own at all against things like Greater Daemons is a sign they belong here. Being able to win makes it definite.
What rises must fall, what falls may rise again.
I'm curious as to how Rock Lee from Naruto fits with this. Though he does have his set of lotus techniques, they work to simply maximize his Badass Normalcy. Is this not considered an example because of his not directly confronting any of the big bads?
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Rock Lee is not a Badass Normal because, even though he can't use genjutsu (illusions) and ninjutsu (magic), he still has ninja superpowers. He still has super jump, Super-Strength, Super-Speed, can Walk on Water and many others. As the description of the trope says:
- "If they have strange or superhuman abilities, they are not normal. There is no "relatively" when it comes to Badass Normal. If you can "barely" lift a tank, your ki blasts can "only" level cities or your ability to alter the fabric of reality isn't as developed as others, tough; you're a badass with superpowers."
Rock Lee is Charles Atlas Superpower, which is different than Badass Normal.
There is also no "relativity" when it comes to a badass normal. If they are capable of things that are nowhere in the realm of human ability that disqualifies them from the trope. Rock Lee is able to keep pace with the others due to having similar chakra techniques as the others, just because he is incapable of using the advanced stuff the others use doesn't mean he's normal. Charles Atlas Superpower is the idea that mere training allows you to accomplish amazing things while still supposedly being "normal" (ie, everyone can do this if they tried hard enough) but that covers the spectrum of Batman (who augments his strength with gadgets) to Lui Kang (who has special Shaolin training).
What about Sanosuke Sagara from Rurouni Kenshin? He can punch down trees and has an iron body that can endure blows from lethal weapons without getting a bisibl mark for the most part.But he's listed as badass normal in that franchise character page simlpy because he lacks formal training and supernatural powers.
On top of that what about a fictional universe where everyone including your average Joe is so above current human physical feats that say running ten miles per hour is doable by a child or lifting over one thousand pounds is something old man can do? I mean I seen fictional work list say a race of demons is badass normal because they lack magics and while they much stronger than humans, humans don't exist in their world so they are the "normal" in terms of superhuman feats. Thus an orc is badass normal because all orcs can carry a five hundred pound ax and swing it like its a baseball bat with one arm.
I've noticed that people with power armor tend to be disqualified from this trope, so let me propose a question. What if, instead of a Warhammer 40k or Iron Man type of armor, someone uses a suit like the HAL-5 or the HULC, powered exoskeletons which do exist and function in our world? If someone uses something like that, would they still be considered a Badass Normal, since it's real world technology, or would they not be allowed on here, because it would amp up their abilities past the unassisted human limit and put them above normal people?
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Depends if the world in question has proper superpowers and/or Functional Magic. If yes, they'd be a Badass Normal.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Here's something that's kind of bugged me for a while. People like Batman, Code B.L.U.E., and Whiplash, Nightwing, and Lex Luthor all have access to incredibly high grade weaponry and technology, and don't possess powers aside from them. For example, Batman has a suit with chemical analysis, lie detection, fire/electric/bullet proofing, insulation from harsh environments, and the like, on top of a belt that contains everything a playboy billionaire philanthropist superhero could need while crime fighting. Okay, fine. What gets me is why someone like Jim Rhodes (War Machine), who has no powers or post-human abilities without his armor, the same deal as the other aforementioned characters, is considered NOT Badass Normal, UNLIKE the other aforementioned characters. Um...pardon me, but last time I checked, Rhodey's 'beyond human' weapons, tools, and defenses came from his suit, not him. Once he takes it off, he's just a dude with military training. So where's this "James Rhodes BEFORE becoming War Machine" coming from?
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Rhodes was a supporting character to Iron Man long before he got armor and became the new Iron Man. The reason he was chosen as the new Iron Man was because he was already a badass (and Tony's friend, mind you).
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The page already defines Badass Normal as related to the world of the series in question; a Badass in a world without Superpowers is not a Badass Normal.
Does this go in the other way? That is, everyone has one super power (lets say unassisted flight), without exception. Some people, however, have other super powers. Standard hero plethora; healing, heat vision, fire control, ice control, etc.
Assume that there is a regular individual; he can fly, but so can everyone else. However, he is capable of holding his own with the people who are refered to as superheros without much issue. In this case, would he be considered a badass normal in his own world? He is normal, as far as everyone is concerned; no charles atlas superpower, probably training from hell, but all capabilities reachable by everyone in the world.
Just trying to get a handle on whether the "normal" refers to our world or the verse.
Again; the baseline power is universal.
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No. The only measure is our world, or possibly a slightly exaggerated take on our world.
The moment someone has an ability not possible in our world, you've left Badass Normal. That doesn't make them less badass. They just don't get to be Batman.
Part of me wants this renamed Nonpowered Superhero, but that's not gonna happen any time soon.
I wrote "Anyone from a Witch Species who can't be defined as a Muggle Born of Mages is disqualified" to help hammer in this concept. Your world of supers would be a Witch Species, simply lacking muggle species as contrast.
A lot of humans from Mass Effect are disqualified on the basis that genetic enhancements are standard issue (not that it stops people from adding them). It's extremely common, but until it becomes standard in our world, that's not how it works.
Edited by Peteman
Wouldn't a character in An enviroment in which most character have combat training of some sort but he doesn't yet still regularly manages to kick ass be considered a badass normal?
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Unless that combat training grants superpowers or is so awesome it falls under Charles Atlas Superpower, no. You may want Badass Bystander.
Edited by Peteman
Um, not having watched Recess, I won't make any declarations, but wasn't that a Slice of Life cartoon that didn't involve super powers?
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It was. But unless the latest season took on a massive Genre Shift and everybody save one dude got hit with a radioactive dodgeball, then no, it's not an example.
In Sailor Moon, according to The Other Wiki, Tuxedo Mask has healing powers and is telepathic, which disqualify him from "normal" status.
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I also noticed that Sailor Jupiter and Sailor Venus were listed as Badass Normal in their respective character pages, despite the fact that both are Sailor Senshi and thus not normal. The explanations following it sounded more like they'd be Badass Abnormal (laconic entry paraphrased: "They could kick your ass before they got superpowers!"). Should I change it?
I'm not familiar with Sailor Moon but it sounds to me that your making the write call.
Not that are ever given any explanation. The only time we ever see that little psychic thing is when Rau's in the neighbourhood. A power that tells you your rival has arrived is not exactly a help in combat, especially when it's never explained if that's what's going on.
Once again though, it never helps him in combat. Ever. We only see the blasted thing when Le Creuset (or later Rey) is nearby. Does that really count as giving you powers? The show never explains it either. Anyway, by the standards of the vast majority of the Gundam entries he is a Badass Normal: he's an unmodified human being who pilots a regular mech against Gundams and accquits himself well. Most of the Gundam entries are along these lines.
Is anyone aware that the page image does not show a Badass Normal? That's Batman, yes, and he is punching out Superman, but he's wearing Powered Armour. Wouldn't that make it an example of Badass Abnormal.
Scott Pilgrim - y/n? He technically doesn't have any powers at all, while Ramona runs around in Subspace and her exes are voodoo hipsters and half-ninjas, etc.
I think the Yugi-Oh example should be removed on account of I feel the ability to win a children's card game somehow misses the point.
Also, weak cards do not reflect one's normalcy. It's a card game. They have absolutely nothing to do with one's inherent superpowers.
Edited by Peteman
Charles Foster Ofdensen from Metalocalypse doesn't seem to qualify. Who are the supers of the show?
Kept here for posterity and discussion. I would have taken out Captain America again, but I know someone keeps shoving him back in. In my mind, having a Super Serum voids him of the title of normal, regardless of his actual power level. For the Transformers Film Series, it seems that if you ake away their numbers (and by default the ability to call for air support) they are helpless. It doesn't mean they are completely useless or not badass, but it just doesn't gel with the rest of the examples. For Ripley from Aliens I'm not arguing that her Mama Bear rampage was not badass, but the Aliens (and Bishop) are the only things actually superhuman. The marines are able to kill plenty of aliens themselves, she just has the highest kill count. For Xander from Buffy, it's been mostly observed that he can survive. He doesn't become a relevant badass in the series, although he has his moments of competence. He doesn't ever show badassitude alongside someone like Buffy or even genuine badass normals like Giles or Robin Wood.
- Do not underestimate the brave warriors of humanity's armies in the Transformers Film Series; what they lack in physical size, brute force, and technology they more than make up for with superior organization, tactics, firepower and sheer numbers. This Megatron learned the hard way after underestimating them during his battle with Optimus Prime in Downtown L.A. Still going to die by the hundreds without Autobot fire support against the big guys, but better than the other versions.
- Not to mention the surviving soldiers that were stranded in the desert following the Decepticons' invasion and gotten themselves in a tussle against Scorpinok. Not only did they send him packing, they even managed to hurt hit plenty and took a piece of their tail!
- And then there was Devastator. True, his defeat was an Epic Fail, but it was a good warning: the humans are developing weapons that can take down Transformers in a single shot.
- There's also the fact that in the second film, the humans probably racked up more Decepticon kills than all of the Autobots combined. In fairness, probably because Optimus Prime was dead half the film.
- Ellen Ripley of the Alien film series is beset left and right by unspeakable monstrosities from beyond the stars. She is nothing more than a space miner who lacks even the most formal of military training. That doesn't stop her from kicking more ass, taking more names, and killing more aliens than any other character in the series.
- In Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Xander is this when he isn't the Butt-Monkey. This is a guy with no powers or training who went toe-to-toe with Angelus- and made him back down.
- The potentials. They slayed quite a lot of bringers and ubervamps before being "activated".
On a similar note, I've had to take out Han Solo again. I'm bringing in the points from the earlier discussion. I may have to resort to buying advertising time.
"What did Han Solo actually do against jedi and other "super" level beigs in his word? My second point is the answer to that question; he got totally pawned by them all. When he's up against characters who only have great piloting skills and blasters themselves then he excels and he's great and badass and we love him but put him against the supers of his world (which actually rarely happens) and they can just catch the blaster shot in their palm and then freeze him in carbonite.
In the world in which he inhabits, he doesn't actually pull himself out of the level of the other normal characters and start play around in the force using levels. Look at what he actually gets involved in and he doesn't even get the chance to be compared to the supers. "
I've seen or helped remove Han Solo and Wedge at least three times since this was posted and it only gets added later. I'm putting a comment line not to add them without visiting the discussion board.
Unclouded TJ: Taking Bunny-Ears Lawyer too literally.
Captain America most emphatically qualifies, the serum has been deactivated in him at least twice and both times he's maintained extreme badass cred. Heck, the first time he actually maintained his "peak human" status with extreme exercise and training until the serum was reactivated again.
I was planning on adding Wedge in, but first I'd like to make a case for him. While never directly facing somebody like Vader in combat, he went up against staggering odds in all three movies and emerged victorious each time. In a sense, he is Batman where a Death Star is Superman.
Also, in the EU, he could hold his own against Luke or just about any Force-user. In I, Jedi, Corran Horn (a Knight in training) tried to read Wedge's mind in a combat exercise and just couldn't do it.
Powerpuff girls example.
Badass Normal doesn't occur in this example. She is not badass at all- that's not a deconstruction and that's not a parody. The technohero or something is probably the target for this example. Thoughts?
- Deconstructed and parodied in the Powerpuff Girls with Princess Morbucks. Princess desperately want to be a Powerpuff girl, despite not having any powers, but with her daddy's money Princess gets Batman style gadgets, she even mentions Batman as a non-powered superhero. However she failed miserably, as she didn't train nearly as much as Batman. Princess later gets a super-powered armor suit, she managed to beat Bubbles and Buttercup, but Blossom still managed to beat her, not with strength but rather with experience.
Regarding Justin from El Goonish Shive: I don't remember him having superpowers, to be honest. I'm not entirely sure about this, however, so I'd appreciate any input on the matter.
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I think I remember him having similar Supernatural Martial Arts skills to Elliot just not as developed.
Unclouded TJ: Taking Bunny-Ears Lawyer too literally.
Warble
Added a real life example, because although there aren't any super heroes, a mail man having done the stuff he has when there are trained professionals is as close as we are going to get
If there is a better trope for it (Badass Normal was the only one that came to mind), then feel free to move it
I wonder what a strip tease from a creature made of souls would be like? Hide / Show Replies
That completely misses the entire point of the trope. It's about people who have only human capacity kicking ass in a universe where superpowered people set the standard.
Why hasn't anyone mentioned the winchesters? Thier whole reason deart'e is fighting demons and such with special bullets and brawling.
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And they do so in a world of normal human beings who do the same. Fighting demons isn't depicted as a "superpowers required" job.
In Conquerer of Shambala, does Ed take on super-powered threats with regularity when he is stuck in our world? Otherwise, he's not a Badass Normal.
I think the Doomguy does qualify because although his side has no super heroes, his opponents do, and those are the guys he slaughters with regularity.
Any objections if we update the trope page to specifically say that if you have Powered Armor, you don't qualify as a Badass Normal while using it? It’s heavily implied, but not directly stated, and it's started creeping back into character pages for those scenarios.
If so, I'd probably put a similar clarification on Empowered Badass Normal.
Thanks!
Edited by Mrph1