Discussion Literature / TheFirstLaw

Wanted to bring this up for discussion, as I think it is a case of Square Peg Round Trope:

• Five-Man Band: Two of them materialize by the end of The Blade Itself. Owing to the series Black-and-Gray Morality, they may not be exactly heroic, but they're protagonists.
  • The Most Feared Men in the North:
    • The Hero - Threetrees
    • The Lancer Black Dow
    • The Big Guy - Tul Duru
    • The Smart Guy - Grim
    • The Chick - The Dogman
  • The Expedition:
    • The Hero - Bayaz
    • The Lancer - Logen Ninefinger
    • The Big Guy - Jezal dan Luthar (physically smaller than Logen, but along only because of his fighting prowess)
    • The Smart Guy - Brother Longfoot
    • The Chick - Malacus Quai
    • The Sixth Ranger - Ferro Maljinn

First, as The Chick page indicates, the trope is about a specific role occupied by a female team member. Male characters who have a similar personality/role are The Heart- so, both of the examples listed for The Chick would be out and neither of those male characters are The Heart either (The Dogman is close, but a better fit would be the unmentioned Forely the Weakest).

In terms of the first group, I can see Duru and Grim in those positions, but The Dogman ends up as the leader pretty quickly (making him a better fit for The Hero) and Dow's role in relation to him as akin to The Lancer. Personality-wise, Dow fits The Brute, which I suppose could support him being The Big Guy.

Basically though, I think it is a stretch to call that group a Five-Man Band.

For the second group, that's a very tenuous justification for Jezal being the Big Guy. And Bayaz is more like a Big Good team leader type (in theory at least), and not The Hero.

With that in mind, I actually would agree that the "fellowship" does fit a Five-Man Band dynamic- because that whole arc of their journey serves to deconstruct such groups in fantasy novels.

So, here's how I might argue it:

• The Mentor/ Big Good: Bayaz
• The Hero: Jezal
• The Lancer: Logen
• The Big Guy: Ferro
• The Smart Guy: Brother Longfoot
• The Heart: Malacus Quai

I put Logen as The Lancer because of his role as adviser/foil to Jezal. He has a lot of characteristics of The Big Guy, but since I had to choose, I thought Ferro would be a better fit, since she's so obsessed with violence.

Note- the group fits the broad outlines of the trope, but I'm not sure it is really an example, since it subverts it, given that among other things, Jezal is pretty much The Load or even The Millstone for a good part of the trip, and Longfoot isn't much better.

Edited by 71.57.52.184 Edit, edit, edit, edit the wiki Hide / Show Replies

I was wondering about this comment:

• Happily Married: Subverted like crazy with Cas and Vitari in "Best Served Cold". Played straight with Calder and Seff in "The Heroes", though.

How are Cas (AKA Shenkt) and Vitari a subversion? I'm not sure if I'm forgetting anything, but I believe they were/are genuinely quite in love with each other and happy (even if it is apparently an open marriage in light of Cas' frequent absenses).

If the example was referring to the fact that both are evilish, then I think that would be Not A Subversion- they would still be Happily Married; it's just that it is Unholy Matrimony.

Edit, edit, edit, edit the wiki

I think Best Served Cold really needs its own page. It's a self-contained work; while it's set in the same world and some of its characters were minor characters in The First Law, the protagonist is not from that book, Styria doesn't feature in it much, and I think its set of tropes is sufficiently different that it would work better with its own entry rather than being hidden among these.

So I'm going to do it. Complain here if you think I'm wrong.

A brighter future for a darker age.

Bit of a silly ask, but could a troper who has read the series add in a brief rundown of the settling/plot, like has been done on the Song of Ice & Fire, Second Apocalypse etc pages? Mainly because Wikipedia is a bit light on details and, heck, I like reading tropers rundowns. They're usually a lot more informative and fun to read.

(I now await to be told to "jf google it")

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