Discussion FanficRecs / HarryPotter

Wait, is this the wrong channel? If so, my apologies.

I dunno about what it is, but You Know That Show is the actual place.

Methinks no. You might want to ask here, though.

Thanks, I actually never knew that was there, which is pretty stupid of me if you think about it.

I know there's a plethora of tastes in fandom, but those still don't seem like things we want to specifically recommend...

Mightn't they fall under "so bad it's good?" If people are willing to read My Immortal . . .

Apparently the author has experienced Author Existence Failure. A quick google search only leads me to finding out the author deleted all of their work around June 19th. So you'll have a very hard time finding anything still up. I'm going to edit the recommendation but not take it down in case it's put up again.

Here we go, one link.

Might as well go ahead; I'll do it for you.

i guess that's why we have a reviews now... any fic that gets more negatives than positives should probably be taken down.

Not entirely sure, but at the same time the split occurred there were numerous pages being split for being too large. Not sure if it's related or the person that split it was just worried because we were close to the limit. Either way the page was getting large.

Indeed - this was a very big page. This is probably for the best so we don't risk damaging the site.

Continuation Fics folder got lost, I'm adding a new page for it.

I'd say no on the Authors and Websites for now. For multiple fics, it would depend on how big they are, but I'd suggest putting just the main one recommended and people will probably just add reviews for the sequels in the same section (or make a separate section). Other than good luck.

Sweet, I actually might have a work-around for the multiple fics to a title line, other than that I'll just need to add the logic to ignore the authors and websites section. (Naturally not going to work for fanfic rec pages who call their authors and websites section something different.) Other than that it's pretty much done.

Wow. Now that you mention it I haven't seen a story like that. I saw one where Harry put Ron in his place as a substitute but that's mostly Ron-bashing so I didn't read much of it.

I think I remember that one. Ron gets killed by a dragon in the First Task, and Harry and Hermione have sex soon afterwards. At the age of fourteen. Yeah.

Wow, Really? I didn't read much further than the excuse for putting Ron in Harry's place by exploiting some weak rule that Harry wanted to heal a broken arm the muggle way. Talk about Die for Our Ship.... Glad I didn't read it then.

No, Ron survives all the tasks, and it's pretty hilarious. Ron just happens to be ten times stupider than in canon, but that's just to make the Humiliation Conga last the entire year... and IIRC, there's no sex, just snogging.

If you're talking about The Champion's Champion, that is. Unless there is another fic out there where Ron replaces Harry and then dies in the first task, and then sex follows...

Wait, so the writer decided to give the resident Butt-Monkey a major, plot-relevant role that would give him a much-needed chance to shine... and then turned it into an excuse for character-bashing him? Oy.

I was refering to Champion's Champion, but no idea if that's what Medicus was referring to or not. Also I agree Iaculus they wasted a good plot with that story. Also we seem to be getting very off the main topic, whether that's a good thing or not is debatable though.

Well, back on topic, I do remember seeing one (another humour one, though) that got one of the Weasley twins entered, under the Harry Potter School of Awesome. They both manage to compete somehow. Cedric is still the "official" Hogwarts champion, though.

Yep, one of my favorite recommendations, "Oh God not again!". Boarderline crack fic if it wasn't listed under Peggy Sue.

I honestly think most fics will have Cedric as the Hogwarts Champion unless Harry is chosen in his stead. I vaguely recall a few where the Goblet chose Harry over Cedric, but none very noteworthy after that I don't think.

I think the Harmonian fics just blur together after a while. There's one where Hermione goes with Harry to the Prefect's Bathroom to figure out the clue, and of course there's teh sexxorz.

My God, that fic is horrible. My kingdom for a Harry/Hermione fic where anyone stays in character.

Honestly I don't care. I never really read the fic beyond the first two chapters, but there are other fics on this page that have several comments on them as well (although not as many that can be summed up as "I didn't like it but your mileage may vary").

Also some time in the past the Slaugh entry was combined with this fic. I don't know the reasoning behind that, but that's why the comments remain about the sequel.

Well, at some point we'll need to bring this page in line with the new format anyway, so it'd probably be best to alter things in-line with that. I.E., chop the comments section, replace it with a link to reviews, and turn each comment into either a review or a comment on someone else's review. See the Trope Repair Shop thread attached to the main Fan Fic Recommendations page for further details, plus Wilbyr's work on Neon Genesis Evangelion and carla's work on Avatar: The Last Airbender.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. This page is gonna be enough work to transfer without having to move an entry the size of DAYD's. I'll take that as a go ahead to do some chopping. I guess DAYD can be our first entry to be done up with the review format! :D

Edit: Phew! All done. Conversation In The Main Page natter cut out and comments moved to reviews!

Oh, and did the warnings too.

I'll start moving my stuff over to reviews soon then.

Nice one. Just one thing - it's spelt 'chauvinistic'. Normally, I'd be doing the whole Repair Dont Respond thing, but my connection ain't up to editing such a large page.

Whoops. fixing that, sorry. Don't worry, I'd rather have it fixed then just lying there..

It's a warning people that read the fanfic added. It's perfectly acceptable as long as it's accurate.

The policy on warnings can be found here and is as follows:

WARNINGS: Now we're getting to the exotic part: warnings for anything that could be squicky (or attract people for its kinkiness). Includes things as wide and varied as BDSM, Oral Sex, Bloodplay, Torture, M Preg, Genderfuck, Wingfic, Het Sex (for the Het Is Ew people), saying it's an Alternate Universe Fic, Character Death (too bad for the people who don't like getting spoiled), Non Con (that's rape), Chan (ahem, paedophilia) and many Characterization Tags. Frequently includes very ridiculous things because people can be squicked by pretty much anything, or some thing which just seeing listed squick many (which is probably why ficcers use cutesy code names for it like Non Con and Chan)

There are two objection in this case: 1. This prominent format is misleading for readers, because when they see this warning, they would expect other fanfics to carry equally strong warnings, and there are stories with descriptions of rape that have no warnings at all. 2. The warnings were added as part of a Wank, long after the initial recommendation was made, and use ALL CAPS TEXT at the front of the list, instead of being added to the end and signed by the people adding them.

I'm with Zeviz on this one. Even now the DAYD warnings are a little over the top.

see the discussion page on the main fanfic rec index. But Basically the comments section on far too many fics was being widely abused to slag fics off, a home to Natter, and Thread Modes. The review system is being rolled out to replace it since people were wanting an option to review a fic. A "Tags" section is for basic information like AU fic, Dark Fic, Fuku Fic (incidentally if you know of a Harry Potter Fuku Fic PM me), Lime, Crack Fic, Lemon, MPreg, Dead Fic, In Progress, Crossover, etc and so on, which was what the comments section was originally for.

So are we switching to the new template or what?

In my opinion there are way too many fics to reasonably do that without causing some problems along the way. I'd like to delay it as long as possible honestly, but then I was never in favor of it at all.

If we can, we switch to the new template. Just take it slow, and remember to transfer the comments to the reviews section.

It's a really big task, and the more of us help out, the better.

Ahh, I was wondering because I happened to agree with the change because I always thought that the comments section was basically for reviews (and griping on occasion). I was just wondering if there was a plan or no. If it helps I'll take care of the fics I've posted up (and those that I have read if the original poster can't do them).

Much appreciated. If you need any further tips on how to do it, Wilbyr did an excellent job on the Neon Genesis Evangelion page. Following his example - and the guidelines on the main Fan Fic Recommendations page - should steer you right as rain.

Well, from the looks of it moving to the review system proposes the largest challenge in terms of porting the comments over as reviews.

I don't think waiting will help any because all that will do is yield more fics and comments that later have to be ported. I do think we can do this thing in phases to smooth it out a bit and not drop a giant bombshell.

• Phase I: We issue a heads up so that people know when the move happens and give people some time to take notice of it.
• Phase II: We add the review buttons, and port over our own comments and give people time to come in and port theirs as well, that way the original reviewers will have edit privileges.
• Phase III: We zap the "Second"s and "Third"s etc as they are now superfluous, and port any relevant reviews over under our names.

Alternatively we can just merge Phases 1 and 2 and just make a giant notice on the front page explaining the format.

We should also probably mention that new recs (while we're transitioning) should follow the new template, that way the new fics are correctly formatted.

As for the Status and Tags sections, if we have someone on hand who has read the fic they can add Tags, otherwise leave it blank until someone comes along.

I wanna see if we can beat the Naruto section to the transition! Guys ?

Only seen a few stories where she was secretly a half-blood because her mother was raped by Death Eaters and then obliviated. Other than that I haven't seen any where they didn't immediately say "lulz let's team up with Voldemort because you're pureblood".

I'd love to read something like that! Sadly most fics I've read use it as an excuse have her randomly change to Slytherin, ditch her adoptive parents, and turn incredible Out of Character.

Honestly, I can't see how it could have that much of an impact unless she's the only powerful, talented Muggleborn witch around. Which seems unlikely.

Sure, it'd likely take some adjustment-time, but the idea doesn't seem capable of supporting a story in and of itself.

Not a long story, no.

I believe ShayGuy was looking for a story that had that as a plot point, but not the main focus of the story. Like my example only revealed Hermione was a half-blood after Harry discovers Death Eaters are using 'dead' vaults in Gringotts and asks muggleborns to take a blood test to see if any squib lines can claim the dormant vaults in question. It's only revealed after the blood test that Hermione's not really her father's daughter in blood and a chapter or two is focused on her reaction to it.

Well, if you can't point to Hermione, you can always point to Lily. Oh, wait, she's a Veela. Nevermind.

Edit: Actually interested in links to those fics.

I'm a bit curious; what's your reasoning behind that request?

Seconding Dor's question. I mean, it's not even redundant - having a trope page is in no way an indicator of quality.

See: My Immortal.

Because the fanfics rec page for this is REALLY crowded already, and much more detailed information on fics that have their own pages can be found on, well, their own pages.

But the Fan Fics index isn't just for recommended fics. There is a maximum size of page the wiki can handle, but I don't think this one is near it yet.

I'm with robert on this one, I don't go to the index when I want recs, I go here. As for this page's size? I suppose if we ever hit the page size limit we'll split this page up into an index or something? Otherwise more folders.

I'm betting some of those fics started out as recs before they got their own pages.

Is it a crossover with anything in particular? I think we could do with an AU section too but I don't wanna add a new folder just for a few fics.

I'd thought the summary said something to the effect that it was a minor crossover with The Dresden Files. I just checked the page and yes it does say it — moved.

Peggy Sues are specifically for when a character's memories go back in time to cause a change in events. For Want of a Nail fics are when some change, however insignificant, causes a change. This usually doesn't involve time travel unless the time travel sends a one time note or object back in time. For Want Of A Nail means if not for that one event everything would have happened as normal whereas Peggy Sues can react to changes and make more changes causing more ripples than a single event.

Not being familiar with Ananke I'm not sure why it's listed under Peggy Sue unless after Lily is sent forward in time she goes back in time. If that's not the case it should be under General fics. Also keep in mind the fics were sorted into these folders back in May and no troper is familiar with them all so there were bound to be mistakes it's up to us to fix them.

While both story types explore the ripple effects of changes done to the past, the changes in question are done differently. For Want Of A Nail stories have the author enforce the change (Think of it as a What If.. type of thing). So a simple example is "What if Harry is sorted into Slytherin". In Peggy Sue stories, the changes are not made by the author, but by a character who is aware of the Canon future (and is, in practice, the protagonist) and is attempting to somehow change it. An example: A bitter and jaded Harry goes back in time and decides to cut off Voldemort's supports base by sorting himself into Slytherin and manipulating the Slytherins etc etc.

If you want to be more fancy about it: Peggy Sue continues the sujet of the Canon while For Want Of A Nail creates an entirely new sujet.

Judging by the description, Ananke is mis-sorted, as are a couple of others.

Ah, okay. Thanks!

He's Harry in name only but that's because he's had an entirely different upbringing so there's no doubt he'll have little in common with canon Harry. He can arguably be called a self insert (if that's what you're insinuating) but, in my opinion, he's not. He's definitely not a Gary Stu though as a lot of his plans fail pretty badly.

Also I'd have to argue against the Ron and Dumbledore Bashing one reviewer left as unless it's changed recently every character is treated very realistically, with a bit of a different background to pretty much everyone. Plus Ron is actually given good qualities that make him trump his opposition.

I would counter-argue that the problem is that the world is just so warped that it's not even recognizably Harry Potter anymore, granted that wouldn't be so bad by itself, the fic seemed to devolve into a treatise on logic and rationality and is basically a few steps short of an Author Filibuster.

Probably because it was written as a treatise on logic and rationality as filtered through the world of Harry Potter.

In that case I feel that it doesn't succeed as either a treatise or a fanfic.

Fair enough. Wasn't trying to defend it (I find that Writer on Board can distort a story pretty badly), just pointing out that something's probably going to feel like a treatise if it's written as a treatise.

It had so much potential too, there were a lot of good original ideas, and I thought the author's maxim of "Frodo Lightsaber, Sauron Death Star" was spot on.

Probably selfish reasoning. Most people skimming through the lists will probably lose patience by the time it gets to the bottom. I try and move them to the bottom when I can but it might help to add a notice at the top of the page.

Snakecharmer has everything you seem to desire in a story. Here's the link: http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5537139/1/Snakecharmer

I remember reading that same essay but sadly never found anything with it becoming true. I'd be interested myself if someone could do it right.

The line the person in question could be incorrectly interpreted. "Feel free to add a fanfic of your own to the list" is meant to be a fanfic you recommend not written I'm pretty sure. I could be wrong though as I'm not entirely certain on the policy or interpretation.

Oh, I guess I misinterpreted the policy then, I second Comartemis' deletion then, it's not that good of a fic

I made a thread on the forum under wiki talk to get the rule clarified. Hopefully we'll get a confirm or deny on that policy. Can be viewed here.

As the one who posted the recently deleted fic, I have no complaints about deletion or whatever if my fic is allowed or not, so long as the rules are clear. Getting called a Shameless Self-Promoter for one single post did rub me the wrong way, but its over now. Keep it there or clear it out, I don't care.

From the forum it sounds like fic deletion is to be avoided in general, but for future reference Troper Works is the place to go if you want to post about your own stuff.

It came out of the discussion when the page, and the whole namespace, was created. The point is when reading those fics, we need to bear in mind when they were written. The three year gap allowed more time for fanon to build up, and the canon has changed significantly since then. However, it would be enough to label each fic with the period when it was written.

Right, so I looked over the fics in the folder and I think that that folder doesn't really tell us as much about the fics in it as would splitting them up into the other folders (and possibly appending where necessary a comment on when they were written). Also to keep the General fics folder from being crowded (that folder is there for any fic that doesn't fit the given categories) I was thinking we could add a Continuation/Children fic folder which deal with fics that continue the story after book 7 (or just after the fall of voldemort).

My suggestion for splitting the fics written between.. folder is as follows:

-General Fic

• The Serpent of Lord Voldemort (Note that this fic is a sequel to the following 3 in descending order last one being the first chronologically)
  • The Serpent http://www.fanfiction.net/s/59464/1/The_Serpent
  • Under the Rose Bush http://www.fanfiction.net/s/21522/1/Under_the_Rose_Bush
  • An Unwelcome Visitor http://www.fanfiction.net/s/26790/1/An_Unwelcome_Visitor
• Realizations

Continuation Fic

• After The End
• The Children

Humor/Crack

• Lord Voldemort and His Complicated Plans
• Harry Potter is on Fire

Shipping

• In the words of Ginerva Molly Weasley (this is a re-telling of book 7 so why is it even there?)
  • Or is this better under General

I'd also move some of the fics from General to Continuation. If you guys have any questions, comments post here and if no one minds (or cares) I'll do the update next weekend.

There's no real reason not to label all the pre book 7 fics as such, but when they were written is most significant for the continuation fics, since it explains why they're ignoring the last 3 books. Some fics written after book 7 explicitly ignore the last book or two anyway, simply because the writer didn't like them, which should also really be mentioned in the summary.

Also what's the story behind Slaugh and DAYD being moved up to the Author's and Websites section? Were we trying to preserve the comments?

I don't remember the reasoning but I think it might have been because of the folder for comments. However that's since been removed so I'll move them both to General.

EDIT Oops, wrong button.

I think his review could be summed up as: this fic breaks Willing Suspension of Disbelief so Your Mileage May Vary. And I do agree with some of his points even if they're a bit poorly stated.

It is a one-shot with an Unreliable Narrator. The person telling the story doesn't know all that's happened so any characterization is entirely justified. There's no realistic way to say something happened behind the scenes that made any of the characters snap under pressure it can be glossed over. Plus it's an AU some OOC is bound to happen.

It's been a while since I read it, I'm merely interpreting Edward's review. I think he found the premise and character's actions (justified or not) to be off-putting. Also calling this fic an AU is a bit of a stretch in my opinion. Although the strict definition (taken from Alternate Universe) is "A story in which the characters we know are seen in a reality that's somehow different, often disturbingly so" I wold argue that the elements introduced in the fic are at least within the fanon bounds of the regular Harry Potter universe and aren't divergent enough to really call it an AU. Also calling the Narrator Unreliable is a bit much as well. I don't believe he contradicts himself or gives us flawed information. True, he doesn't give us the whole picture but that's not unreliable, that's uninformed. Although those last few remarks are my own views and not Edward's

Double checked the page history and the last time any major editing took place that might have removed some entries was a month ago when ShadowAI sorted the entries into new folders. I don't think that would be the case if you're worried about the past week. In fact more entries were added in the past week than removed (the only one removed was one that was added by the same person a few days earlier). So perhaps you're imagining things?

I didn't remove anything, just sorted it. It might just be that the General fics folder is a lot shorter since a lot of the stuff there was moved somewhere else.

Sorry, didn't mean to say you removed one on purpose. I was just saying that it was possible when you moved them around one might have been deleted accidentally. However since he specified it was within the last week I discounted that possibility.

Do you have a suggestion on what kind of folders to put them in? It's a valid idea especially with how long the page has gotten but I'm just not sure how best to file them.

I think (s)he's suggesting keeping the current organization, just with everything in folders as opposed to the current headings. The only question I have is whether the software can handle sub-folders (for the DAYD comments).

I don't think it can (or at least I don't know how) but then I don't know why it needs it either I mean some other fics have longer comments take Backwards with a Purpose and Nightmares of Futures Past. I suppose I'll put in folders to replace to sections and remove the DAYD comments folder and if someone figures out how to fix it then they can fix it.

I probably should have read this first. Sorry guys, I borrowed the Naruto folder structures and singled out the fic types that were recurring a lot (Crossovers, peggy sues etc.). I also kept anything I wasn't certain on in General Fics, especially stuff I haven't read.