I was thinking of having a runoff crowner between anything that has a positive ratio without having enough consensus, but I'm tempted to go back to the original suggestion of MediaHistory/ by mod fiat (which I generally don't like to do, but I also want to avoid headaches with crowners) if Media/ (the current top option, which I switched my downvote to an upvote for, making it go from 2:1 to 2.5:1) doesn't retain consensus.

Edit: Bumped the ATT bulletin to see if we can get more votes (I'll do this tomorrow as well, since the 21st is the last day), which I think I might have previously had plans to do, but it probably slipped through the cracks because I got sick shortly after making this crowner (but I'm starting to get better).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 19th 2023 at 2:26:22 PM

Posting this comment to make public that I voted in favor of the Media/ name for the namespace. I didn't upvote or downvote any of the other options.

Media/ is the only one within consensus range so far, and since it's just under 4:1 (ratio of 3.86:1 with 27 yeas and 7 nays), that means my previous mod post will probably be rendered moot, thankfully (since I was concerned the crowner might fail for a while). Seems like bumping the bulletin worked.

Edit: Speaking of which, I gave the bulletin one last bump before it's time to call the crowner on the 21st.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 20th 2023 at 4:04:28 AM

I know /Media is the consensus choice, but is anyone else concerned with the vagueness of that as a name (does that even matter at this point)? That was the biggest reason I voted it down, because "media" can also refer to "works" and having to differentiate between the two can be confusing.

We in this thread would know the difference but it isn't all that apparent just from the name itself.

I'm concerned too. Switching my vote back—don't know why I switched it to begin with.

I also think Media/ is... Media.

Stating publicly that Media Notes is my vote, seeming most indicative of the purpose it serves. Voted against Media History because that implies information about the past, not necessarily the present.

MediaNotes/ is actually my preferred option despite it previously lacking consensus (it now has a 2:1 ratio, meaning it's now the only option with consensus); I decided on MediaHistory/ as the default because it was the original suggestion. I do think that's a good point regarding Media/, either way.

As for why I commented on Media/ despite preferring MediaNotes/, that ties into what I've previously said elsewhere on the forums about how I stay neutral when calling consensus and just give the go-ahead to do something a crowner says even if it wasn't my preferred option (in this case, MediaNotes/ previously lacked consensus while Media/ was the only one with consensus; they have since switched places in that respect).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 20th 2023 at 1:46:54 PM

Sigh... -_-

Alright, downvoting Media (and also Media History) and upvoting Media Notes. Hopefully the pool of options will stick this time.

~Aegis P:

• This is not the purpose of this thread. Changing tropes that should be Useful Notes but aren't is the job of Trope Repair Shop, and the best place to gather input on that is either in the Meta thread therein or in Trope Talk.
• Definition-Only Pages can be tropes that we just don't collect examples of for some reason.

Oh, right, and we'll need to do a couple of things here:

• Draft Media Notes and Platforms indexes (I figured "Platforms" should be plural even though the namespace we're using is singular); these will be located in Main/ like Main.Useful Notes despite the pages themselves not being in Main/.
• Go through the Useful Notes index and see which pages should be moved to Platform/ or MediaNotes/.

I'll add this to the header.

Edit: And done. Holler if anything needs to be fixed.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 21st 2023 at 7:14:57 AM

Should we just redirect Platforms to Video Game Systems? A point was made that Virtual Reality Index may also be a platform, but all systems there are at Video Game Systems already. Another point about Networks was leant on them being more like Creators.

As I noted before, there are actually items on the Virtual Reality Index that aren't on the Video Game Systems list, although this may be an oversight.

What I'd be more concerned about is drawing a delineation between Platform/ and Website/, because we have a number of pages under the latter namespace that are just big third-party content hosting sites with no original content of their own. Examples like Website.Twitch, Website.Fan Fiction Dot Net, Website.Keenspot, and so on.

Would these work better as Platform/ pages? I don't know, but they technically could be considered both.

Edited by TotemicHero on Mar 21st 2023 at 12:49:01 PM

Added Oculus Quest to Video Game Systems.

They probably would work better in the Platform/ namespace, especially because they're already exampleless instead of being treated the same as regular work pages, and they exist to host user-made content (as opposed to how the thread previously brought up Creator/ pages for TV networks and streaming services that make content in-house). I'll wait for more feedback on that part, though, but either way, video game platforms were only mentioned as an example of something that would go in the Platform/ namespace; it was never intended to be exclusive to video games.

If a dedicated page for the Platform/ namespace would be redundant with existing indexes, then maybe we don't need one, but it might not hurt to have a super-index (or whatever the index equivalent of a supertrope would be called) that lists those indexes instead of listing individual pages.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 21st 2023 at 12:35:33 PM

I agree on the website = a type of media platform part and think they should go there as well.

Would the "Platform" namespace be a good fit for Peking Opera and Broadway And The West End? While not gaming related they are, for lack of better terms, "Platforms" currently in the Useful Notes namespace.

Yes. Platform/ is for anything that plays host to works without being a Creator or a work in-and-of-itself.

Correct.

I feel like Platform/ might be a bit misleading in that case but I'm struggling to come up with a name that intuitively covers both game consoles and venues for staging plays.

Looking at the pages themselves, Peking Opera is written more like a genre page (albeit with an Examples Are Not General-violating example list), but then has a list of "references in other media" that would be more appropriate for an actual useful notes page. Nowhere does it really link actual examples of Peking operas. Broadway And The West End, on the other hand, has two lists of works in folders in the first section of the page that would allow it to qualify for Platform/ status (in my view anyway).

Edited by MorganWick on Apr 3rd 2023 at 1:23:38 AM

We already decided what to call the namespace, so there's no need to think of more names. Besides, I don't see how the use of Platform/ for live venues in addition to electronic distribution platforms is any less intuitive (or at least not significantly less intuitive) than how we've been doing something similar with Literature/ for years by using it for digitally distributed works in addition to printed works.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Apr 3rd 2023 at 3:51:58 AM

Bumping this because someone brought up Sandbox.App Namespace in a separate thread, and it seems like that would run right into the whole Platform/ issue regarding websites.

Also, assuming no further objections, we really ought to begin migrating pages over to the new namespaces, so another question I have is if we want to coordinate that here or start a couple of Projects threads for handling each of the respective namespaces.

I was thinking we could handle migration here, as with other namespace-related changes. (Lack of mod hat intentional. I'm just stating my opinion here.)

Edited by GastonRabbit on Apr 17th 2023 at 3:04:57 AM