We have determined that Lets Players are not inherently tropable. They need to provide some sort of narrative, characters, and story to be allowed on this wiki. This applies to Vtubers just as much as other content creators, but Kayfabe makes the distinction between streamer and character particularly fuzzy.
The purpose of the thread is to remove tropes from pages concerning Vtubers that apply only to the actor rather than the character.
- If there is not a clear separation between the character and the actor, we assume that it is the actor represented, and thus they are not tropable.
- In other words, it is up to the user writing the example to show that it pertains to the character and not the actor.
- Regardless, the content they produce must meet our standards for Web Video, meaning substantial original and/or transformative material.
- A vlog, review, or Let's Play does not become tropable just because the person doing it has an anime avatar.
More details in this post
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For our full policy, visit our Administrivia page on Real Life Troping.
PLEASE do not argue over the guidelines here. We've been through that argument too many times and it slows the cleanup effort down. Asking if some grey area meets the guidelines is okay. Arguing that the guidelines should be changed are not. If you would like to discuss the guidelines, go to the Real-Person Troping Policy thread
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Edited by badtothebaritone on Oct 12th 2022 at 4:58:06 AM
Incindentally, I think we need to enforce the commented-out warning now.
~l3nsman, based on your editing history, you really have it out for Nijisanji by disregarding restrictions against meta troping.
- Unperson: After the unfortunate events before and after her termination, her very existence has become taboo for the company, with the only notable exception being Rosemi, who still keeps Selen in her intro. Her segments in the 2024 AR-Live were noticeably the only ones that were completely wiped out note , leading to a significant part of the female performances being cut out too, since they were collaborations Selen did with the other Livers.
I deeply apologise for seeming biased. I promise not to edit any other Nijisanji pages until a few months pass and emotions die down a bit.
That being said, if my recent edit concerning Selen's Unperson status violates the rules somehow, then so does the entry in Zaion's bio in the XSoleil page. Could I please get an explanation why Zaion's Unperson entry complies with the rules and my recent Selen entry doesn't?
the Retromancer
- Unperson: After being terminated and being removed from the company, other livers made some changes to their channels regarding their involvement with Zaion. While not every collab involving her were made private, Finana and Maria privated their respective two-man collabs with her, and Kyo privated his four-man collab with her as well. The video title of Maria's cover collab with Zaion was also changed twice, initially removing Zaion's name, and then later her own while also deactivating the comment section of said video. The video's description, however, still mentions her as "Zai-chan".
Edited by Amonimus on May 12th 2024 at 2:55:42 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Thanks for clearing it up, I will be personally deleting those entries. I will then temporarily stop making edits to the Nijisanji page for a few months.
EDIT: Done, deleted both.
Edited by l3nsman on May 12th 2024 at 5:00:57 AM
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On that note, yes, this means that a lot of We Hardly Knew Ye / Put on a Bus / Unperson / But Now I Must Go need to be pruned not just on all Nijisanji pages, but also other agency pages like hololive. This is also why I want Nijisanji India cutlisted, because 2 out of 3 Livers there have nothing but But Now I Must Go as their sole trope.
Edited by AnoBakaDesu on May 12th 2024 at 8:40:26 AM
"They played us like a DAMN FIDDLE!" — Kazuhira Miller, Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
Would it be a good idea to add that "No Real Life Examples, Please!" to the description of Open Secret? I see it is indeed on the index, but it really wouldn't surprise me if others saw no such warning and assumed it was alright the way I did.
On that note, what would cross the line re: Virtual Youtubers under Open Secret? For example, would it be acceptable to simply note that things like Previous Lives are open secrets, and that the caveat is in those situations where a controversy was involved, but not provide any detailed examples?
Lost in Space
"Previous Lives are open secrets"
We're stretching the kayfabe again, are we? Any in-universe lore that simply layers over real events is not tropable. We've discussed that in the past.
If you want to discuss the NRLEP policy and how it is documented in trope descriptions, see here or here.
Edited by Fighteer on May 13th 2024 at 8:55:40 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
the Retromancer
Edited by Amonimus on May 13th 2024 at 4:12:09 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Yes, part of the reason I'm confused is because I was thinking specifically of that thing Takanashi Kiara did a while back where it was an open secret she was from Austria, but she'd claim to be from "Australia" and make a big exaggerated wink at the camera to make it clear she was joking. But then she dropped it because people weren't getting it was a joke and were beginning to genuinely think she was from Australia.
That was done "in-character", but she was talking about where she lives (lived?) as a gag.
Lost in Space
I just want to make it clear, whatever it takes, that the toxic, parasocial aspects of Vtuber fandom, especially the ones related to the quasi-fictionalized elements of the actors' identities, are not tropable.
If fans want to obsess over this stuff, that's on them. None of our business. We simply don't want it in our articles.
Edited by Fighteer on May 13th 2024 at 9:57:36 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
There's this entry on YMMV.Phase Connect that's been there for a while:
- Pippa also counts, not just from her design, but also in a rather Tsundere manner. Yes, her content can be rather controversial, edgy, brash or transgressive, and she herself often tends to swear and try to act boisterous. But the more you watch her the more you realise she's actually incredibly sweet and empathic on the inside; even her own friends and coworkers constantly say this. She's defined by her honesty, but behind the scenes she's also defined by genuine caring and compassion for others, not just for fellow Phase (she didn't like that she was given special rules) but also for her audience (she reads every name even if it exhausts her), and her Aspiring Vtuber streams show that she wants people who are passionate in the art to grow. Although her anxiety, Impostor Syndrome and "Pipkin" causes her communication problems that she's actually utterly afraid to mess up, and her existential zatsudans admit that she's someone who's Desperately Looking for a Purpose in Life, that which she found in Vtubing. Then you realise that watching her is like the experience of having a somewhat manic little sister who acts up in your presence but in the end, in reality, she's actually just a very shy, kind, introspective and selfless girl whom you just want to protect. Just show her images of cute animals or wholesome moments (e.g., from her oshi Watame) and you'd know what "Pippa Love" truly means.
This seems less like something describing the cute appeal of Pippa (of all people) and moreso just an overextended gushing entry.
Edited by GalaxyLight777 on May 13th 2024 at 8:34:22 AM
"I know we'll make it cause somehow, the universe is fun now!" ~Sana
the Retromancer
Moe is inherently gushing. But from this wall of text, 100% of this is about the performer and not the character, so it can go.
Edited by Amonimus on May 13th 2024 at 12:20:02 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
In terms of Kiara specifically, at this point her being a German/Austrian Phoenix seems to be firmly baked into her In-Universe character. She even has an outfit that is based off traditional German fashion.
Edited by Snowy66 on May 13th 2024 at 11:56:49 AM
This strikes me as IRL troping. Anyone else?
the Retromancer
Maybe. I don't understand what "proven to be wrong on all accounts" refers to, and "expecting to actually speaks" is quite questionable English on its own.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Chronic lore addict
It is; I've seen the moment they're referencing come up before and it's Pekora talking about her real life and giving advice for the real lives of others. Cut and send a notifier.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]")
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]")
I never liked how the XSOLEIL members threw Zaion under the bus back then, and the Armcha1r Expert video reasserts my stance on the matter. However, TVTrope rules are clear, and it's drama importation that's only mentionable on the Trivia section (where it is already mentioned), not on the characters' pages.
"They played us like a DAMN FIDDLE!" — Kazuhira Miller, Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain