Everything done by the angels in this game is an attempt to revert the events from The Garden of Eden.
- And it's even hinted in the game, mainly by Lilith's speech about the apple on her execution. They name the Unclean Ones as such first and foremost because of their access to the Demon Summoning Program, but later they're pretty much calling, and then summarily executing, anyone who came in contact with any symbol of knowledge, like books of any kind, even manga. The law ending pretty much cements that the only humans allowed to live with the Lord's blessing are Casualries: the humble workforce, with no luxuries whatsoever, with no education or not-from-above instruction. Like the popular understanding of Zeus's punishment of Prometheusnote , they're killing anyone who dares to know. Wisdom is a sin in the eyes of the angels. Humanity, to remain pure and blissful, must remain in complete ignorance—and completely dependent about what to do on divine edict.
- This is pretty much confirmed by one sidequest after NG+, where you must assassinate the baker of Mikado's outskirts, who transformed into a demon. Specifically, he became Dantalion, a Duke of Hell whose role mirrors that of Prometheus: divulge arts and sciences. Notice that the same baker, before his transformation, gone through the whole game (as confirmed by the sequel, seven years roughly) shirking his work now and then to distribute books to anyone, free of charge. Is the player really executing a humble man turned monster, or rooting yet another means for those of Mikado to receive education?
Someone tampered with the past similar to Raidou Kuzunoha vs. The Soulless Army, which might explain the anachronistic nature of East Mikado.
- Jossed. Mikado was simply built with God's Chosen (kidnapped children who don't remember Tokyo) on a ark and was built on the ceiling of Tokyo afterwards. The flow of time is different between the two.
The characters are in some kind of time loop or their future selves are contacting Flynn to convince him to take the side they want.
This game takes place after SMT2 on the main timeline, somewhere around the year 3080.
- Jossed. Characters mention China and the United States also having come under demonic invasion. Neither country exists after SMT1.
- Can evidence of the latter be provided?
- Only anecdotally: The Great Flood in the closing act of SMT 1 drowns the entirety of Tokyo save the Cathedral. Given how high the water would have to rise to do so, it's not much of a stretch to guess that almost the entire world found itself underwater, except without a convenient Ark.
- According to SMT2's manual, only Tokyo (with the exception of the Cathedral) was flooded. Other than that, the point still stands; China and the US would have presumably been too damaged to rebuild.
- Can evidence of the latter be provided?
- Jossed further. There is evidence in the game (mentioned at Kasumigaseki's supercomputer, which surprisingly still functions) saying the game takes place in (irony ahead) 2038.
This game takes place after Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey.
- God/YHVH has decided, since the Schwarzelt and Demi-fiend failed, to just take his chosen and create a paradise for them.
- Jossed. Most of the game's plot is caused by The White, manifestations of human despair at God's ultimate control over mankind's fate. Their goal is to remove mankind from the control of god by ending existence. Where Strange Journey falls in relationship to this game is unclear, but Nocturne is clearly unrelated. Besides, Strange Journey is a textbook example of Gaia's Vengeance, while Nocturne is one link in an inconceivably large Gambit Pileup between the Great Will and Lucifer (or its resolution, depending on your choice of ending).
- Strange Journey has no relation to the game as the Counter-Demon Force Base has info that reveals that Country A created the Demonica to fight demons, which people didn't know about in Strange Journey until after they entered the Scharzwalt. Japan became the world's second best demon fighting force using the armor.
- Furthermore, if the neutral ending is the canon one and assuming that Gore wasn't lying (which is unlikely), mankind picks itself back up and grows to be prosperous without intervention.
- Not entirely jossed, it's revealed by both Merkabah and Lucifer that as long as humans cling to God or have desires respectively that the cycle of law vs chaos will continue indefinitely, so even if the protagonist in SJ gets the Schwartzwelt nuked in the end it will come back too as long as humans abuse nature. Couple that with how Mastema talks about how he slaughtered Unclean Ones before, Demonee-ho, and the Demonicas themselves being in Tokyo. What better way for a person to fight demons with a suit that enhances you? Even though they are the prototype models, Jack's Squad shown how powerful they can be. Finally, it's revealed that it is possible for Demons to come out of the Schwartzwelt. Even if it's nuked, it is unknown how many demons escaped, meaning it's entirely possible the events of SJ caused what happened in IV.
- All the demons disappear in the Neutral Ending when the Schwartzwelt disappears. It's also stated that the Demonicas were specifically made to combat Demons, which the ones in SJ weren't made for such a thing. IV's also lack the adaptability that the Demonicas in SJ had. Demonee-ho is also most likely a different demon much like how there are different King and Black Frosts. Mastema was talking about literal biblical times when he spoke of slaughtering Unlcean Ones and it's unknown whether he was being serious or not since the whole fight was a joke. Also, different technology exists in the different alternate worlds and some technology gets developed in multiple ones, which explains the Demonicas, as well as there being countless multiple worlds out there, which the Yamato Perpetual Reactor can access through the Expanse.
- Honestly this will forever be a mystery. There are valid points on both ends. One could just point to how Nocturne reveals how the series is not on one particular universe but over multiple universes. There's just an equal of a chance as SJ causing IV's plot as there is of SJ having nothing to do with it at all. This is backed up by how depending on where you get SJ, in American releases the protagonist is American. Now this screws up lore a little bit considering it's implied that America and China at least are in ruins. No one knows for sure. All we can confirm is that Flynn is the fifth one to step up to the plate where SMT I's protag, Hawke, Demi-Fiend, and SJ's protag came before. They all had a say in the fate of everything regardless on what universe they are in.
This game takes place during SMT1.
- Specifically during the 30 year gap between when the nukes fell and when Kazuya & co are in Makai. It is mentioned that it the nukes fell 25 years ago meaning this would take place 5 years before the second part.
- The details of the main endings make this HIGHLY unlikely.
- I support this guess. It would also explain why Lucifer Took a Level in Jerkass and why Gabriel isn't the Only Sane Man of the Archangels, they simply hasn't taken their level in kindness yet. Also I would guess that Kazuya arrives some time after the filament has been lifted.
The Yamato Reactor is somehow connected to the Amala Network.
- Unlikely, given that the Yamato Perpetual Reactor is actually a particle accelerator..
Isabeau is this world's incarnation of the Heroine from SMT1.
- In Nocturne, we learn that a 'world' is actually its own universe, and not a literal planet. Considering
◊ she looks almost like the heroine if you have her wear the heroine's clothes and untie her hair...◊
Alternatively, everyone is a reincarnation of the cast of SMT1.
- We know Flynn is a reincarnation of someone who gave his life to raise the firmament. That someone might have been the Shin Megami Tensei I protagonist, in an alternate version of the events of first game of the series. The Law and Chaos protagonists likely existed as well, but died after Tokyo was saved from the ICBMs. The Heroine likely met this fate as well. 1500 years later, they were reborn as Flynn, Isabeau, Jonathan, and Walter.
Time doesn't move faster for the people of Mikado. Time in Tokyo moves slower.
- The Yamato Reactor generates black holes. Black holes cause time dilation. The Eastern Kingdom of Mikado hasn't experienced 1500 years of history while only 25 years have passed in Tokyo - 1500 years have passed in the outside world while Tokyo has experienced only 25.
- There might be some evidence to this. When Masakado destroys the barrier and assumes his true form and from pretty much you see in Mikado, the outside world is filled with greenery and lakes. If the entire world was nuked over, it's doubtful it could recover in only 25 years time.
- Furthermore, it was more than 1500 years outside - the calendar kept by Mikado started with the kingdom's foundation by Aquila, and he (as the local Akira) and the remains of the Counter-Demon Force already had worked for some time to drill the path that would become Naraku to the surface. Furthermore, the Minotaur claims it's been more than 1,500 years since he was posted at the Hall.
Navarre's parents were among those killed in The Purge.
- When you eventually pick up Navarre at Kiccigiorgi, he's dressed in common clothes and is clearly disheveled from being pursued by the angels. Most likely, after being discharged, he was taken to his family's residence, where he more or less witnessed his family's death at the hands of the angels. He was still marked for death for possessing forbidden knowledge, and was thus forced to run and hide at Kiccigiorgi, making him even crazier after the Alraune incident and reducing him to a pauper.
Masakado has limited Time Master powers.
- He manipulates time in a very limited fashion with Guardian's Eye; he used a massively larger form of the same technique to entrap Tokyo in a bubble of slowed time to allow it to last enough for help to come from outside.
The Great Spirits of Goodwill and Spite are Jonathan and Walter's souls.
- Merkabah and Lucifer are only able to maintain their forms because they need Jonathan and Walter's essences to give them power; the angels at one point even say that they specifically need Jonathan's soul to summon Merkabah. When Flynn defeats them, he frees Jonathan and Walter's souls, and Masakado uses their power to lift the ceiling off of Tokyo. Plus, they're called SPIRITS, not "entities" or "guardians" or anything to imply that they're the actual demons.
The Walter and Jonathan you fight in the Neutral ending aren't your Walter or Jonathan.
- When going through Blasted Tokyo and Infernal Tokyo, both Jonathan and Walter believe that you helped them in the previous sections, despite them being mutually exclusive routes. With Walter you join up with Lilith and trigger the remote, with Jonathan you slay Lilith and fail to stop Walter from triggering the remote. But after returning in the Neutral path, neither of them mention the journey, the White, or much of anything before fighting you as Lucifer/Merkabah. The point is: If the White are able to bring an alternate ally that you helped in a parallel universe that wasn't yours, then they may have permanently separated said allies from you after you refuse to help destroy everything, and brought the allies you did not help to your world as a final measure to prevent your success.
Alternately, it's the Walter and Jonathan who accompany you through Blasted and Infernal Tokyo that aren't your Walter or Jonathan
- Going off those same points with the mutually exclusive routes, it's also possible that your Walter and Jonathan never left your universe, and your companions in Blasted and Infernal Tokyo were from parallel universes. While you were off gallivanting in parallel universes, Walter and Jonathan were busy as Lucifer and Merkabah, causing all the offscreen havoc.
- Also, as a form of Schrödinger's Gun, if you went for Law and helped Jonathan, then you go adventuring with your Jonathan and an alternate Walter in the parallel universes, while your Walter fused with Lucifer on schedule. Chaos is just vice versa. Admittedly, the argument breaks down if you somehow managed to get Law while helping Walter, or Chaos while helping Jonathan.
The White are an allegory for SMT fans who are sick of the Law/Neutral/Chaos conflict.
- Confirmed. They are sick of the constant conflict and want to push Flynn over the Moral Event Horizon and cause him to destroy the entire universe to finally put a complete stop to the conflict.
The current storyline of the Megaten Series is as follows:
Shin Megami Tensei II, in which YHVH has basically become omnipotent and fucked up everything beyond repair. Aleph managed to defeat YHVH and set the world back on track, but the Great Will is still too powerful, able to set up the Conception System and pretty much do what he wants. Lucifer realizes that there's no saving this timeline, and it's best to give it a Mercy Kill. Of course, he sees a way to get something he wants out of it, and sacrifices the timeline to create the Demi-Fiend. Then he goes back in time and helps Raidou make sure none of this ever happens.
Without being under the thumb of YHVH, humanity prospers. But they take it a little too far and summon the Schwarzwelt, kicking off Strange Journey. The Archangels, now having to work behind the scenes due to not having the power they did in SMTII see this as a chance to create the Millennium Kingdom, but the Strike Team puts the kibosh on their plans.
The Archangels snap and decide subtly is for pussies, and attempt to nuke the planet. Tokyo is saved by Masakado and the Hero. Thus begins Megaten IV
- Good attempt to reconcile them all, but a lot of text plus mutually incompatible timelines seem to argue that it's a case of multiple universes where this plays out one way or another.
Charon is himself playing Shin Megami Tensei IV.
His character keeps dying and is low on both Macca and Play Coins. He wants Play Coins from you because he's not going to get many Play Coins per day just sitting there at his desk.- Sure he is. He gets up to greet each new prospective member of the afterlife.
Isabeau, Jonathan, and Walter are themselves reincarnations of the basal world's Akira, Kiyoharu, and Kenji, respectively
. Given that Stephen apparently adjusted the gauntlets to activate on finding the reincarnation of Masakado's wielder, it's not too far off the mark to suspect that they're also sensitive to the reincarnations of his comrades. Navarre did notice that the year's catch of Samurai was ridiculously high, especially given the recent lack of chosen for several years. It may well be that the four comrades of old were drawn to each other's new incarnations—and given to their old inclinations of neutrality, law, and chaos. Navarre never wanted to be a Samurai in the first place.
It's true that after being freed from Alraune he says he's been a victim ever since the Gauntlet chose him, but the context could be seen as him doing an about face from his previous attitude of pride in being a Samurai. However, it needs to be remembered that the Gauntlet ceremony is mandatory for each year's eighteen-year-olds, whether Casualry or Luxuror. What's more, Navarre's strutting is always in the context of being a Luxuror, not being a Samurai. In effect, he doesn't know how not to be a Luxuror—a status with no meaning among Samurai. And during the training sessions, it becomes clear that he has no idea what to do. It's very possible that his extra-heavy preening and chronic sneering at Casualries was actually an attempt on his part to mask his ill ease over his sudden and unwanted responsibility. The situation with Alraune was enough to [[Sanity Slippage break both mask and resolve, though- Pretty much jossed by Gaston in Apocalypse.
The Four Archangels helped to create the Class System in Mikado as a failsafe should their plans to destroy Tokyo be thwarted.
It's specifically mentioned in the Clipped Wings DLC that the Four had helped Aquila found the kingdom and the class system had existed since the beginning. Eventually when Aquila learned of their plans for Mikado he joined with Mastema to prevent his old home from being destroyed. Though he was killed in his attempts to stop him, the archangels never took complete control of the kingdom and had them abolish the system in the past.Gabriel likely saw it as an necessary tool to help build resentment amongst the Casualries as part of a long term plan to eventually free her brothers. Once they are released from Kagome Tower, they could use the kingdom as the base for a third attempt at destroying Tokyo by abolishing the caste system and making themselves look like righteous heroes.
Mikado only has one meal of the day: Breakfast
At least, breakfast is the only formal meal; all other times are like coffee breaks. At the start of the game, the four prentices have breakfast together. K says that he asked Sister Gabby out to breakfast a long time ago, rather than lunch or dinner as would be expected of a date. King Aquila deliberately sabotaged Mikado's isolation
Apocalypse spells out his goal: lead Mikado so that it can eventually unite with Tokyo, even though the Archangels are watching. Everything he did to isolate Mikado was designed to ensure that there was a path between Tokyo and Mikado: Naraku.- Fighting the 'Unclean Ones': He was installed king because he saved Mikado, which gave him political power, but more importantly, it gave him the legendary status that made him an idol.
- Building Mikado Castle: The sensible option to having a hole full of demons is to cave it in, so Akira had to prevent anyone from trying this. Building Mikado Castle on top of Naraku would make it very hard to get the necessary materials to the entrance. Also, the entrance to Naraku is only a double-door next to some spiral steps, which would make it even harder to move building materials down.
- Forming the Samurai: The only military force in Mikado emulates and admires him completely, possible enough to override the Monastery. More importantly, they're one of the few groups that know of Naraku's existence, ostensibly to protect the populace, but it also makes it even harder to destroy it. If they have to hide from the non-Samurai and Monastery members in the castle, it would be a lot harder to cave it in.
- Writing the code so that they can't go down past the Third Stratum: the Fourth Stratum contains a bridge that you need to cross to reach the Fifth. He had to put that one in so that they wouldn't destroy the bridge.
- Placing the Minotaur: This one is harder to justify. He probably put him in as lip service to the Archangels; he's strong, but not the strongest of his demons.
The Red Pill alone isn't enough to turn people into demons
Reds are made out of brains processed with Yaso Magatsuhi's gas, which explains why demons like them so much, but not how they can turn people into demons. My guess is that Reds won't work on the average person, but they do work on everyone in the game because:- Apocalypse retconned it so that everyone in Mikado has a little bit of the demonic gene to experiments, which is why class dissatisfaction was enough to turn them into demons. Reds will turn any citizen of Mikado into a demon because they already have a little bit of demon in them.
- Everyone in Tokyo eats demon meat, so they're all made of demon.
