WMG / MCU: The Universe In General

Beware of unmarked spoilers!

Red Skull was planning on unleashing Shuma-Gorth all along

In Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. we learn HYDRA's true purpose, brining back Hive. In Captain America: The First Avenger Red Skull apparently knows nothing of this. A good assumption was the he was part of the more Science focused parts of HYDRA, reinforced by his disciple Reinhardt/Whitehall's disdain for the cult.

In What If…? (2021)'' a version of Red Skull tries to unleash Shuma-Gorth only to backfire on him. Quite similar to the Cult. It's possible that Red Skull studied Hive, and decided that he could do bigger. That is when he discover Shuma-Gorth, that also represented HYDRA symbolically.

Trevor Slattery was the real Mandarin all along.

Notice how in All Hail The King Trevor was the only one who wasn't attacked or hurt. During the final scene, the hidden gun misses the target, the assassin fights off the bodyguard, there's an explosion in the background, and Trevor ducks under a table to avoid being hit by anything before he finds a gun and points it at the Assassin but he never tries to kill him.

Remember that since this takes place in a prison there are cameras everywhere and Trevor would have to be an amazing actor in order to fool all the guards who are watching him. Well guess what? He is. He's so good at what he does he managed to fool not only America and Tony Stark, but also Killian. Trevor may have gotten himself hired in order to get rid of Killian before he became a threat to the real Ten Rings.

• Seems less likely after Shang-Chi, which had another villain claiming to be the Mandarin in the film, and who has been around using ten magic rings for a millenia to prove it, but also had Trevor Slattery as his captive...
  • But, even that version of the Mandarin claimed that other people gave him that name, and mocked the title. Maybe Trevor really is the "Original" Mandarin, that used ten magic rings (in the classic comic sense of having magic rings of different powers on his fingers) and inspired such a potent mythology about himself, that even after he retired from villainy for millenia, another immortal warlord with ten powerful magic rings was then immediately assumed to be him. Looking like Trevor Slattery, and having a past as an actor from London is just a result of him hopping into a new host and taking over their body (a form of magic that the comic Mandarin used to escape death many times).

The MCU has a completely different history than our Timeline.

The first clue is in the opening of Thor, Odin strongly implies that the Norse myths originated from the war Asgard carried on with Jotunheim, which the film places in 965 A.D. Loki's birth is also placed in or after this year. This simply does not jibe with our timeline, in which not only were Pagan Norse beliefs already well established by 965, they were in fact in decline due to the influence of Christianity. This means Norse beliefs are FAR newer than Christianity in this universe, which in turn means a completely different chain of historical events from that point forward. Belief in the Aesir would have had to persist for a couple of centuries at least, for it to be a well established religion, and for records to be made of it's existence, such as is seen in the books shown in the first Thor film. This means Scandinavia was probably Pagan until the 13th century, at least, which is totally different from our history.

• There's nothing in the movie that suggests the war was the origin of the myths. All Odin says is that the inhabitants of Earth knew they were not alone, which easily leaves open the idea that the battle depicted in the intro was one of the last visits of the Asgardians to Earth, not the first. The part of the timeline that clearly doesn't fit our reality is the fact that said war is long in the past when we are first shown Thor and Loki as children, thus it being impossible for them to have been the inspiration for their own mythological counterparts. There are two simple ways to reconcile this without MCU history being radically different from our own:
  • The first simply requires you to move the line in Norse mythology that delineates which stories happen in the past, and which happen in the future. Since quite a few of the myths already take place in the future (most notably Ragnarok), making even more of the existing mythology prophetical doesn't change a whole lot.
  • The other way is to handle it the way they did in the comics and have Ragnarok be a "Groundhog Day" Loop that repeats over and over again, and that Norse mythology is actually based on the previous Asgard, not the current one. The latter method also lets you smooth over the wild discrepancies between the myth and the movies, such as Loki being Thor's brother rather than his uncle, or Thor being blond rather than red-headed.

Then we have Captain America: The First Avenger. In this film, the characters exhibit very little prejudice for the time period. Everyone is totally cool with Cap's interracial team of commandos, which seems unlikely for the time period.

• It's implied that his interracial unit was allowed less because everyone was fine with it and more because he's Captain America and used his considerable authority (and physically imposing presence) to let him organize his own unit with few arguments.

This suggests a different history than the one we know.

• There were many minorities that served in WWII. The only thing remotely unusual would be all of them in one team, but that's easily explained: They were personally selected by Steve Rogers. Rogers was selected for the Super Soldier program specifically because of his moral fiber. Considering he was selected by Dr. Erskine, "moral fiber" would almost certainly have included "non-prejudiced". He would therefore have selected his team using the same criteria. So Steve Rogers chose his team because specifically because they were less inclined to such things. As for the brass, they probably were willing to give him a lot of leeway in how he put together his people.
• The present, at the very least, is confirmed to be different than ours, since while it is confirmed than Obama did serve 1 term, by the time Iron Man 3 rolled around, he's been replaced by Matthew Ellis - looks like in the MCU, The Battle of New York was the Nail that resulted in Obama getting voted out.
• Black Panther also pretty much confirms that at least in terms of Wakanda's existence, African and larger world history has been very different from real-world history.
• Also, Shang-Chi introduces a mighty and immortal warlord who terrorised the world for a millenia.

The Marvel Cinematic Universe is a prequel to Firefly

Now, the obvious logic is "Joss Whedon", but there's been other nods to the future, starting with The Bus over on Agents Of Shield. The engines are smaller, but the same general design, as a Firefly class ship, and in fact, it in general is designed like a precursor to Firefly class ships like Serenity. However, we also see another technological nod forward in The Winter Soldier, where Bucky and Cap have their last battle. The design of the room is almost identical to that of the room Mal and The Operative have in their own final battle. Furthermore, it's been established that Shield has never found a psychic, ever. Psychics are a myth. In a future 500 years ahead of us, with space crime and space zombies, psychics are still considered a myth. River is a rarity, and something astounding. Also, cryonics in real life is a really pathetic science. We have no plan for unfreezing the frozen. However, in the MCU, we know that they have a perfect example of how to pull it off now, since Cap managed to accidentally be cryogenically frozen, and they could wake him up successfully. By the time of Firefly, transporting subjects like River Tam in cryogenic suspension is quite simple, and they wake up in no time whatsoever. Although the MCU didn't begin as a Firefly prequel, the moment they handed control over to Joss Whedon, it's likely he decided to make it one, because he can, and because the sheer mindfuck it might cause audiences if it becomes more obvious in the future. That's why, despite Nathan wanting to, Nathan is not Ant-Man.

There are two Marvel Cinematic Universes

They were split with the release of The Incredible Hulk, Punisher: War Zone, and The Amazing Spider-Man.

The first continuity ran from 1998 to 2007 (although it continues to crop up, as seen below), and begins with Blade, shortly followed by the first X-Men movie, and then Blade II. It then starts the Sam Raimi's Spider-Man Trilogy with Spider-Man. It continues with Daredevil, the second X-Men movie, and the first Hulk. Then The Punisher happens, followed by Spider-Man 2 and the conclusion of the Blade trilogy with Blade: Trinity, a sequel to Daredevil with Elektra, Fantastic Four, and the third X-Men movie, The Last Stand. It then goes into Ghost Rider, the conclusion of the Spider-Man trilogy with Spider-Man 3, and the Fantastic Four sequel, Rise of the Silver Surfer. This concludes the first continuity's initial run.

The second continuity is the one Marvel is currently invested in. It begins, at its earliest point, with Captain America: The First Avenger in the '40s, then skipping ahead to Iron Man, which kicks off the modern timeline (as of present day). What sets this continuity apart from the first is The Incredible Hulk, a reboot of the first Hulk film, and Punisher: War Zone, which does the same for the Punisher franchise. Running at the same time as Incredible Hulk is Iron Man 2, and then Thor, which leads into The Avengers. This is all established within the film's continuity. Speculation and hints around the franchises also establish The Amazing Spider-Man as being part of this continuity.

An interesting note is that the X-Men films are canonical to both continuities^note So are the Ghost Rider films, because while the other franchises have been rebooted, the X-Men franchise^note And ''Ghost Rider''! has continued to produce movies.

There may be a third MCU from before Blade, which includes the early Captain America, Fantastic Four, Punisher, and Spider-Man movies, as well as the Incredible Hulk TV series and Howard the Duck.

• Until the modern MCU, there was NO Marvel Cinematic Universe. The movies were isolated and unconnected. They aren't connected through time, but shared events (and, more accurately, production companies). The reboots of Hulk and Punisher were not connected to the previous franchises, the X-Men franchise is unconnected to the current MCU (although rumors imply that Quicksilver will be appearing in both Days of Future Past and Age of Ultron, linking the two universes), nor is Ghost Rider.
  • ...Confirmed? There are now many (Marvel Cinematic) universes in this franchise.

Phase 3 will be primarily Cosmic

While it will begin with Ant-Man (which is a heist film and most probably earth-based), it seems phase 3 will be set primarily in the great beyond. First off, Doctor Strange and Inhumans are all but confirmed. Sure, Doctor Strange starts off on eath, but he usually winds up zipping off to other cosmic planes. Also, this film would be the perfect chance to introduce charaters and concepts like Eternity and the Living Tribunal before the Infinity Gauntlet. Inhumans, of course, is mostly set on the moon. A Thor movie seems highly likely, with the cliffhanger from Dark World, and, like Doctor Strange, will probably start on earth but branch off, especially if the Surtur theory is correct. A GOTG sequel seems likely, if for no other reason to familiarize us further with Thanos and his world. The only other film I can see them trying to squeeze in before Avengers 3 would be perhaps another Cap movie, but we'll see. With the introduction of Phase 3, the MCU film lineup will double in size.

Phase 4 will likely have a heavier focus on terrestrial stories. With Doctor Strange having tested the waters for paranormal stories, Blade or Ghost Rider wouldn't be misplaced. And Black Panther has to happen. And Ant-Man 2, Cap 4, maybe War Machine or Iron Man with a new actor...

• Confirmed projects for Phase 3 are:
  • Captain America 3' - given the character and the previous films, this is probably Earth-only as well.
  • Spider-man - Will skip the origin story.
  • Guardians of the Galaxy 2 - obviously this will be a cosmic film, and will likely involve Quill searching the universe for his father.
  • Doctor Strange - by default, this will at least begin Earth-based, but the good Doctor could easily start dimension-hopping.
  • Thor: Ragnarok - Thor is back on Earth for Age of Ultron, but he will likely be branching out into more of the Nine Realms for his next film.
  • The Avengers 3 - this has long been rumored as Avengers vs. Thanos, with a heavy possibility of the Guardians of the Galaxy being involved as well, so it will probably spend a significant chunk of the film off-Earth.
  • Ant-man and the Wasp
  • The Black Panther
  • Captain Marvel
  • Avengers 4
  • Inhumans
  • Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D., which will almost certainly stay Earth-bound in its second season.
  • Agent Carter, which is a series following Peggy Carter after WWII, will likewise be entirely Earth-bound.
  • The Defenders series, which encompasses Daredevil, Luke Cage, Iron Fist and Jessica Jones, is a team of street-level heroes, so probably won't stray far from New York, let alone Earth.
• Overall, it looks like Phase 3, much like Phase 2, will be pushing out into the universe, but still maintain a firm grounding on Earth. After that... who knows?

White Star will be forged to replace SHIELD

After something happens that proves that the world needs a SHIELD-like organization, Captain America will be approached to head a new organization under the logic that he's the one man who can be trusted wholly. Cap will take from what he learned with the Avengers and Howling Commandos to heart when building it, forging an organization that uses small squads to respond to situations and overall keeps it a smaller scale rather than going full GDI with heavy Helicarriers that fall out of the sky every other Thursday. Coulson and his team would likely be a good start. While Cap will do what he can to refuse the name, it eventually sticks despite his best efforts, perhaps leaving Cap looking philosophically at the impact a man's legacy can have in ways he never would have wanted.

• As of the end of the first season of Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D., Fury has given the task of rebuilding S.H.I.E.L.D. to Coulson, so jossed.

Every Phase will begin with an Iron Man movie and end with an Avengers movie. Also, all members of the Avengers in the first movie will cameo in every future Avengers movie, even if they are(for some reason) not a part of the ongoing plot.

• Phase Three is set to begin with the Ant-Man movie.
• No, Ant-Man is the final film of phase 2, and the first film in phase 3 is Captain America: Civil War with Iron Man in it, technically making the first part accurate.
  • Confirmed for as long as it could be, ended by Phase 4, in which Iron Man is dead, and which is starting with Black Widow's solo movie, and (assuming nothing else is announced) will end with a Thor film.

Just like in the comics, the Defenders will be assembled by Doctor Strange

Except this time he will be the Mysterious Backer of the team rather than an outright leader. Furthermore, the Netflix series is apparently set to debut in 2015, long before Doctor Strange's movie will, allowing him to make a grand entrance at the end of the season.

• The series was not, but maybe a future team, more comic accurate, in a film, might be.

Star Wars had no prequels in the Marvel Cinematic Universe Timeline

Think about it. If someone told Steve to watch Star Wars, then the movies with Samuel Jackson cannot exist, otherwise everyone would be freaking out.

• Or, more likely, they can be Mutually Fictional.
• Ditto for the Star Trek-reboot, since Chris Hemsworth was in the first one.
• Or they just had alternate actors in this universe. The part of Mace Windu was played by Morgan Freeman instead, who would've been better suited anyway.
• Or they're just those two guys who look alike.
• If the Star Wars prequels never existed in the MCU, then there would be no Celebrity Paradox. And it would also explain Parker's comment in Civil War about Empire being "that really old movie." In the MCU, the only Star Wars that ever happened were Hope, Empire, and Jedi. There would probably still be fans of Star Wars around (explaining the note in Steve's notebook), and anyone who grew up in the late 70's/early 80's would remember it (like Rhodes), but any younger generations (ie. Parker) would've never received such thorough pop-cultural osmosis as everyone in the real world.

There have been active superheroes prior to Iron Man

This one takes a bit of time to explain. Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. has shown that SHIELD was monitoring superpower individuals for a long time now, easily before Tony put on the suit. Most of them, as is the case with Chan Ho Yin, were kept a close eye on and warned away from using their abilities in public. But many could easily have slipped through their cracks and started their own hero careers. SHIELD was either unable to apprehend them or unwilling depending on how well they did their jobs. Fury tells Tony that he's not the only superhero - while he could be referring to Steve, it's unlikely because they all assumed he was dead at that point. Thor hadn't shown up yet, and Hulk wouldn't be considered a hero even if he was superpowered. The reason these heroes didn't come out of the woodwork after Tony's statement is because Superman Stays Out of Gotham - they've all got their own villains and neighbourhoods to patrol, so they can't fly around in the world or ride in quinjets to get rid of every threat there is. They're street level. They could also not be as strong as the Avengers power-wise. Furthermore, all the Avengers have public identities, and that has caused them quite a bit of grief^note Tony was publicly targeted by both Vanko and the Mandarin; Steve and Bruce both became fugitives from the government; Natasha and (presumably) Clint had to build their covers back up after all the SHIELD secrets leaked; Thor...is a god and has his own problems on Asgard so he doesn't really count. The pre-Iron Man heroes wouldn't want anybody finding out who's behind the mask and coming after them.

• Confirmed by Ant-Man. Hank Pym first operated way back in the seventies.
• Also confirmed by Black Panther as that monarchical title goes back millennia and both the film and prequel comic show that they've been covertly operating outside of Wakanda since at least the 20th century.
• Also confirmed by Captain Marvel as her origin movie takes place in the nineties.
• And then we have the Eternals, who have lived on Earth for thousands of years. The group has aided the people of earth over time, but were only allow to protect humans from threats of Deviants. To prevent themselves from attracting too much attention, the group would move around the globe and later assume new identities.
• Also confirmed by Thor. And Captain America. And Bucky Barnes. And the Ancient One (plus Wong, Mordo, and a lot of other sorcerers).

Most of the early Marvel teen heroes were active before Iron Man

This is continuing from the above. Let's assume that the first teen heroes of Marvel Comics (The New Warriors, Cloak and Dagger, and Jessica Jones) were all active in the MCU on a street level prior to the events of Iron Man. This means that 6-7 years have passed since and they're likely young adults now - just like they are in the comics, and thus similar ages to the other A-listers. This means that Jessica Jones is at the right age to have already gone through the trauma of Alias and become a PI, and Cloak and Dagger would already have the experiences of teenage runaways to tutor the actual Runaways should they appear.

• Confirmed. Jessica Jones is a perfect example, in fact.

Rocket's real name will be revealed in either Avengers 4 or Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3...

It's Bert.

• Jossed for Avengers 4. Rocket has a real name. That name is Rocket.

All the Marvel Netflix characters have died during Thanos' fingersnap in Infinity War

.It is pure coincidence that all the Marvel Netflix shows are cancelled after the release of Avengers: Infinity War. We might not see them again since the Disney's upcoming streaming service would not include them because they're too mature. Given that we see in the Super Bowl trailer of Avengers: Endgame where cities are empty, this means that the Marvel Netflix characters are also victims of Thanos' Badass Fingersnap. And with the rumors of the Avengers using time-travel to stop Thanos from using the Gauntlet, the Marvel Netflix shows that would ever get picked by other networks or sites would take place after Endgame.

There will be more characters from alternate universes

In Spider-Man: Far From Home, Mysterio is confirmed to be from an alternate universe, coming through a wormhole as a side effect to Thanos's snap. Who's to say there aren't more wormholes opening up elsewhere?

• New characters:
  • Taskmaster
  • Kang
  • Mephisto
  • Juggernaut
  • The Lizard
  • Venom/Carnage
  • Enchantress
  • Gambit
  • Moon Knight
  • Hercules
  • Psylocke
  • Sinister Six
  • Doc Ock
  • Beta Ray Bill
  • Squirrel Girl
  • Ben Reilly
  • Spider-Gwen
  • Ms. Marvel (Kamala Khan)
• Returning characters:
  • Ronan the Accuser
  • The Mandarin (The real one)
  • Quicksilver
  • Ultron
  • Vision
  • Tony Stark
  • Howard the Duck
  • Lady Sif and the Warriors Three
• Jossed. Mysterio made the whole thing up.
• However despite Mysterio's lied, this later came true anyway. The previous two Live-Action versions of Spider-Man and some of their villains show up in Spider-Man: No Way Home.
  • The Disney+ Series have made Mysterio's lie into more truth than he ever intended. Loki give us both the variant Sylvie, (who is a Composite Character of Female Loki and the Enchantress) and 'He Who Remains', who is a variant of Kang). What if...? throws an even crazier curveball of a variant of Ultron who nearly destroys the multiverse!

The Nick Fury and Maria Hill we've been following all this time have been Talos and Soren this whole time.

In the after credits scene of Spider-Man: Far From Home it's revealed that Talos and his wife have been impersonating Nick Fury and Maria Hill the whole movie. How do we know they haven't been doing it for longer than that? As far back as Iron Man, Fury probably told them about people he's been keeping an eye on and told them when to approach them. Admittedly this would mean they're impersonating them for an entirely different reason than the comics. But this is Nick Fury we're talking about, his Crazy Preparedness is rivaled only by Batman would you REALLY put it past him?

• Jossed. According to Word of God the real Fury was at Tony's funeral in Avengers: Endgame.

Ego is indeed a Celestial, but one whose birthing from the planet went wrong.

As stated in Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 2, Ego is a Celestial. However, his appearance is vastly different from the others like Arishem or Tiamut. This could be because he almost emerged from whatever planet he was manifesting on, but something caused him to fuse with the planet itself rather than break out of it.

Steve Rogers really is on the Moon.

The ending of Avengers: Endgame was deliberately misleading. In truth, he only stayed in the past with Peggy for a relatively short time. Upon his return he was taken to a Lunar base by SWORD, as part of a mission of such extreme secrecy that his retirement had to be faked to even his closest friends. That mission? Discovering the reason for Skrull infiltration of Earth, and if necessary, defeating them. Once it's all revealed though, he will confirm he really does consider Falcon worthy to be his successor as the new Captain America.

Betty Ross will become Red She Hulk, instead of Thunderbolt Ross for the Thunderbolts film.

After the real life death of Thunderbolt Ross's actor, William Hurt, the MCU will change Red Hulk's origin story and properly write out Thunderbolt Ross. Instead of Thunderbolt Ross becoming Red Hulk, his daughter Betty will receive the serum and become the Red She Hulk, much similar to the comics. This would allow the Red Hulk to still appear in the upcoming Thunderbolts film. Betty's transformation could lead to her rekindling her relationship to Bruce. Or even lead to a frenenemy rivalry with Jennifer/She-Hulk. Finally, The MCU's Thunderbolts will also use the " Thunderbolts" moniker to honor Thunderbolt Ross.

• Partially Jossed. Harrison Ford has been recast as Thunderbolt Ross

The third MCU saga will focus on...

• The mutants. Ever since Fox was bought out by Disney, people were anticipating the mutants' arrival to the MCU for the longest time. And after the teases in the Multiverse Saga so far, such as with Ms. Marvel, Namor, and Earth-838's Professor X, this may foreshadow what's to come after Secret Wars.
• The Quantum Realm. The Infinity Saga focused on one universe, while the Multiverse Saga focuses on the multiverse. How can they go even further beyond that? Perhaps focusing on the Quantum Realm. Despite the multiverse's massive scope, it's still confined to a singular dimension: the Earthly Plane. Expanding the MCU's scope to two dimensions by increasing the Quantum Realm's prominence could be the next big leap for the franchise, with Quantumania being just a taste of what's to come.
• Mephisto. The demon's been massively (and rather infamously) speculated by fans to be joining the MCU as early as WandaVision. But with Kang being the current Big Bad, Mephisto's chances of becoming the MCU's post-Thanos threat is now highly unlikely. That being said, it's possible that the devil could take over as main villain after Kang is defeated. Further corroborating this is Mephisto's current stint as big bad is Jason Aaron's run of Avengers as of this writing, and the fact that he may be appearing in Ironheart—complete with an actor already attached to play him.

The Big Bad of the third saga

Villains that could succeed Kang as the Big Bad include:

• Dr Doom
• Galactus
• Mephisto
• An Ultron Variant
• A Red Skull Variant
• Korvac
• Knull
• Apocalypse
• The Beyonder
• Annihilus

The Multiverse Saga is assembling living counterparts to the Infinity Stones.

So Thanos "used the Stones to destroy the Stones" in Avengers: Endgame, and the borrowed counterparts used to undo the Blip were returned to their proper places in the timeline. But along comes Kang and his variants who have enough powers, technology, intelligence and ferocity to be even more of a threat than Thanos was. But there are no Infinity Stones left to match him ... until individual beings start stepping into the niches the Stones used to represent, and probably need to cooperate to defeat him:

• Carol Danvers, better known as Captain Marvel, still embodies the powers of the Space Stone from when she was infused with them in the 1990s.
• Wanda Maximoff, now the Scarlet Witch, has reached the point where she can alter Reality on a god-like scale, and her powers have a red aura like the Reality Stone did.
• Loki (or at least a variant of him) has ascended to basically become a deity of Time, holding the many branching paths of the multiverse together. As a bonus, he has a prominent green motif (much like the Time Stone did) that only intensifies when he takes on his multiversal role.
• Kamala Khan, now known as Ms. Marvel, may well be embodying Power, speculating from the Purple Is Powerful aspect of her abilities.
• Again more speculative, but Shang-Chi may be linked to either Soul or the Mind through his capabilities.