Headscratchers / Kaitou Sentai Lupinranger VS Keisatsu Sentai Patranger

• I know the odds of it being addressed are slim to none, but I might as well ask: Is there going to be a Greater Power for each team (in other words, two for this season), or are the two teams going to share one?
  • I'd argue it depends on if they join together or not. It should be two, but there seems to be something odd about their powers in universe.
  • I'm hoping this isn't straight Natter, but... can you elaborate on what seems "odd"?
    • Besides the fact that they share a transformation device, which in itself is not that unusual, there's the whole hidden meaning behind what "VS" means in this universe, down to why both teams each have emblems with one letter or the other on their gear, how the Pats can use the Good Striker at all, as you would expect only the Lupinranger to, and why their powers seem to be so evenly mirrored. One team combines, the other duplicates. One flies, the other drives. It honestly seems as if both teams were designed to purposefully counter each other, but from what we've learned from scans, it seems that both teams were created independently of one another. I'm certain there's an explanation but at the moment it just appears suspect. EDIT: Same poster here. With the reveal of the new ranger, something fishy is definitely going on.
    • As of right now (Episode 4) the greater power would probably be GoodStriker
      • Zenkaiger counts them as two separate teams and they each have their own Sentai Gear so it's likely they'd have two different Greater Powers, although for the most part Greater Powers stopped being a thing post Gokaiger other than the Gobusters because of their crossover. While the Gokaiger's have appeared relatively often post show and even use Ranger Key's of teams that came out after them they did not have their Greater Power and did not hint what it is (especially since they never use Gokai Oh in their more recent team ups). And that's unlikely to change due to how the franchise works. The greater Power was a Gokaiger thing, and Gokaiger is over and even though they guest star from time to time they're not the current main team anymore so they don't have the main gimmick. Barring one of the future anniversary seasons being Gokaiger season 2 or whatever we probably will never know what any post Gokaiger show's Greater Power is.
• Could the allies of the Patrolrangers being called 'G.S.P.D' be a sign that they're allied with the S.P.D. from Dekaranger? And if so, does this mean this season is back in the main Sentai universe?
  • It's not out of the question, but unlikely that they're allied with the S.P.D from Dekaranger - the S.P.D from Dekaranger stood for "Special Police Dekaranger". 'G.S.P.D' stands for Global Special Police Department.
  • Besides, it's actually G.S.P.O.: Global Special Police Organization.
• I know I'm just nitpicking here but, why isn't the blue ranger on the Patranger line-up? Considering how common is to associate said color with law enforcements.
  • Maybe when the powers were created for both teams, the Lupin were made first, and thus got the color? Although that wouldn't explain two reds...
    • The Lupins are billed first, so they likely got the colors that are on almost every team. As for two reds, well, the last time there was a team without a red was the Hanarangers, who were Psycho Rangers.
• Magazine scans for this season had a picture of an upcoming hero, who is looking to be a double agent. Why put in a new hero in a magazine scan when the show hasn't even started yet?
  • That's actually a toy catalog not meant to be seen by the public. Toei/Bandai send them out to retailers so they know what's coming up and thus what they're going to be selling/advertising/making room for. We just get them leaked when they come out. As a fun fact, there are usually four, the first covers the initial Rangers, and all their gear. The second is secondary gear/mecha, or the sixth in shows that debut them early. The third is usually the power up item, and movie mecha if there's one and the sixth, if he/she/they haven't been shown yet, and the last is the "big" mecha, like Orion Battler, or Cube Whale, or what have you and anything else. The scans in question are from number 2.
• Quick question. The VS Vehicles are Collection pieces too right? Because if so, then we need to have a talk about how many seem to be in police hands.
  • It's likely to be a plot point at some point.
  • Right, I thought that might be the case, I just wanted to make certain.
  • I'm more questioning why it seems Hilltop's team wasn't well-informed about the dangers that the Collection possess. They found out about the Collections' power just recently, and it seems there is still no information about what would happen if a Collection is destroyed. Knowing the immense power that Collections possess, the result might not gonna be good, yet Patrangers are destroying Ganglers without any care for the Collection the Ganglers stored inside their safe.
  • It's most likely intentional that the police are being kept in the dark. Kogure is keeping the Lupins in the dark about the collection and if he's Playing Both Sides he could have intentionally given the police their VS changers at a time when they were desperate and willing to not ask questions.
  • We do get an explanation in Episode 21. Noel created the Trigger Machines for purposes against the Gangler, but the G.S.P.O sent them to the Japan branch without his knowledge or consent.
• I was wondering, in episode 4, how come there are no CCTV installed in a crime-fighting facility as important as GSPO station? Had them installed one inside the Patranger's control room, they would quickly figure out why Tsukasa's missing, and her "little secret" would be safe. Is there any written law about that in Japan? Would anyone know about Japan or living in Japan confirm this?
  • I don't know why there's no CCTV, but her "little secret" wouldn't be safe either way since the CCTV would also record her nearly sensual attraction towards the plush doll.
• Keiichiro in Episode 5. Is his statement "This is a tool used by the Global Police used to protect the world!" a case of Hypocrisy? Is he in denial that his Trigger Machine and VS Changer are actually stolen from the Lupin Estate? Or does he simply see his use of the Changer and Machine as something like a long-term Flashed-Badge Hijack, given just how big a threat the Gangler are?
  • Given that this is in response to LupinRed, a criminal who he probably doesn't trust with the Collection's power, it's hard to say.
    • Likely a little of column A, and B. While Keiichiro is being a hypocrite, he rationalizes it by believing in the authority the Patrangers have to protect the planet. As far as he's concerned, he can't trust the Lupinrangers because he doesn't know their motives, nor their plans for the Collection. However as Kairi correctly points out, he's only slightly better then the Gangler, due to still using something that's not his.
    • So Column C then, the Flashed-Badge Hijack? I mean, I know it’s not a direct example, but it’s the best I could find - using the authority of the police to utilize another’s property to handle a severe criminal situation.
• Why the Lupinrangers aren't worried that their identities might be compromised by Goodie? He already saw them out of suits and given how whimsical he was, he might ended up telling the Patrangers.
  • Goodie seems to view the entire thing as one giant game. Doing that would leave one team unable to play. As such I think it's honestly one of the few things he won't do.
  • Episode 7 explains that Goodie has his own agenda independent to whatever Kogure is up to. He is the protector of the Lupin collection and since the Lupins are the ones stealing it back they get preferential treatment over the Patrangers.
• So in episode 11, after the Patrangers get genderbent the movie narrator comes up with new names for them to match. He notices that the name Tsukasa would work either way, but wouldn't Sakuya's name also work?
  • I wonder about that too. There's female Sakuya in Rune Factory 3, for example. Or, you know, Sakuya Izayoi.
• It could be chalked up to Rule of Cool but do the Lupinrangers literally hanging on thin air in episode 11? I'm talking when they use the wire to hang on (the sky?) so the MoTW couldn't make them slip on the ground.
  • It was probably an off-screen camera crane. They were in the middle of a shoot, after all.
• So... why was Umika wasn't affected by the dream world in #17?
  • It seems all members of Lupinranger have a high tolerance against illusion as shown by #34. That doesn't necessarily mean they can break the illusion though.
• Why in episode 37, doesn't the go home beam work on Kairi? I suspect that the hint is in episode 2 when we see him argue with his brother right before Shori was frozen. Maybe Kairi angrily left his home with Shori. He acts as if he has guilt over the way he treated his brother, and can't get comfortable enough at the bistro to find it a new home.
• Noel is an undercover agent and came specially from GSPO's Undercover Unit. He blows his cover in his debut episode. Why?
  • Difficult, but here's two reasons I came up with. 1) He wanted to prove to Kairi that he was Lupin X by doing tricks and parkour, as the Lupinrangers were skilled in it. 2) A weird, and possibly silly, excuse to introduce himself to the Patorangers.
  • I'm operating under the theory that Noel's goal is to get both teams to work together for....reasons. Going off that, his gambit here does a few things: A) Shows both teams "I know who you all are, and you can't say the same, so I'm going to help with that." B) Highlights that he's capable of using the tricks of both teams, and can do the work of three by himself, or the standard sixth practice of being overpowered at their debut. C) It gets both teams asking questions and potentially breaking the status quo.
  • Turns out he's a double agent, as he is also a servant of the Lupin Family. Its clear Noel has his own agenda that involves both the Patrangers and Lupinrangers.
• So here's a question (might be dumb but I'm asking anyways). If the Lupinrangers want the Lupin Collection, why not had Good Striker, or even Noel for that matter, tell the Patrongers about them, and give them an insight on how they're important? Hell, have one of them in their transformed state make a mention that they need them to rescue their loved ones, and even asking them to hold off blowing up the monsters until they collect a piece.
  • Would the Patrangers believe them? They have a duty as police officer and the Lupinranger are breaking the law no matter the cause and even is Keiichiro has lighten up a bit, that doesn't mean they will trust the words of a bunch of thieves. They don't fully trust Good Striker or Noel, either. So even if they did that the chances are still 50/50.
  • I think it would just only complicated matters. Suppose the police knows that the Collections are supposed to granting wish, I think they would just to confiscate it instead. They are cops, it's their duty to protect the citizens, and the collections are too dangerous to be trusted to the hand of unknown thieves with unknown motivations (from their side POV anyway).
  • Orignal poster here. Episode 32 had Noel tell Keichiro about the Lupin Collection and about regaining their loved ones. Although it was not to thorough, it's implied that the Patorangers are going to look more into it, and maybe Keichiro will give a little more respect to the Lupinrangers.
• Is it just me or does it feels like Lupinranger has way more importance to the show than the Patoranger makes me think what the point of Patoranger sometimes? I mean the Lupinrangers have a more driven goal, it feels like they are getting more promotions, more items and more upgrades sometimes (then again this particular point might change in the future) Goodie have more of their sympathy and genuine alliance, Noel seems to favor the Lupinrangers more than the Patorangers even though he is supposed to be a double agent in a way (Heck the Lupin Collection items he helped modified weren't even originally supposed to go the Patorangers, they were given to them without his permission and he is affiliated with the Lupin family) and they can be just invested in helping civilians and defeating the Gangler even if they get the Collection piece from the Gangler already. It sometimes feels like the Patorangers are there for comic relief or there just because. Protecting the innocent and public is something any random group and the Lupinranger can do without really needing to create a entire new Sentai team to do so and you don't need to create another super sentai team to give Lupinrangers rivals. Am I thinking about it too hard? Or am I jumping to conclusions too early?
  • I feel the same, especially with the reveal that Toei treated Lupinrangers as the 42nd sentai team, while Patrangers is the 43rd team, likely because they want the 2019 sentai to be the 44th and the 2020 sentai to be the 45th, matching 2020 being the 45th anniversary of Super Sentai. If this is true, this means Patrangers might have been developed literally just as a filler, and what's even worse, the reveal that 42nd sentai team was initially flight-themed (see Trivia section), means Patrangers might have been hastily created way later into development.
    • Note that by Zenkaiger this is no longer the case. Both Lupin and Pats are both considered to be team 42 despite being separate teams despite with Ryusoulger as 43 Kiramei as 44 and Zenkaiger as 45 (with 45 straight up being on Zenkaiser's helmet). They both have a separate Sentai Gear that has 42 on it. This is also means Gokaiger wise that Lupin/Patren X is considered two different powers and has a Ranger Key for each.
  • By episode 34 it is clear that Lupinranger is the one having the focus given by how many upgrades they had.
  • Originally it should be balanced. Though, Its clearly one sided because toy sales are what Super Sentai and Kamen Rider exist for. Hence, when the sales dropped, the story goes wrong all the way. Just like Kamen Rider Hibiki. The story is good but the contract with Bandai suggest, I don't care. Make the toys sales profittable.
• In Episode 28, isn't Noel's action rather risky? He basically admitted to supporting the thieves, even being proud at what he has created. Sure, toy leaks reveal he has an upgrade for the Patrangers as well, but....then the same toy catalogue also reveal he's going to "hijack" that, in his Lupin X persona too. is he going to become a full-time thief instead of a double agent?
• In Episode 32, although the power is not revealed just yet, Gauche's Gueris le Monde Lupin Collection seems to have an unseen power that scare Noel AND Kogure enough to imply that it's gonna be a nightmare to deal with. Kogure even stopped putting the Collections into his book and just take the remaining ones with his hand, and hurriedly leave. What kind of power it has that makes even the usually calm Kogure that worried?
  • Maybe it's the most powerful pieces of the Lupin Collection, and if the Gangler has it in their possession, then they have to be prepared for anything.
  • But then that creates another question, why it is in Gauche's possession, and not Dogranio's?
    • Probably because she is good at persuasion by flirting. I mean, she is the the spoiled type. Just anything she asked he gave it or ordered someone to fulfill it. But he took it back when she was too reliant on her collections, even getting an experiment with collections to help her in episode 48.
  • The main page says that it can read personalities. Maybe they're afraid that their true motive will be revealed.
  • well with the revelation that Noel isn't human and is working with the Gangler's, it was something neither he nor Kogure wanted the Lupinrangers to find out.
  • That's not a revelation, that's what the preview wanted you to think. Previews are not exactly a credible source of information, they often splice up scenes and dialogues in order to gather attention.
  • Exactly, while there IS a revelation about Noel, it's not as simple as "he's a spy"
  • Actually, what Noel and Kogure never told Kairi, Touma and Umika was that the two were not humans in bloodline. Well, that's official.
  • However, Gueris le Monde, as shown in episode 8 and based on Gauche's claim, it allows her to analyse everything whom she scans. It is not a matter of someone else knowing the victims' origin, it's a matter that she is able to know what to do to defeat them, plus knowing their weaknesses and fears, all sort of that.
• We know Dogranio had an unbounded space dimension inside his safe by episode 49. Now the question is, why do the protagonists have to break his chains? To begin with, what does those chains do on the safe? Possible answers yet not confirmed in the show even after it ends.
  • Serve as a magical lock that nullfies hacking by dial fighters or increases the number of lock digits to impossible.
  • A security which will be activated when somebody tried to open the safe and caused the chain to bind or kill the intruder.
  • Simple enough it renders someone from successfully opening his safe because even real chains are sturdy to move and if it wraps around the cover, no one can open it successfully as the chains got in the way. That is why the Lupinrangers and Noel were desperate to cut the chains first. A simple common sense it is for the main purpose of safelocking belongings.
• What would Dogranio gain by retiring if he is 999 years old and could possibly still be around for 999 more? Where exactly would he even retire to?
  • He's the eldest of the Ganglar and had pretty much committed all kinds of crimes. He is literally rich too that he does not know what to do with them anymore, he had all he want at that time. In addition, it is said in the first episode he had grown bored with it and decide that someone else should lead the Ganglar with the condition to be cleared was to dominate the human world. The one who succeeds gets everything Dogranio can offer to him/her. What happened afterwards if such scenario happens is what he will think and do later. Granted while the candidates competed and failed multiple times, he can think during that time. But even in episode 48, you can tell that from the first episode, his true aim is that he wants some excitement that entertain him and which even possible urges him to go in and play/interfere as well, as suggested with him taking away Goche's Collection pieces.