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Renamed trope
* QuestionableCasting:
** The casting of Aidan Gillen as Littlefinger is divisive, because it's a complete departure from how he is in the books. There Littlefinger is genuinely convincing and charming, and people trust him because he's so good at putting on a nice facade. In the show he's so obviously evil that many fans wonder why Ned, Catelyn, Sansa etc trusted him at all. George RR Martin has said that this particular character is a different entity to how he is in the books.
** Kit Harington received some criticism early on in the show for seeming too wooden to play Jon Snow. Most agree that he grew into the role over time, although he does still have a few detractors.
** Emilia Clarke got similar criticism for being too old for her role (forgetting that Daenerys is given an AgeLift to avoid uncomfortable scenes involving a teenage actress) and for the {{Narm}} in her many {{Rousing Speech}}es. Like Harington, this has mostly levelled off over time.
** Although it was just a cameo, Ed Sheeran appearing on the show got such an avalanche of criticism that he deleted his Twitter account over it. Most fans claim that he was so well-known it took them out of the show.
** The casting of Aidan Gillen as Littlefinger is divisive, because it's a complete departure from how he is in the books. There Littlefinger is genuinely convincing and charming, and people trust him because he's so good at putting on a nice facade. In the show he's so obviously evil that many fans wonder why Ned, Catelyn, Sansa etc trusted him at all. George RR Martin has said that this particular character is a different entity to how he is in the books.
** Kit Harington received some criticism early on in the show for seeming too wooden to play Jon Snow. Most agree that he grew into the role over time, although he does still have a few detractors.
** Emilia Clarke got similar criticism for being too old for her role (forgetting that Daenerys is given an AgeLift to avoid uncomfortable scenes involving a teenage actress) and for the {{Narm}} in her many {{Rousing Speech}}es. Like Harington, this has mostly levelled off over time.
** Although it was just a cameo, Ed Sheeran appearing on the show got such an avalanche of criticism that he deleted his Twitter account over it. Most fans claim that he was so well-known it took them out of the show.
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* WTHCastingAgency:
** The casting of Aidan Gillen as Littlefinger is divisive, because it's a complete departure from how he is in the books. There Littlefinger is genuinely convincing and charming, and people trust him because he's so good at putting on a nice facade. In the show he's so obviously evil that many fans wonder why Ned, Catelyn, Sansa etc trusted him at all. George RR Martin has said that this particular character is a different entity to how he is in the books.
** Kit Harington received some criticism early on in the show for seeming too wooden to play Jon Snow. Most agree that he grew into the role over time, although he does still have a few detractors.
** Emilia Clarke got similar criticism for being too old for her role (forgetting that Daenerys is given an AgeLift to avoid uncomfortable scenes involving a teenage actress) and for the {{Narm}} in her many {{Rousing Speech}}es. Like Harington, this has mostly levelled off over time.
** Although it was just a cameo, Ed Sheeran appearing on the show got such an avalanche of criticism that he deleted his Twitter account over it. Most fans claim that he was so well-known it took them out of the show.
** The casting of Aidan Gillen as Littlefinger is divisive, because it's a complete departure from how he is in the books. There Littlefinger is genuinely convincing and charming, and people trust him because he's so good at putting on a nice facade. In the show he's so obviously evil that many fans wonder why Ned, Catelyn, Sansa etc trusted him at all. George RR Martin has said that this particular character is a different entity to how he is in the books.
** Kit Harington received some criticism early on in the show for seeming too wooden to play Jon Snow. Most agree that he grew into the role over time, although he does still have a few detractors.
** Emilia Clarke got similar criticism for being too old for her role (forgetting that Daenerys is given an AgeLift to avoid uncomfortable scenes involving a teenage actress) and for the {{Narm}} in her many {{Rousing Speech}}es. Like Harington, this has mostly levelled off over time.
** Although it was just a cameo, Ed Sheeran appearing on the show got such an avalanche of criticism that he deleted his Twitter account over it. Most fans claim that he was so well-known it took them out of the show.
to:
** The casting of Aidan Gillen as Littlefinger is divisive, because it's a complete departure from how he is in the books. There Littlefinger is genuinely convincing and charming, and people trust him because he's so good at putting on a nice facade. In the show he's so obviously evil that many fans wonder why Ned, Catelyn, Sansa etc trusted him at all. George RR Martin has said that this particular character is a different entity to how he is in the books.
** Kit Harington received some criticism early on in the show for seeming too wooden to play Jon Snow. Most agree that he grew into the role over time, although he does still have a few detractors.
** Emilia Clarke got similar criticism for being too old for her role (forgetting that Daenerys is given an AgeLift to avoid uncomfortable scenes involving a teenage actress) and for the {{Narm}} in her many {{Rousing Speech}}es. Like Harington, this has mostly levelled off over time.
** Although it was just a cameo, Ed Sheeran appearing on the show got such an avalanche of criticism that he deleted his Twitter account over it. Most fans claim that he was so well-known it took them out of the show.
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** Ellaria's choice of hairstyle in Season 5. While it was probably to show [[GoodHairEvilHair that she wanted revenge now]], the style looks more likes something a modern businesswoman would sport than someone in a medieval fantasy setting. Compare to Brienne's more appropriate BoyishShortHair.
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** Ellaria's choice of hairstyle in Season 5. While it was probably to show [[GoodHairEvilHair that she wanted revenge now]], the style looks more likes like something a modern businesswoman would sport than someone in a medieval fantasy setting. Compare to Brienne's more appropriate BoyishShortHair.
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Disambiguation
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** Same goes for Ramsay/Reek, which has a few HoYay moments but is a TortureTechnician and StockholmSyndrome type of thing.
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** Same goes for Ramsay/Reek, which has a few HoYay moments but is a TortureTechnician and StockholmSyndrome AMatchMadeInStockholm type of thing.
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Disambiguation
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** Khal Drogo is a bloodthirsty rapist and a slaver, but due to him being a badass and having some sweet moments with Daenerys ([[StockholmSyndrome who he also raped]]) he has legions of fans who would have liked nothing more than see him wage war on Westeros and sit on the Iron Throne. [[MisaimedFandom Even on this very site]] his speech about raping Westeros's women and enslaving its children is on the SugarWiki/MomentOfAwesome page.
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** Khal Drogo is a bloodthirsty rapist and a slaver, but due to him being a badass and having some sweet moments with Daenerys ([[StockholmSyndrome who ([[AMatchMadeInStockholm whom he also raped]]) he has legions of fans who would have liked nothing more than see him wage war on Westeros and sit on the Iron Throne. [[MisaimedFandom Even on this very site]] his speech about raping Westeros's women and enslaving its children is on the SugarWiki/MomentOfAwesome page.
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** Although the show presents Edmure Tully as an idiot whose incompetence played a role in making Robb lose the war, fans felt like the constant [[NoRespectGuy disrespect given to him is being taken too far]]. While Robb chews him out for unintentionally preventing the Mountain from falling into his trap by holding the Stone Mill, he's partly to blame for failing to communicate his orders to Edmure clearly, something that Edmure himself points out only to be browbeaten by Robb and the Blackfish. Robb also admonishes Edmure for losing 200 men in said engagement (despite Edmure inflicting heavier losses on the Lannisters) when they do not have enough men to spare like Tywin, yet Robb himself sacrificed ten times that number at the Battle on the Green Fork. Another instance is when Edmure gets pressured by Robb, Catelyn, and the Black Fish into marrying Walder Frey's daughter, with the three of them chastising Edmure for his reluctance to accept the marriage proposal. Yet this is coming from Robb, who broke his promise to the Freys by marrying Talisa in the first place, and the Blackfish, who famously had a falling out with the late Hoster for refusing to marry. In short, Edmure is getting the lion's share of the blame for blunders that others are just as responsible for.
to:
** Although the show presents Edmure Tully as an idiot whose incompetence played a role in making Robb lose the war, fans felt like the constant [[NoRespectGuy disrespect given to him is being taken too far]]. While Robb chews him out for unintentionally preventing the Mountain from falling into his trap by holding the Stone Mill, he's partly to blame for failing to communicate his orders to Edmure clearly, something that Edmure himself points out only to be browbeaten by Robb and the Blackfish. Robb also admonishes Edmure for losing 200 men in said engagement (despite Edmure inflicting heavier losses on the Lannisters) when they do not have enough men to spare like Tywin, yet Robb himself sacrificed ten times that number at the Battle on the Green Fork. Fork which makes him come off as hypocritical. Another instance is when Edmure gets pressured by Robb, Catelyn, and the Black Fish Blackfish into marrying Walder Frey's daughter, with the three of them chastising Edmure as selfish for his reluctance being reluctant to accept the marriage proposal. Yet this is coming from Robb, who broke his promise to the Freys by marrying Talisa in the first place, and the Blackfish, who famously had a falling out with the late Hoster his brother and Lord for refusing to marry. In short, Edmure is getting the lion's share of the blame for blunders that others are just as responsible for.being blamed by people who have no moral ground to stand on.
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Changed line(s) 614 (click to see context) from:
** Although the show presents Edmure Tully as an idiot whose incompetence cost Robb the war, fans felt like the constant [[NoRespectGuy disrespect given to him is being taken too far]]. While Robb chews him out for unintentionally preventing the Mountain from falling into his trap by holding the Stone Mill, he's partly to blame for failing to communicate his orders to Edmure clearly, something that Edmure himself points out only to be browbeaten by Robb and the Blackfish. Robb also admonishes Edmure for losing 200 men in said engagement (despite Edmure inflicting heavier losses on the Lannisters) when they do not have enough men to spare like Tywin, yet Robb himself sacrificed ten times that number at the Battle on the Green Fork. Another instance is when Edmure gets pressured by Robb, Catelyn, and the Black Fish into marrying Walder Frey's daughter, with the three of them chastising Edmure for his reluctance to accept the marriage proposal. Yet this is coming from Robb, who broke his promise to the Freys by marrying Talisa in the first place, and the Blackfish, who famously had a falling out with the late Hoster for refusing to marry. In short, Edmure is getting the lion's share of the blame for blunders that others are just as responsible for.
to:
** Although the show presents Edmure Tully as an idiot whose incompetence cost played a role in making Robb lose the war, fans felt like the constant [[NoRespectGuy disrespect given to him is being taken too far]]. While Robb chews him out for unintentionally preventing the Mountain from falling into his trap by holding the Stone Mill, he's partly to blame for failing to communicate his orders to Edmure clearly, something that Edmure himself points out only to be browbeaten by Robb and the Blackfish. Robb also admonishes Edmure for losing 200 men in said engagement (despite Edmure inflicting heavier losses on the Lannisters) when they do not have enough men to spare like Tywin, yet Robb himself sacrificed ten times that number at the Battle on the Green Fork. Another instance is when Edmure gets pressured by Robb, Catelyn, and the Black Fish into marrying Walder Frey's daughter, with the three of them chastising Edmure for his reluctance to accept the marriage proposal. Yet this is coming from Robb, who broke his promise to the Freys by marrying Talisa in the first place, and the Blackfish, who famously had a falling out with the late Hoster for refusing to marry. In short, Edmure is getting the lion's share of the blame for blunders that others are just as responsible for.
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Added DiffLines:
** Although the show presents Edmure Tully as an idiot whose incompetence cost Robb the war, fans felt like the constant [[NoRespectGuy disrespect given to him is being taken too far]]. While Robb chews him out for unintentionally preventing the Mountain from falling into his trap by holding the Stone Mill, he's partly to blame for failing to communicate his orders to Edmure clearly, something that Edmure himself points out only to be browbeaten by Robb and the Blackfish. Robb also admonishes Edmure for losing 200 men in said engagement (despite Edmure inflicting heavier losses on the Lannisters) when they do not have enough men to spare like Tywin, yet Robb himself sacrificed ten times that number at the Battle on the Green Fork. Another instance is when Edmure gets pressured by Robb, Catelyn, and the Black Fish into marrying Walder Frey's daughter, with the three of them chastising Edmure for his reluctance to accept the marriage proposal. Yet this is coming from Robb, who broke his promise to the Freys by marrying Talisa in the first place, and the Blackfish, who famously had a falling out with the late Hoster for refusing to marry. In short, Edmure is getting the lion's share of the blame for blunders that others are just as responsible for.
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Changed line(s) 172 (click to see context) from:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. This prompted some to re-evaluate their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views are the subject of controversy themselves, particularly with regard to some of the showrunners' earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic character]] in the series; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as the series' book author [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this is was not the intention of the show]].
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* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. This prompted some to re-evaluate their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views are the subject of controversy themselves, particularly with regard to some of the showrunners' earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic character]] in the series; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as the series' book author [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this is was not the intention of the show]].
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Changed line(s) 172 (click to see context) from:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. This prompted some to re-evaluate their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
to:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. This prompted some to re-evaluate their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, controversy themselves, particularly with regard to some of D&D's the showrunners' earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] character]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; series; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as the series' book author [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this is was not the intention the of the show]].
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Changed line(s) 543 (click to see context) from:
** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the plastic water bottle left behind the leg of a chair in another. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then then, the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where when a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the a plastic water bottle was left behind the leg of a chair in another. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** While Ser Barristan's actor Ian [=McElhinney=] also had some fame with ''Series/TheTudors'' and ''Series/TheFall'', he'd reach new levels as part of the main cast of ''Series/DerryGirls''.
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** While Ser Barristan's actor Ian [=McElhinney=] also had some fame with ''Series/TheTudors'' and ''Series/TheFall'', ''Series/TheFall2013'', he'd reach new levels as part of the main cast of ''Series/DerryGirls''.
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Changed line(s) 144 (click to see context) from:
** Cersei being the last human villain to be defeated even after the Night King divides fans. Some fans believe that this makes perfect sense, because the war for the throne and the human characters are more important than the one-dimensional White Walkers. In addition, Lena Headey being a great actress also helps. However, quite a few believe that Cersei overstayed her welcome. She has been seen by many fans over the last two seasons as a CreatorsPet for the showrunners. Plus her [[RocksFallEveryoneDies downfall]] was considered unsatisfying by many, including Lena Headey herself. There’s also the fact that Cersei was barely even in the final season, with many finding it highly questionable why someone who had practically nothing to do that year should be built up as the show’s final obstacle.
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** Cersei being the last human villain to be defeated even after the Night King divides fans. Some fans believe that this makes perfect sense, because the war for the throne and the human characters are more important than the one-dimensional White Walkers. In addition, Walkers, and Lena Headey being a great actress also helps. However, quite a few believe that Cersei overstayed her welcome. She welcome as she has been seen by many fans over the last two seasons as a CreatorsPet for the showrunners. Plus showrunners; plus her [[RocksFallEveryoneDies downfall]] was considered unsatisfying by many, including Lena Headey herself. There’s also the fact that Cersei was barely even in the final season, with many finding it highly questionable why someone who had practically nothing to do that year should be built up as the show’s final obstacle.
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Changed line(s) 172 (click to see context) from:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
to:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in This prompted some re-evaluating to re-evaluate their view of Daenerys, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white savior, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
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Changed line(s) 172 (click to see context) from:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, claiming she did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only wanted leadership for herself, and she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier statements calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white saviour, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
to:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, claiming she criticizing her as a "white savior" character who did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, claiming Dany only wanted leadership for herself, and that she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier statements comments calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white saviour, savior, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
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Changed line(s) 172 (click to see context) from:
* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, claiming she did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only wanted leadership for herself, and she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier statements calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, citing she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white saviour, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
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* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. However, this resulted in some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, claiming she did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only wanted leadership for herself, and she freed slaves on a personal whim. These views too are the subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier statements calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, citing explaining she is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white saviour, adding this was not the intention the of the show]].
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I haven't experienced Daenerys's popularity really decreasing in the fandom, but rather, her Face Heel Turn seems to be tied to the crash & burn of the show's success. Even the "Dark Dany" views pushed by some on the internet as "having always been there" instead of a retcon are likewise subject to controversy.
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* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. Around this same time (and even before then), many people re-evaluated her role in earlier seasons, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who didn't really do much to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only claiming their leadership for herself and freeing slaves on a personal whim. Years after the original series' ending, while she isn't universally hated, Dany's reputation has taken quite the fall from the beloved heroine that she used to be.
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* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. Around However, this same time (and even before then), many people re-evaluated her role resulted in earlier seasons, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who didn't really do much some re-evaluating their view of Daenerys, claiming she did little to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only claiming their wanted leadership for herself herself, and freeing she freed slaves on a personal whim. Years after These views too are the original series' ending, while subject of controversy, particularly with regard to some of D&D's earlier statements calling Daenerys [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yseeWMfaHlQ the most empathetic characters]] in the series, citing she isn't universally hated, Dany's reputation has taken quite is driven by a "deep empathy"; stating Dany [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k0YsrTBEYM is unlike her father and one of "the good Targaryens"]]; as well as [[https://youtu.be/5X_0PSvGhvc?t=79 George R. R. Martin refuting Daenerys as a white saviour, adding this was not the fall from intention the beloved heroine that she used to be.of the show]].
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* CharacterPerceptionEvolution: During the early seasons of the show, Daenerys Targaryen was viewed as a powerful, badass feminist icon, as a highly capable young woman on a quest to liberate people across the world and claim the Iron Throne for the greater good. However, her [[FaceHeelTurn sudden turn to villainy]] in Season 8 caught many people off guard, and was heavily criticized along with many other aspects of the season. Around this same time (and even before then), many people re-evaluated her role in earlier seasons, criticizing her as a "white savior" character who didn't really do much to upend the corrupt systems in Westeros and Essos, only claiming their leadership for herself and freeing slaves on a personal whim. Years after the original series' ending, while she isn't universally hated, Dany's reputation has taken quite the fall from the beloved heroine that she used to be.
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* JerksAreWorseThanVillains:
** Joffrey Baratheon is easily the most hated character even when compared to the likes of his grandfather Tywin Lannister, Ramsay Bolton, or [[GreaterScopeVillain the Night King himself]]. Though he and Ramsay are incredibly cruel and sadistic, Ramsay has his fans for being entertaining, clever, and charismatic in an EvilIsCool way, while Joffrey is a dumb and bratty DirtyCoward. Tywin, on the other hand, is a pragmatist that will only engage in any kind of acts of cruelty when it's in his best interests to do so and otherwise strives to maintain friendly relationships with the other allied Houses. And the Night King is more of a force of nature than anything else.
** Catelyn Stark is often hated by fans for being mean to Jon, her husband's (supposedly) bastard son. While she doesn't treat him like a son and is quite cold to him, she ''does'' [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone feel very bad about it]], most of her children grow up with a close relationship with Jon, and Catelyn is also a loving mother to all her other children. Compare her to Tywin, a much more antagonistic ArchnemesisDad who also hates his son Tyrion for an unfair reason (being a dwarf and MaternalDeathBlameTheChild), treats Tyrion much worse than Catelyn treats Jon, feels no remorse over it at all, and is a terrible father to his other children as well. Unlike Catelyn, Tywin is a fan favorite.
** Joffrey Baratheon is easily the most hated character even when compared to the likes of his grandfather Tywin Lannister, Ramsay Bolton, or [[GreaterScopeVillain the Night King himself]]. Though he and Ramsay are incredibly cruel and sadistic, Ramsay has his fans for being entertaining, clever, and charismatic in an EvilIsCool way, while Joffrey is a dumb and bratty DirtyCoward. Tywin, on the other hand, is a pragmatist that will only engage in any kind of acts of cruelty when it's in his best interests to do so and otherwise strives to maintain friendly relationships with the other allied Houses. And the Night King is more of a force of nature than anything else.
** Catelyn Stark is often hated by fans for being mean to Jon, her husband's (supposedly) bastard son. While she doesn't treat him like a son and is quite cold to him, she ''does'' [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone feel very bad about it]], most of her children grow up with a close relationship with Jon, and Catelyn is also a loving mother to all her other children. Compare her to Tywin, a much more antagonistic ArchnemesisDad who also hates his son Tyrion for an unfair reason (being a dwarf and MaternalDeathBlameTheChild), treats Tyrion much worse than Catelyn treats Jon, feels no remorse over it at all, and is a terrible father to his other children as well. Unlike Catelyn, Tywin is a fan favorite.
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* JerksAreWorseThanVillains:
** Joffrey Baratheon is easily the most hated character even when compared to the likes of his grandfather Tywin Lannister, Ramsay Bolton, or [[GreaterScopeVillain the Night King himself]]. Though he and Ramsay are incredibly cruel and sadistic, Ramsay has his fans for being entertaining, clever, and charismatic in an EvilIsCool way, while Joffrey is a dumb and bratty DirtyCoward. Tywin, on the other hand, is a pragmatist that will only engage in any kind of acts of cruelty when it's in his best interests to do so and otherwise strives to maintain friendly relationships with the other allied Houses. And the Night King is more of a force of nature than anything else.
**JerksAreWorseThanVillains: Catelyn Stark is often hated by fans for being mean to Jon, her husband's (supposedly) bastard son. While she doesn't treat him like a son and is quite cold to him, she ''does'' [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone feel very bad about it]], most of her children grow up with a close relationship with Jon, and Catelyn is also a loving mother to all her other children. Compare her to Tywin, a much more antagonistic ArchnemesisDad who also hates his son Tyrion for an unfair reason (being a dwarf and MaternalDeathBlameTheChild), treats Tyrion much worse than Catelyn treats Jon, feels no remorse over it at all, and is a terrible father to his other children as well. Unlike Catelyn, Tywin is a fan favorite.
** Joffrey Baratheon is easily the most hated character even when compared to the likes of his grandfather Tywin Lannister, Ramsay Bolton, or [[GreaterScopeVillain the Night King himself]]. Though he and Ramsay are incredibly cruel and sadistic, Ramsay has his fans for being entertaining, clever, and charismatic in an EvilIsCool way, while Joffrey is a dumb and bratty DirtyCoward. Tywin, on the other hand, is a pragmatist that will only engage in any kind of acts of cruelty when it's in his best interests to do so and otherwise strives to maintain friendly relationships with the other allied Houses. And the Night King is more of a force of nature than anything else.
**
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** "[[Recap/GameOfThronesS6E10TheWindsOfWinter The Winds of Winter]]" gives us a similar example with [[spoiler:Arya feeding Walder Frey [[FamilialCannibalismSurprise the remains of two of his children in a pie]], then [[DramaticUnmask revealing who she really is]], slitting his throat in the [[IronicEcho exact same way her mother's throat was slit]], and making him bleed out as painfully as possible. For anyone else still alive on the show with the exception of Cersei this would have been a case of KickTheSonOfABitch, but ''it's [[AssholeVictim Walder Frey]]'', making it a clear case of KarmicDeath]].
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** "[[Recap/GameOfThronesS6E10TheWindsOfWinter The Winds of Winter]]" gives us a similar example with [[spoiler:Arya feeding Walder Frey [[FamilialCannibalismSurprise the remains of two of his children in a pie]], then [[DramaticUnmask revealing who she really is]], slitting his throat in the [[IronicEcho exact same way her mother's throat was slit]], and making him bleed out as painfully as possible. For anyone else still alive on the show with the exception of Cersei this would have been a case of KickTheSonOfABitch, KickTheDog, but ''it's [[AssholeVictim Walder Frey]]'', making it a clear case of KarmicDeath]].
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removing a chained sinkhole
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** There is an overlap between fans of Game of Thrones and [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyXII the]] [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyTactics works]] [[VideoGame/TacticsOgre of]] Creator/YasumiMatsuno. It does help that Matsuno is also a fan himself.
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** There is an overlap between fans of Game of Thrones and [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyXII the]] [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyTactics works]] [[VideoGame/TacticsOgre of]] the works of Creator/YasumiMatsuno. It does help that Matsuno is also a fan himself.
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She’s already noted to be the actress just above.
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** Cersei being the last human villain to be defeated even after the Night King divides fans. Some fans believe that this makes perfect sense, because the war for the throne and the human characters are more important than the one-dimensional White Walkers. In addition, Lena Headey being a great actress also helps. However, quite a few believe that Cersei overstayed her welcome. She has been seen by many fans over the last two seasons as a CreatorsPet for the showrunners. Plus her [[RocksFallEveryoneDies downfall]] was considered unsatisfying by many, including the actress Lena Headey herself. There’s also the fact that Cersei was barely even in the final season, with many finding it highly questionable why someone who had practically nothing to do that year should be built up as the show’s final obstacle.
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** Cersei being the last human villain to be defeated even after the Night King divides fans. Some fans believe that this makes perfect sense, because the war for the throne and the human characters are more important than the one-dimensional White Walkers. In addition, Lena Headey being a great actress also helps. However, quite a few believe that Cersei overstayed her welcome. She has been seen by many fans over the last two seasons as a CreatorsPet for the showrunners. Plus her [[RocksFallEveryoneDies downfall]] was considered unsatisfying by many, including the actress Lena Headey herself. There’s also the fact that Cersei was barely even in the final season, with many finding it highly questionable why someone who had practically nothing to do that year should be built up as the show’s final obstacle.
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** Dany's story arc is probably the biggest point of contention within the fandom, but fans seem to be unable to reach consensus on ''why''. A significant number of Daenerys fans just don't like her arc of FallenHero at all, regardless of the show's (or George R.R. Martin's) intentions, with many of these fans feeling betrayed for having followed the character's journey for eight years only to end in such an inglorious and cruel way or have her revealed as EvilAllAlong. Another group of fans see Dany's downfall as fitting, but not fully earned, because it happened in a very rushed way, feeling a previously merciful and compassionate ruler had suddenly turned into a ruthless villain over the course of five episodes. Another group is very much on board that Dany was EvilAllAlong and a ruthless tyrant, but that her actions in ''The Bells'' were borderline cartoonishly evil. Then there's fans who believe that her arc was decently executed (often arguing Dany had been a tyrannical ruler for ''years'' before the final season and that she [[https://www.redcross.org.au/news-and-media/news/game-of-thrones rivaled Ramsay as the worst War Criminals in all of Westeros before the final season began]]) and makes perfect sense with the themes of the books and the TV series. Finally, some also see Dany as a victim of bad MoralLuck.
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** Dany's story arc is probably the biggest point of contention within the fandom, but fans seem to be unable to reach consensus on ''why''. A significant number of Daenerys fans just don't like her arc of FallenHero at all, regardless of the show's (or George R.R. Martin's) intentions, with many of these fans feeling betrayed for having followed the character's journey for eight years only to end in such an inglorious and cruel way or have her revealed as EvilAllAlong. Another group of fans see Dany's downfall as fitting, but not fully earned, because it happened in a very rushed way, feeling a previously merciful and compassionate ruler had suddenly turned into a ruthless villain over the course of five episodes. Another group is very much on board that Dany was EvilAllAlong and a ruthless tyrant, but that her actions in ''The Bells'' "The Bells" were borderline cartoonishly evil. Then there's fans who believe that her arc was decently executed (often arguing Dany had been a tyrannical ruler for ''years'' before the final season and that she [[https://www.redcross.org.au/news-and-media/news/game-of-thrones rivaled Ramsay as the worst War Criminals in all of Westeros before the final season began]]) and makes perfect sense with the themes of the books and the TV series. Finally, some also see Dany as a victim of bad MoralLuck.
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** In the years since the final season aired, a major split has occurred among its detractors regarding the first four(or in some cases, six or even seven) seasons. Some who'd enjoyed the show for most of its runtime believe that the ending is so bad that they can no longer enjoy the rest of the seasons knowing that everything that is set up will have such a terrible payoff (e.g. the Night King being built up for seven seasons and defeated in a single episode). Others, however, have more appreciation than ever for the early seasons, and invoke FanonDiscontinuity on the parts of the show they dislike.
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** In the years since the final season aired, a major split has occurred among its detractors regarding the first four(or four (or in some cases, six or even seven) seasons. Some who'd enjoyed the show for most of its runtime believe that the ending is so bad that they can no longer enjoy the rest of the seasons knowing that everything that is set up will have such a terrible payoff (e.g. the Night King being built up for seven seasons and defeated in a single episode). Others, however, have more appreciation than ever for the early seasons, and invoke FanonDiscontinuity on the parts of the show they dislike.
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** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the plastic water bottle left behind a chair in another. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the plastic water bottle left behind the leg of a chair in another. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the bottle left behind a chair. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** Season 8 was widely considered one of the worst of the show, if not ''the'' worst, and a demoralizing conclusion to something so beloved at the start of its run. Fans and critics attacked nearly every aspect of the show: plot holes, pointless twists, idiotic battle strategies, unsatisfying conclusions, and irrational decisions all around. Only the costumes, sets, music and special effects maintained their quality, and the only people who had a good word to say about the final season were those primarily there for the spectacle rather than the plot or characters. Even then the quality of filming seemed to suffer, such as the infamous incident where a modern coffee cup was left on a table during one of the scenes, and the plastic water bottle left behind a chair.chair in another. And while the early seasons' twists and betrayals made sense, the showrunners themselves admitted that for later seasons they chose to write merely what was shocking or unexpected, regardless of whether it made sense. On Rotten Tomatoes, [[https://editorial.rottentomatoes.com/guide/every-episode-of-game-of-thrones-ranked/ four of the five lowest-rated episodes]] are from Season 8, while on Website/{{IMDb}}, [[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0944947/episodes/?ref_=tt_ov_epl the six lowest-rated episodes are the six episodes of Season 8]]. The final season as a whole currently hovers at 55% on Rotten Tomatoes based on twenty reviews, making it the lowest-rated season as a whole (this is particularly notable since all the previous seasons [[https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/game_of_thrones had aggregate scores in the 90s]]).
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** In the Japanese dub, this was for many of the voice actors in the cast, mainly fo Creator/{{Lynn}}, Creator/NobunagaShimazaki, Creator/YasuhiroMamiya, Creator/YukiyoFujii and many others who would end major roles in both Japanese media and foreign dubs.
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** In the Japanese dub, this was for many of the voice actors in the cast, mainly fo Creator/{{Lynn}}, Creator/NobunagaShimazaki, Creator/YasuhiroMamiya, Creator/YukiyoFujii and many others who would end doing major roles in both Japanese media and foreign dubs.
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** In the Japanese dub, this was for many of the voice actors in the cast, mainly fo Creator/{{Lynn}}, Creator/NobunagaShimazaki, Creator/YasuhiroMamiya, Creator/YukiyoFujii and many others who would end major roles in both Japanese media and foreign dubs.
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** Many fans have noted that the beginning of the SeasonalRot which the show inevitably became quite infamous for, began when GRRM stepped down from the show, and the writers fielded their ideas and storylines, such as the Dorne storyline, Winterfell plot during Season 5 becoming some of the series' lowest points (pre-Season 8).
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** Many fans have noted that the beginning of the SeasonalRot which the show inevitably became quite infamous for, began when GRRM stepped down from the show, and the writers fielded their ideas and storylines, such as the Dorne storyline, and the Winterfell plot during Season 5 becoming some of the series' lowest points (pre-Season 8).
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-->"My Littlefinger would never have turned Sansa over to Ramsay. Never. He's obsessed with her. Half the time he thinks she's the daughter he never had -- that he wishes he'd had, [[PiningAfterProtagonistsParent if he'd married Catelyn]]. And half the time he thinks [[ReplacementGoldfish she is Catelyn]], and he wants her [[LoveFatherLoveSon for himself]]. He's not going to give her to someone who would do bad things to her. That's going to be very different in the books."
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Page has since been cut.
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* SignatureScene: Now [[SignatureScene/GameOfThrones has a page]]. There are a lot of them, one can make multiple entries for episodes, but proverbially:
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* SignatureScene: Now [[SignatureScene/GameOfThrones has a page]]. There are a lot many of them, one can them. One could make multiple entries for episodes, but proverbially:
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About fanon exaggeration. Must explain how an unfair exaggeration.
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** Of all Tyrion's increasingly idiotic decisions made throughout the final season, his betrayal of Varys, his best friend and the man who saved his life and gave him new purpose, is by far the one haunts his reputation the most. It doesn't help that he goes on commit treason against Daenerys, the very thing Varys is executed for, by freeing Jaime in the very next scene. Nor does it help that Varys only knew the information about Jon in the first place because Tyrion told him.
