History YMMV / FinalFantasyVIIRemake

** This has also led to debates, mainly in the western fandom, surrounding [[spoiler:Aerith's ultimate fate and whether her surviving would mean the potential for an interesting story or if it would cheapen the themes of the original game. Detractors argue that Aerith's death--even being as well-known as it is--is too integral to the plot and themes of [=FFVII=] and that preventing it would retroactively invalidate the original game's message about the permanence of death--[[https://kotaku.com/is-squall-really-dead-final-fantasy-producer-addresses-1800007113 as stated by Yoshinori Kitase]]. At most, they concede that players should only be given the opportunity to ''delay'' when her death happens, but not prevent it altogether (even those who are on board with the StealthSequel theory, a more optimistic narrative or other deaths being prevented)]]. On the other hand, supporters of Aerith surviving argue that her death has become [[ItWasHisSled so well-known]] that it no longer has the same impact and that similar themes can be reinforced if someone else(usually theorized as alternate timeline [[HopeSpot Zack]], [[DieForOurShip Tifa]] or even [[TheHeroDies Cloud]]) dies or vanishes in her place. Alternatively, they argue that, assuming the ''Remake'' trilogy is a StealthSequel, Aerith deserves a chance at a happy ending with either Cloud or an alternate timeline spared Zack after having to die in a previous timeline, and that the greater emphasis placed on "fate" and "destiny" in the Remake could potentially push the story into TooBleakStoppedCaring territory if she dies in the same manner no matter what. They also point out that the other narrative purpose behind her death was always to show how sudden, unexpected and unnecessary it was--just like how death often can be in real life--as described by [[WordOfGod Hironobu Sakaguchi]], and that, assuming there's an AlternateTimeline or AlternateUniverse in play, the permanence of death does not necessitate forcing characters to stick to the same predestined fate across all realities.

** Whether ''Remake'' in general loses a lot of the interesting subtlety, pacing and tone-building in the original, like [[spoiler:the characters getting several glimpses of future events from the original (i.e., Aerith's death, Meteor falling, the battle with Sephiroth at the Northen Crater), Hojo nearly revealing to Cloud that he wasn't in SOLDIER or Sephiroth appearing much earlier than in the original game and openly stating a lot of his intentions]]. Supporters say that most of the original game's twists and plot points are well-known, and that these changes allow for deeper characterization, and if ''Remake'' and its' sequels are meant to be a StealthSequel to the original game and the Compilation, they would be justified by the events having already happened in the past in an earlier timeline. Detractors believe that this bombastic and unsubtle approach lessens the overall impact of the story not unlike the ''Compilation''.

** This has also led to debates, mainly in the western fandom, surrounding [[spoiler:Aerith's ultimate fate and whether her surviving would mean the potential for an interesting story or if it would cheapen the themes of the original game. Detractors argue that Aerith's death--even being as well-known as it is--is too integral to the plot and themes of [=FFVII=] and that preventing it would retroactively invalidate the original game's message about the permanence of death--[[https://kotaku.com/is-squall-really-dead-final-fantasy-producer-addresses-1800007113 as stated by Yoshinori Kitase]]. At most, they concede that players should only be given the opportunity to ''delay'' when her death happens, but not prevent it altogether (even those who are on board with the StealthSequel theory, a more optimistic narrative or other deaths being prevented)]]. On the other hand, supporters of Aerith surviving argue that her death has become [[ItWasHisSled so well-known]] that it no longer has the same impact and that similar themes can be reinforced if someone else(usually theorized as alternate timeline [[HopeSpot Zack]], [[DieForOurShip Tifa]] or even [[TheHeroDies Cloud]]) dies or vanishes in her place. Alternatively, they argue that, assuming the ''Remake'' trilogy is a StealthSequel, Aerith deserves a chance at a happy ending with either Cloud or an alternate timeline spared Zack after having to die in a previous timeline. They also point out that the other narrative purpose behind her death was always to show how sudden, unexpected and unnecessary it was--just like how death often can be in real life--as described by [[WordOfGod Hironobu Sakaguchi]], and that, assuming there's an AlternateTimeline or AlternateUniverse in play, the permanence of death does not necessitate forcing characters to stick to the same predestined fate across all realities.

** Chapter 18 as a whole along with its [[spoiler:meta commentary on the concept of remakes with the Whispers, the major deviation from the original game's plot as compared to previous chapters and [[TheEndingChangesEverything the ending itself]] revealing that the series is actually a StealthSequel]]. Supporters are glad that [[spoiler:Remake is becoming its own thing and resolving issues which they might have had with the original game, find the [[MetaFiction meta commentary]] to be a clever and interesting concept, including the DoubleMeaningTitle, and consider the battle against the Whisper Harbinger and Sephiroth an epic way to end Part 1. They also argue that the [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyVII the original game]] is still there for those who want a faithful retelling of the story]]. Detractors [[spoiler:believe that Square Enix promoting the first installment as a "remake" and then delivering an entirely different meaning of the word is a case of NeverTrustATrailer, that the [[SerialEscalation escalation of the threat was far too abrupt and early]] (going from Shinra's military to a godlike physical manifestation of destiny), that the meta commentary feels shoehorned and [[LeaningOnTheFourthWall immersion-breaking]], turning the characters into mere conduits for it, that the heroes lack a sufficient motivation to defy destiny, the Whispers' addition feeling unnecessary, inconsistent and reminiscent of [[Franchise/KingdomHearts the Heartless]], and having the heroes defeat the Whisper Harbinger and going toe-to-toe with Sephiroth this soon nullifies any future threats they might face]]. Another group of fans who liked the changes, or at least are fine with them, feel the game may have shown its hand too early and are left wondering [[spoiler:how future installments can possibly top the finale of the first part wherein the characters destroy a physical manifestation of fate and even get an epic showdown with Sephiroth (complete with the iconic "One-Winged Angel" theme), during which a mirror-universe version of Midgar is blown up by the scale of the fight]].

* FashionVictimVillain: Rufus's redesigned outfit gets a little ridiculous when examined up close, as the redesign adds in [[TooManyBelts two hoops of belts]] dangling from his waist and unbuttoned hakama-like pant legs that match the style of his suit jacket over his actual pants. Which has lead to several fans joking how he's wearing a wedding dress.

** [[ChairmanOfTheBrawl Chairith]] [[PunnyName Painsborough]].[[labelnote:Explanation]] Aerith's blunt idea of knocking out some of Corneo's goons with a chair out of a wrestling match hasn't gone unnoticed, which has led to a lot of pro wrestling references being made. It's also a really awesome moment for her. As an extension of this and Sephiroth's "Shall I give you despair?" line from ''Anime/FinalFantasyVIIAdventChildren'', there is also the memetic phrase "[[PreAsskickingOneLiner Shall I give you dis chair?]]" [[/labelnote]]

** Some of Barret's English line delivery can be this, due to the intentional hokeyness of his character sometimes conflicting with the tone of specific cutscenes, and his voice has a habit of cracking in the middle of some sentences. His reaction when Rude [[spoiler:presses the button which disengages the pillar, dropping the plate above down on Sector 7 below]] is perhaps the most notable example. What is clearly a serious and emotionally devastating turn of events is slightly undermined by the way that his tone shifts and cracks rather noticeably as he screams: "What have you doooOOOOne???!!!" The dramatic zoom of the camera combined with the fact that his facial expression does not so much convey horror as generic anger doesn't help matters.

** Some of Barret's English line delivery can be this, due to the intentional hokeyness of his character sometimes conflicting with the tone of specific cutscenes, and his voice has a habit of cracking in the middle of some sentences. His reaction when Rude [[spoiler:presses the button which disengages the pillar, dropping the plate above down on Sector 7 below]] is perhaps the most notable example. What is clearly a serious and emotionally devastating turn of events is slightly undermined by the way that his tone shifts and cracks rather noticeably as he screams: "What have you doooOOOOne???!!!" The dramatic zoom of the camera combined with the fact that his facial expression does not so much convey horror as generic anger does not help matters. Thankfully, however, his voice actor [[SugarWiki/HeReallyCanAct did come around in time]] for the scene in which Barret [[spoiler:mourns the presumed loss of his daughter.]]

** Cloud's famous "Nailed it, I know. Thank you. Moving on" is a 100% invention of the English script, but it's hard to argue it's ''massively'' more hilarious than the original Japanese line: "Don't need to be so impressed. There was no other way".

* ''YMMV/FinalFantasyVII''

* ''YMMV/CrisisCore

* ''YMMV/CrisisCore''

* EvilIsSexy: Scarlet is [[TheVamp vampish]] LadyInRed with a {{Dominatrix}} air about her. The scene of her using a henchman as an ottoman got ''a lot'' of attention.
%% ** Sephiroth of course. Rufus Shinra, Tseng, Reno and Rude also count.
%% ** In ''Intergrade'', there is Weiss the Immaculate for some.

** This has also led to debates, particuarly in the western fandom, surrounding [[spoiler:Aerith's ultimate fate and whether her surviving would mean the potential for an interesting story or if it would cheapen the themes of the original game. Detractors argue that Aerith's death--even being as well-known as it is--is too integral to the plot and themes of [=FFVII=] and that preventing it would retroactively invalidate the original game's message about the permanence of death--[[https://kotaku.com/is-squall-really-dead-final-fantasy-producer-addresses-1800007113 as stated by Yoshinori Kitase]]. At most, they concede that players should only be given the opportunity to ''delay'' when her death happens, but not prevent it altogether (even those who are on board with the StealthSequel theory, a more optimistic narrative or other deaths being prevented)]]. On the other hand, supporters of Aerith surviving argue that her death has become [[ItWasHisSled so well-known]] that it no longer has the same impact and that similar themes can be reinforced if someone else(usually theorized as alternate timeline [[HopeSpot Zack]], [[DieForOurShip Tifa]] or even [[TheHeroDies Cloud]]) dies or vanishes in her place. Alternatively, they argue that, assuming the ''Remake'' trilogy is a StealthSequel, Aerith deserves a chance at a happy ending with either Cloud or an alternate timeline spared Zack after having to die in a previous timeline. They also point out that the other narrative purpose behind her death was always to show how sudden, unexpected and unnecessary it was--just like how death often can be in real life--as described by [[WordOfGod Hironobu Sakaguchi]], and that, assuming there's an AlternateTimeline or AlternateUniverse in play, the permanence of death does not necessitate forcing characters to stick to the same predestined fate across all realities.

** This has also led to debates surrounding [[spoiler:Aerith's ultimate fate and whether her surviving would mean the potential for an interesting story or if it would cheapen the themes of the original game. Detractors argue that Aerith's death--even being as well-known as it is--is too integral to the plot and themes of [=FFVII=] and that preventing it would retroactively invalidate the original game's message about the permanence of death--[[https://kotaku.com/is-squall-really-dead-final-fantasy-producer-addresses-1800007113 as stated by Yoshinori Kitase]]. At most, they concede that players should only be given the opportunity to ''delay'' when her death happens, but not prevent it altogether (even those who are on board with the StealthSequel theory, a more optimistic narrative or other deaths being prevented)]]. On the other hand, supporters of Aerith surviving argue that her death has become [[ItWasHisSled so well-known]] that it no longer has the same impact and that similar themes can be reinforced if someone else(usually theorized as alternate timeline [[HopeSpot Zack]], [[DieForOurShip Tifa]] or even [[TheHeroDies Cloud]]) dies or vanishes in her place. Alternatively, they argue that, assuming the ''Remake'' trilogy is a StealthSequel, Aerith deserves a chance at a happy ending with either Cloud or an alternate timeline spared Zack after having to die in a previous timeline. They also point out that the other narrative purpose behind her death was always to show how sudden, unexpected and unnecessary it was--just like how death often can be in real life--as described by [[WordOfGod Hironobu Sakaguchi]], and that, assuming there's an AlternateTimeline or AlternateUniverse in play, the permanence of death does not necessitate forcing characters to stick to the same predestined fate across all realities.

** Barret gets an AdaptationalIntelligence upgrade, giving him more chances to show off why he would be leading Avalanche. His infamous SirSwearsALot attitude is somewhat toned down to help make him seem less like a stereotype, and his friendship with Avalanche is emphasized more to make him AFatherToHisMen, making it clear he is more than just an AngryBlackMan like the original game's localized script implied.

** And of course, the ending suggests that [[spoiler:Zack is now alive in a new timeline, leading many fans introduced to the franchise via ''VideoGame/CrisisCore'' who ship him and Aerith to join in on the frontlines of this particular shipping war]], usually as ShipMates with Cloti shippers even through a fair chunk of them, in contrast to the Clotis, are open to the idea of [[spoiler: Aerith staying in the Terrier timeline with alternate timeline Zack rather than the story following the same beats as the original and both dying no matter what]].

** And of course, the ending suggests that [[spoiler:Zack is now alive in a new timeline, leading many fans introduced to the franchise via ''VideoGame/CrisisCore'' who ship him and Aerith to join in on the frontlines of this particular shipping war]], usually as ShipMates with Cloti shippers even through a fair chunk of them are open to the idea of [[spoiler: Aerith staying in the Terrier timeline with alternate timeline Zack rather than the story following the same beats as the original and both dying no matter what]].

** And of course, the ending suggests that [[spoiler:Zack is now alive in a new timeline, leading many fans introduced to the franchise via ''VideoGame/CrisisCore'' who ship him and Aerith to join in on the frontlines of this particular shipping war]], usually as ShipMates with Cloti shippers.

** The fact that many characters now appear to have been SparedByAdaptation (including [[spoiler:Zack, AVALANCHE, and a larger number of Sector 7 citizens]]) has further deepened the divide, between supporters who are [[spoiler:happy for their survival, are interested in their roles in future games and hope they [[EarnYourHappyEnding get the happy outcome they didn’t had in the original game]], or alternatively believe that the devs are planning to make Aerith's death a even bigger PlayerPunch by offering the player the illusion that they can save her via sparing multiple characters that died in the OG, only to still kill her off regardless]]]] and detractors who believe [[spoiler:these characters surviving is contradictory to a CentralTheme from the original game, that being living with tragedy and [[WeAllDieSomeday accepting loss as a fact of life]]]]. A third camp contends that [[spoiler: it is too early to tell if these characters are really SparedByAdaptation, either theorizing that the aforementioned characters were spared in an AlternateTimeline (which increasingly appears to be the case on Zack's part) but still died in the main timeline or that they are all dead anyways and are trapped moreso in a limbo between the real world and the Lifestream, unable to truly pass on due to Mako contamination]].

** The fact that many characters now appear to have been SparedByAdaptation (including [[spoiler:Zack, AVALANCHE, and a larger number of Sector 7 citizens]]) has further deepened the divide, between supporters who are [[spoiler:happy for their survival, are interested in their roles in future games and hope they [[EarnYourHappyEnding get the happy outcome they didn’t had in the original game, or alternatively believe that the devs are planning to make Aerith's death a even bigger PlayerPunch by offering the player the illusion that they can save her via sparing multiple characters that died in the OG, only to still kill her off regardless]]]] and detractors who believe [[spoiler:these characters surviving is contradictory to a CentralTheme from the original game, that being living with tragedy and [[WeAllDieSomeday accepting loss as a fact of life]]]]. A third camp contends that [[spoiler: it is too early to tell if these characters are really SparedByAdaptation, either theorizing that the aforementioned characters were spared in an AlternateTimeline (which increasingly appears to be the case on Zack's part) but still died in the main timeline or that they are all dead anyways and are trapped moreso in a limbo between the real world and the Lifestream, unable to truly pass on due to Mako contamination]].

** The fact that many characters now appear to have been SparedByAdaptation (including [[spoiler:Zack, AVALANCHE, and a larger number of Sector 7 citizens]]) has further deepened the divide, between supporters who are [[spoiler:happy for their survival, are interested in their roles in future games and hope they [[EarnYourHappyEnding get the happy outcome they didn’t had in the original game]]]] and detractors who believe [[spoiler:these characters surviving is contradictory to a CentralTheme from the original game, that being living with tragedy and [[WeAllDieSomeday accepting loss as a fact of life]]]]. A third camp contends that [[spoiler: it is too early to tell if these characters are really SparedByAdaptation, either theorizing that the aforementioned characters were spared in an AlternateTimeline (which increasingly appears to be the case on Zack's part) but still died in the main timeline or that they are all dead anyways and are trapped moreso in a limbo between the real world and the Lifestream, unable to truly pass on due to Mako contamination]].

** Jessie also has a lot more screentime, which expands what was just some light flirting in the original (so light that some people missed it) into full-blown thirst for Cloud that makes even Aerith's teasing look like tame banter by comparison. Her front, decisive attitude towards pursuing Cloud romantically has made a lot of people warm up to and root for her instead, [[spoiler:even while fully aware of her tragic end. Her possible survival has led to many "Clessie" shippers expressing hope she will play a role in future games]]. This pairing has not been without controversy through, as one of the more vocal shippers of [=CloudXJessie=] was caught harassing Nojima on social media to the point where Nojima stopped discussing the game altogether.

** On the other hand both the expansion of Cloud's interactions with both girls and the ending heated up shipping war discussions in the fandom with both factions of the shipping war, with debates on the ending being split in many circles based on shipping preferences. The vast majority of Clerith shippers believe that the Remake trilogy is a StealthSequel where Cloud and Aerith finally get their happy ending(with the ending theme ''Hollow'' seemingly foreshadowing that Cloud will save her this time around). Conversely, the vast majority of Cloti shippers believe in the "[[spoiler: alternate timeline Zack is actually main timeline Zack DeadAllAlong and stuck in limbo]]" theory or any theories about the next two games in the trilogy that will see Aerith dying regardless. Heating things up further is the presence of Toriyama and Hamaguchi in the development of the Remake trilogy and the perception of both developers as excessively pro-[=CloudXAerith=] within shipper circles, with Cleriths believing that their presence on the development team will see the love triangle be resolved towards [=CloudXAerith=], while Clotis believe that Normura and Nojima (both of whom are commonly perceived as favoring [=CloudXTifa=], even through their [[CommonKnowledge actual stances is more complicated]]) will restrain them from tilting the love triangle in that direction.

** On the other hand both the expansion of Cloud's interactions with both girls and the ending heated up shipping war discussions in the fandom with both factions of the shipping war, with debates on the ending being split in many circles based on shipping preferences. The vast majority of Clerith shippers believe that the Remake trilogy is a StealthSequel where Cloud and Aerith finally get their happy ending(with the ending theme ''Hollow'' seemingly foreshadowing that Cloud will save her this time around). Conversely, the vast majority of Cloti shippers believe in the "[[spoiler: alternate timeline Zack is actually main timeline Zack DeadAllAlong and stuck in limbo]]" theory or any theories about the next two games in the trilogy that will see Aerith dying regardless.
*** Heating things up further is the presence of Toriyama and Hamaguchi in the development of the Remake trilogy and the perception of both developers as excessively pro-[=CloudXAerith=] within shipper circles, with Cleriths believing that their presence on the development team will see the love triangle be resolved towards [=CloudXAerith=], while Clotis believe that Normura and Nojima(both of whom are commonly perceived as favoring [=CloudXTifa=], even through their [[CommonKnowledge actual stances is a bit more complicated]]) will restrain them from tilting the love triangle in that direction.

* ShipToShipCombat: Cloud, Tifa and Aerith back in 1997 formed what is one of, if not THE most iconic LoveTriangle in video game history (so much so that this wiki's main and YMMV articles for the original game had to be permanently locked as a result of frequent edit warring over the subject), so the situation was bound to be repeated here. However, the expanded characterization has created a few new developments unique to the remake both intensifying and mitigating the intensity of this shipping war.

** [[spoiler:Zack's potential survival in his last stand has led to multiple theories explaining just what his survival entails. The most popular theories were that he was spared in an alternate timeline, dubbed the "Terrier timeline" that could potentially interact with the timeline Cloud and co. are on, which is dubbed the "Beagle" timeline. Another popular theory is that the defeat of the Whispers caused Cloud and his party to cross over to the Terrier timeline, and all future Remake trilogy games will be set in said timeline. A less popular theory, primarily tied to elements of the western fandom that believes the Remake trilogy to not be a StealthSequel, states that Zack is actually DeadAllAlong, and that his spirit is in a limbo trapped between the world of the living and the Lifestream, and that the framing of his supposed survival and "multiple timelines" is used to goad the player into thinking that they could save Zack and Aerith, only to rip out that hope at the last second when it comes for Aerith to die, making it clear that Remake will ultimately continue to follow the flow of the original game and the Compilation.]]

** On the other hand both the expansion of Cloud's interactions with both girls and the ending heated up shipping war discussions in the fandom with both factions of the shipping war, with debates on the ending being split in many circles based on shipping preferences. The vast majority of Clerith shippers believe that the Remake trilogy is a StealthSequel where Cloud and Aerith finally get their happy ending(with the ending theme "Hollow" seemingly foreshadowing that this time Cloud will not repeat the events that led to her original death"). Conversely, the vast majority of Cloti shippers believe in the "[[spoiler: alternate timeline Zack is actually main timeline Zack DeadAllAlong and stuck in limbo]]" theory or any theories about the next two games in the trilogy that will see Aerith dying regardless.

** Jessie also has a lot more screentime, which expands what was just some light flirting in the original (so light that some people missed it) into full-blown thirst for Cloud that makes even Aerith's teasing look like tame banter by comparison. Her front, decisive attitude towards pursuing Cloud romantically has made a lot of people warm up to and root for her instead, [[spoiler:even while fully aware of her tragic end. Her possible survival has led to many "Clessie" shippers expressing hope she will play a role in future games]].
** And of course, the ending suggests that [[spoiler:Zack is now alive in a new timeline, leading many fans introduced to the franchise via ''VideoGame/CrisisCore'' who ship him and Aerith to join in on the frontlines of this particular shipping war.]]

*** Heating things up further is the presence of Toriyama and Hamaguchi in the development of the Remake trilogy and the perception of both developers as excessively pro-[=CloudXAerith=] within shipper circles, with Cleriths believing that their presence on the development team will see the love triangle be resolved towards [=CloudXAerith=], while Clotis believe that Normura and Nojima(both of whom are commonly perceived as favoring [=CloudXTifa=], even through the [[CommonKnowledge reality is a bit more complicated]]) will restrain them from tilting the love triangle in that direction.

** On the other hand both the expansion of Cloud's interactions with both girls and the ending heated up shipping war discussions in the fandom with both factions of the shipping war, with debates on the ending being split in many circles based on shipping preferences. The vast majority of Clerith shippers believe that the Remake trilogy is a StealthSequel where Cloud and Aerith finally get their happy ending(with the ending theme "Hollow" seemingly foreshadowing that this time Cloud will not repeat the events that led to her original death"). Conversely, the vast majority of Cloti shippers believe in the "[[spoiler: alternate timeline Zack is actually main timeline Zack DeadAllAlong and stuck in limbo]]" theory or any theories about the next two games in the trilogy that will see Aerith dying regardless. Heating things up further is the presence of Toriyama and Hamaguchi in the development of the Remake trilogy and the perception of both developers as excessively pro-[=CloudXAerith=] within shipper circles, with Cleriths believing that their presence on the development team will see the love triangle be resolved towards [=CloudXAerith=], while Clotis believe that Normura and Nojima(both of whom are commonly perceived as favoring [=CloudXTifa=], even through the [[CommonKnowledge reality is a bit more complicated]]) will restrain them from tilting the love triangle in that direction.