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** Madame de Montmirail is a grumpy, obstructive old woman that treats the Crawleys with contempt throughout their stay in France, but it's hard not to feel bad for her situation: her recently deceased husband has left property to an Violet whom he had an old fling with, because he never got over her and made sure to remind his wife of that by leaving a picture of Violet on display, forever reminding his own wife and mother of their son that she was inferior to TheOneThatGotAway. And her own son can't seem to understand her situation, too involved with the possiblility that [[spoiler:Robert is his brother, even if that turns out not to be the case]].
** Myrna Dalgleish is a vain, spoiled actress who quickly gains people's antipathy with her rudeness, but she's a White-Dwarf Star, haunted by the arrival of talking films destroying her career, as she happens tohave a Cockney banground and [[VocalDissonance her hoarse voice and thick accent]] will have no place on the next era of film. Worse, it's a reminder that her aristocratic glamour is shallow, as her background is as humble as that of the servants, which Daisy seeks to invoke in a positive manner by reminding her that [[YouAreBetterThanYouThinkYouAre she's had to climb to her place, unlike the upper-class]].

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** Madame de Montmirail is a grumpy, obstructive old woman that treats the Crawleys with contempt throughout their stay in France, but it's hard not to feel bad for her situation: her recently deceased husband has left property to an Violet the Dowager Countess, whom he had an old fling with, because he never got over her and made sure to remind his wife of that by leaving a picture of Violet on display, forever reminding his own wife and mother of their son that she was inferior to TheOneThatGotAway. And her own son can't seem to understand her situation, too involved with the possiblility that [[spoiler:Robert is his brother, even if that turns out not to be the case]].
** Myrna Dalgleish is a vain, spoiled actress who quickly gains people's antipathy with her rudeness, but she's a White-Dwarf Star, haunted by the arrival of talking films destroying her career, as she happens tohave to have a Cockney banground background and [[VocalDissonance her hoarse voice and thick accent]] will have no place on the next era of film. Worse, it's a reminder that her aristocratic glamour is shallow, as her background is as humble as that of the servants, which Daisy seeks to invoke in a positive manner by reminding her that [[YouAreBetterThanYouThinkYouAre she's had to climb to her place, unlike the upper-class]].upper-class and can do better]].
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** Madame de Montmirail is a grumpy, obstructive old woman that treats the Crawleys with contempt throughout their stay in France, but it's hard not to feel bad for her situation: her recently deceased husband has left property to an Violet whom he had an old fling with, because he never got over her and made sure to remind his wife of that by leaving a picture of Violet on display, forever reminding his own wife and mother of their son that she was inferior to TheOneWhoGotAway. And her own son can't seem to understand her situation, too involved with the possiblility that [[spoiler:Robert is his brother, even if that turns out not to be the case]].

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** Madame de Montmirail is a grumpy, obstructive old woman that treats the Crawleys with contempt throughout their stay in France, but it's hard not to feel bad for her situation: her recently deceased husband has left property to an Violet whom he had an old fling with, because he never got over her and made sure to remind his wife of that by leaving a picture of Violet on display, forever reminding his own wife and mother of their son that she was inferior to TheOneWhoGotAway.TheOneThatGotAway. And her own son can't seem to understand her situation, too involved with the possiblility that [[spoiler:Robert is his brother, even if that turns out not to be the case]].
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* JerkassWoobie:
** Madame de Montmirail is a grumpy, obstructive old woman that treats the Crawleys with contempt throughout their stay in France, but it's hard not to feel bad for her situation: her recently deceased husband has left property to an Violet whom he had an old fling with, because he never got over her and made sure to remind his wife of that by leaving a picture of Violet on display, forever reminding his own wife and mother of their son that she was inferior to TheOneWhoGotAway. And her own son can't seem to understand her situation, too involved with the possiblility that [[spoiler:Robert is his brother, even if that turns out not to be the case]].
** Myrna Dalgleish is a vain, spoiled actress who quickly gains people's antipathy with her rudeness, but she's a White-Dwarf Star, haunted by the arrival of talking films destroying her career, as she happens tohave a Cockney banground and [[VocalDissonance her hoarse voice and thick accent]] will have no place on the next era of film. Worse, it's a reminder that her aristocratic glamour is shallow, as her background is as humble as that of the servants, which Daisy seeks to invoke in a positive manner by reminding her that [[YouAreBetterThanYouThinkYouAre she's had to climb to her place, unlike the upper-class]].
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Now an Index disavowing examples.


* AcceptableTargets: Guy Dexter is RP-accented, SpoiledSweet and an InstantExpert when he has to dub his dialogue for the first time. Myrna Dalgleish is a foul-mouthed cockney who is rude to everyone, behaves like a complete diva and fails to take to the "talkies" as Guy does--having to suffer BreakTheHaughty to become nicer. She even has to be lectured on how she's not one of the aristocracy and needs to remember where she came from.
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More than six months have passed so this text can be removed.


%%Per Administrivia/NoRecentExamplesPlease, don't add Broken Base, Base Breaking Character, Contested Sequel or sequelitis untl at least six months afrer the release.
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Moving to Funny Page


* MomentOfFunny: When Mary is asked to dub over Montmirail's lines she says she can't. Mrs. Hughes points out that Mary is being asked... to literally just speak in her own accent.
** This becomes funny in a meta sense when one learns that Mary's actress had been playing an American for several years and as such actually HAD forgotten out to talk like Lady Mary!
** Carson utterly refusing to wear anything but his full suit while in France, and thus constantly being overly warm but refusing to do anything about it.
** As they film the final scene and get everything right at the very last second Cora and Robert walk into the scene, Robert utterly horrified that a room of Downton has been made up as a gambling parlor.
** While occurring during the film's biggest tearjerker scene there is something very funny about [[spoiler: the Dowager's final words to be her joking that her maid is crying so loud she can't even hear herself die.]]
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Moving to Awesome Page


* MomentOfAwesome: Molesley agrees to help the movie director alter his script to turn it from a silent film into a talkie, it expected that he'd just do minor touchups. He instead goes to Mary and the director and points out the ending is bad (the leading man loses everything and returns to gambling) and within 1 minute pitches a beautiful romantic ending that has Mary near tears. The director is so impressed he decides to hire Molesley to be his new screenwriter!
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* MomentOfAwesome: Molesley agrees to help the movie director alter his script to turn it from a silent film into a talkie, it expected that he'd just do minor touchups. He instead goes to Mary and the director and points out the ending is bad (the leading man loses everything and returns to gambling) and within 1 minute pitches a beautiful romantic ending that has Mary near tears. The director is so impressed he decides to hire Molesley to be his new screenwriter!
* MomentOfFunny: When Mary is asked to dub over Montmirail's lines she says she can't. Mrs. Hughes points out that Mary is being asked... to literally just speak in her own accent.
** This becomes funny in a meta sense when one learns that Mary's actress had been playing an American for several years and as such actually HAD forgotten out to talk like Lady Mary!
** Carson utterly refusing to wear anything but his full suit while in France, and thus constantly being overly warm but refusing to do anything about it.
** As they film the final scene and get everything right at the very last second Cora and Robert walk into the scene, Robert utterly horrified that a room of Downton has been made up as a gambling parlor.
** While occurring during the film's biggest tearjerker scene there is something very funny about [[spoiler: the Dowager's final words to be her joking that her maid is crying so loud she can't even hear herself die.]]
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* LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt: It was heavily hinted that [[TonightSomeoneDies a major character would be killed off]] in the promotional materials. The movie tries to mislead the audience to thinking it might be [[spoiler: Cora, who reveals she may have cancer]]. But, given that the previous film ended with [[spoiler: Violet getting some kind of diagnosis, it's no surprise that she's the one to die in the climax]].

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Myrna isn't depicted as talentless, just inable to adapt to talking in film by a combination of inexperience and her thick accent. Also, the entry can stand without calling the creator classist—Creator Bashing isn't to go on any page. Also, this last bit in the Unintentionally Unsympathetic entry reads like a bit of a twisted interpretation—she wasn't being callous and telling Robert to "suck it up," she was trying to comfort him.


* AcceptableTargets: Julian Fellowes's classism rears its head in particular with the comparison between Guy Dexter and Myrna Dalgleish. The former is RP-accented, SpoiledSweet and an InstantExpert when he has to dub his dialogue for the first time. The latter is a foul-mouthed cockney, who is rude to everyone, behaves like a complete diva and is portrayed as talentless - having to suffer BreakTheHaughty to become nicer. She even has to be lectured on how she's not one of the aristocracy.
* AngstWhatAngst:
** Robert is the only character who shows anything resembling genuine angst about [[spoiler: him possibly being born from a different father]]. Everyone else is remarkably blasé about the idea that Violet could have lied to them for their whole lives.
* TrappedByMountainLions: Cora's entire subplot of [[spoiler: revealing she may have cancer, only for it to turn out it's anaemia]] receives so little screen time and affects the plot so much one wonders why it was even in the film.

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* AcceptableTargets: Julian Fellowes's classism rears its head in particular with the comparison between Guy Dexter and Myrna Dalgleish. The former is RP-accented, SpoiledSweet and an InstantExpert when he has to dub his dialogue for the first time. The latter Myrna Dalgleish is a foul-mouthed cockney, cockney who is rude to everyone, behaves like a complete diva and is portrayed fails to take to the "talkies" as talentless - having Guy does--having to suffer BreakTheHaughty to become nicer. She even has to be lectured on how she's not one of the aristocracy.
aristocracy and needs to remember where she came from.
* AngstWhatAngst:
**
AngstWhatAngst: Robert is the only character who shows anything resembling genuine angst about [[spoiler: him possibly being born from a different father]]. Everyone else is remarkably blasé about the idea that Violet could have lied to them for their whole lives.
* TrappedByMountainLions: Cora's entire subplot of [[spoiler: revealing she may have cancer, only for it to turn out it's anaemia]] receives so very little screen time and affects ultimately has no effect on the plot so much one wonders why it was even in the film.as a whole.



* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Cora thinks it's a good idea to casually drop the ConflictBall that [[spoiler:she's possibly got a terminal illness]] on her husband right after he's found out [[spoiler:he might actually have had a different father and been lied to his whole life]], in addition to preparing for his mother's imminent death. And she does this not in their room, where he could process this, but in the middle of a wild party. And when he appropriately bursts into tears, she basically tells him to suck it up and pretend to be happy for the sake of the party.

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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Cora thinks it's a good idea to casually drop the ConflictBall that [[spoiler:she's possibly got a terminal illness]] on her husband right after he's found out [[spoiler:he might actually have had a different father and been lied to his whole life]], in addition to preparing for his mother's imminent death. And she does this not in their room, where he could process this, but in the middle of a wild party. And when he appropriately bursts into tears, she basically tells him to suck it up and pretend to be happy for the sake of the party.

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%%Per Administrivia/NoRecentExamplesPlease, don't add Broken Base, Base Breaking Character, Contested Sequel or sequelitis untl at least six months afrer the release.



* BrokenBase:
** There are numerous contentious issues in the film, but one of the most intense is the debate between people who enjoy [[spoiler: Thomas leaving Downton to live in Hollywood to work for Guy Dexter and people who wanted him to remain in England--especially if remaining allowed him to get back together with Richard Ellis, his love interest in the first film who is unceremoniously PutOnABus in the second]].
* {{Sequelitis}}: While the 2019 film was seen as unnecessary by some already, it did get touted as a worthy enough GrandFinale to the series. This sequel was criticised for being completely unneeded, considering some of the {{Drama Bomb}}s don't even cause much in the way of lasting change, and the stakes are incredibly low. Even the [[spoiler: death of Violet]] was already implied and foreshadowed to more powerful effect at the end of the previous film.
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** There are numerous contentious issues in the film, but one of the most intense is the debate between people who enjoy [[spoiler: Thomas leaving Downton to live in Hollywood with Guy Dexter and people who wanted him to remain in England--especially if remaining allowed him to get back together with Richard Ellis, his love interest in the first film who is unceremoniously PutOnABus in the second]].

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** There are numerous contentious issues in the film, but one of the most intense is the debate between people who enjoy [[spoiler: Thomas leaving Downton to live in Hollywood with to work for Guy Dexter and people who wanted him to remain in England--especially if remaining allowed him to get back together with Richard Ellis, his love interest in the first film who is unceremoniously PutOnABus in the second]].

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Angst, What Angst? typically refers to characters not displaying angst when they suffer due to something being done to them; the negative things listed in the original comment were all the consequences of Thomas's deliberate action, which he decided he could live with. Other tropes may apply, but Angst What Angst doesn't seem to be the best one.


** Thomas leaves his home of 20 years, the place he laid some roots, his friends, the kids he bonded with, to leave to be an aging actor's servant / lover . He doesn't say goodbye and his departure is seen as "going away".

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* BrokenBase:
** There are numerous contentious issues in the film, but one of the most intense is the debate between people who enjoy [[spoiler: Thomas leaves leaving Downton to live in Hollywood with Guy Dexter and people who wanted him to remain in England--especially if remaining allowed him to get back together with Richard Ellis, his home of 20 years, love interest in the place he laid some roots, his friends, first film who is unceremoniously PutOnABus in the kids he bonded with, to leave to be an aging actor's servant / lover . He doesn't say goodbye and his departure is seen as "going away".second]].
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* UnintentionallySympathetic: Madame de Montmirail is treated as a grumpy obstructive villain, only given the most minor of sympathy by the narrative. Not only has she just lost her husband; but he's left property to a woman he had a minor affair with decades ago, and he even kept her picture on display in the house, forever letting his wife know that she would always come second to Violet.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Cora thinks it's a good idea to casually drop the ConflictBall that [[spoiler: she's possibly got a terminal illness]] on her husband right after he's found out [[spoiler: he might actually have had a different father and been lied to his whole life]], in addition to preparing for his mother's imminent death. And she does this not in their room, where he could process this, but in the middle of a wild party. And when he appropriately bursts into tears, she basically tells him to suck it up and pretend to be happy for the sake of the party.

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* UnintentionallySympathetic: Madame de Montmirail is treated as a grumpy obstructive villain, only given the most minor of sympathy by the narrative. Not only has she just lost her husband; husband, but he's left property to a woman he had a minor affair with decades ago, and he even kept her picture on display in the house, forever letting his wife know that she would always come second to Violet.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Cora thinks it's a good idea to casually drop the ConflictBall that [[spoiler: she's [[spoiler:she's possibly got a terminal illness]] on her husband right after he's found out [[spoiler: he [[spoiler:he might actually have had a different father and been lied to his whole life]], in addition to preparing for his mother's imminent death. And she does this not in their room, where he could process this, but in the middle of a wild party. And when he appropriately bursts into tears, she basically tells him to suck it up and pretend to be happy for the sake of the party.

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grammar


* AngstWhatAngst: Robert is the only character who shows anything resembling genuine angst about [[spoiler: him possibly being born from a different father]]. Everyone else is remarkably blasé about the idea that Violet could have lied to them for their whole lives.
Thomas leaves his home of 20 years , the place he laid some roots , his friends , the kids he bonded with , to leave to be an aging actor s servant / lover . He doesn t say goodbye and his departure is seen as " go away "

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* AngstWhatAngst: AngstWhatAngst:
**
Robert is the only character who shows anything resembling genuine angst about [[spoiler: him possibly being born from a different father]]. Everyone else is remarkably blasé about the idea that Violet could have lied to them for their whole lives.
** Thomas leaves his home of 20 years , years, the place he laid some roots , roots, his friends , friends, the kids he bonded with , with, to leave to be an aging actor s actor's servant / lover . He doesn t doesn't say goodbye and his departure is seen as " go away ""going away".
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Thomas leaves his home of 20 years , the place he laid some roots , his friends , the kids he bonded with , to leave to be an aging actor s servant / lover . He doesn t say goodbye and his departure is seen as " go away "
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* AcceptableTargets: Julian Fellowes's classism rears its head in particular with the comparison between Guy Dexter and Myrna Dalgleish. The former is RP-accented, SpoiledSweet and an InstantExpert when he has to dub his dialogue for the first time. The latter is a foul-mouthed cockney, who is rude to everyone, behaves like a complete diva and is portrayed as talentless - having to suffer BreakTheHaughty to become nicer. She even has to be lectured on how she's not one of the aristocracy.
* AngstWhatAngst: Robert is the only character who shows anything resembling genuine angst about [[spoiler: him possibly being born from a different father]]. Everyone else is remarkably blasé about the idea that Violet could have lied to them for their whole lives.
* {{Sequelitis}}: While the 2019 film was seen as unnecessary by some already, it did get touted as a worthy enough GrandFinale to the series. This sequel was criticised for being completely unneeded, considering some of the {{Drama Bomb}}s don't even cause much in the way of lasting change, and the stakes are incredibly low. Even the [[spoiler: death of Violet]] was already implied and foreshadowed to more powerful effect at the end of the previous film.
* TrappedByMountainLions: Cora's entire subplot of [[spoiler: revealing she may have cancer, only for it to turn out it's anaemia]] receives so little screen time and affects the plot so much one wonders why it was even in the film.
* UnintentionallySympathetic: Madame de Montmirail is treated as a grumpy obstructive villain, only given the most minor of sympathy by the narrative. Not only has she just lost her husband; but he's left property to a woman he had a minor affair with decades ago, and he even kept her picture on display in the house, forever letting his wife know that she would always come second to Violet.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: Cora thinks it's a good idea to casually drop the ConflictBall that [[spoiler: she's possibly got a terminal illness]] on her husband right after he's found out [[spoiler: he might actually have had a different father and been lied to his whole life]], in addition to preparing for his mother's imminent death. And she does this not in their room, where he could process this, but in the middle of a wild party. And when he appropriately bursts into tears, she basically tells him to suck it up and pretend to be happy for the sake of the party.

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