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Old Shame is In-Universe only
Changed line(s) 5,6 (click to see context) from:
* CreatorBacklash: Over the years, Wagner's depiction of Hunter Rose has shifted from an initial ByronicHero characterisation to simply a hateful, arrogant, murderous asshole. Wagner has said in an interview that every time he writes about Hunter he likes him a little less.
* OldShame: The Comico black-and-white miniseries, as well as the character's ''introduction in Comico Primer #2.''
* OldShame: The Comico black-and-white miniseries, as well as the character's ''introduction in Comico Primer #2.''
to:
* CreatorBacklash: CreatorBacklash:
** Over the years, Wagner's depiction of Hunter Rose has shifted from an initial ByronicHero characterisation to simply a hateful, arrogant, murderous asshole. Wagner has said in an interview that every time he writes about Hunter he likes him a little less.
* OldShame: ** The Comico black-and-white miniseries, as well as the character's ''introduction in Comico Primer #2.''
** Over the years, Wagner's depiction of Hunter Rose has shifted from an initial ByronicHero characterisation to simply a hateful, arrogant, murderous asshole. Wagner has said in an interview that every time he writes about Hunter he likes him a little less.
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None
Added DiffLines:
* AllStarCast: The ''Black, White, and Red'' comics were a series of short Hunter Rose stories drawn by a Who’s Who of well-known artists from the late ‘90s.
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None
Changed line(s) 10,17 (click to see context) from:
* UnintentionalPeriodPiece:
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is out of vogue. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
** During Brian's tenure as Grendel, someone was discussing going home and watching Creator/DavidLetterman although they felt that the "old fart just aint funny anymore". Letterman retired from Late Night host in 2015; that would be about ten years before the events in the comic.
*** Averted now that Letterman has a new talk show on Netflix.
** Like the majority of 1980s era cyberpunk, the near future failed to anticipate mobile smartphones, the ubiquitous internet, and other technological developments.
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former "Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
*** Possibly averted; the exact length of Grendel's reign is never clear. Behold the Devil begins during the early days, when Grendel's existence is an open secret to the general public. This would have to be before Grendel takes over the eastern seaboard (he announces this feat to the press), and the epilogue of Behold the Devil takes place nine months after the events of the comic, shortly after Grendel's death. Given Hunter Rose is TheAce both as a writer and as Grendel, as well as Stacy Palumbo not visibly aging during her time with Hunter, it's entirely possible that the Hunter Rose identity only lasts two or three years in total, a relatively short time for anyone to seriously investigate Hunter in the first place.
*** Additionally, Eddie was a minor, with fewer records than an adult -- mostly grades, and the tournament. His social security number would be the biggest problem.
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is out of vogue. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
** During Brian's tenure as Grendel, someone was discussing going home and watching Creator/DavidLetterman although they felt that the "old fart just aint funny anymore". Letterman retired from Late Night host in 2015; that would be about ten years before the events in the comic.
*** Averted now that Letterman has a new talk show on Netflix.
** Like the majority of 1980s era cyberpunk, the near future failed to anticipate mobile smartphones, the ubiquitous internet, and other technological developments.
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former "Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
*** Possibly averted; the exact length of Grendel's reign is never clear. Behold the Devil begins during the early days, when Grendel's existence is an open secret to the general public. This would have to be before Grendel takes over the eastern seaboard (he announces this feat to the press), and the epilogue of Behold the Devil takes place nine months after the events of the comic, shortly after Grendel's death. Given Hunter Rose is TheAce both as a writer and as Grendel, as well as Stacy Palumbo not visibly aging during her time with Hunter, it's entirely possible that the Hunter Rose identity only lasts two or three years in total, a relatively short time for anyone to seriously investigate Hunter in the first place.
*** Additionally, Eddie was a minor, with fewer records than an adult -- mostly grades, and the tournament. His social security number would be the biggest problem.
to:
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is out of vogue. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
** During Brian's tenure as Grendel, someone was discussing going home and watching Creator/DavidLetterman although they felt that the "old fart just aint funny anymore". Letterman retired from Late Night host in 2015; that would be about ten years before the events in the comic.
*** Averted now that Letterman has a new talk show on Netflix.
** Like the majority of 1980s era cyberpunk, the near future failed to anticipate mobile smartphones, the ubiquitous internet, and other technological developments.
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former "Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
*** Possibly averted; the exact length of Grendel's reign is never clear. Behold the Devil begins during the early days, when Grendel's existence is an open secret to the general public. This would have to be before Grendel takes over the eastern seaboard (he announces this feat to the press), and the epilogue of Behold the Devil takes place nine months after the events of the comic, shortly after Grendel's death. Given Hunter Rose is TheAce both as a writer and as Grendel, as well as Stacy Palumbo not visibly aging during her time with Hunter, it's entirely possible that the Hunter Rose identity only lasts two or three years in total, a relatively short time for anyone to seriously investigate Hunter in the first place.
*** Additionally, Eddie was a minor, with fewer records than an adult -- mostly grades, and the tournament. His social security number would be the biggest problem.
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None
** "Devil Child" is loosely based on the writer's own rape.
Changed line(s) 15 (click to see context) from:
*** Possibly averted; the exact length of Grendel's reign is never clear. Behold the Devil begins during the early days, when Grendel's existence is an open secret to the general public. This would have to be before Grendel takes over the eastern seaboard (he announces this feat to the press), and the epilogue of Behold the Devil takes place nine months after the events of the comic, shortly after Grendel's death. Given Hunter Rose is TheAce both as a writer and as Grendel, as well as Stacy Palumbo not visibly aging during her time with Hunter, it's entirely possible that the Hunter Rose identity only lasts two or three years in total, a relatively short time for anyone to seriously investigate Hunter in the first place.
to:
*** Possibly averted; the exact length of Grendel's reign is never clear. Behold the Devil begins during the early days, when Grendel's existence is an open secret to the general public. This would have to be before Grendel takes over the eastern seaboard (he announces this feat to the press), and the epilogue of Behold the Devil takes place nine months after the events of the comic, shortly after Grendel's death. Given Hunter Rose is TheAce both as a writer and as Grendel, as well as Stacy Palumbo not visibly aging during her time with Hunter, it's entirely possible that the Hunter Rose identity only lasts two or three years in total, a relatively short time for anyone to seriously investigate Hunter in the first place.place.
*** Additionally, Eddie was a minor, with fewer records than an adult -- mostly grades, and the tournament. His social security number would be the biggest problem.
*** Additionally, Eddie was a minor, with fewer records than an adult -- mostly grades, and the tournament. His social security number would be the biggest problem.
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None
Added DiffLines:
* CreatorBacklash: Over the years, Wagner's depiction of Hunter Rose has shifted from an initial ByronicHero characterisation to simply a hateful, arrogant, murderous asshole. Wagner has said in an interview that every time he writes about Hunter he likes him a little less.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* RealitySubtext: The ''Grendel Tales'' stories by Darko Macan and Edvin Biukovic, "Devils and Deaths" and "Devil's Choices", are set in the Balkans and have very obvious subtext to the 1990s [[UsefulNotes/TheYugoslavWars Yugoslav Wars]] that were raging in the region in real life at the time.
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None
Changed line(s) 11 (click to see context) from:
----
to:
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*** Averted now that Letterman has a new talk show on Netflix.
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See the Deader Than Disco cleanup thread: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=14654177060A30520700
Changed line(s) 6 (click to see context) from:
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is DeaderThanDisco. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
to:
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is DeaderThanDisco.out of vogue. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 9,10 (click to see context) from:
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former
"Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
"Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
to:
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former
former "Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Like the majority of 1980s era cyberpunk, the near future failed to anticipate mobile smartphones, the ubiquitous internet, and other technological developments.
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former
"Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
** Hunter Rose's era is restricted to having occurred no later than the mid 1980s. Much of what he accomplished (including erasing all traces of his former
"Eddie" identity) would not be possible with tracing and forensic technology that would be available after that. It certainly would not be possible in the digital age and post 9/11 age of surveillance.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* UnintentionalPeriodPiece:
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is DeaderThanDisco. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
** During Brian's tenure as Grendel, someone was discussing going home and watching Creator/DavidLetterman although they felt that the "old fart just aint funny anymore". Letterman retired from Late Night host in 2015; that would be about ten years before the events in the comic.
** In Issue #1 of "Devils Legacy" Christine was on the PhilDonahue show where she discussed the legacy of Grendel in her family. She mused that Donahue must be about 70 by now. According to recent estimate (based on when the idea of the original Hunter Rose stories being set in the early-mid 80s), Christine's story arc would have to take place somewhere in the mid 2020's. That would make Donahue more likely to be in his 90s by then. Donahue's long running show ended in 1996 and he had a short lived show between 2002-2003. The fact that the second show didn't last a year might reflect how relevant Donahue was in the 2000s (not very). Even if he's still alive, the "serious" talk show format is DeaderThanDisco. So no one is really holding their breath thinking that he'll try again anytime soon.
** During Brian's tenure as Grendel, someone was discussing going home and watching Creator/DavidLetterman although they felt that the "old fart just aint funny anymore". Letterman retired from Late Night host in 2015; that would be about ten years before the events in the comic.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
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* OldShame: The Comico black-and-white miniseries, as well as the character's ''introduction in Comico Primer #2.''
** To an extent, Wagner feels this of his original concept of even ''Devil By the Deed'', what with the line about [[TrueArtIsAngsty Grendel being the spirit of society's mediocrity.]]
* ScrewedByTheNetwork: The title saw a delay of several years due to the bankruptcy of its original publisher (Comico). During the interim, Comico's owners tried to claim Grendel as a company asset and prevent Wagner from taking the character elsewhere. This also held up Dark Horse reprints of the Comico issues, which eventually went through without further complications.
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* OldShame: The Comico black-and-white miniseries, as well as the character's ''introduction in Comico Primer #2.''
** To an extent, Wagner feels this of his original concept of even ''Devil By the Deed'', what with the line about [[TrueArtIsAngsty Grendel being the spirit of society's mediocrity.]]
* ScrewedByTheNetwork: The title saw a delay of several years due to the bankruptcy of its original publisher (Comico). During the interim, Comico's owners tried to claim Grendel as a company asset and prevent Wagner from taking the character elsewhere. This also held up Dark Horse reprints of the Comico issues, which eventually went through without further complications.
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