History Main / RousseauWasRight

-->'''[[Literature/TheQuran Surah 7:173]]:''' ''And remember when your Lord brought forth from the loins of the children of Adam their descendants and had them testify regarding themselves. Allah asked, "Am I not your Lord?" They replied, "Yes, You are! We testify.""''

* The majority of stuff by Creator/GrantMorrison. One could say that the CentralTheme of his works is that ''everyone'' has the potential to be an awesome hero.

* In all of ''LightNovel/KyoKaraMaoh'', there have been perhaps two {{Big Bad}}s that are not redeemed. One of them is literally SealedEvilInACan, and the other [[spoiler: becomes a mindless puppet for said SealedEvilInACan]].

* ''Manga/ShuumatsuNoWalkureRecordOfRagnarok'' runs on the premise that [[HumansAreGood humans are basically decent and would only become malicious under extreme circumstances]]. Most of the human characters have their more unsavory traits [[AdaptationalHeroism removed]] (such as Lu Bu's ChronicBackstabbingDisorder tendency and Adam and Eve's willful disobedience that led to their exile). Even Jack the Ripper--a man described in-universe as "the worst humanity has to offer"-- is portrayed as a [[UsedToBeASweetKid decent child]] who only [[IJustWantToBeLoved wants to be loved]], and eventually becomes a hedonistic SerialKiller after he realises that his mother, the only person he thought had loved him, only wanted to use him to bait his wealthy father and save her from a life of poverty, [[HiddenDisdainReveal and that she doesn't really love her son as a person.]]

** Even the various {{Big Bad}}s of the games show this. Giovanni -- despite his selfish motives -- still faces his defeat with a degree of honor, the leaders of Team Aqua and Magma are both {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s that pull a HeelFaceTurn when they realize [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone just how badly their plans backfire]], even ''[[OmnicidalManiac Cyrus]]'' is implied to have had [[FreudianExcuse a pretty horrible childhood]], N is an AntiVillain with his heart in the right place, [[spoiler: Lysandre's]] stated to have once tried to genuinely help people until he went insane due to being convinced of his own limitations and the stupidity of the human race and [[spoiler:Lusamine]] used to be a good parent before the disappearance of her husband and her encounter with Nihilego drove her crackers. [[spoiler:Chairman Rose]]'s villainy is driven by a genuine concern about Galar's future and a desire to solve an energy crisis. and [[spoiler:Commander Kamado]] wants to protect Jubelife Village from the dimensional rifts by any means necessary. The only exceptions are [[spoiler:Ghetsis and Volo]], who have no excuse at all for their evil actions and [[NotSoWellIntentionedExtremist only selfish intent behind their supposedly noble goals]].

* An anti-hate PSA opens with a scene of babies in a maternity ward, with an announcer saying "Here's one time it doesn't matter who your neighbor is." Then, following a rapid-fire montage of various rallies and demonstrations from the KKK, neo-Nazis, etc., the scene cuts to a graveyard as the announcer says "Here's the other."

** Kyo's biological father would be a closer subversion. While he's obviously not the most mentally stable person in the world (suffering from paranoid delusions), he's still in control of himself, and given that he never changes his utter disgust and fear of his son, and is heavily implied to have been the one who really [[spoiler:drove Kyo's mother [[DrivenToSuicide to suicide]]]], he stands out for lacking ''any'' sympathetic qualities. Close runners-up would be Rin's parents; while they only appear once, their abrupt DespairEventHorizon is never explained, and their malicious neglect of their daughter thereafter contributed to her [[IllGirl health problems]] even before Akito got involved.

* ''Fanfic/TheFlashSentryChronicles'': This is essentially used to justify the fate of The Cult of Shadow. The group was a group of criminal cultists that caused tremendous suffering and death, all in the name of their leader Shadow Corrupter. However, it is noted how most of them have [[TragicVillain suffered in someway themselves in the past]], and crossing paths with Shadow made them worse since he kept them at their lowest to make it seem like they had no choice but to serve him. Thus, after they were defeated by Team Flash in The Lost City, [[spoiler:Faust]] decides that most of them deserve a second chance. So, with the exception of Shadow Corrupter and one of his CoDragons, Armalum, all the other members have [[LaserGuidedAmnesia all of their memories erased except for their own names]], in the hopes that without Shadow's influence on them they can better themselves. This is played straight for most of the amnesiac members, since when they are briefly seen again in a flashback in "A Returning Storm" they are all happy with their lives now and have been given a home by a group of kind ponies. The only subversion is [[TokenEvilTeammate Storm Blade]], who leaves the group to due to refusing to accept not knowing about his past and sets out on a quest to find out who is responsible for his stolen memories and make them pay, not caring about any lives he destroys in the process.

** If the above was the case, it's possibly the descriptions for the monsters themselves in ''WesternAnimation/MonstersINC'' and ''WesternAnimation/MonstersUniversity.'' With the exception of Randall that is...
** This trope can be said about the villains in all the ''WesternAnimation/ToyStory'' movies.

It should be noted that the TropeNamer Creator/JeanJacquesRousseau did not philosophize that humans in their natural state were actually "good", but rather humans who are without a social contract have no morality/concept of good and evil and as such, will act in their own self-interest but cannot do so maliciously--that is to say, that people are naturally ''innocent'' in the same way [[ChildrenAreInnocent we understand children to be]].

[[HanlonsRazor Hanlon's Razor and Grey's Law]] present an interesting related notion: assume an action arises from stupidity or ignorance until it is proven to be intentional evil, and that sufficiently misguided actions are indistinguishable from actual evil (in a similar vein to PoesLaw). Thus, [[AmbiguousInnocence "innocent" and "harmless" are not the same]]: from this viewpoint, it's not so much "KidsAreCruel" as [[ObliviouslyEvil Kids are Obliviously Evil]]/[[TheIngenue Kids Are Ingenues]]. Although it's not truly evil to err or make a mistake without desiring another person to suffer, it's effectively harmful as well. Thus, it can be inferred that, in truth, people being born innocent as we understand infants to be, whether or not they're capable of unwittingly causing harm, and only later being truly evil as a result of corrupting themselves with self-interest and greed, is true in accordance with this trope; for people to cease to value others' well-being for whatever reason, and desire what's worst for others, or to willfully remain ignorant or uncaring of how their actions harm others, is the point at which they are evil. Desiring the suffering of another can also be evil in two different ways: people can be actively evil and hate another person (or other people) by desiring that they suffer, or people can be passively evil and not care about others' well-being, which is just as evil.

** [=RPG=] villains like [[VideoGame/SuperMarioRPG Smithy]], [[VideoGame/PaperMarioTheThousandYearDoor the Shadow Queen]], [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiSuperstarSaga Cackletta, Fawful]], [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiPartnersInTime the shroobs]], [[VideoGame/SuperPaperMario Dimentio]], and [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiDreamTeam Antasma]] are more fully evil, however.

* In ''Film/TheDarkKnight'', a recurring theme is the question of whether [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters Humans Are Evil]] or Rousseau Was Right. ComicBook/TheJoker preaches the former, that all humans are cowardly, cruel, self-serving and will happily slaughter each other to get to the top of the pile. To this end, near the end of the film, he sets up a social experiment to determine which. [[spoiler:He rigs two ships with explosives, one ferrying innocent refugees and the other carrying convicts, with each ship having access to the other ship's detonator. If one blows up the other, that ship is allowed to leave. The Joker gives them 10 minutes to decide, and if no action is taken, the Joker will detonate the bombs on BOTH ships. Not only do they both defy the Joker and refuse to condemn the other to death, it's the convicts who refuse to do it first.]]

* This is a philosophy used a few times in the ''VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog'' franchise, notably at the end of both of the titles in the ''[[VideoGame/SonicAdventure Sonic]] [[VideoGame/SonicAdventure2 Adventure]]'' series (Tails and Amy, respectively).

* As revealed in the [[NewGamePlus NG+]], almost all of the conflicts in ''VideoGame/{{NieR}}'' are a result of tragic misunderstandings, with several foes just having been trying to protect themselves/loved ones. In fact, the BigBad who [[spoiler: kidnapped your daughter/sister?]] He was just trying to [[spoiler: save his. And was responsible for keeping the remnants of humanity sane.]]

** It's brought UpToEleven during the [[TournamentArc Student Council Election arc]]. Medaka openly admits [[spoiler:that she's unsure of whether she can save the leader of Class Minus 13. She ultimately does, and he even joins the student council]].

In this setting, everyone is born as a moral BlankSlate (or ''tabula rasa'', as John Locke put it), with a natural inclination to goodness. All villains in such a setting are a product of environmental influences, such as [[FreudianExcuse upbringing]], [[SocietyIsToBlame society]], or maybe just an unlucky spot of brain damage. Of course, this doesn't stop good characters from being {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s or otherwise having viewpoints and goals that bring them into conflict with other good characters.

* Seems to be borne out by the series premise of ''Series/DarkMatter'': a crew of ruthless mercenaries whose crimes are so extensive that they're on the galaxy's most wanted list and spoken about in rumor and whisper awaken from stasis aboard their ship in the pilot episode with all their memories erased, and upon learning about themselves from the ship's database, decide to defend the mining colony that Ferrous Corp (one of many evil [[MegaCorp Mega Corps]] in the setting) sent them to exterminate. They are literally reduced to [[BlankSlate Blank Slates]] with more of a tendency towards good than bad.

* One of the central themes of ''Series/TheGoodPlace'' is that, when you get down to it, people just aren't that bad. It's mentioned that trying to get humans to torture each other in the Bad Place has failed repeatedly because humans don't inherently ''want'' to hurt other people. [[spoiler:The "Good" Place at the start of the series is an attempt to see if they'll torture each other ''unwittingly''.]]

[[folder:TabletopGames]]
* The drow in ''TabletopGame/DungeonsAndDragons'' are usually believed to be AlwaysChaoticEvil because they are born that way. He may be a cliché nowadays, but [[TabletopGame/ForgottenRealms Drizzt Do'Urden]] proves otherwise.

* For how infamously dark the series is, ''Franchise/PuellaMagiMadokaMagica'' has this theme. Every single villain is either a WellIntentionedExtremist or out for {{Revenge}}. The witches are [[spoiler:former Magical Girls who were corrupted and turned into monsters and are just trying to MercyKill humanity]], while the antagonistic Magical Girls are [[spoiler:trying to fight against the system that has set them up to become witches]]- or, in the case of [[spoiler:Kagari]] from ''Manga/PuellaMagiSuzuneMagica'', she wants to avenge a loved one. Even the OverarchingVillain, [[spoiler:Kyubey/Incubator]], despite being a HateSink, is [[spoiler:trying to save the universe]], and has BlueAndOrangeMorality which leads them to [[spoiler:attempt maximization for energy production even after Madoka has created a system where no one needs to suffer]]. The other biggest examples are [[spoiler:Madoka/Gretchen and Homura/Homulily themselves]], who become two of the greatest threats to the universe [[WoobieDestroyerOfWorlds because]] of the TraumaCongaLine they suffered, and because of their [[LoveMakesYouEvil love for each other]].

* ''Fanfic/CodexEquus'': This is essentially the Vertusians' philosophy of "[[https://www.deviantart.com/comments/1/787594426/4932929594 True Good]]". To simplify it, the Vertusians believe that all sapient creatures are born inherently good, and that circumstances and corruption, not [[HobbesWasRight one's own nature]], are what makes them turn to evil. While still possessing emotions like desire, followers of True Good pursue their desires and help others with theirs without needing to exploit them or expect a reward in return, respectively. "[[NecessarilyEvil Constructive Evil]]" is considered part of True Good because it involves directing one's worst flaws/impulses towards positive ends, like punishing the genuinely wicked. The goal of the Vertusians, up to [[GodOfGood Virtucrat Fairytale]] herself, is to recreate the world at large into a {{Utopia}} where no one has no need for evil even for constructive purposes, even though Fairytale genuinely does not wish those who practice Constructive Evil any harm. However, True Good ends up deconstructed in light of [[BalanceBetweenGoodAndEvil how the world works]] - the world not only cannot exist without evil, it ''[[GoodNeedsEvil needs]]'' evil in order to continue surviving, let alone function properly. And by implication, True Good calls for the eradication of all evils, which includes beings like Temnobog, who, [[spoiler:due to being the living bisected half of High King Bogolenya]], literally cannot live without his twin brother, Belyolen, as one would die if the other dies. [[GodOfTheDead Moon Ray Vaughoof]] also compares True Good to [[https://www.deviantart.com/comments/1/884432948/4933045389 throwing out all the Hell-Realms in the world while keeping only the Heaven-Realms]]. The Vertusians themselves are at a loss in regards to replacing evil with a better alternative, and it's through the existence of [[{{Mordor}} Malrègnar]] that they are able to continue existing at all without massive consequences. However, it's reconstructed as True Good ''does'' have truth to it - the fact that all sapient creatures are born with the ability to choose to be evil yet are naturally inclined to be good [[spoiler:implies that there are higher forces at work who ''wanted'' the world to function that way... and that whoever created ''those'' higher forces is ultimately ''the'' BigGood of ''the entire setting'']].

[[folder:RealLife]]
* 2300 years ago the Zou-nese (modern-day Shandong province, China) Confucian Philosopher Mencius (Meng-zi, literally 'Master Meng') espoused the then-revolutionary idea that people were innately good. This was a deeply troublesome idea since it implied that people didn't ''need'' Kings or Emperors to bully them into behaving morally, so this aspect of his philosophy was firmly glossed over until the 19th-20th centuries.
* School bomber [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Kehoe Andrew Kehoe]] had a sign at his burnt-down farm that said "[[SocietyIsToBlame Criminals are made]], not born."
* Provided they last long enough, most human societies and civilizations apparently tend to get more peaceful and tolerant. Whilst there are notable and unfortunate exceptions, it does appear that we as a culture (if not as a species) are becoming if not more loving and caring, then at least less violent and bloodthirsty.
* From a world stage picture one could argue the world has (in general) seemingly never been more peaceful. While there are still conflicts and wars, many disputes overall are solved through negotiation, as opposed to outright elimination of the opposing side. The number of wars fought ''between countries'' that are going on as opposed to internal conflicts can be counted on the fingers of one's hand. On the other side, it could be argued that weapons technology that's reached today's level of destruction and control is what really keeps the peace. Powerful nations simply can't afford the ramifications of armed conflict, so it's the threat of wholesale destruction that keeps conflicts limited in scope.
** From a smaller-scale model, there are of course still regional scuffles, skirmishes, and murders that are woefully common. [[note]]Though we stress Academia has little way of accounting for those of these actions that the perpetrators actually get away with. However more or less common in reality they are, is always up for debate.[[/note]]
* Universalist preacher [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hosea_Ballou Hosea Ballou]] was of this belief, writing that those who emphasized a FireAndBrimstoneHell were inadvertently harming their congregations.
-->''By having such an example constantly before their eyes, they have become so transformed into its image, that, whenever they have had the power, they have actually executed a vengeance on men and women, which evinced that the cruelty of their doctrine had overcome the native kindness and compassion of the human heart.''
** And in a (possibly apocryphal) conversation with a Baptist minister, the Baptist claimed that "if I were a Universalist and feared not the fires of hell, I could hit you over the head, steal your horse and saddle, and ride away, and I'd still go to heaven." Ballou's response: "If you were a Universalist, the idea would never occur to you."
* ''Lord of the Flies'' has been praised by reviewers and readers alike for its "psychological realism" and ability to describe the "universal darkness at the heart of Men." [[https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/may/09/the-real-lord-of-the-flies-what-happened-when-six-boys-were-shipwrecked-for-15-months?CMP=share_btn_tw Yet, when the events of the novel were accidentally replicated in Real Life, instead of enduring a slow descent to madness and chaos, the children created a peaceful island commune, divided tasks equitably, and efficiently rationed out resources so they could wait for rescue. Sure enough, they were ready when it came.]]
** Except it has been argued that this wasn't that Golding intended when writing the book at all. Golding was a teacher in a boy's school, and knew how incredibly awful they had the capacity of being. The book was intended to be a commentary exclusively on a very specific class of people in that situation: namely, white, well off, British boys who had been spoiled rotten and filled with thoughts of how theirs was the proper "British" way. The book was intended as a deconstruction of what he saw as an overly-idealistic trend in children's books at the time, of young (again, usually white and mostly male) children surviving alone on islands. Golding knew those kind of boys. He knew what they would ''actually'' do. There was no intended commentary on overall human nature,
* For those who believe that KidsAreCruel, it could be because ''adults'' can be cruel. Chances are children who bully other children may have been raised by the wrong kind of parents. That is, the parents were either PushoverParents who neglected to discipline their kids for wrongdoing or they were AbusiveParents whose kids [[MisplacedRetribution took their wrath out on weaker kids]]. From there, the other kids learn that being cruel to the victim is acceptable and will garner praise from their peers. Thankfully, anyone who was raised by [[GoodParents the right kind of parents]] would know that it doesn't have to be that way.
* A hilariously ironic show of this came from [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acali The Acali Experiment]], an experiment run by anthopologist Santiago Genovés in 1973, consisting of leaving a group of four men and six women across a 100-day long raft trip across the Atlantic and -- without explaining what the purpose of the experiment was -- seeing what happened. It was a resounding failure only in regards to the actual hypothesis; Genovés believed that [[HumansAreBastards left to their own devices, they would devolve into violent debauchery as men fought and killed each other over the women]], but the crew members got along ''astonishingly'' well and [[PlatonicLifePartners became lifelong friends]][[note]]There also were a few sexual hookups, but not nearly as much as the sensationalized "Sex Raft" headlines made it out to be, and everyone returned to their personal lives and relationships following the experiment[[/note]]. In fact, just about the only factor you could argue would make a case for the hypothesis [[SelfDefeatingProphecy was Genovés himself]], who became increasingly antagonistic as the experiment went OffTheRails, earning the ire of everyone onboard by virtue of being an abusive ControlFreak, trying to incite drama and conflict that everyone was quick to resolve amicably.
[[/folder]]

** One of Professor Elm's aides in ''VideoGame/PokemonGoldAndSilver'' is of the opinion that there are no inherently "bad" Pokémon, only bad trainers. Even the most explicitly malicious Pokémon generally have a good reason for being so; including Mewtwo ([[BeingTorturedMakesYouEvil the result of nightmarish genetic experiments]]), Darkrai ([[PowerIncontinence no control over the nightmares it brings to the people around it]]), Yveltal ([[AboveGoodAndEvil depicted as more of a force of nature than a villainous force]]) and Necrozma ([[HumansAreBastards betrayed by the people who once worshipped it,]] [[HorrorHunger left permanently crippled]] and in constant pain). And yet, they and other Pokémon that have a known violent disposition (Gyarados, Hydreigon, etc.) are still perfectly capable of bonding with the player over time.

** Even the various {{Big Bad}}s of the games show this. Giovanni -- despite his selfish motives -- still faces his defeat with a degree of honor, the leaders of Team Aqua and Magma are both {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s that pull a HeelFaceTurn when they realize [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone just how badly their plans backfire]], even ''[[OmnicidalManiac Cyrus]]'' is implied to have had [[FreudianExcuse a pretty horrible childhood]], N is an AntiVillain with his heart in the right place, [[spoiler: Lysandre's]] stated to have once tried to genuinely help people until he went insane due to being convinced of his own limitations and the stupidity of the human race and [[spoiler:Lusamine]] used to be a good parent before the disappearance of her husband and her encounter with Nihilego drove her crackers. [[spoiler:Chairman Rose]]'s villainy is driven by [[spoiler:his]] genuine concern about Galar's future. [[spoiler:Ghetsis, however, has no excuse at all. Which has made him the most depraved of all Pokemon villains. ]]

** [=RPG=] villains like [[VideoGame/SuperMarioRpg Smithy]], [[VideoGame/PaperMarioTheThousandYearDoor the Shadow Queen]], [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiSuperstarSaga Cackletta, Fawful]], [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiPartnersInTime the shroobs]], [[VideoGame/SuperPaperMario Dimentio]], and [[VideoGame/MarioAndLuigiDreamTeam Antasma]] are more fully evil, however.

** Even the various {{Big Bad}}s of the games show this. Giovanni -- despite his selfish motives -- still faces his defeat with a degree of honor, the leaders of Team Aqua and Magma are both {{Well Intentioned Extremist}}s that pull a HeelFaceTurn when they realize [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone just how badly their plans backfire]], even ''[[OmnicidalManiac Cyrus]]'' is implied to have had [[FreudianExcuse a pretty horrible childhood]], N is an AntiVillain with his heart in the right place, [[spoiler: Lysandre's]] stated to have once tried to genuinely help people until he went insane due to being convinced of his own limitations and the stupidity of the human race and [[spoiler:Lusamine]] used to be a good parent before the disappearance of her husband and her encounter with Nihilego drove her crackers. [[spoiler:Ghetsis, however, has no excuse at all. Which has made him the most depraved of all Pokemon villains. ]]

** Except it has been argued that this wasn't that Golding intended when writing the book at all. Golding was a teacher in a boy's school, and knew how incredibly awful they had the capacity of being. The book was intended to be a commentary exclusively on a very specific class of people in that situation: namely, white, well off, British boys who had been spoiled rotten and filled with thoughts of how theirs was the proper "British" way. The book was intended as a deconstruction of what he saw as an overly-idealistic trend in children's books at the time, of young (again, usually white and mostly male) children surviving alone on islands. Golding knew those boys. He knew what they would ''actually'' do. There was no intended commentary on overall human nature,