History Main / GunsAreWorthless

* In the ''VideoGame/{{Fallout}}'' series of games, having a low skill in guns makes them utterly worthless weapons, subject to low damage, poor aiming and frustratingly common jamming problems.

* Played with in ''AttackOnTitan''. While huge cannons rip through Titans easily due to Titans being MadeOfPlasticine, the Titan's HealingFactor doesn't let it keep them down for more than a few minutes. It's somewhat averted that cannons are used effectively to slow down Titans and give civilians time to evacuate. Also, high-explosive shells are used to wipe out Titans in during the end of the Battle of Trost. And when [[spoiler: Titans are sighted within Wall Rose]], the Garrison used cannons to bring down Titans and let elite soldiers like Rico finish them off.

* ''[[VideoGame/Prototype]]'' played this trope in a rather realistic way. Guns are actually very powerful against what you'd expect them to work on. Walkers, the basic mutated humans that you face in droves, usually die after a few rounds to the face, same with the soldiers. Problem is, over time you get giant mutants that are more than capable of shrugging off small arms fire, which quickly makes guns useless in favor of your powers.

* ''VideoGame/Prototype'' played this trope in a rather realistic way. Guns are actually very powerful against what you'd expect them to work on. Walkers, the basic mutated humans that you face in droves, usually die after a few rounds to the face, same with the soldiers. Problem is, over time you get giant mutants that are more than capable of shrugging off small arms fire, which quickly makes guns useless in favor of your powers.

* ''VideoGame/Prototype''played this trope in a rather realistic way. Guns are actually very powerful against what you'd expect them to work on. Walkers, the basic mutated humans that you face in droves, usually die after a few rounds to the face, same with the soldiers. Problem is, over time you get giant mutants that are more than capable of shrugging off small arms fire, which quickly makes guns useless in favor of your powers.

** Note that the same thing would happen with a melee weapon/lightsaber fight, although this is almost always glossed over. Realistically, unless you have a sword that resists lightsabers you are both going to kill each other in a single stroke, as both weapons will pass through each other effortlessly and into your squishy flesh.

* In [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergey_Lukyanenko Sergey Lukyanenko's]] ''A Lord from Planet Earth'' trilogy, guns, as well as all forms of explosive, nuclear, and energy weapons, are generally disabled through the use of [[AppliedPhlebotinum neutralizing fields]]. Somehow, the field generators are able to prevent the chemical reactions that cause a gun to go off from occurring. This leaves only one form of combat (apparently, nobody in that [[TheVerse Verse]] believes in [[MyKungFuIsStrongerThanYours unarmed combat]]) - sword-fighting. The swords almost exclusively used in combat are [[AbsurdlySharpBlade Absurdly Sharp Blades]], which requires a different style of sword-fighting than with normal bladed weapons.

** Outside of spirits, however, the trope is inverted. Any player who thinks a "Street Samurai" is obligated to go into battle with nothing but a katana and the spirit of the warrior is bound to end up a punctured red mess on the pavement. In nine times out of ten firearms are generally the quickest and easiest way to go when you want someone dead.

* In ''SpiritOfTheCentury'' guns, fists, and melee weapons do all the same amount of damage. Because it's a [[RuleOfCool Pulp World]] it's assumed that someone with a 3 in Guns is just as lethal with those guns as someone with a 3 in Fists. (Guns do retain an edge in range, for which the Fists skill notionally compensates by not needing a gun in the first place -- genre-appropriately, it's expected that characters will be deprived of their weapons or at least opportunities to casually use them at least some of the time.)

* In ''SpiritOfTheCentury'' guns, fists, and melee weapons do all the same amount of damage. Because it's a [[RuleOfCool Pulp World]] it's assumed that someone with a 3 in guns is just as lethal with those guns as someone with a 3 in fists.

In games, especially in settings where firearms would be {{Game Breaker}}s but the [[RuleOfCool "neato" factor is too great to ignore]], this trope is often reflected in a reduction of firearm effectiveness and power compared to "standard" melee weapons, sometimes to the point where [[PistolWhip bludgeoning an enemy with a gun]] will do significantly more damage than actually shooting them with it. Again, ammunition also tends to be used as a limiting factor; swords don't need to be reloaded, after all. Or, the designers can make a preference for melee weapons a matter of practicality, as in "hack and slash" games, where being able to [[HerdHittingAttack attack many foes around you in one quick motion]] would often be better than being able to only fire at a single enemy in front.

* Let's not forget that the modern firearm is a ''vast'' improvement over the early models when it comes to aiming and reliability. When your projectile-thrower will be more useful as a club if the weather gets a bit too damp for it, it better be a really ''good'' club. Consider, too, the problems that'd be caused if your enemy does not helpfully clump together and the best your guns do for aiming is 'point in general direction of the enemy.' Long story short, what we're saying is that [[TruthInTelevision there was in fact an early period of time]] when guns ''were'' worthless. The problem is, people are never seen ''using'' those early worthless models.
** "In effect, rather than making plate armour obsolete, the use of firearms stimulated the development of plate armour into its later stages. For most of that period, it allowed horsemen to fight while being the targets of defending arquebuseers without being easily killed. Full suits of armour were actually worn by generals and high-ranking commanders right up to the second decade of the 18th century. It was the only way they could be mounted and survey the overall battlefield with safety from distant musket fire." [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armor#Early - Wikipedia]]
** However, several contempary accounts describe early guns as being highly effective on the battlefield, arguably superior to bows-one account describes a siege where hundreds were killed by arquebus wounds, as opposed to one man who died from longbow fire (because the wound became infected). In addition, arrows were described as being unable to reliably penetrate the armour worn by men at arms, whilst the guns were highly dangerous. When the tendency for gunless civilisations to adopt them as soon as possible is taken into account, it seems like RL was playing with this trope for quite some time.
*** Many of the limitations on early fire-arms were as much about training and cost of munitions as they were about problems with the guns themselves (such as long rates of fire and increasing inaccuracy beyond a certain distance). This is one of the reasons why the "massed muskets in formation" tactic lasted as long as it did; when your soldiers have only shot one or two rounds in training before being marched onto a battlefield, massing them was the best way to change advantage of the (not surprisingly) inaccurate individual gunfire.
** When talking about unimpressive early firearms, [[SmallReferencePools many people think of the 1400s]] but what was fielded then was the result of continual improvement since 1200s. Historians chalk up European conquest of the Americas to ingenuity, and luck with disease more than any technological edge, and European colonialism didn't have comparable success again until the 1800s in areas where disease was in the enemy's favor. The initial game changer was the cannon, which could take down walls and sink ships, another 400s years before guns were enough on their own.
** By the 1400's hand guns, if not arquebuses, were a part of warfare and were quite useful. Now, that being said, they weren't by themselves a game changer and were inferior to other weapons in many ways. That doesn't mean, however, that they were useless -- it simply means that they had their place on the battlefield along with many other weapons and ways to defend against those weapons. It really wasn't until the 1600's when guns became completely dominant on the battlefield, but before then they were still a major part of most European armies and did change the way wars were fought.
** The Renaissance saw military doctrines that combined the use of firearms with older weapons in ways that fiction today rarely depicts. For example, [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pike_and_shot pike and shot]] tactics, which combined pikemen with arquebusiers.
** If anything, the psychological effect of firearms in the early days could be something. In a time where the loudest thing was metal clanging and men shouting war cries, explosions could be pretty startling.
** The comment about aiming in particular seems off, as we have accounts of sharpshooters on the battlefield starting from the early 15th century at least - almost a century before the invention of rifling. The inaccuracy of black powder firearms is often wildly exaggerated due to tactics that were adopted (starting in the late 16th century) that emphasized rate of fire over accuracy, as well as late 17th century increases in the size of armies that lead to a drop in quality.

* Back in the day, [[BayonetYa the bayonet]] was there because sometimes charging something was preferable to a long reload. As guns became less and less worthless, a bayonet was actually more useful as a tool than anything, further showing how far gun tech has come.
** The bayonet was developed primarily to allow musketeers to defend themselves against cavalry, allowing armies to dispense with the pikemen who had previously been charged with this task.

** It's also a bit of a misconception that bayonets are used only for strict combat purposes. This was true back in the days of ball in musket, but following bayonet innovations made in Prussia, the bayonet was combined with the field knife to create one multipurpose tool. Now days, the bayonet and the combat knife are pretty much the same tool, and used to do things such as cut wire. Pure combat knives are extremely rare, issued almost exclusively to Special Operations units and single-purpose bayonets are almost entirely extinct.
* Before the adoption of bayonets, musketeers would sometimes have swords as a close combat weapon, since swords where better for that then using the gun as a club
* The "Tueller Drill" is the source of the "21 foot rule". The rule states that within 21 feet, a knife is superior to a gun, because the man with the knife can close that distance within 1.5 seconds, faster than it can take the guy with the gun to draw, aim and fire. This is a misconception. While it is true the "Tueller Drill" determined that the gap ''could'' be crossed that quickly, it's obviously not a certainty. The reason why this was a problem was that if a police officer fired too early at a knife-wielding suspect, they could be seen as shooting someone who was not an immediate threat and charged with murder. If too late, you have a stabbed cop. A gunman could draw a weapon in that time, but police have the legal considerations to take in before doing so. This "rule" has even been invoked in media, ''Series/CriminalMinds'', in the episode "The Tribe".

*** Also is the fact that guns are LOUD, and it is nearly impossible to commit a crime without somebody hearing the bang.

* During the Peninsular War, TheDukeOfWellington, GenreSavvy FourStarBadass that he was, inquired if a corps of longbowmen could be raised for the British Army. Why? Because the average British soldier could fire just 3 musket rounds a minute. However, a longbowman could fire up to six rounds a minute. At the Battle of Agincourt, the English deployed 7000 archers, meaning that in the first minute of the battle the English fired 42,000 arrows, a firing rate of 700 ''per second'', at comparable ranges to a Napoleonic fusilier. Unfortunately, by the [=1810s=], there were no longer enough men skilled enough in the use of the longbow. Had there been enough men to raise an archer corps, then Wellington's usual curb stomps would have been even easier. The only reason, in fact, that the English army abandoned the use of the longbow was because a longbowman required a life of practice in order to develop the (huge) muscles needed to draw the weapon, whilst a fusilier could be trained to proficiency in a week.
** His Russian counterpart Field Marshal Kutuzov, however, ''had'' been able to muster a corps of archers, as Bashkir nomads in lower Urals still much preferred bows to the slow and cumbersome muskets of the time. Add to that the fact that Bashkir composite bow, while about three times shorter than English longbow, was significantly heavier to pull, made those men (who in addition were born in the saddle) a terrifying force indeed. While their actual participation in Napoleonic Wars is more of a footnote (they were mostly used for light guard duty and to harrass the French supply trains), Bashkir horse archers is the last documented case of the large-scale use of a bow by a modern army in a conventional warfare.
** The Bashkirs were neither terrifying nor particularly useful. French army soldiers gave them the mocking nickname of "Little Cupids" and they were by far the least feared of the tsar's men. As for the Wellington archer story, this is oft repeated but there is no source attesting it at the time, making it very likely to be the work of victorian antiquarians. There are many reasons why every other steppe tribe had switched to guns as soon as they could, and the old saw about "numbers" which is often repeated by english historians is the last of these.

* In ''MassEffect2'', Shepard's ''punches'' deal more damage than bullets. However, it should be noted that the guns are in no way weak, and Shepard is at that point essentially an indestructible cyborg.

** In-universe, the description given for the Lasgun states that it can take off limbs and cause fatal burns against most conventional targets (i.e: other humans) and it's destructive force is comparable to that of a modern-day AK47. The Bolt Pistol, standard sidearm to any Space Marine, is a one-handed RPG launcher. The problem is though, the targets are usually monsters with shells thicker than most structurally sound bunkers, supersoldiers clad in power armor surrounded by a forcefield/daemonic energies, undead skeletal machines that can regenerate their steel, and EldritchAbominations that defy reality with every breath.

** In addition, characters in the BlazBlue universe do not use regular guns or gunpowder. The in-story explanation being that conventional weapons had no effect on the Black Beast, and the only way to damage the beast was through seither-powered Ars Armagus (which essentially allowed mankind to use Magic). Since seither came from the Black Beast, concentrations were highest in proximity to the beast and allowed for more efficient usage of Armagus. This lead to weapons being designed for close- or melee-ranged, and after the Dark War, the population just continued to use Ars.

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[[folder: Fan Fiction]]
* HalfLifeFullLifeConsequences: "I have to kill fast and bullets too slow!"
* Zig-zagged in ''Fanfic/PerfectionIsOverrated''. It is pointed out that guns have comparatively less power than the Himes' abilities. [[SubvertedTrope On the other hand]], when faced with a [[ParodySue SUE]] who has the ability to drastically reduce the effectiveness of everyone else's powers, and completely cut off one person's power, Natsuki obtains a pistol and [[spoiler:kills the SUE in one shot]]. Then [[spoiler:double subverted when Natsuki tries to kill [[AuthorAvatar the Avatar]] with the same gun, only for him to make all the bullets disappear, but he points out that [[NighInvulnerable nothing she could bring to bear would have any effect on him anyway]].]]
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[[caption-width-right:345:[- Yeah, a freakin' ''[[ImprobableWeapon hairclip]]'' is more \\
powerful than the Gatling gun.-] ]]

* ''VideoGame/StarOceanTheLastHope'' at least tries to explain this. Soldiers realistically use railguns to try to kill the giant bugs that attack them, but apparently the eletromagnetic signature emitted by the railgun when fired allows the bugs to block the shots with some kind of shield. Protagonist Edge only gives up on his railgun when he drops it, and then grabs the first weapon he can, which just happens to be a sword-like cutting tool, which, of course, works perfectly.

* In an early Doctor Who episode, as UNIT fires uselessly at a super-robot, the Brigadier says "Just once, it'd be nice to be up against something that isn't immune to bullets."
* Guns are useless in TheVampireDiaries as well... unless they're fitted with wooden bullets, which pretty much completely disable a vampire. And yes, [[TruthInTelevision both wooden bullets and silver bullets are possible IRL,]] just less effective than the usual lead.
* Possibly averted in Star Trek in that the Borg can adapt to energy weapons, but are seemingly vulnerable to bullets and blades.

* ThatGuyWithTheGlasses's ''Suburban Knights'' takes this UpToEleven. Multiple times guns are fired at close range into large groups of people, sometimes even with bullet animations bouncing off people, to no effect whatsoever.