History Main / AthensAndSparta

* ''Franchise/{{Dune}}'': Gives us Caladan (Athens) and Geidi Prime (Sparta). Caladan is a bit harsh and primal, but still beautiful, covered in vast oceans, has a somewhat Mediterranean climate, and is ruled by the just and fair House Atreides. Geidi Prime is an industrial hellhole ruled by the sadistic and hedonistic Harkonens. The visual design on the [[Film/Dune1984 David Lynch film]] really drives the point home. The prequel novels reveal that this wasn't always the case. Prior to the Butlerian Jihad, Geidi Prime was fairly green and pleasant, and Xavier Harkonen expressed a desire to settle down there one day. Then it suffered a ColonyDrop and, eventually, became the seat of power for House Harkonen (they initially only had the icy world of Lankiveil) and heavily industrialized.

Needless to say, these two cities probably do not get along and might even wage wars on each other. And seeing as they are right next door to each other, violence and espionage are probably common. At best the two cities are rivals, at worst they are sworn enemies. Named after the real life [[UsefulNotes/AncientGreece Greek]] cities, a work's conflict centers on two cities with opposing cultures. Expect the one that focuses more on peace to be the protagonist faction 100% of the time. In fiction, this is a good justification for a [[BlackAndWhiteMorality black and white conflict]] and a way to find the heroes likable, and the villains despicable. On the occasions [[GreyAndGrayMorality exceptions]] to the moral conflict exist, expect both cities to be [[BothSidesHaveAPoint largely correct about the flaws of the other]], and for the plot to revolve around [[ReconcileTheBitterFoes reconciliation between the two]].

Needless to say, these two cities probably do not get along and might even wage wars on each other. And seeing as they are right next door to each other, violence and espionage are probably common. At best the two cities are rivals, at worst they are sworn enemies. Named after the real life [[UsefulNotes/AncientGreece Greek]] cities, a work's conflict centers on two cities with opposing cultures. Expect the one that focuses more on peace to be the protagonist faction 100% of the time. In fiction, this is a good justification for a [[BlackAndWhiteMorality black and white conflict]] and a way to find the heroes likable, and the villains despicable. On the occasions [[GreyAndGrayMorality exceptions]] to the moral conflict to exist, expect both cities to be about the same, morally speaking, and for the plot to revolve around [[ReconcileTheBitterFoes reconciliation between the two]].

Needless to say, these two cities probably do not get along and might even wage wars on each other. And seeing as they are right next door to each other, violence and espionage are probably common. At best the two cities are rivals, at worst they are sworn enemies. Named after the real life [[UsefulNotes/AncientGreece Greek]] cities, a work's conflict centers on two cities with opposing cultures. Expect the one that focuses more on peace to be the protagonist faction 100% of the time. In fiction, this is a good justification for a [[BlackAndWhiteMorality black and white conflict]] and a way to find the heroes likeable, and the villains despicable.

[[/folder]]

[[folder:RealLife]]
* The TropeNamer is the real life rivalry between ancient Athens and ancient Sparta. Their rivalry has long since ended; nowadays, modern UsefulNotes/{{Athens}} is the capital and largest city of UsefulNotes/{{Greece}}, while modern Sparta is a town in the rural Peloponnese with little choice but to yield to Athens's dominance (modern Sparta plays ''fifth'' fiddle in today's Peloponnese, behind not only illustrious names like Corinth but also towns that barely existed in ancient times like Kalamata and Tripolis).
** In modern UsefulNotes/{{Greece}}, UsefulNotes/{{Athens}} seems to be at odds with its co-capital, Thessaloniki, a rivalry which itself is parodied over and over again in Greek media, due to both of them being the biggest and most powerful cities of the country.
* Athens and Sparta were themselves predated by the Mycenaean Greeks, who were warrior kingdoms and the Minoans, traders and artists and the basis of Atlantis, with little archaeological evidence of extended warfare until the Mycenaeans attacked them.
* The UsefulNotes/PunicWars pitted UsefulNotes/TheRomanRepublic against Carthage. Both of them were expansionist city-states with client-kingdoms. [[WrittenByTheWinners The only known sources for the conflict come down from Roman historians]], who as a rule tended to paint Rome as the civilized land of virtue, patriotism and military glory and they loathed Carthage and its population, who they painted as "barbarians" (for a time their word to describe all non-Romans, be they Italian, Gallic, Gothic, Britannic, Persian or anything else). The Romans noted that the Carthaginians practiced HumanSacrifice of children, of which we apparently have some archaeological evidence but how much it was actually done is highly disputed. Likewise, the Romans, as per Livy, themselves performed HumanSacrifice after their defeat at the Battle of Cannae but Livy is sure to remind us that [[SuspiciouslySpecificDenial this is the last time it happened]].
** Roman writers went on about how Roman glory was built on citizen soldiers while UsefulNotes/HannibalBarca's army was composed largely of mercenaries. Indeed, Carthage's merchant oligarchy hired mercenaries and clients to fight their wars for them, and Roman victory was because of its ideology and patriotism and their ability to subvert or annex Carthaginian allies. So in a certain sense, Carthage is the Athens to Rome's Sparta... the former is a sophisticated, worldly, commercial society while the latter is a military-driven society bound by strong ideology. Likewise, Carthage, like Athens, was primarily a naval power, while the Romans were largely and mainly a land army like the Spartans.
** Incidentally, during UsefulNotes/TheFrenchRevolution and UsefulNotes/TheNapoleonicWars, France painted England as "the Modern Carthage" with themselves as the Romans. They did this because they pointed out that England was a largely naval power while the French under Napoleon were a land-based power. The former was driven largely by mercantile and commercial interests while the latter was bound by ideology and promises like meritocracy and liberty. Of course, the English saw themselves as the true Romans opposing the Modern Hannibal, Napoleon.
* UsefulNotes/{{North Korea}} and UsefulNotes/{{South Korea}}. South Korea is a wealthy, technologically advanced and respected democracy with fast internet connection, and ''VideoGame/StarCraft'' tournaments. However, North Korea is poor, has scarce food, a HUGE military and is a communist dictatorship. Spying and espionage are common among the two Koreas and both want to reunify the country, but under their own ideals.
** This is largely a recent development. During the UsefulNotes/KoreanWar and its aftermath, both nations were brutal dictatorships that committed war crimes during the conflict and committed many human rights abuses after the war. North Korea likewise was bombed into the Stone Age during the war, with Pyongnang almost entirely destroyed and losing all its infrastructure, subsisting on aid given by USSR and China (who both had their own problems) while South Korea received much aid from America for redevelopment.
* UsefulNotes/{{Saudi Arabia}} and UsefulNotes/{{Iran}}, the two main Middle Eastern powerhouses, can be seen as Athens and Sparta respectively. Saudi Arabia is a (slightly sketchy) ally of the United States, with CrystalSpiresAndTogas as buildings and wealthy [[ArabOilSheikh businessmen who make big investments in oil]]. It is sparsely populated with an average-sized army equipped with advanced contemporary technology. Iran, on the other hand, is considered one of America's greatest foes. Most of its urban buildings are rather ill-coloured, and the streets can be seen as far more tradition with bazaars and markets. It is also a theocratic dictatorship with a highly skilled and disciplined soldiers despite using mostly military technology from the '80s and '90s. Oh, and the two are using smaller Middle Eastern countries to fight a proxy war against each other.
** Arguably deconstructed, similarly to the original Athens and Sparta. While Saudi Arabia may be the wealthier nation, the lack of freedom and the sheer amount of human rights violations in the country is on par with, if not even ''worse'' than, its northern Shia rival. In fact, only recently did the country allow women to drive thanks to the policies of the new prince Mohammed bin Salman [[BreadAndCircuses (who more or less only permitted them for publicity)]]. Overall, it is just another brutal theocratic dictatorship not all that different from Iran but it gets better treatment from the rest of the world because it's better at public relations.
* In America, many people, especially [[UsefulNotes/NewYorkCity New Yorkers]] and other East Coasters, see themselves as Athens to Los Angeles' Sparta -- and vice versa, with [[UsefulNotes/LosAngeles Los Angelenos]] and other West Coasters considering ''themselves'' the Athens to the East Coast Spartans. Each of these two cosmopolitan coastal cities see themselves as the UsefulNotes/MeltingPot, the center of the art and theater worlds and of politics, agreeing with each other that the rest of America is {{flyover country}} of little interest, but each also sees the other city as a trashy West Coast wanna-be / East Coast has-been.
--> '''Fran Liebowitz''': "Los Angeles is a large city-like area surrounding the Beverly Hills Hotel."
** The East Coast and the West Coast, particularly in and around the metro areas of the large coastal cities like Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Boston, New York, Philadelphia, and Washington D.C, together can be seen as the Athens to the rest of the United States Sparta. The Coastal states particularly the cites are rich centers of culture, while other regions tend to struggle a lot more with money and are generally seen as backwaters. A rule of thumb is that any part of the country inhabited by what Republicans call 'coastal elites' are the Athens, while parts inhabited by what Democrats call 'deplorable redneck gun nuts' are the Sparta.
** In general, American liberals have proudly seen themselves as "sophisticated, wise, educated" Athens over the "crude war-mongers" of the other side while American conservatives have proudly seen themselves as "tough, practical, effective" Sparta over the "decadent dilettantes" of the other side, regardless of which party/region is conservative and which party/region is liberal that era.
** Texas has its own version: the (very liberal) big cities, especially Austin, San Antonio and Houston, are Athens, and the (very conservative) rural areas in between them are Sparta.
* Some of the strongest sports rivalries between cities occur as fanbases tend to sort themselves into two sides with differing cultures, especially so if the cities are geographically close to each other. A few examples:
** During the early part of the 20th century, the rivalry between UsefulNotes/MajorLeagueBaseball's New York Giants and Brooklyn Dodgers had this kind of connotation. Although Brooklyn had ceased to exist as a separate municipality from the City of New York as of the 1898 consolidation, it very much retained its own character as a working-class area. This extended to the local fanbase -- the Dodgers nickname came from some writers [[AppropriatedAppelation saying that their spectators had to dodge the trolleys]] crisscrossing the streets of Brooklyn on the way to Ebbets Field. By contrast, the New York Giants based in Manhattan were the team of the well-to-do, Manhattan being where all the big banks and cultural centers were. They even played at the Polo Grounds, a sport traditionally associated with the rich. When the franchises left for California in 1958, their rivalry was carried with them.
** The UsefulNotes/NationalFootballLeague's Raiders have spent most of their existence in metro areas shared with another NFL team -- with the 49ers during their tenures in the Bay Area and with the Rams during their time in Los Angeles. Especially during their time as the Oakland Raiders, they and the Raider Nation fanbase considered themselves the Sparta (Oakland being the working-class main port of the Bay Area and the team cultivating an industrious, nose-grinding bad-boy outlaw image) to San Francisco's Athens (the more established and posh city with the international renown).
** At the college level, the long rivalry (nicknamed "Clean, Old-Fashioned Hate") between the University of Georgia (UGA) and the Georgia Institute of Technology (Georgia Tech) spills over into how their host cities are seen. Though both are universities for higher learning, Georgia Tech is primarily an engineering school who focuses more on solving problems, and Atlanta is more known for being a major industrial and transportation center with a culture that is less tied to the rest of the South than many others, making it the Sparta (''relatively'' speaking -- this is certainly not to suggest that Atlanta lacks culture of any kind). As for UGA? Besides being focused more on the liberal arts, the city their main campus is in is ''literally'' called Athens.
* Lancashire and Yorkshire, two counties in the North of England. Historically, much of Yorkshire remained Celtic kingdoms after Lancashire became a Roman wasteland, and later the UsefulNotes/WarsOfTheRoses were fought (Lancs = red rose, Yorks = white rose). The rivalry persists today, with there only being one route between the neighbouring counties -- and it's a [[ChokepointGeography dangerous mountain pass]]. Tykes insist that Lancastrians aren't actually Northern, which is the most damning of insults there. Lancastrians insist that their hotpot is better than the Yorkshire pudding.
* France has its two largest cities, Paris and Marseille. Paris, for all its flaws, is the greatest political and cultural center in the country, which makes it Athens. Marseille, while equally rich in history and actually more ancient than Paris, is Sparta, with its friendlier but also more aggressive social culture and high levels of delinquence. This trope is often exacerbated by soccer fans, as the PSG (''Paris Saint-Germain'') and the OM (''Olympique de Marseille'') are the two teams with the greatest rivalry in the country. The trope was also exacerbated during the UsefulNotes/COVID19Pandemic, as one of the most vocal supporters of [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroquine_and_hydroxychloroquine_during_the_COVID-19_pandemic hydroxychloroquine as a remedy against COVID]] in France was Didier Raoult, a microbiologist at the head of a medical training and research facility located in Marseille. As the efficiency of this remedy was more and more challenged by various researches, supporters of this medicine had been heard dismissing studies concluding against hydroxychloroquine's efficiency as being motivated by the Paris-Marseille rivalry.[[note]]Depending on criteria, some prefer counting Lyon as the second French major city and Marseille as the third one, but Lyon (another city with a very rich and ancient history, doubling as a cultural center and the culinary capital city of the country) fits better as another Athens than as Sparta.[[/note]]
* Taiwan is the Athens to China's Sparta. Taiwan is a growing democracy, with a relaxed atmosphere, the country of origin for Bubble and Milk Tea, and though they practice conscription, they don't take it as seriously as South Korea. Meanwhile, China, while it has an entertainment industry and [=BiliBili=] is responsible for co-hosting anime conventions, is a totalitarian society with a tense and unfriendly environment, people are constantly monitored 24/7, employ indoctrination that forces people into worshipping the Chinese Communist Party, and often give people, as early as [[https://www.themainewire.com/2023/07/exclusive-the-chinese-military-is-training-kindergarteners-for-war-in-bootcamps-across-the-country/ kindergarteners]], [[https://www.insider.com/chinese-kids-bayonet-japanese-soldiers-theme-park-military-gun-mortar-2023-5 military training]] to prepare for a war.

* ''VideoGame/CommandAndConquerRedAlert'' has the Allies and the Soviets. The Allies is TheAlliance formed to defend their countries from Soviet aggression. They rely on fast moving, high tech units in winning battles. The Soviets are an aggressive militaristic state that has no problem in using military force to expand their power. Their army's rely on brute force and large numbers to overwhelm their opposition.

* Taiwan is the Athens to China's Sparta. Taiwan is a growing democracy, with a relaxed atmosphere, the country of origin for Bubble Tea and Milk Tea, and while they practice conscription, they do not take it as seriously as South Korea. Meanwhile, China, while it has an entertainment industry, and [=BiliBili=] is responsible for co-hosting anime conventions, is a totalitarian society, with a tense and unfriendly environment, people are constantly monitored 24/7, employ indoctrination that forces people into worshipping the Chinese Communist Party, and often give people, as early as [[https://www.themainewire.com/2023/07/exclusive-the-chinese-military-is-training-kindergarteners-for-war-in-bootcamps-across-the-country/ kindergarteners]], [[https://www.insider.com/chinese-kids-bayonet-japanese-soldiers-theme-park-military-gun-mortar-2023-5 military training]] to prepare for a war.

* Taiwan is the Athens to Mainland China's Sparta. Taiwan is a growing democracy, with a relaxed atmosphere, the country of origin for Bubble Tea and Milk Tea, and while they practice conscription, they do not take it as seriously as South Korea. Mainland China, while it has an entertainment industry, and [=BiliBili=] is responsible for co-hosting anime conventions, is a totalitarian society, with a tense and unfriendly environment, people are constantly monitored 24/7, employ indoctrination that forces people to worship the Chinese Communist Party, and often give people, as early as [[https://www.themainewire.com/2023/07/exclusive-the-chinese-military-is-training-kindergarteners-for-war-in-bootcamps-across-the-country/ kindergarteners]], [[https://www.insider.com/chinese-kids-bayonet-japanese-soldiers-theme-park-military-gun-mortar-2023-5 military training]] to prepare for a war.

* Taiwan is the Athens to Mainland China's Sparta. Taiwan is a growing democracy, with a relaxed atmosphere, the country of origin for Bubble Tea and Milk Tea, and while they practice conscription, they do not take it as seriously as South Korea. Mainland China, while it has an entertainment industry, and [=BiliBili=] is responsible for co-hosting anime conventions, is a totalitarian society, with a tense and unfriendly environment, people are constantly monitored 24/7, indoctrination that involves worshipping the Chinese Communist Party, persecute minorites and dissidents, and often give people, as early as [[https://www.themainewire.com/2023/07/exclusive-the-chinese-military-is-training-kindergarteners-for-war-in-bootcamps-across-the-country/ kindergarteners]], [[https://www.insider.com/chinese-kids-bayonet-japanese-soldiers-theme-park-military-gun-mortar-2023-5 military training]] to prepare for a war.

* Taiwan is the Athens to Mainland China's Sparta. Taiwan is a growing democracy, with a relaxed atmosphere, the country of origin for Bubble Tea and Milk Tea, and while they practice conscription, they do not take it as seriously as South Korea. Mainland China, while it has an entertainment industry, and [=BiliBili=] is responsible for co-hosting anime conventions, is a totalitarian society, with a tense and unfriendly environment, people are constantly monitored 24/7, indoctrination that involves worshipping the Chinese Communist Party, persecute minorites, and, as fitting for the description of Sparta, often give people, as early as [[https://www.themainewire.com/2023/07/exclusive-the-chinese-military-is-training-kindergarteners-for-war-in-bootcamps-across-the-country/ kindergarteners]], [[https://www.insider.com/chinese-kids-bayonet-japanese-soldiers-theme-park-military-gun-mortar-2023-5 military training]] to prepare for a war.

* Creator/WoodyAllen's ''Film/AnnieHall'' famously features Alvy Singer upset about coming to Los Angeles, hating the architecture, the advertising, the lack of cultural refinement and poor West Coast fashions, while he prefers New York, the land of the UsefulNotes/MeltingPot, true culture and cosmopolitan sophistication.
* Creator/JosephLMankiewicz's ''Film/{{Cleopatra}}'' contrasts Ptolemaic Alexandria with Late-Republican Rome. The former is a bustling, advanced city of knowledge, sexuality, and antique glories, while Rome is a kind of boring dilapidated area filled with conservative, boring senators. UsefulNotes/JuliusCaesar's attraction and romance with UsefulNotes/CleopatraVII and later hers and Mark Antony's is framed in the film as stuffy Romans enjoying and preferring Hellenistic sophistication (or decadence in the eyes of Roman senators), while the conservative Octavian scapegoats Cleopatra as a slutty vamp, and proceeds to (ahistorically) murder a wise Egyptian astronomer in Rome, to prove which is the better civilization.

* Creator/CharlesDickens' ''Literature/ATaleOfTwoCities'' naturally paints London as the embodiment of peace and stability over disorderly Paris. This largely reflects his English, and Victorian, biases, but the novel also points out that London is filled with inequality and corruption and could face problems if they get too complacent, while Paris is a great city that will recover from the violence of the Revolution.
* Creator/JulesVerne's ''Literature/TheBegumsMillions'' has Dr. Sarrasin's France-ville, an utopian city built with public health in mind, opposed by "proto-Hitler" Dr. Shultz's Stahlstadt, a militaristic city dedicated only to building weapons of war, and with a vow to destroy France-ville.
* ''Literature/TheLordOfTheRings'' has Gondor, a human kingdom that is noble and heir to a powerful and advanced civilization, but on its final legs by the time of the book. Sadly, it is located right next door to {{Mordor}}.
* ''Literature/TheInheritanceCycle'' has Terim, a coastal city that is well laid out, has fancy buildings, and both [[TheHero Eragon]] and [[TheLancer Roran]] have found aid in the city from [[GentlemanAndAScholar Jeod Longshanks]]. However, one of the cities neighbors is Dras-Leona, a hellhole of a city with ramshackle buildings crammed together, people so poor that the children are half feral, and a [[CorruptChurch corrupt church]] holds a lot of influence. To make matters even worse, [[SlaveryIsASpecialKindOfEvil slavery is even legal in Dras-Leona]] [[spoiler: After the defeat of Galbatorix, Terim becomes an independent City State, while Dras-Leona is absorbed into the newly revived Broddering Kingdom.]]
* ''Franchise/{{Dune}}'' gives us Caladan (Athens) and Geidi Prime (Sparta). Caladan is a bit harsh and primal, but still beautiful, covered in vast oceans, has a somewhat Mediterranean climate, and is ruled by the just and fair House Atreides. Geidi Prime is an industrial hellhole ruled by the sadistic and hedonistic Harkonens. The visual design on the [[Film/Dune1984 David Lynch film]] really drives the point home. The prequel novels reveal that this wasn't always the case. Prior to the Butlerian Jihad, Geidi Prime was fairly green and pleasant, and Xavier Harkonen expressed a desire to settle down there one day. Then it suffered a ColonyDrop and, eventually, became the seat of power for House Harkonen (they initially only had the icy world of Lankiveil) and heavily industrialized.