History Headscratchers / DarthPlagueis

* Why did Plagueis, being from the Bane lineage as he was, think he could avert the RuleOfTwo and NOT have Palpatine murder him? What did he think would make him so special in his apprentice's eyes that together they could abandon a millenia of doctrine and that a new paradigm of Sith methods and relations could be set into place just like that?

*** This is most likely. He'll murder puppies for shits and giggles, but if someone tells him to do it, he'll probably bristle at it even if he was going to do it anyway.
*** He as much as says this, berating Plagueis for trying to turn him into "a mere messenger and intermediary" and saying that he's grateful to Plagueis as a teacher, but never as a Master.
*** The main thing he seemed angry at him about was the murder of his entire family, which Palpatine did partly because of encouragement from Plagueis, partly out of blind rage. Even from the chapter immediately following this crime, it is implied that Palpatine is genuinely unnerved by what he had just done- even if he truly hated his father, he may never have previously planned on ''killing'' him, and even if ''that'' didn't bother him, he may have regretted murdering his mother and siblings. Of course, he isn't really taking any responsibility for this (blaming Plagueis- semi-justifiably, but still) and if it counts as evidence that (and this is true in RealLife) even sociopaths like Palpatine often do have some ''sliver'' of conscience or familial affection (see MoralSociopathy), it still means that he crosses his own personal MoralEventHorizon before the first act of the novel is over, and he certainly ends the novel as a monstrous psychopath. I'm guessing then that, despite what the rest of the Tropes page seems to believe, Luceno may not believe that Palpatine was ''born'' evil; rather, while he may have been a sociopath from the very start, that doesn't mean he was destined to be the Dark Lord of the Sith, or that he was ''pure'' evil from the very beginning.
*** Despite his own claims of wanting to join the Sith since before Plagueis arrived, and from what Luceno intended, we do get a few scenes that imply the argument that Palpatine ''wasn't'' born a monster holds a lot of water. First, his relationship with Vidar Kim seemed genuinely affable, despite their political differences, and while he didn't feel any remorse about killing Vidar later, he did show reluctance to go through with it, then consoled himself by noting it would be a MercyKill, since Vidar's family is gone (believe it or not, Palpatine had ''nothing'' to do with their deaths); second, during his final confrontation with his father, Palpatine genuinely complimented Plagueis--"He's powerful, influential, and brilliant. More so than any of my professors. Head and shoulder above you! Or any of your royal confederates." So, at the time, Palpatine had two father figures he felt he could cling to, and then everything came crashing down when Plagueis cheerfully revealed that he'd lied to and manipulated him. As mentioned above, Palpatine has no compunction about killing, but he doesn't like being used, even when he was going to kill that specific person anyway for the heck of it. Hell, the fact that Plagueis used him didn't bother him as much as the fact that Plagueis ''lied'' to him--remember, the whole reason Palpatine decided to become his agent in the first place was because Plagueis was honest about his intentions for Naboo and that Palpatine would be a pawn in that scheme, something that Palpatine didn't mind. And then Plagueis goes and lies to him. For Palpatine, ''that'' was when he crossed the MoralEventHorizon and the DespairEventHorizon, and because of the magnitude of what he did, there was no going back.

** It's essentially how the Rule of Two safeguards itself: the apprentice kills the master, then decides "I'm going to rule forever with my apprentice as my minion," only for said apprentice to do the exact same thing. And so on. So, with that in mind, why take an apprentice at all? Because Sith lords are arrogant people who have a compulsive need to be at the top of a pecking order, and who better than someone you can mold into a powerful enforcer?

*** Bane only did that after [[EntertaininglyWrong he thought his first apprentice lacked the guts to confront him; she, in turn, thought he was setting a trap.]] Even Bane's attempt to cheat death made sense in Zannah's warped Social Darwinist mindset after she really thought about it.

*** There's a few other supporting elements, although they admittedly boil down to conservation of detail and may be coincidences. Plagueis first senses the presence of a force user every bit his equal on that world. He eventually concludes it was Venamis, but Venamis isn't that powerful. The captain of the ''Woebegone'' was partying with an extremely young man the night Plagueis stowed away that her crew jokingly claim she seemed almost ready to hand the ship over to; this could be Palpatine trying to manipulate his way into a first meeting and failing because she was resistant to his influence (as Plagueis also found out to her sorrow).

*** Despite his own claims of wanting to join the Sith since before Plagueis arrived, and what Luceno intended, we do get a few scenes that imply the argument that Palpatine ''wasn't'' born a monster holds a lot of water. First, his relationship with Vidar Kim seemed genuinely affable, despite their political differences, and while he didn't feel any remorse about killing Vidar later, he did show reluctance to go through with it, then consoled himself by noting it would be a MercyKill, since Vidar's family is gone (believe it or not, Palpatine had ''nothing'' to do with their deaths); second, during his final confrontation with his father, Palpatine genuinely complimented Plagueis--"He's powerful, influential, and brilliant. More so than any of my professors. Head and shoulder above you! Or any of your royal confederates." So, at the time, Palpatine had two father figures he felt he could cling to, and then everything came crashing down when Plagueis cheerfully revealed that he'd lied to and manipulated him. As mentioned above, Palpatine has no compunction about killing, but he doesn't like being used, even when he was going to kill that specific person anyway for the heck of it. Hell, the fact that Plagueis used him didn't bother him as much as the fact that Plagueis ''lied'' to him--remember, the whole reason Palpatine decided to become his agent in the first place was because Plagueis was honest about his intentions for Naboo and that Palpatine would be a pawn in that scheme, something that Palpatine didn't mind. And then Plagueis goes and lies to him. For Palpatine, ''that'' was when he crossed the MoralEventHorizon and the DespairEventHorizon, and because of the magnitude of what he did, there was no going back.

* Why did the M2 probe droid continue drilling into the dangerous accumulation of lethane? Apparently part of it's programming had been designed to override a critical fail safe command issued to it by it's Sith owners. Who would have done such a thing? Before you say Plagueis, the opportunity to murder Tenebrous only presents itself a few minutes later when the cave is crashing down. We know this because we are privy to his train of thought. It seemed like a very opportunistic killing, rather than a premeditated plan. Who else would subvert the droid's programming, though?

*** This most likely. He'll murder puppies for gits and shiggles, but if someone tells him to do it, he'll probably bristle at it even if he was going to do it anyway.

*** Main thing he seemed angry at him about was the murder of his entire family, which Palpatine did partly because of encouragement from Plagueis, partly out of blind rage. Even from the chapter immediately following this crime, it is implied that Palpatine is genuinely unnerved by what he had just done- even if he truly hated his father, he may never have previously planned on ''killing'' him, and even if ''that'' didn't bother him, he may have regretted murdering his mother and siblings. Of course, he isn't really taking any responsibility for this (blaming Plagueis- semi-justifiably, but still) and if it counts as evidence that (and this is true in RealLife) even sociopaths like Palpatine often do have some ''sliver'' of conscience or familial affection (see MoralSociopathy), it still means that he crosses his own personal MoralEventHorizon before the first act of the novel is over, and he certainly ends the novel as a monstrous psychopath. I'm guessing then that, despite what the rest of the Tropes page seems to believe, Luceno may not believe that Palpatine was ''born'' evil; rather, while he may have been a sociopath from the very start, that doesn't mean he was destined to be the Dark Lord of the Sith, or that he was ''pure'' evil from the very beginning.

*** Despite his own claims of wanting to join the Sith since before Plagueis arrived, and what Luceno intended, we do get a few scenes that imply the argument that Palpatine ''wasn't'' born a monster holds a lot of water. First, his relationship with Vidar Kim seemed genuinely affable, despite their political differences, and while he didn't feel any remorse about killing Vidar later, he did show reluctance to go through with it, then consoled himself by noting it would be a MercyKill, since Vidar's family is gone (believe it or not, Palpatine had ''nothing'' to do with their deaths); second, during his final confrontation with his father, Palpatine genuinely complimented Plagueis--"He's powerful, influential, and brilliant. More so than any of my professors. Head and shoulder above you! Or any of your royal confederates." So, at the time, Palpatine had two father figures he felt he could cling to, and then everything came crashing down when Plagueis cheerfully revealed that he'd lied to and manipulated him. As mentioned above, Palpatine has no compunction about killing, but he doesn't like being used, even when he was going to kill that specific person anyway for the heck of it. Hell, the fact that Plagueis used him didn't bother him as much as the fact that Plagueis ''lied'' to him--remember, the whole reason Palpatine decided to become his agent in the first place was because Plagueis was honest about his intentions for Naboo and that Palpatine would be a pawn in that scheme, something that Palpatine didn't mind. And then Plagueis goes and lies to him. For Palpatine, ''that'' was when he crossed the MoralEventHorizon and the DespairEventHorizon, and because of the magnanimity of what he did, there was no going back.

* If Darth Tenebrous had always meant to hijack Plagueis via the maxi-chlorians, what was the point of training Venamis, who soon went to try and kill Plagueis anyway?

** Mummification can occur naturally if the conditions are right to desiccate the corpse.

* In "The Tenebrous Way" short story, thanks to the maxi-chlorians, Darth Tenebrous finds his own corpse years after his death, but it's specified that the corpse is mummified. How was Tenebrous' corpse mummified and who mummified him? Shouldn't his corpse have rotted over the years? And who would mummify a corpse if they were not going to bury it?

** He didn't leave witnesses. At the end of the scene it's stated that he was the only one who got back on the bus the pilgrims came on, everyone else being compelled to wander out into the desert to die of exposure.