- Jossed Theories
- Confirmed Theories
- Theories on the Order
- Theories on Team Evil
- Theories on the Linear Guild
- Theories on Divine Beings
- We know he actually counts as a deity; he managed to weakly smite Roy early on, and Odin was considering accepting him to the pantheon.
- If he requests membership again, Odin probably would allow him; they are desperate to get the vote they need.
- And since he and Giggles are rivals (similar to Thor and Loki), Giggle's followers (which is a whole island of Orcs) technically power him as well.
- Since the two of them came into being after the new world was created, like the Dark One, they might count as purple gods
- So, their plan is more or less this: destroy all Gates, forcing gods to remake the world again, and do it without leaving their own traces, so that gods couldn't suspect and pwn them as punishment. Three pantheons can wait for Snarl to calm itself, but The Dark One cannot. So they show themselves to him and offer him something (most likely souls) to sustain himself during interim period, at least temporarily making him dependent on them. This places them in control of purple quiddity, and with this they can make demands to pantheons, for whatever their next stage is.
- Except how can they benefit from one world's destruction and a new one's creation, if all outsiders' memories are wiped each time it happens? Even if they think this would work, all it would take to scuttle this idea would be for Loki or Tiamat (or Rat, assuming he's not still too angry to speak to the guy) to tell the Dark One that the IFCC won't even remember him during the interim.
- Seems like they have some sort of contingency for this, since they really wanted Hel to succeed in destroying the world. Maybe the artifact they were talking about is meant to prevent the mind wipe.
- Except how can they benefit from one world's destruction and a new one's creation, if all outsiders' memories are wiped each time it happens? Even if they think this would work, all it would take to scuttle this idea would be for Loki or Tiamat (or Rat, assuming he's not still too angry to speak to the guy) to tell the Dark One that the IFCC won't even remember him during the interim.
- That's why it killed the Eastern Pantheon... and why it saved Zeus for last.
- Jossed. The Snarl is just the personification of strife amongst the pantheons.
- It hates everyone, it has been shown to be an omnicidal manic (or a beast, we don't know how smart it is.) it was suggested that there being more then one gate intact has stopped it noticing the rifts, so when the last gate is being fought for, it will be happily trying to to kill everyone too!
- How about Artemis = Haley (Archer, Sneaky, intimacy issues...)
- Elan=Apollo. Both are allegedly attractive, and linked to music and storytelling.
- Actually, Roy is more remmeniscant of Hades, the Only Sane Man of the Greek pantheon.
- V could be Hermes, who has a connection to magic and an androgynous son. Durkon could be Athena, since cleric is a wisdom-based class.
- So Belkar really IS a God of war, albeit a sexy and shoeless one.
- It will be a happy ending for Elan.
- He'll be spared as High Priest of Banjo.
- Elan would be miserable anyway, without his friends, especially Roy and Haley.
- He'll be spared as High Priest of Banjo.
- Probably Jossed, because there have already been untold millions of worlds where the heroes failed and the gods had to recreate things. It's not much of a subversion when it's already established that it's the sort of outcome that happens all the time.
- My theory is that Banjo, being a puppet god, is controlled by whoever's hand is in the puppet. So Elan will be saved because he is Banjo. And that might not include Redcloak; the Dark One is already a god and that's all Redcloak needs.
- Redcloak might well replace the Dark One as a God maybe. A lot of 'The Dark One isn't on the up and up' theories are floating around, and if Redcloak finds out he let all those Goblins die for nothing I wouldn't put it beyond him to unleash the Snarl on his former master.
- I hope that the heroes and even the Gods fight a final battle with the Snarl after it is released. The heroes Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence and fill the vacancy left by the Gods who perished in the battle and use their power to rebuild the Multiverse that was destroyed in the battle. The catch is that they do not and possibly even cannot understand the world's workings and they recreate the world differently than it was before. This leads to a 4th-edition-based world. The heroes decide that the new world is so wonderful that they reincarnate themselves to become adventurers, except for a few others who become the new Gods including Vaarsuvius who becomes the new Corellon-type God.
- Redcloak's opinion about paladins made him invent the forth edition paladins(that doesn't have to be lawful good)!!
- Depends on your house rules as to whether "Good Acting" applies. Besides, it's not saying that the monster races are the only source of XP — just that the only reason they EXIST is as one of the many sources of XP.
- Roleplaying XP clearly exists in the Order of the Stick universe.
- I kinda get the whole Animatrix "Second Renaissance" vibe where, despite being presented as fact, it just sounds too... propagandized, to really seem true. There's probably a good deal of truth, but a lot was exaggerated, and some details omitted.
- To me, the Dark One has to be evil- because the only thing that justifies fantasy heroes killing their enemies is when they are evil (or mindless). To think that Redcloak's story is true and humans just started killing goblins for its sake is taking morality issues a little too far (especially for a humorous strip.) In the early D&D editions, it was made clear that monsters CANNOT change their alignment, unlike humans and demihumans; goblins are just born evil and are always evil, which justifies killing them off. I dunno if this applies to the current edition, but it should. Sure, there can be rare exceptions (just as there monster mutations) so heroes cannot have to be careful, but in general, goblins deserve to die; the XP they give is inconsequential.
- And I say just having an Evil alignment isn't enough to deserve being killed if you're not doing anything actively evil. Which is presumably what happened to Redcloak's village: they were all Evil, but weren't doing anything evil.
- And the Book of Exalted Deeds would agree with you. Besides, Burlew loves subverting tropes. Always Chaotic Evil is a trope.
- Or the Dark One used to be just like Redcloak but never had a My God, What Have I Done? Redloak had when a hobgoblin saved his life, as a result he became a Knight Templar, as a result turned the monster races into the Always Chaotic Evil they are now, he enlist Redcloak to fix his mistakes (or finshed what he started aka kill all PC races)
- We know the Dark One's backstory, though, and it's nothing like that.
- Yes because we all know gods don't lie or history is never fudge or anything like that.
- And I say just having an Evil alignment isn't enough to deserve being killed if you're not doing anything actively evil. Which is presumably what happened to Redcloak's village: they were all Evil, but weren't doing anything evil.
- Perhaps he was telling the truth about the origin of the monstrous humanoids, but unlike, say, the Iron Golems orc fans, the jungle island orcs, or the lizardfolk and kobolds of the Western Continent, he refuses to consider alternatives.
- Goblins had a deific patron, sort of: Fenris. Too bad he has a personality of 6-year old ADHD kid, and the moment he discovered they aren't going to pwn every other race he lost interest and ditched them.
- Alternatively: The Snarl is released, and the world ends — but all or some (most likely including Elan) of the Order influence the creation of the world after that. If Elan is involved, he makes sure that the old Order is in some way brought back just the way it was.
- They definitely want something out of him beyond just "testing" the splice.
- 668 confirms that what they want out of him has something to do with the Gates...
- Jossed: Snarl (part of it) is shown on screen, and Dark One confirms it's existence independently.
- Because that's not how Zodiac signs work. To sum up: over the year, the sun follows a path through the sky. Any constellation that crosses this line is a Zodiac sign. You cannot simply add another Zodiac without re-arranging the constellations on the sky. (That said: In the west we actually do have 13 Zodiacs, we just ignore one of them because the Sun passes through it in about a day).
- Wrong. "Zodiac" literally means "circle of animals", which is why the word is used for the Chinese zodiac. But the Chinese zodiac has nothing to do with the constellations the sun passes through.
- According to legend, Cat would have been a thirteenth (Chinese) zodiac sign, but his good friend, Rat, played a trick on him.
- Wrong. "Zodiac" literally means "circle of animals", which is why the word is used for the Chinese zodiac. But the Chinese zodiac has nothing to do with the constellations the sun passes through.
- Tying this with the "Belkar really is a God of War" WMG, maybe Mr. Scruffy/Cat is trying to get both of them awakened as part of the new gods to replace some of the dead ones?
- This is quite possible, as every single depiction of the snarl has been second hand in a crayon drawing- Xykon was destroyed by the rune preventing entry to the rift, not the rift itself. As such, it is not beyond the realm of possibility that both the bearers of the crimson mantle and the rest of the cast have been deliberately misled.
- Except we do see it, in strip number #945, where it breaks through Girard's Gate attacks Laurin and her troops.
An alternative version is that the Snarl was created by the gods as a defence mechanism, a part of the planet itself, to convince anyone living on the Order of the Stick planet to close any leaks that might let people escape from the other planet.
- When this is revealed, someone, probably V, will complain about what a cliche it is.
- Jossed by Rich.
The Snarl has had an extremely long time to sort itself out. It was made by gods who were new at this whole world-making thing, and since their fight over what would and wouldn't be part of the world was childish and immature, the Snarl itself was childish and immature. The unstoppable rage that killed the Western gods was merely a collossal temper-tantrum. With however many years it's been since then, the Snarl has grown up, used its powers to raise the Western pantheon, and is now a stable world with stable gods and stable people.
- Oi! I came to the same sort of conclusion about seven WMGs up... though I didn't think of the "temper tantrum" angle... [+]I guess great minds think alike! [ ]You stole from the WRONG man.
- The reason that it attacked in the modern day was because to it, the Snarl was defending it's self and it's world. It only attacked after they cast spells at it.
- Cutting off Xykon's head (which, unfortunately, probably won't kill him)
- Distracting/Flanking someone (such as Redcloak) long enough for Haley to get in a dramatic Sneak Attack
- Speaking a single sentence in the background that hangs a lampshade on something
- Is given a name and revealed to be a high-ranking commander who is treated as though everyone knew him all along
- Rescues O-Chul from some catastrophe
- Asks Hinjo where he would like a lampshade hung
- Says one line, then gets killed
- Part of the Dark One's Plan or not, Goblinkind finding their way to the planet within the planet could be one way of delivering an ending that, while happy for our heroes, does not ultimately shaft goblinkind. The world being unmade to make way for a world that is more fair towards goblinkind, would still be a loss for our heroes (the world being unmade would claim many lives, after all). On the other hand, the goblins not getting anything out of the deal, remaining XP-fodder for adventurers, would subvert the "being a monstrous humanoid does not mean you deserve to be killed"-theme Burlew has going. Solution: Goblinkind get a fair chance to make their own fortune on the planet within the planet (even more so if it is uninhabited, giving them an entirely clean slate), and the current planet gets to survive.
- Except going after the starmetal was Nale's idea.
- It could be delaying them with a wild goose chase was Nale's idea, Sabine just helpfully "filled in the details".
- This is Xanatos Roulette territory. The IFCC would have no way of predicting that V specifically would kill the dragon and incur the mother's wrath, when the mother would catch up with him, or that all his other options would run out - and V is the only member of the Order who would conceivably deal with archfiends in return for arcane power. Though they may well have been watching V for this opportunity for a long time in case something came up that would make him sell his soul for power.
- I dunno, even if it's not for arcane power, it'd be totally in character for, say, Belkar to ask for supernatural abilities, or Haley to at least consider a Deal with the Devil in exchange for her father's freedom. Besides, while V might be one of the few who'd be willing to make a deal, the elf is also the most likely to kill the dragon, or at least, to play a large role in the dragon's demise. While everyone else is using material weapons (1d4 daggers and arrows (plus about 3d6 in sneak attack), a 1d10 hammer, a 2d6 greatsword and Elan wasn't even fighting directly), V was using Disintegrate at the earliest available opportunity (bare minimum 24d6 points of damage), which made them the most likely to actually kill the dragon, or at least, the biggest contributor in terms of raw damage, and thus the primary target for the dragon's mother. Assuming, of course, the original plan wasn't just for the dragon to kill them, which would eliminate competition for the Linear Guild and thus the IFCC. Lee, Cedrik and Nero probably have a few ranks in Xanatos Speed Chess between them.
Consider how Elan, the bard and the one most in touch with tropes, has started defying tropes, most notably by just telling Haley about Therkla, in defiance of Bardic tradition. Furthermore, he persuaded Julio Scoundrél to return and take on Tarquin by pointing out that the most heroic thing he could do would be to defy stories themselves - which Julio did by surviving.
This all points to Elan defying tropes more and more, which will reach its apogee at the very end, when he defies the Snarl, a cosmic entity made entirely of tropes.
- She's probably going to unleash the Snarl, then harvest the souls of everyone it kills via collateral damage instead of directly (because those will be soul-killed).
This may be a case of Unreliable Narrator. The world in the rift still exists, but is now devoid of any living creatures (which would be consistent with Laurin finding no trace of life in the ocean). Perhaps one day, after the Snarl is destroyed, it may yet be repopulated.
- Confirmed
- Alternatively, Giggles could play a role.
Obviously they would vary in what they get out of aiding (or manipulating) TDO. Some could merely wish to settle grudges with some other god and so set TDO's faction up to dispose of or weaken the enemy god. Others could be unsatisfied with the state of the world, especially if they're a patron of a fodder species, and so work to ensure either the Dark One succeeds or that he gets far enough to weaponize the Snarl then jack it from him. Even Tiamat could be plotting to do a plan similar to TDO's faction but with reptilian species (dragons, kobolds) as the chosen ones instead of goblins. Her oracle not helping Xykon could be just keeping up appearences (don't let her enemies know she's aiding an army trying to awaken the Snarl) or trying to cripple the competition.
It's borne from attempts to create a perfect world, and the frustrations of keeping continuity forms into an actual Continuity Snarl.
- Confirmed by virtue of being of not much of a guess, it's all but directly told during the exposition.
- Everyone seems to be operating off the assumption Dvalin is compelled to follow the elders' decisions whatever they may be, and it's possible he's always asked them their opinions and gone with the majority out of respect, but as the First King of the Dwarves he can likely overrule them if he chooses to. After all, he always consults the clan elders, but nobody has yet said he has to obey them. And since the entire prophecy involving Durkon up to and including everything following Durkon's return was a huge Batman Gambit by Odin, this makes Dvalin's stalling all the more likely and Odin the probable mastermind.
Thor and Loki are both part of the faction in question, which is why they're on better terms than would be expected given their history and opposing alignments.
- When introduced, Banjo had orange stars framing them, while when Giggles was introduced, they had purple stars framing them. So they provide orange and purple quiddity respectively, potentially forming a five-colour seal.
- Half-Jossed. Purple quiddity is the Dark One's color.
- Objection! Quiddity doesn't belong to individual gods, it belongs to pantheons. Giggles is Banjo's evil brother, if he has purple quiddity, that just means that, as an evil god who exists only to be an evil counterpart to a pre-existing good god for him to fight, that gives him a shared concept with the Dark One, who also sees himself as an evil counterpart for the "good" guys to fight. If Giggles and Banjo manifest quiddity, then Giggles might be the thing that convinces Redcloak that quiddity is a real thing.
- Half-Jossed. Purple quiddity is the Dark One's color.
- It's entirely possible some of them Fell, but we're limited to Redcloak's limited perspective. It would be hidden by them all being in grey-scale for the book already.
- ...By destroying the Azure City gate. Why? Otherwise, Soon Kim and the other ghost-martyrs would have killed Xykon and more importantly Redcloak. Remember that Rat was part of the group that protected and planned on recruiting the Dark One to end the cycle. Even though the Dark One turned on them, as Thor explained, his high priest could still be persuaded to channel enough divine quiddity for them to make the plan work. If Redcloak dies and the Crimson Mantle falls into Sapphire paladin hands, no more high priests. Yes, it means sacrificing Azure City, but you don't give up a chance, however slim - of ending the threat of the Snarl.
- As a counterpoint, one of the prequel books shows that the Dark One ascended to godhood before the gates were made. Unless that's another case of Unreliable Narrator, the Snarl can't have sponsored the Dark One's ascension.
Loki admits that gods are shaped by their followers as much as their teachings shape their followers' lives. While he was alive, the Dark One was able to see beyond his people's condition to genuinely try to better their lot in life... but after his death, his people's desire for revenge and resentment at their place in the world became a part of his being, and losing sight of what's important in favor of the Plan up in the divine planes is at least partially the fault of beings like Redcloak doing it on the material plane.