What we didn't get to see is that when Link pulled the Master Sword the first time, it didn't seal him away in the Sacred Realm. Instead, Ganondorf revealed himself after Link took the Master Sword and the two did battle. Link fought valiantly, but he was still too young and inexperienced to win. Ganon defeated him and claimed the Triforce of Power and Courage then. However, the Triforce of Wisdom still went to Zelda. As Sheik, she reunited the six sages during the following years while Hyrule descended into darkness. She then used her own Triforce of Wisdom as bait to lure Ganondorf into the Sacred Realm. Ganon obtained the complete Triforce and wished to conquer the world. The Triforce granted his wish and transformed the Sacred Realm into the Dark World, giving him an entire world's worth of loyal monsters. However, from the World of Light, the seven sages sealed the Sacred Realm then, trapping Ganon.
Hyrule was saved from the time being, but Zelda's heart was heavy with grief and guilt. She had foolishly sent a child to his death. She knew she had to fix it somehow, even though she knew she herself would never see it: using the Ocarina of Time and the Master Sword, she sent Rauru back in time to when Link pulled the Master Sword from the Temple of Time and instructed him to protect him for seven years, until a time where he would be strong enough to fight Ganon.
- Could it be the kid from the graveyard? The one who had an obsession with the morbid, and when we next see him he's (possibly) the insane Poe collector... Entering the well finally broke him?
- I was under the impression that the Poe collector was the same guy as that castle guard from 7 years prior (he was in the same room, and if you pestered him at the right time he'd mention he was a paranormal enthusiast). On the other hand, that still doesn't quite explain that kid's whereabouts... Maybe the well was sealed because he went in, but he DIDN'T come out. Then someone went in looking for him, and...
- That actually makes sense in a really creepy way when you consider that the little boy doesn't have an adult counterpart despite almost everyone else having one...
- Zelda was essentially doing an In-Universe version of Save Scumming. She'd meet Link, ask him to help save Hyrule, and then, when Ganondorf ultimately defeated him, use the Ocarina's power to reverse the flow of time and try again. However, the continuous use of this power came with a side effect: She couldn't access all of her memories from the previous timeline, limiting her knowledge of how events would play out. Of all of her attempts, this was the only one to succeed.
Supporting evidence: When she first meets Link, she experiences a feeling of Deja Vu and says that Link's name sounds familiar. Maybe that's because she's already heard it before and simply couldn't remember. Also, her "prophetic dream" about someone coming out of the forest to save Hyrule could be a buried memory instead. Ditto for Link's dream about running into Ganondorf at the beginning of the game.
- And to explain why Link is not under the same limitation as Zelda was, Link probably does lose his memories when using the Song of Time in Majora's Mask, but someone outside the regular flow of time is guiding, specifically we the players.
More supporting evidence: It is stated in Hyrule Historia that the timeline was actually split into three, not two. One for the Adult timeline (which led to The Wind Waker), one for the Child Timeline (Majora's Mask, Twilight Princess), and the final one is one that nobody suspected, which was a timeline where the Hero failed, producing A Link to the Past. This third timeline was probably caused by a prior failed attempt that Zelda rewinded (or at least one of them).
Before you complain that Guru-Guru says something along the lines of "Grr, you played the Ocarina again didn't you?", keep in mind the man isn't exactly calm and is possibly just making assumptions.
One possible explanation is that the sword originally did allow Link to wield it, but being young and inexperienced was unable to use it to its full potential. Somewhere along the way, he came close to death, at which point either the sword, the ocarina, or Raoru pulled Link back to the point where he pulled the Master Sword from its pedestal and sealed him away. This would create a third timeline that seemingly has Link die, or at least be defeated and never return. It also removes the hypothetical scenario of the player dying while playing the game, since there are plenty of people who beat it without getting a Game Over.
One specific location has this happen no matter how much forethought and planning the player has to prevent it. One chest in the Spirit Temple must be uncovered as a child and opened as an adult; it's simply not there as an adult until the puzzle that makes it appear is completed as a child. This means that at least one time during the course of gameplay, the player has to go to the past and change things, creating a new future for something as seemingly inconsequential as a chest appearing. The entire Downfall Timeline could, therefore, simply be for want of a chest.
1. As a child, Link begins his epic quest in Kokiri Forest, by lifting the curse cast on the Great Deku Tree (forest motif).
2. Then, he moves through Kakariko Village and the Gorons, until he beats Dodongo's Cavern at the foot of Death Mountain. Despite the name, the cavern still has pools of lava in its main section, as well as in the center of King Dodongo's boss area. (fire motif)
3. Later, Link visits Zora's Domain and releases their fish deity, Jabu Jabu, from a parasitic aquatic lifeform named Barinade, a sea anemone (water motif).
Later, Link begins the Adult portion of his quest:
1. The first dungeon Link may visit is Forest Temple, an abandoned manor-like building deep within Sacred Forest Meadow (forest motif).
2. Next, Link fights his way through the Fire Temple, a temple that is located inside Death Mountain Crater. As a "Fire" Temple, its perils involve fire pits and lava pools (fire motif).
3. Finally, Link passes through the Water Temple, a structure hidden under the water of Lake Hylia. Also, its boss is an amoeba-like enemy - amoebas also being parasitc beings in Real Life that live in freshwater and bodies of water, like ponds and lakes (water motif).
Past this midpoint, Bottom of the Well can be completed at any time between Forest Temple and Shadow Temple, but, for the sake of this argument, it is being placed here:
4. Link goes back in time and ventures into the bottom of Kakariko Village's Well. To his surprise, after the water recedes, a dark picture of Hyrule and Kakariko's past is alluded to, with zombies, a green miasma, and what appears to be torture chambers loaded with execution devices (death/underworld motif).
4. As part of Adult Link's quest, he goes to Karariko Village's graveyard, where lies the entrance to the somber Shadow Temple. Like the Bottom of the Well, the Shadow Temple features torture devices and all assortments of death traps, again alluding to Hyrule's sordid past (death/underworld motif).
Finally, both the Child and the Adult timelines quests converge at the Spirit Temple:
5. The Spirit Temple "requires" a first exploration with Child Link, getting the treasure on one of the hands of the external hands of the goddess statue and travelling forward in time.
5. As Adult Link, our young hero vanquishes Twinrova and releases the last Sage.
It could be argued that the motif of the Spirit Temple is sands of time, considering its location (The Desert Colossus), and as a pun, considering the gameplay mechanic of going forward and back through time.
The placement of the Ice Cavern is the only thing that does not fit well with the proposed parallelisms.
- The Hero's Shade in Twilight Princess IS Link from OoT.
- It seems more likely that him being sent back in time simply created a branch in the timeline where he lived out his life as normal, while the Adult Timeline continued on — but without him, because he's in a separate reality.
- The King stays behind to lead during war. Zelda goes into hiding with Impa. The Queen takes Link (who as the male would have been primary heir even if Zelda was actually older). The split betters the chance one heir would survive should something go wrong during the escape.
- Word of God confirms that pointy ears are a sign of the royal family of Hyrule. Can you think of a certain Hero of Time with pointy ears?
- Gonna have to call foul on that, or at least ask for a source. A quick check in Ocarina of Time shows that everybody and their brother has pointed ears. All the Kokiri, all the Hylians, Impa, Malon, Talon, Ingo, Link, Zelda. . . Even Ganondorf gets in on the elfy-ears action, post-seven-year Time Skip. Link and Zelda have have a whole lotta siblings, aunts, uncles, and cousins if that were the case, is all I'm saying.
- You left out the part about Link's name being familiar to Zelda even though this is the first pair and it was the first time they met.
- When Impa teaches the song Zelda's Lullaby to Link, she says that "this song is only taught to members of the royal family."
- That could just be Impa letting Link know that he's special/privileged, and also, a hint that the other races (i.e. Gorons and Zoras) will accept him more easily as a messenger of the Royal Family.
- Definitely Jossed by Word of God. Several publications show that Link's father was actually a Knight of Hyrule, which does still indicate his family being nobility, but also Zelda's mother passed away when she was a child, while Link's mother died when he was an infant after delivering him to the Great Deku Tree.
- Link's mother is never shown in canon materials and the narration by the Deku Tree doesn't say her family was specifically targeted; it said she escaped a burning settlement, which any ordinary person could have done.
- Definitely intriguing. The only other possibility is if there was another hero to bear the Triforce of Courage during the Imprisoning War, which seem very likely given that at least one other game (Minish Cap) mentions a yet-unseen Hero - the Hero of Men.
- Except the Hero of Time's death resulted in Ganon gaining the complete Triforce. Even if there was someone else who could have received it, they did not.
- Being an adult doesn't make you any better at using a sword or playing an ocarina. And Link's age wasn't obvious based on his sprite in the first game — if Nintendo had wanted to make him an adult, they could've just told everyone "he's an adult".
- Sorry, but Ganondorf kills the Sage of Water. She would have to awaken as the Water Sage no matter what, apparently.
- What evidence do you have that he kills her in the Child Timeline? When could he have?
- You see him kill a Water Sage in a flashback in Twilight Princess. Presumably that was Ruto's predecessor. Though the fact that the Water Sage is still missing from the group by the time of TP may mean that Ruto, or any other replacement, was never awakened as a Sage.
- There is no longer any promise to Ruto in the Child Timeline. Why not? Because he was sent back, basically, to the first time he met Zelda, which was before he ever met Ruto or obtained the Zora's Sapphire. While he does know Ruto, she wouldn't know him (side note: you do, as I recall, see the Sages in the final scene, and they're adults... so apparently, they're capable of moving between timelines).
- This theory is supported by the fact that when Navi leaves Link in the end, the general direction she travels in is toward a spot that would later be a secret entrance to the Temple of Time in TP.
- Along with her adventure with S.S. Link and the time she spent resting her way of speech became more human, she took the form of a fairy to help OoT Link fulfill his destiny rather than just a ball of light, or her real form, because it was a form he would trust (Which explains why she looks like fairy but can't heal him like other fairies, she's not a real one).
- The reason why she appeared before Link got the Master Sword was because she was summoned by the Deku Tree to lead him to the Master Sword which was required to defeat Ganondorf.
- If that's the case, why didn't Fi come clean about this after Ganondorf's defeat? By keeping up the ruse, she accidentally led Link to go on a long, possibly fatal journey to find "Navi" again when her real form was right where he left her the whole time.
- In the game Majora's Mask, which is the direct sequel to Ocarina of Time, Link uses various magical masks to transform himself into different beings. Each mask was created when a member of the race it represented was killed, and the Song of Healing was played. The Goron Mask came from a great Goron named Darmani; the Zora Mask came from Mikau, the guitarist of a Zoran rock band called Indigo-Go; and the Deku Scrub Mask was implied to come from the unnamed son of a butler at the Deku Scrub Palace. Whatever form Link is in, he still maintains certain key traits of his original form (mainly the green tunic and his trademark hat).
- Now, let’s think about the Sheikah. Princess Zelda's nanny, Impa, is a Sheikah, and apparently the last of her tribe. Impa has red eyes, and, although she doesn't look very old, and seems to still be in very good physical shape, white hair. Since the Sheikah tribe never actually appears in the game, it is possible that this coloration is — was — typical of the Sheikah people.
- As this Wild Mass Guesser mentioned before, in Majora's Mask, Link still looks somewhat like himself in any form. So Sheik, being Zelda in disguise, would maintain his (her) blond hair.
- Now, let’s think about the Sheikah. Princess Zelda's nanny, Impa, is a Sheikah, and apparently the last of her tribe. Impa has red eyes, and, although she doesn't look very old, and seems to still be in very good physical shape, white hair. Since the Sheikah tribe never actually appears in the game, it is possible that this coloration is — was — typical of the Sheikah people.
- Also, about Zelda’s disguise as Sheik: the Sheikah, judging from Impa’s getup, wear very skintight clothing, probably to help them sneak around better (kind of like ninjas). Being a tribe based on Shadows, going unnoticed would be very important for spying.
- So, if Zelda was simply dressed as a Sheikah man, wouldn’t her physical characteristics as a woman show through a skintight suit? I think so.
- Conclusion: Sheik was once an actual Sheikah warrior. He was killed in battle, and, as a desperate attempt to save him, Impa sealed his soul into a mask.
- Jossed on at least one count: Hyrule Historia states that the owl and the sage are one and the same. Her father in Skyward Sword is specifically designed to look similar to Rauru. It is possible that he is her father and the King of Hyrule, but that seems unlikely as he is already a sage when Link is a child while all the others have to be awakened to their cause.
- One possibility is that the moment Ganondorf received the Triforce of Power in the Child Timeline is the same moment in the Adult Timeline that he the Triforce fragmented. Time may splinter, but there is only one Triforce.
- ...except they don't sparkle off into the distance. The cutscene fades to black before the Sages actually go anywhere, so they could just as easily have come back.
- But when you think about it... Darunia entered Volvagia's boss room before you had a chance to. And then when you finally get there, Darunia is nowhere to be found...
- You can talk to Saria all throughout the Forest Temple. Kotake and Koume teleported Nabooru away, they didn't kill her, and their Twinrova form is used in the Oracle games as well, so Nabooru wasn't a component of it. Plus, the only reason the sages weren't awoken immediately was because Ganondorf cursed the temples and they couldn't awaken as sages until the boss monsters were killed and they could hear the call. Saria was sad because the sages had to live in the Sacred Realm, at least until they had to seal Ganondorf into it, at which point it may have been to dangerous for them to stay in it.
- You can talk to Saria, but never see her again, until you enter the Chamber of the Sages. As mentioned above, Darunia runs headlong into the boss room...with no trace of him when YOU manage to get in there. Likewise, Ruto bolts ahead of you with no way of defending herself into a dangerous temple. And one assumes Nabooru is teleported, but that magical blast could just as easily be fatal. In addition, look at the ending dance party. Everyone is dancing, and having a blast, except for two. Mido and the Zora King. Of the sages, only three had anyone close to them that would be so deeply impacted by death. Saria, Ruto and Impa. Impa's passing would likely be mourned by Zelda later, when she was no longer occupied with rebuilding her razed kingdom. Darmani's son is too young to truly comprehend death, and Nabooru would likely come from a tribe where death is an accepted reality (if she wasn't branded a traitor outright.) This leaves only Mido and Zora King to be the ones who understand the situation, and are understandably mourning their losses.
- (Spoiler Alert) However, in Twilight Princess, the sages do not have physical bodies, they are just spirits, and one of the sages actually dies. Ganondorf lashes out at the sage of water and he just dissapears, never to be seen again.
- We're not talking about the TP sages. And whether or not they're one in the same as OoT's sages is a whole other debate.
- According to WoG the sages from OoT were just physical bodies the sages took through some sort of reincarnation thing, don't ask me why. And they are the same sages, just not quite the same "people". Ruto, Saria and the rest were basically vessels containing the sages until their awakening.
- We're not talking about the TP sages. And whether or not they're one in the same as OoT's sages is a whole other debate.
- Would like to point out that in the original beta of the game (and in the manga, which by WoG is canon, like Volvagia) you originally found Impa's bones in the acid around the bongo drum at the end of the Shadow Temple.
- Source? All of the mangas are non-canon if I remember correctly.
- What about a Link Between Worlds? It's confirmed that the sages of that game are descendants of the sages of this game. Wouldn't that mean they had to be alive?
- That doesn't necessarily mean they survived. Darunia already has a confirmed child who could continue his bloodline. Kokiri never physically age beyond the equivalent of a human child at roughly 8-10 years old, so we don't know how old Saria actually is or even how Kokiri reproduce (their evolution into the Koroks later in the timeline could imply that Kokiri biology is closer to plants than to humans). Rauru and Impa both look old enough to not only have off-screen children, but possibly even grandchildren. Nabooru's exact age is never hinted at, but she's already an adult when Link is still a child, so certainly old enough that she could have off-screen children somewhere. Ruto is the only Sage other than Darunia who has a family member appear on-screen with King Zora being her father and is most likely the youngest Sage (and thus, the one with perhaps the strongest argument to not have any off-screen children).
- A case for them not dying: in the 3DS version's credits (this troper has only played 3DS so I don't know if it's in the original version's credits or not), the Sages are seen hanging out on Death Mountain, looking completely fine. This troper believes it means they survived and got to return to Hyrule.
- That is on the original as well. But that doesn't prove anything. They could as well be watching over Hyrule as spirits, only interacting with themselves and no one else. As people already stated, it's heavily implied they are dead due to their circumstances: you can talk to Saria during the Forest Temple, but it's always the same message and it goes more along the lines of Gameplay and Story Segregation since you could do that as soon as you leave the Temple of Time (implying Saria WAS alive but was killed while you were heading to the temple - notice you don't get to actually MEET her there until the very end), Darunia, Ruto and Impa rushed headlong into the temple (and Daruna even entered the boss room), while the spell that Twinrova used on Nabooru may as well be fatal and they were planning to revive her as a zombie or something else.
- I'm the original author of this theory from back in 2005/2006 and I'm amazed it's still here. Even the "Think about it" line is still there, which is pretty funny. I can't really prove it was me though, but that's not important. I just wanted to say that these days I believe that some of the sages might've died (like Darunia) and some were still alive by the time they were made sages. If they were dead, they were just brought back to life for the sage ascension. Once they became sages, they were removed from Hyrule and put into the Chamber of Sages, where they must remain to perform their sagely duties. It seems that they are unable to exist (at least not for very long) in Hyrule and they can't interact with anyone aside from Link (and possibly other wielders of the Triforce). Effectively, as far as the non-sages are concerned, the same as if they died, though perhaps they aren't technically dead. That's just how I see it.
- That could work, except for the part where Darunia expresses himself as a male ("We are brothers") and the part were the Goron named after you asks you to rescue his Dad.
- Maybe in the Goron language the word "brother" is a term referring to anyone (reminiscent of words like "ellos" in Spanish referring to a group of mixed men and women).
- I always figured that Gorons have the same gender-thingy going on as Discworld dwarves, where both male and female dwarves look and act masculine. That, or they're all masculine hermaphrodites.
- I always thought of them reproducing asexually like single-celled organisms. Maybe like with one of the scale-like things on their backs falling off and growing into a new Goron.
- The series treats Gorons as a Single-Gender Race. The only female Gorons are in the non-canon manga. Given that every Goron with a child has thus far been treated like a Truly Single Parent, I see no reason to assume there is a reason to doubt it. They're probably like Namekians. Some concept art from Twilight Princess seems to back this up but is apocryphal at best.
- With the way their last scenes (in reality) were portrayed, it seemed like this was heavily implied, if not outright stated.
- But Twinrova outright said they still had use for Nabooru, they just teleported her.
- No, they had a use for her and bound her into a magic circle. Link kills Nabooru in the Iron Knuckle fight, but Twinrova bound her soul into the floor so she couldn't become a Sage. Killing Twinrova freed her spirit.
- What spirit? We see her body well alive.
- Ah, but then she is spirited away, and the next time you see her, she's in the Temple of Time, just like the rest of the sages.
- Uh, no. Twinrova had planned on brainwashing her again, and there's no point if she's dead.
- Downfall Timeline gives us the obvious conclusion: All seven sages have Bloodlines, and far from all had procreated at this point. They didn't die.
- It is still possible that they died, but were resurrected as sages. Thus, they would continue to live long enough to sire children (or in the case of Darunia, additional children) which would inherit the sages' power.
- But Twinrova outright said they still had use for Nabooru, they just teleported her.
- Furthermore, one of the Sheikah rocks near the Forest Temple states that Kaepoera may be the reincarnation of a Sage...
- I say no, since at no point does Rauru ask, "Did you get all of that?"
- Actually... When you first enter the Chamber of Sages, and Rauru explains to you how seven years of Ganonrule have passed and how you must now go to cleanse the five temples, he ends that exposition scene by asking something akin to "Do you understand what your destiny is?". If you answer with "No"... he repeats it. Totally pulled a Kaepora Gaebora there.
- Well, a minor correction: Kaepora Gaebora does appear in the Desert Colossus, but while Link was an adult. He's perched up on a nearby tree during the cutscene of Link playing the Requiem of Spirit with Sheik. That said, this is his only appearance during the adult portion of the game.
- This is pretty doubtful, Kaepora pretty much says 'I didn't believe you exist' on the last meeting, why would he say this when Rauru should know he's already gotten his hand on the Master Sword and time travelled?
- Because Kaepora meets Child!Link in the past. When he does, it's the final confirmation for him that "the boy who could travel through time," isn't a myth. He gives Link his last advice as the owl, then leaves to await their next meeting, seven years later. From the time-traveling Link's perspective, the last meeting with Kaepora happens long after he meets Rauru. From Kaepora/Rauru's perspective, however, he doesn't meet Adult!Link as Rauru until after all of his meetings with Link as Kaepora.
- It seems more likely (and possibly implied) that Kaepora Gaebora is some sort of agent for Rauru in Hyrule, rather than outright being him. Rather like a benign version of Aghanim.
- Confirmed in the Hyrule Historia.
- To tie it in with the WMG of Link and Zelda being siblings, compare Rauru with King Daphnes in WW; Rauru might have been the King of Hyrule.
- Actually, the king is alive (but just offscreen) when Link meets Zelda. The manga has him killed in Ganondorf's coup.
- Or it could also be that Rauru is Kaepora Gaebora, whom Link just happened to know as a child.
My theory is that sages have two lives. The first is their mortal life. In this life, they live just like any other person, and are only required to perform sage duties when needed. Their second life is their "immortal" life. After their mortal bodies die, they gain new bodies that can live forever, the catch being is that they can't return to their normal life, and are sages 24/7. Of course they're not completely immortal, and can be killed with enough power (i.e. an attack from Ganondorf) and when this happens they need to be replaced.
I also believe the same rules apply to the Sages of Earth and Wind. By the time Ganon gets to them, they have already entered their "immortal" life, but were killed again and had to be replaced.
- However, save for the red hair, she doesn't look like a Gerudo at all. It's possible that it was planned that she was going to be but was changed into a Marin expy later on. Or, perhaps Gerudo children look like Hylians until they're about in their early twenties or so? But that's its own WMG...
- Of the three timelines, two (Adult and Defeated) are left without a Link, and the sages aren't awakened in the Child Timeline. On the other hand, the next game in the Child Timeline is Twilight Princess, which features a Link that's grown up as a ranch-hand...
- The Links are unrelated by blood, this confirmed by The Wind Waker, because the King of Red Lions states that Link isn't related to the Hero of Time.
- Yes, but the "Hero's Shade" (OoT Link) make an offhand remark about the skills being passed through their bloodline, implying OoT/TP Link are related. This is confirmed in Hyrule Historia (p. 118).
- To add to this, TP Link is not royalty, so that rules out Zelda; he's not part Zora, which rules out Ruto; Saria is both a forever child and stated herself that "she will always be [Link's] friend", so no-go there for obvious reasons; and he's not part Gerudo, so that rules out Nabooru. Since it's canonically confirmed that TP Link is OoT Link's descendant, Link obviously got with a girl. Given the Childhood Marriage Promise via Talon, Malon is the only other ship tease option. Adding to this, TP Link happens to be a rancher, rides a horse he named Epona, and knows Epona's Song... passed down through the family, perhaps?
- That doesn't mean he married Malon; maybe he himself passed down the name Epona and the song.
- To be fair, to be a descendant of someone does not require that person to be directly descended from the ancestor. TP Link could have been a child of someone from OoT Link's extended family. Not to totally shoot down the theory — I think it's good, but to introduce other possibilities.
- There's no possible way Link has any other immediate family members, since most games in the series often depicts Link as an only child and tends to have a Parental Substitute. As far as this game is concerned, Link's mother was only mentioned in passing while nothing else is known about any other family member. It's not too difficult to think that Link may have his own set of adventures as a fully-grown adult and got with Malon at some point.
- Link seemed to own Epona as of Majora's Mask, so another Link owning a similar horse with the same name wouldn't automatically connect him to Malon. And the horse grass plays Epona's Song automatically - Link specifically doesn't have to know it. (Otherwise, he wouldn't need the horse call from Ilia to call Epona whenever he wanted.) Also, the only eligible love interest? You're forgetting the Cucco-chasing girl in Castle Town in Ocarina of Time. Link could've ended up with her, as well.
- The Links are unrelated by blood, this confirmed by The Wind Waker, because the King of Red Lions states that Link isn't related to the Hero of Time.
- Her different appearance could just be a sign of her being the second-in-command of their base or a way to make her look unique.
While genetic differences can occur throughout the generations, if you look and Talon and Rauru side-by-side, they bear some resemblance. They both have the same eyes, very similar beard and hair styles and similar facial features (bar the nose, chin and ears). Thus, I believe that Rauru is a distant ancestor of Talon and, by extension, Malon.
This would also mean that either Malon or Talon is a candidate for the new Sage of Light if Rauru hadn't stayed alive in the Sacred Realm, which is consistent with the way that Link meets the other six as children.
Of course there's the small hitch that Malon is a girl and Malanya is by all appearances male, but a lot can happen over multiple millennia and several transcensions of one's state of existence.
- Except OoT Fado is different from Fado the Wind Sage. Wind Waker Fado is male. Sorry.
- Fado was meant to be the wind sage in Ocarina of Time, that's what I meant.
- Either way, Jossed
- But the other Fado does also have blonde her and is outright stated to have been the last Kokiri...
- But WW Fado was also a Sage.
- How is she still a kid though? A ghost?
- She's still the wind sage.
- Rather perturbed, considering her creepy laughing throughout the conversation.
- What could possibly be so condemning as a little bit of nervous laughter?
- Are you suggesting that Fado is the first Kokiri to be transformed into a Korok?
- She wasn't unarmed... she had a saw.
- Who says they need to be alive...?
- Who says they're not alive in the first place but just in hiding because of their low numbers?
- Hmm... that is true. So then, the Shadow seal is supported by Sheikah spirits?
- No real explanation as the title is self-explanatory, however, it would explain why they battle Link together instead of one at a time. It isn't Tactical Suicide Boss, they just need to be close to each other to be able to use powerful magic, as well as why their Majora's Mask counterparts aren't nearly as powerful, with each running one part of the business, they lose a lot of power (thankfully, it is for Termina's best...)
Link, having no other choice, and also perhaps not knowing this was the case, destroyed Twinrova and in turn, Nabooru's body, killing her in the process, if she wasn't dead already. If we go by the 'the sages died to become sages' theory, this could possibly be applicable. She was witnessed as being alive before Twinrova attacked her after Link broke the first spell on her.
However, she was killed, and her body was destroyed, and she realized her role as a sage.
- Except for the fact that Koume and Kotake, as mentioned above both assume the same form in the Oracle games, no Nabooru required. That fact may just very well make this theory Jossed.
After their battle with Link, the twins both gain one halo each and ascend to the beyond—apparently they go to Heaven (or the verse's equivalent) after they're defeated, despite setting Ganondorf up as a god and presumably aiding him in his schemes.
Unless they did absolutely nothing wrong to begin with they were brainwashed by Ganondorf before he left to conquer Hyrule. While they're powerful, Ganondorf cursed two guardian spirits and infested the Goron's mines with ancient monsters, before he ever stepped foot in the Sacred Realm. Why not start his quest for world domination at home—especially if the witches weren't very supportive of his plans to usher in a dark age.
Not only would Koume and Kotake have been programmed to brainwash any Gerudo who tried to interfere—like Nabooru—with Ganondorf's plans, they also served the purpose of preventing the next Sage of Spirit from hearing the awakening voice, as described by the Sheikah's Legend of Temples.
And then their final battle: Link breaks their bonds to them mortal realm and effectively frees them from the curse.
- On that note, in-game lore says the twin witches (Koume and Kotake) raised Ganondorf. Maybe Twinrova is a sort of patron fairy of the Gerudo, or Ganondorf's Fairy Godmother?
- Basically confirmed when you return to the past and talk to the guy, and he reveals he's a bit of a ghost enthusiast. (In the remake, at least — I don't 100% remember if this was in the original, but given that not many lines were changed/added, it probably was.)
- It was in the original version, and you don't have to return to the past for him to say that, it just has to be night-time. He'll say that anytime in the game you visit him as long as it's night-time.
- Very unlikely. The Poe Collector refers to Link as a young man. The kid at the graveyard is clearly a few years younger than Link.
- Well, I think one of the Gossip stones says that the Gerudo go into Hyrule to "get boyfriends"... So this is pretty darn plausible of a WMG...
- Even more than just plausible, wear the Gerudo Mask around Castle Town and talk to the men. They freak out like you are there to abduct them.
- Going by the stereotypical actions and (especially in the original Japanese) feminine mannerisms of the carpenters, the Gerudo might have found the men "less than willing" to cooperate, if not ideal specimens. Considering how a pretty face like Link is thrown into a special walled off cell on his own might mean that his fate might have laid...
- Even more than just plausible, wear the Gerudo Mask around Castle Town and talk to the men. They freak out like you are there to abduct them.
- Just like in Wand of Gamelon, he ignores all of his daughter's warnings, stupidly trusts someone who ends up betraying him, and almost dooms Hyrule. He probably thought he could bring the physical Triforce of Courage to protect him.
- Alternatively, he ran away to Termina and started a new life in the Cucco Shack, where people are treating him much better and thus he lost his depressed outlook on the world. If this were the case, it would've occurred either way since Termina is visited by child Link, so perhaps the difference between the two timelines is that Ganondorf's rule in the adult timeline caused some complications that delayed the punk's plans by several years.
Some facts to support this theory are the fact that they're referred to as "restless souls" and "living dead". Their masks are carved from coffinwood, and are based on Haniwa, an ancient Japanese funeral ornament placed outside graves to protect the dead. They're first found in the Royal Family's Tomb, and the inscription describing the Sun's Song was built long before the events of the game. In addition, when they die, they don't disappear into smoke like Ganondorf's minions do; instead, they just collapse limply and fade from existence.
- They had to create an Iron Knuckle model that had Nabooru underneath, so they just recycled the boss model for every Iron Knuckle in the game.
- Jossed, by Miyamoto's word. They even made it so only Nabooru's has her face under it in the remake.
- Actually, the Japanese don't take being a god that seriously. One Touhou Project game had two gods as stage 1 bosses.
- This is particularly notable in light of Volvagia's depictions in later reference materials, such as the Hyrule Historia and the Encyclopedia. When discussing the three guardian spirits in The Wind Waker, the Historia describes the Deku Tree in that game as being descended from the one in Ocarina, Jabun as being descended from Lord Jabu-Jabu — and the dragon Valoo as being descended from Volvagia. The Encyclopedia likewise groups it with the Deku Tree and Jabu-Jabu, and describes it as being "the spirit of Death Mountain".
Why those Medallions specifically? It seems thematically appropriate.
- It's also theorized that the Spirit Medallion became the Lens of Truth.
- That fits, because even though you complete the Spirit Temple last, there are several in-game instances in which Spirit is listed before Shadow. And since you need the Lens of Truth in both temples, maybe this was a change that was made late in development...
- The Light Medallion could be the Mask of Truth.
- Then what's the Shadow Medallion? My money's on the Ocarina.
- According to the 1997 beta, both Light and Shadow Medallion can either illuminate or darken places respectively.
- Further evidence that could support this: the entrance room for the Shadow Temple involves a torch puzzle that requires the use of Din's Fire. However, the platform Link must stand on to be properly placed for this spell has an image of the Fire Medallion on it, even though nothing else about the room seems linked to the Fire Temple in any way. Given the developers' tendency to plant visual clues to the solution of a puzzle, it's likely that the medallion image was placed there so the player knew which item/spell to use. Therefore it could be assumed that the image wasn't removed when the medallion-as-spell idea was scrapped, but that the solution spell itself remained in the form of Din's Fire.
- According to this, the medallions actually functioned as the Warp Whistle of the game.
- Why does it have to be the Medallions? Forest, Fire and Water are also the themes for the Child Link dungeons (Great Deku Tree, Dodongo's Cavern, Jabu-Jabu's Belly). It would be much more consistent to have those three spells correspond to the Kokiri's Emerald, the Goron's Ruby and the Zora's Sapphire, rather than just having three other medallions with (as far as we know) no power.
- Semi-confirmed. In the leaked 1997 build of the game, the Wind (Forest) and Fire medallion didnserve the purpose of Farore's Wind and Din's Fire respectively. The Ice (Water) Medallion is an ice spell instead. None of the others possess the ability that became Nayru's Love.
- The Gerudo Fortress = The Forsaken Fortress
- Castle Town = Windfall Island
- The architecture on the island seems to resemble a castle. The resemblance to Kakariko Village is due to the residents of Kakariko moving to Windfall and rebuilding their homes. Eventually, the sub-cultures/architecture of the people from Castle Town and Kakariko Village merged, and they created Windfall.
- Death Mountain = Dragon Roost Island (and Fire Mountain)
- In Twilight Princess, it's implied that the Gorons don't need to breathe, and can stay underwater indefinitely. So most of them may have felt no need to evacuate to higher ground when the Flood came. (The three travelling merchants — all clearly Gorons — located on Greatfish Isle, Bomb Island, and Mother and Child Isles remain on the surface for business purposes.) So the Gorons stayed in Goron City.
- The Zoras, on the other hand, despite being highly adapted to aquatic environments, weren't so lucky. Although they seem at home in the water with their fins and gills, their humanoid bodies imply that they aren't meant to be in the water all the time.
- In real life, most fish are meant to be in either saltwater or freshwater; only a few, like bull sharks, can swim and breathe in both. Some of the Zoras, by praying to the Goddess Nayru, were able to adapt quickly to the saltwater environment, and settled on Greatfish Isle until it was destroyed and they all disappeared. To thank Her, they created Nayru’s Pearl, which housed some of power of the Goddess Herself. They also hatched, nurtured and raised Lord Jabun, the offspring of the demi-god Lord Jabu-Jabu, to watch over them as the new living Water Spirit.
- The other Zoras travelled north to the top of Death Mountain, and turned to the Goddess Din for aid. In answer to their prayers, She gave them avian features (beaks, feathers, wings) to protect them from the scorching heat, and entrusted a dragon egg to them. This egg held the single surviving offspring of the dragon Volvagia, who was slain by the Hero of Time. When the egg hatched, Din deemed the newborn dragon to be Lord Valoo, the living Sky Spirit. The Zoras, no longer being Zoras, began to call themselves Ritos, in memory of Ruto, the Princess (and later Queen) of the Zoras in ancient times.
- Although the Ritos had wings, their wings were not big or strong enough to enable flight. So Din instructed Valoo to give each adult Rito one of his scales (which grew back easily). These scales triggered a magical "growth spurt" that caused a Rito’s wings to grow big enough to allow flight. Eventually, it became customary for young Ritos to visit Valoo and receive their wings when they came of age. To thank the Goddess for Her kindness, the Ritos created Din's Pearl, which housed some of the power of the Goddess Herself.
- In Twilight Princess, it's implied that the Gorons don't need to breathe, and can stay underwater indefinitely. So most of them may have felt no need to evacuate to higher ground when the Flood came. (The three travelling merchants — all clearly Gorons — located on Greatfish Isle, Bomb Island, and Mother and Child Isles remain on the surface for business purposes.) So the Gorons stayed in Goron City.
- Kokiri Village and the Lost Woods = The Forest Haven and the Forbidden Woods
- When the Great Flood came, the Kokiri were completely unprepared. They were afraid to leave their forest, and couldn’t bear to abandon their guardian, the Great Deku Tree. The Deku Tree, who had just reached his juvenile stage of growth, prayed to the Goddess Farore for aid.
- The Goddess answered by taking away the burden of the human forms the Kokiri took on. They shed their mimicked humanoid features and became what they had always been underneath: the Koroks.
- The Kokiri, despite their mammalian appearance, had always been sentient plant-people. Instead of blood, they had chlorophyll keeping them alive. When they became the Koroks, they became lightweight enough to use the leaves that the Great Deku Tree shed as makeshift "wings".
- To thank the Goddess for Her kindness, the Koroks created Farore’s Pearl, which housed some of the power of the Goddess Herself.
- The Forbidden Woods may also be the former Kokiri village. Remember the two or three cabins containig treasure chests ? They basically look like empty Kokiri houses. The Forest Haven may be just the Deku tree's alcove; the Kokiri may have had to take refuge there becauce it was the only protected place.Once upon a time, long ago, the Koroks took on human forms, but when they came to live on the sea, they took these shapes.
—The Great Deku to Link, when the Koroks reveal themselves.
- When the Great Flood came, the Kokiri were completely unprepared. They were afraid to leave their forest, and couldn’t bear to abandon their guardian, the Great Deku Tree. The Deku Tree, who had just reached his juvenile stage of growth, prayed to the Goddess Farore for aid.
- Except for the fact the Temple of Time in Twilight Princess (not the dungeon that shares its name) is virtually identical to how it appears in Ocarina of Time. In addition, there's ruins in the Sacred Grove that suggest there was civilization before the formation of the Sacred Grove seen in Twilight Princess. If anything, it's more plausible that the Hyrule Castle Town in Ocarina of Time is the Sacred Grove in Twilight Princess. Which is supported by the fact that the Sealed Temple, which is confirmed by Hyrule Historia to be the Temple of Time in Ocarina of Time, shares its layout with the Temple of Time in question, and the fact that Skyward Sword's ending suggests the Master Sword never moved.
- I always had the headcanon that all the temples had a secondary use besides being, well, temples.
- The Forest Temple seems to be some manner of manor, perhaps a vacation castle for the royal family. The place where you fight against Phantom Ganon is quite evidently a museum, so they probably collected art there. Since it was in a sacred meadow, the spirits of the forest started to populate it after it went into decadence.
- The Fire Temple was explicitely made to house Volvagia.
- The Water Temple was quite clearly some manner of water treatment plant, and is position in the heart of the biggest body of water allowed it to control the flows in Hyrule (magic probably was used, to). The place where you fight against Morpha was the center.
- The Temple of Time strikes me as the one that was used as a regular church. Unlike the rest that were exclusively on sacred places and hard to reach, people actually went here to pray.
- The Shadow Temple is widely believed to have been a mausoleum or a torture chamber. There is A LOT of information to lead to this. The Sheikah were in service of the royal family, so here is probably where they took the enemies of the realm. It became a temple as a way to honor the fighting tradition of the Sheikah, as well as to house the vengeful spirits of the tortured and condemmed (which would eventually became Bongo Bongo). As for the idea of it being dedicaded to Demise...could be, in a way, perhaps he was at some point revered as a god of death, specially by people such as the Sheikah, which dealt with death constantly.
- The Spirit Temple wasn't dedicated to a particular deity, but rather to the spirits of the desert. The Gerudo seem to have a highly idiosincrasic culture in Hyrule, so they probably uphold different deities (probably the woman of the great statue). They probably had some manner of Egyptian-like animism in which they worshipped their deceased.
- Given the heavy nudge in that direction from the book, it's most likely the case.
- Or perhaps, it's the fairies in combination with the forest that do it. In the forest with their fairies, the Kokiri appear to fade in as you get close to them. In the ending sequence when they are outside the forest, they don't have this fade in and don't have their fairies either. It would also explain several things: why they don't appear more often; how the Maidens and Sages of LTTP and LBW, respectively, are descendants from the original sages (Gully and his parents wear clothes that resembles the Kokiri garb notably, with Gully outright looking like a Kokiri); the reason why they would "die" if they left the forest (they would grow old and die); and notably, the Kokiri (and Link himself) were inspired by Peter Pan, who was known to go to a place where he never had to grow up (along with other "Lost" children, known as the Lost Boys, though girls work, too). However, going deeper into the forest wouldn't cause them to become Skull Kids, but getting lost and staying within the forest too long. Having a fairy with them protects them from getting lost and becoming Skull Kids.
Alternatively...
This is seemingly Jossed by The Wind Waker and Hyrule Historia, which state that the Time Travel component really happened, but assuming that wasn't always supposed to be the case, this could have been an intended reading at one point.
- Unknown sages? I thought Fado and Laruto were the sages from that time.
- Laruto? You're thinking of The Wind Waker, unless they introduce a Laruto in OoT.
- No, what I mean is, I thought Laruto and Fado were the sages circa OoT, then they died later on, then Medli and Makar become the sages during Wind Waker.
- Wrong Fado. We're talking about the Kokiri girl.
- Laruto? You're thinking of The Wind Waker, unless they introduce a Laruto in OoT.
- Jossed. The 3DS remake simply updated graphics, modified some in-game models, and otherwise just tweaked and optimized what was already there.
- Add Fado as a sage and the Wind Temple.
- Jossed.