Line #33 FanonDiscontinuity/StarWars


1	Being a long-running franchise with some drastic changes over the decades, fans are bound to disagree over what is and [[FanonDiscontinuity isn't canon]].
2	----
3	!!Mainline Movies
4	The ''Franchise/StarWars'' movies have one of the most divided fandoms when it comes to determining which works are canon (or ''ought'' to be canon). Discussion on the subject unfortunately leads to some of the fiercest {{Flame War}}s on the Internet, rife with Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike.
5	* The most extreme fans accept only a ''single'' film as canon: the original 1977 ''Film/ANewHope'' (not that they'll call it that; its original title was just ''Star Wars'', and only got changed ''because'' more films were made). They don't like ''Film/TheEmpireStrikesBack'', usually because of its DarkerAndEdgier tone. The most common complaints are that ''Empire'' doesn't fit tonally with the first movie, that the Empire's counterattack is a kind of HappyEndingOverride of the victory against the Death Star, and that Darth Vader [[LukeIAmYourFather being Luke's father]] is a {{Retcon}} which retroactively turns Obi-Wan into a liar and Luke's heroic father into a traitorous villain.
6	* Most fans accept both ''A New Hope'' and ''Empire'', but a few disregard ''Film/ReturnOfTheJedi'', citing several reasons:
7	** They don't like the Ewoks. They especially don't like how they [[RockBeatsLaser so easily made the Empire look like chumps]]. They also point out that in early versions of the script, the Ewoks were actually Wookiees, and they cynically note that the change was almost entirely to introduce a KidAppealCharacter. Even some of the executive producers hated the Ewoks, and C-3PO's actor Creator/AnthonyDaniels also expressed his antipathy (although given his loyalty to his role, he probably doesn't consider the film Discontinuity).
8	** They don't like TheReveal that Luke and Leia are siblings. First, it's a {{Retcon}}, as earlier drafts didn't say this at all (nor did ''Literature/SplinterOfTheMindsEye'', published between the releases of ''A New Hope'' and ''Empire'' and likely to bring it up if it were true). It hit especially hard with fans who {{shipp\|ing}}ed Luke and Leia and aren't into {{Twincest}}.
9	** They feel that Boba Fett, an EnsembleDarkhorse, ended up [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter wasted as a character]] with his quick and embarrassing death in the Sarlacc's digestive tract. (It may be mitigated by [[AllThereInTheManual the proverbial manual]] noting that he escaped.)
10	** They don't like the plot of having to blow up the Death Star again, going as far as to call it a RecycledScript. Creator/HarrisonFord tried to make things interesting by suggesting to Creator/GeorgeLucas that his character Han die in the process in a HeroicSacrifice, but Lucas said no.
11	* Some fans accept all three films in the original trilogy, but prefer to disregard any movie made after them. Over the years, this has grown to include (or rather exclude) the prequels, the sequels, and the spin-off movies like ''Film/RogueOne'' and ''Film/{{Solo}}''.
12	* Some fans disregard the prequel trilogy, even if they're fine with other movies like the sequel trilogy. The objections are many and have been rehashed on the Internet for decades now, but they boil down to complaining that ''(a)'' the characters who were referenced in the original trilogy are given arcs that contradict what the original trilogy establishes; ''(b)'' the ''new'' characters were largely forgettable or unlikeable; ''(c)'' the introduction of midichlorians amounts to DoingInTheWizard; and ''(d)'' the idea that Jedi are banned from having relationships made it more difficult to make plausible SlashFic.
13	* A few fans specifically disregard ''Film/ThePhantomMenace'', but are fine with the other prequels. They recommend watching the films in the "[[https://www.nomachetejuggling.com/2011/11/11/the-star-wars-saga-suggested-viewing-order/ Machete Order]]": ''A New Hope'', then ''Empire'', then ''Film/AttackOfTheClones'', then ''Film/RevengeOfTheSith'', then ''Return of the Jedi''. The idea is that it's the best way to see Anakin's character arc; first, you build up to TheReveal of "LukeIAmYourFather," then you jump back and see how he fell to TheDarkSide, and finally you jump forward again and see his redemption. The argument is that ''The Phantom Menace'' doesn't add anything to that arc that makes it worthwhile.
14	* Some fans disregard all or parts of the sequel trilogy for various reasons. Among the most common objections are that the new conflict is a HappyEndingOverride for the original trilogy, the tone is too different and unfitting, the new characters (or even the old ones) don't have good characterization, the films are too fond of internal {{Deconstruction}}, and the plots are stupid and rehashed. Interestingly, fans who disregard the sequels tend to clash with fans who disregard the ''prequels'', as they clash with the original trilogy for fairly different reasons; and both sets of fans are criticized for only hating what was new to ''them'' and seizing an opportunity to be a self-righteous meta-level KnightTemplar. Also interestingly, each of the sequel trilogy's films can be individually excluded for different reasons:
15	** Some fans reject ''Film/TheForceAwakens'' for being a SoftReboot that resets the status quo, [[HappyEndingOverride undoes the victory over the Empire in the original trilogy]], writes out ''both'' the New Republic and the New Jedi Order (the latter as early as the opening crawl), and rehashes the original trilogy's conflicts under new names. The old characters have gone practically nowhere relative to before (Han returns to smuggling, Leia returns to being Rebel leader, and Luke takes Obi-Wan's place as the mysterious hermit), while the new characters aren't given a sufficiently developed world in which to work. These fans found the film's universe [[TooBleakStoppedCaring too bleak to care about]]; many also stopped caring about what happened next, so most fans who reject ''The Force Awakens'' reject the entire sequel trilogy.
16	** Some fans accept ''The Force Awakens'' but disregard ''Film/TheLastJedi''. That film has an incredibly BrokenBase; you rarely find anything between total acclaim and total contempt for it. The ones who disregard it cite difficulty reconciling with ''The Force Awakens''. A few were receptive to the twists and deconstructions but found them poorly executed; others were opposed on principle, feeling that they were unfitting for the series. Some people hated ''The Last Jedi'' so much that they immediately started a (now closed) [[https://www.change.org/p/the-walt-disney-company-have-disney-strike-star-wars-episode-viii-from-the-official-canon change.org petition]] calling for Disney to declare it CanonDiscontinuity.
17	** Some fans accept only ''The Force Awakens'' and not ''The Last Jedi'' or ''Film/TheRiseOfSkywalker''. The tone shifts back and forth going from one movie to the next, ''The Last Jedi'' and ''The Rise of Skywalker'' overlap minimally and are particularly difficult to reconcile, and none of the three mesh well together as a whole. There's also the specter of ShipToShipCombat between the three films. Given the choice of only one "definitive" sequel film, most fans choose ''The Force Awakens''.
18	** Some fans accept both ''The Force Awakens'' and ''The Last Jedi'', but not ''The Rise of Skywalker''. One main objections here is that they don't like the plot; compared to the other two, it's much more conservative and StrictlyFormula. The other is that the film brought Palpatine BackFromTheDead as the villain, which ''(a)'' is a ''big'' HappyEndingOverride for ''Return of the Jedi'', given that Vader/Anakin supposedly killed him in a HeroicSacrifice to resolve what became a six-film-long character arc, and ''(b)'' they already tried that in the ''Franchise/StarWarsExpandedUniverse'' in the 90s, to such criticism that later EU content had to downplay it significantly.
19	* Many fans only accept certain ''versions'' of the films. Some consider the Special Editions to supersede the theatrical releases; others only accept the theatrical versions. Perhaps the biggest point of contention is whether "Han shot first", of which there are ''three'' variants: the original where Han just shoots Greedo, the modified version where Greedo shoots first and misses and Han shoots him back, and the third version where Han and Greedo shoot nearly simultaneously. Many traditional fans suggest that [[NoTrueScotsman the only "true" version]] has Han shoot first, a view so widespread that George Lucas even once wore a T-shirt on set reading "Han shot first". But given that Lucas was responsible for all three variants, this could go either way. The official 4K release uses the third version with the twist of Greedo saying "Maclunkey!"[[note]]Without subtitles, so you'd have to be a pretty hardcore fan ([[JustForFun/TVTropesWillRuinYourLife or Troper]]) to know what it means, but it's roughly "This will be the end of you!" -- the point is, it's something Han can fairly interpret as an imminent threat[[/note]] before firing.
20
21	!!''Franchise/StarWarsLegends'' and ExpandedUniverse
22	There was always a BrokenBase over the canonicity of the ''Franchise/StarWarsExpandedUniverse'', which heated up after Creator/{{Disney}} bought the franchise and made the original ''Franchise/StarWarsLegends'' an AlternateContinuity, meaning one cannot accept anything made after 2014 and the original EU as the same canon. Some fans continue to prefer ''Legends'' over the sequels, and factions within ''that'' often only accept ''certain'' material like ''ComicBook/StarWarsLegacy''. Others will reject the post-Disney canon on principle. There's even a certain subset of fans who, seeing that both universes accept the original six films and ''WesternAnimation/TheCloneWars'' as canon, treat them as the only works to be definitively canon, regardless of the quality of anything beyond that.
23	* Some fans accept ''WesternAnimation/TheCloneWars'' as canon, but not the prequel films, while others consider the entire EU canon ''except'' ''The Clone Wars'' because it was the only original EU media source to ''not'' become CanonDiscontinuity under Disney. The series contradicts the pre-existing and similarly named ''WesternAnimation/StarWarsCloneWars'', which it was meant to supersede. Some fans like to mix them for reasons like preferring the older portrayal of General Grievous's fearsome Jedi-killer reputation and Mace Windu crushing his lungs to cause his less than intimidating appearance, plus its buildup to Anakin and Obi-Wan in ''Film/RevengeOfTheSith'' and Anakin's use of his skeletal golden arm for FanWank, while preferring the new series' Ahsoka Tano and character interaction. Alternatively, some Legends fans ignore the 2008 Clone Wars series for a few reasons, including the series having many contradictions with previous Legends canon, not feeling the series fits well enough in its place in the timeline, feeling Anakin wouldn’t be considered mentor material due to his emotional control issues, or disliking Order 66 being boiled down to MindControl. Also there’s a preference with these fans for the 2003 micro series rather than the 2008 one.
24	* Some fans mix ''certain'' Disney-era works with ''Legends'', which is most common with ''Series/TheMandalorian'', ''Film/RogueOne'', ''WesternAnimation/StarWarsRebels'', and ''Series/{{Andor}}'' as they occur before the sequels (and even the originals for the latter three) and thus fit more easily into the BroadStrokes. Fans of ''VideoGame/KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' may accept Disney canon over EU canon except when it involves the games, as do some fans of ''ComicBook/StarWarsRepublic'', or ''VideoGame/DarkForcesSaga'', who favor it over ''Film/RogueOne'' concerning how the rebels stole the Death Star plans. Indeed, it was almost encouraged in some circles to mix ''Legends'' into the Disney-era works; Disney even started making a habit of cherry-picking bits of ''Legends'' continuity they liked (such as force-healing), only to end up confusing people who weren't familiar with ''Legends'' to begin with. The trend nowadays is to specify, in ''Legends''' case, that it remains canon after the Disney acquisition unless and until Disney writes something to contradict it. This is so hard to keep track of that the ''Star Wars'' wiki created the [[https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Canon#Canon_in_the_Holocron_continuity_database Holocron continuity database]], a list of works categorized by canonicity based on multiple factors -- which Disney will happily ignore and throw into disarray every so often.
25	* Even before the ContinuityReboot, fans accepted certain bits of ''Legends'' continuity more than others. Before ''Literature/NewJediOrder'', individual opinions over what was considered FanonDiscontinuity or not were vastly varied between individual fans, ranging in extremes from only discounting obvious pieces (such as the ''Literature/JediAcademyTrilogy'' and ''Literature/TheCourtshipOfPrincessLeia'' which were full of {{Continuity Snarl}}s) to ignoring absolutely everything set after the Thrawn Trilogy. Even afterward, some fans wanted the ''Literature/NewJediOrder'' series to be the end of the ''Legends'' franchise and disregard almost everything afterward, while the people that dislike ''New Jedi Order'' want either the ''Literature/HandOfThrawn'' duology or ''Literature/YoungJediKnights'' to be the end.
26	** It all began with ''Literature/SplinterOfTheMindsEye'', the first Legends novel ever written. The book was meant to be the plot for a low-budget sequel to Episode IV [[WhatCouldHaveBeen in the event that it wasn't the commercial success it ended up being]], but remained canon within the Legends continuity with elements from it appearing elsewhere in the timeline. Many fans disagreed with this choice due to Luke's faceoff against Vader within the novel diminishing the gravity of their climactic showdown in ''Empire Strikes Back'', as well as the unwanted additional ShipTease with him and Leia.
27	** The novel ''Literature/TheCrystalStar'' is generally considered the worst ''Star Wars'' book written, thanks to its slow plot, out-of-character actions, and general weird crap, [[CanonDiscontinuity and the writers seem to agree]].
28	** The ''Jedi Prince'' young adult novels (also known as ''Literature/TheGloveOfDarthVader'' after the first book) as refused as ever occurring by fans, helped by only two points from the entire series ever being brought up again, ever: the concept of [[RidiculouslyHumanRobots Human Replica Droids]] and Duro being a wasteland, polluted to the point of being uninhabitable by industrial waste, neither of which requires the stories' specific events to work. Ironically, Disney's reboot [[Film/TheRiseOfSkywalker would ultimately bring up]], [[HilariousInHindsight whether it were intentional or not]], the idea of [[spoiler: Emperor Palpatine having a grandchild who ends up on the side of good instead]].
29	** The ''ComicBook/DarkEmpire'' comics series, which brought Palpatine back, is often disregarded in favor of the roughly concurrent ''[[Literature/TheThrawnTrilogy Thrawn Trilogy]]'' of novels and the rest of ''Legends'' that followed its lead. Or else the comics are imagined to be in its own continuity as a sequel to ''Return of the Jedi''. This is encouraged by the inevitable thematic ContinuitySnarl between the comics and the prequel movies made later, which retroactively established the whole prophecy that Vader would "bring balance to the Force" and that he fulfilled it by killing Palpatine in ''Return of the Jedi''. Thus, some fans disregard ''The Rise of Skywalker'', and by extension the entire sequel trilogy (for having darksiders in general), for the same reason.
30	** The ''Literature/NewJediOrder'' series had an enormous number of fans rejecting it outright, mostly revolving around claims of making ''Star Wars'' needlessly DarkerAndEdgier. This opinion was pushed well into the majority after the BloodierAndGorier ''Literature/DarkNestTrilogy'' and the ''Literature/LegacyOfTheForce'' series, each considered FanonDiscontinuity for their own reasons, with only a small minority still holding out after events such as [[spoiler:Mara Jade and Anakin Solo's deaths]]. ''Literature/FateOfTheJedi'' initially looked to [[FixFic regain some of the lost fans,]] but then served only to further diminish their numbers.
31	** ''VideoGame/StarWarsTheOldRepublic'' tie-in novel ''Literature/{{Revan}}'' is hated by fans of ''VideoGame/KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' and ''VideoGame/KnightsOfTheOldRepublicIITheSithLords'' -- alongside putting Revan and TheExile through TheWorfEffect, the KOTOR squadmates are incredibly shafted, outside of Canderous, T3 and Bastila. Even more so for the KOTOR 2 squadmates, where outside of Kreia (only a short reference as "Darth Traya") ''[[DemotedToExtra none of them are even mentioned by their names]]''. Add this in with Exile having ForgotAboutHisPowers, her connection to the Force magically re-appearing, the Sith Emperor being an InvincibleVillain, and all of Kreia's teachings about the Force and the Jedi being dismissed as Dark Side corruption. And on top of that, [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking quite a few people hate the name Meetra Surik]]. Adding even more fuel to the fire, the novel is implied to be [[YouShouldHaveDiedInstead one of the few things that survived the reboot]] as ''Franchise/StarWarsTheHighRepublic'' refers to Surik by name.
32	** Some ''ComicBook/StarWarsRepublic'' fans disregard the AllThereInTheManual deaths of Ki-Adi Mundi's family.
33	** ''[[Literature/CoruscantNights The Last Jedi]]'' (not to be confused with the sequel film of the same name) is quite controversial due to fitting closer with ''[[WesternAnimation/StarWarsTheCloneWars The Clone Wars]]'' and Disney canon than with the Legends EU and getting [[spoiler:Laranth]] killed.
34	** Some fans like to think Thall Joben, one of R2-D2 and C-3PO's many owners in ''WesternAnimation/{{Droids}}'', is a survivor of Order 66 and don't like WordOfGod saying he merely found the lightsaber he carries somewhere.
35	** ''ComicBook/DawnOfTheJedi'' fans can be tempted to disregard the third and final story arc, ''Force War'', or at least parts of it, due to how the story feels a bit rushed and abruptly ends due to the approaching Disney buyout. It probably would have turned out differently if not for the ContinuityReboot.
36	** Fans of the ''ComicBook/DarkTimes'' comic series have two notable points of contention with the storyline that they sometimes try to disregard: the DroppedABridgeOnHim death of [[spoiler:Crys Taanzer]] halfway through the comic, and fan favorite OneManArmy Order 66 survivor Beyghor Sachet [[spoiler:turning out to have killed another Jedi and pledged allegiance to Palpatine, leading to his death and that of two other supporting characters in the final arc]].
37	** ''Film/TheStarWarsHolidaySpecial'' was near-universal FanonDiscontinuity; Creator/GeorgeLucas himself disowned it and allegedly said he would destroy every copy of it he could find himself. However, it was always ''officially'' BroadStrokes canon and only became CanonDiscontinuity when Disney jettisoned the entire EU.
38	* Many fans of the Creator/JudeWatson books would rather ignore the ''Literature/RebelForce'' series for having HappyEndingOverride (or at least BittersweetEnding override) of ''Literature/TheLastOfTheJedi'' and ''Literature/JediQuest'', while being written by a different author with a different style. Some might also apply this to the last ''Literature/TheLastOfTheJedi'' book as well, due to how much AnyoneCanDie is at play there. Some fans of the ''Literature/JediQuest'' books also dislike how they end with a popular supporting character dying because of Anakin's bad decision-making in a way that some people feel is more consistent with his post-''Film/AttackOfTheClones'' persona rather than how he was at the start of the film.
39	* ''Series/TheMandalorian'' has some fans who want to reject [[Series/TheBookOfBobaFett the first spin-off]], a generally common choice for Creator/DisneyPlus's worst ''Star Wars''-based show, and Season 3, which continues from the RequiredSpinoffCrossover. These fans argue that even if ''Mandalorian'' Season 2 doesn't have a totally happy ending, it still feels like appropriate and resonant closure for the clan's story; when Din Djarin reveals his true face to Grogu, then the two permit Luke Skywalker to resume Grogu's training. They also argue that the aforementioned continuations reverse too much of Din's character development (such as when he accepts a trial of atonement from the Armorer for revealing his face, and doesn't let Grogu see it again afterwards), delivered disappointing payoffs to earlier plot threads, and aren't as enjoyable to viewers who don't know the complete canon timeline of the cartoons (including the unaired episodes). Disney's Blu-ray department didn't help when they announced, four months after Season 3 finished, that the inaugural wave of ''Mandalorian'' sets would stop at Season 2.
40	* Another unofficial timeline includes every ''Mandalorian'' season, but trims ''Series/TheBookOfBobaFett'' down to the aforementioned crossover. This gained support mainly from viewers who missed ''Boba Fett'' during its original run, but didn't understand the ''Mandalorian'' Season 3 premiere until other fans advised them to watch Din's appearances. By skipping the preceding episodes, these viewers can disregard several instances of Boba acting uncharacteristically weak or altruistic, as well as some fake-outs regarding the show's ultimate villain.

Context FanonDiscontinuity / StarWars