Discussion History Main / BaraGenre

Here\\\'s where I think the problem lies with the Bara and BoysLove pages. In Japan BoysLove - most commonly known as yaoi in the west - is a huge umbrella supergenre. It includes effiminate pretty boys and melodrama, shonen-ai, shotacon, transgender couplings, manly men having one night stands, reversible positions of all descriptions, in-detail mature stories, realism and WishFufillment, PlotWithPorn, fetishes... can I go on? In the West, Yaoi = effeminate pretty boys and melodrama. Bara = manly men and the \\\'realistic\\\' alternative to Yaoi. There is a slight problem with this, first of all Bara (as the west understand it) is mostly porn. Why the hell would you want your porn to be \\\'\\\'realistic\\\'\\\'? (i.e. have realistic situations and realistic expectations, obviously a certain amount of base realism is absolutely necessary in any porn, but professional Yaoi (as the west understand it) porn seems to cater for a similar degree of base realism \\\'\\\'for the greater part\\\'\\\'). No, this is what people in the west try to call Bara in order to escape the stigma of liking what might be called Yaoi (I know people who say they read Bara for this exact purpose, and even on certain discussion boards \\\'\\\'I\\\'\\\' tend to conveniently leave out the fact that I read \\\"Yaoi\\\" as often as I read Bara (as I\\\'ve come to understand it from a western perspective)). Works about male homoeroticism come from different roots (Bara from gay porn (appealing for gay men), Yaoi from shoujo (of all places) (appealing to straight women)) but it ends up under the same supergenre in the end. At least, that\\\'s how I understand it works in Japan and should probably work in the west.

I have to say that my understanding of Bara and Yaoi comes from reading it and what I\\\'ve gathered from translated authors notes and fan dialogue. So I may be completely off (I\\\'m sorry if I am). Honestly, when I came onto this site and found them divided in such a way I was confused, because I\\\'d come across them only under the umbrella of BoysLove or Yaoi and didn\\\'t know the extra category existed (I still don\\\'t know if some of the works I like would be called Yaoi or Bara).

One thing I have noticed in western culture that is shockingly prevalent is the feeling of being ashamed of liking Yaoi. Because in the west, liking Yaoi makes you a YaoiFangirl, with the mental age of a 13 year-old and no understanding of how men act or sex works. Who the hell would want to be known as liking Yaoi when you get laughed off the discussion boards for it? It happens on this site too. A lot. YaoiFangirl is a byword on tvtropes for a condemnation of common sense or an idea of reality.

What I think would be the most effective thing would be to list \\\"Yaoi\\\" and \\\"Bara\\\" under
one title, merge the two, explain the different styles and origins and then leave it so we can just have fun with the works without picking and choosing categorization.

Okay, I don\\\'t think anyone will read this (it is \\\'\\\'horribly\\\'\\\' long, for which I apologise) but I thought I\\\'d put my thoughts here where maybe the idea of restructuring the pages would still be open anyway.

Here\\\'s where I think the problem lies with the Bara and BoysLove pages. In Japan BoysLove - most commonly known as yaoi in the west - is a huge umbrella supergenre. It includes effiminate pretty boys and melodrama, shonen-ai, shotacon, transgender couplings, manly men having one night stands, reversible positions of all descriptions, in-detail mature stories, realism and WishFufillment, PlotWithPorn, fetishes... can I go on? In the West, Yaoi = effeminate pretty boys and melodrama. Bara = manly men and the \\\'realistic\\\' alternative to Yaoi. There is a slight problem with this, first of all Bara (as the west understand it) is mostly porn. Why the hell would you want your porn to be \\\'\\\'realistic\\\'\\\' (i.e. have realistic situations and realistic expectations, obviously a certain amount of base realism is absolutely necessary in any porn, but professional Yaoi (as the west understand it) porn seems to cater for a similar degree of base realism \\\'\\\'for the greater part\\\'\\\')? No, this is what people in the west try to call Bara in order to escape the stigma of liking what might be called Yaoi (I know people who say they read Bara for this exact purpose, and even on certain discussion boards \\\'\\\'I\\\'\\\' tend to conveniently leave out the fact that I read \\\"Yaoi\\\" as often as I read Bara (as I\\\'ve come to understand it from a western perspective)). Works about male homoeroticism come from different roots (Bara from gay porn (appealing for gay men), Yaoi from shoujo (of all places) (appealing to straight women)) but it ends up under the same supergenre in the end. At least, that\\\'s how I understand it works in Japan and should probably work in the west.