Discussion History Analysis / AntiHero

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, would NeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, remains ethical despite ridiculous amounts of mental torture since she was born, minds her own business unless she notices corruption afoot (in which case she attempts to expose it) or dangerous individuals severely threaten herself or her friends, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or at worst mild type IV. She\\\'s definitely less extreme than Marv in any case, who is also a professional criminal I might add, and Dwight, who \\\'\\\'was\\\'\\\' placed as mild type IV, is willing to hurt occasional innocents or offhandedly kill much greater amounts of criminals than she is, and under less extreme duress. Comics or movies simply let a writer get away with greater amounts of cruelty than a novel that is explicit (rather than offhanded) about the full uncomfortable details/implications of what is happening.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Vendetta, well the memories are fuzzy at this point, but I don\\\'t recall him harming any innocents beyomd when Evey asked him to enlighten her about his situation, whereupon he gave her a MindScrew trick to make her believe herself imprisoned in a camp just like he was and given the same notes from the prisoner beside him that he was, so I think a YourMileageMayVary if he\\\'s a type IV or V should be inserted, although I may misremember.

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, would NeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, remains ethical despite ridiculous amounts of mental torture since she was born, minds her own business unless she notices corruption afoot (in which case she attempts to expose it) or dangerous individuals severely threaten herself or her friends, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or at worst mild type IV. She\\\'s definitely less extreme than Marv in any case, who is also a professional criminal I might add, and Dwight, who \\\'\\\'was\\\'\\\' placed as mild type IV, is willing to hurt occasional innocents or offhandedly kill much greater amounts of criminals than she is, and under less extreme duress. Comics or movies simply let a writer get away with greater amounts of cruelty than a novel that is explicit (rather than offhanded) about the full uncomfortable details/implications of what is happening.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Vendetta, well the memories are fuzzy at this point, but I don\\\'t recall him harming any innocents beyomd when Evey asked him to enlighten her about his situation, whereupon he gave her a MindScrew trick to make her believe herself imprisoned in a camp just like he was and given the same notes from the prisoner beside him that he was, so I think a YourMileageMayVary if he\\\'s a type IV or V, although I may misremember.

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, would NeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, remains ethical despite ridiculous amounts of mental torture since she was born, minds her own business unless she notices corruption afoot (in which case she attempts to expose it) or dangerous individuals severely threaten herself or her friends, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or at worst mild type IV. She\\\'s definitely less extreme than Marv in any case, who is also a professional criminal I might add, and Dwight, who \\\'\\\'was\\\'\\\' placed as mild type IV, is willing to hurt occasional innocents or offhandedly kill much greater amounts of criminals than she is, and under less extreme duress. Comics or movies simply let a writer get away with greater amounts of cruelty than a novel that is explicit (rather than offhanded) about the full uncomfortable details/implications of what is happening.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Vendetta, well the memories are fuzzy at this point, but I don\\\'t recall him harming any innocents beyomd when Evey asked him to enlighten her about his situation, so I think a YourMileageMayVary if he\\\'s a type IV or V, although I may misremember.

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, would NeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, remains ethical despite ridiculous amounts of mental torture since she was born, minds her own business unless she notices corruption afoot (in which case she attempts to expose it) or dangerous individuals severely threaten herself or her friends, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or at worst mild type IV. She\\\'s definitely less extreme than Marv in any case, who is also a professional criminal I might add, and Dwight, who \\\'\\\'was\\\'\\\' placed as mild type IV, is willing to hurt occasional innocents or offhandedly kill much greater amounts of criminals than she is, and under less extreme duress. Comics or movies simply let a writer get away with greater amounts of cruelty than a novel that is explicit about the full uncomfortable details of what is happening.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Vendetta, well the memories are fuzzy at this point, but I don\\\'t recall him harming any innocents beyomd when Evey asked him to enlighten her about his situation, so I think a YourMileageMayVary if he\\\'s a type IV or V, although I may misremember.

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, would NeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or mild type IV.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, WouldNeverHurtAnInnocent, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or mild type IV.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Lisbeth Salander on the other hand is placed within type V without due reason compared to other characters on the scale. She\\\'s very similar to Hartigan of SinCity in that she\\\'s strictly using PayEvilUntoEvil as a last recourse when technically outmatched and the system has legitimately completely betrayed her (her supposed lifelines literally either torture or rape her), but has strong ethics beyond that, is unshakably loyal to her friends, and will allow the system to handle things when it works. For example since her Ombudsman repeatedly raped and mistreated her, she filmed it as evidence, tazered him and tattooed \\\"I AM A RAPIST\\\" on his skin. Basically, she\\\'s in an incredibly desperate situation, and doesn\\\'t have the luxury of being a superhuman who has the upper hand, and as such it is incredibly arguable whether she is a type III or IV, but definitely not a type V or AxCrazy. PayEvilUntoEvil as a last outmatched resort is a better definition, so probably a dark type III or mild type IV.

As for Lelouch, as I said above, it is a fine compromise to state in his entry that he swings between types V and III, but might average as a type IV. Not mentioning it at all on the other hand...

Wolverine is of course arguable is he\\\'s a type V or not, as he has gladly slaughtered completely outmatched street punks in an extatic bloodcraze and similar antics, or done even worse in slughtering entire villages of bystanders in his flashbacks. It\\\'s the whole strange fictional RunningTheAsylum / DependingOnTheWriter tendency that makes things odd (back-and-forth personality shifts) in this case, so at other times he\\\'s simply played as a type III.