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The IRL section got deleted. Since it wouldn\'t seem like a problem to anyone who\'s not a Vulcan to have this info \'\'somewhere\'\', say on a YMMV page, especially since this is primarily a [[MetaConcepts Meta Trope]], would it be OK to move some of the following to TroperTales or similar namespace?
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The IRL section got reasonably pared back, but all the YMMV stuff was simply deleted. Since it wouldn\\\'t seem like a problem to have this info \\\'\\\'somewhere\\\'\\\', say on a YMMV page, especially since this is primarily a [[MetaConcepts Meta Trope]], would it be OK to move some of the following to TroperTales or similar namespace?
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* Mexican politicians \'\'love\'\' the abuse of this trope. Since governors and presidents are replaced every 6 years instead of every 4, that means people who can\'t remember what the previous winner said, and candidates conquering the people with exactly the same demagogic drivel over and over and over again. This is especially bad in the conservative central states, where the conservatives score easy wins after throwing bland, generic speeches about \
to:
* Mexican politicians \\\'\\\'love\\\'\\\' the abuse of this trope. Since governors and presidents are replaced every 6 years instead of every 4, that means people who can\\\'t remember what the previous winner said, and candidates conquering the people with exactly the same demagogic drivel over and over and over again. This is especially bad in the conservative central states, where the conservatives score easy wins after throwing bland, generic speeches about \\\"our Catholic virtues\\\", \\\"good customs\\\" and \\\"moral values\\\".\\\\\\\\
** To an extent and modified for regional issues, \\\'\\\'all\\\'\\\' politicians do this, worldwide.\\\\\\\\
* All presidential candidates in the United States promise security, better government, economy and moral values. The result is that American government swings back and forth between Republican and Democratic parties every four to sixteen years, and even though these parties eventually get ZeroPercentApprovalRating, especially since both of them take their policies to their [[strike:logical]] most extreme. It\\\'s a wonder that Americans haven\\\'t just thrown up their hands and choose a new major political party. \\\"Hope and Change\\\" and \\\"Reform, Peace, Prosperity\\\" are OlderThanYouThink.\\\\\\\\
** The whole thing about them going to the most extreme version is actually an example of the trope, both sides accuse each other of this and then both act in almost exactly the same way (centrist with expanding bureaucracy). A running joke on \\\'\\\'TheDailyShow\\\'\\\' is to show clips of the most vocal supporters and opponents of a policy, and then show clips from when the other party was in power. The same people are making the same points with the same arguments, but who is making which point is reversed. If they really went to extremes, the first act of either side as soon as it came back to power would be to repeal all the major changes the last one made. American elections use single member districts instead of proportional representation; it actually forces a two-party system, with change only coming if a party collapses.\\\\\\\\
*** After the most recent election, \\\'\\\'The Daily Show\\\'\\\' not only {{lampshaded}} this... they admitted to doing the same thing themselves, and basically said \\\'\\\'\\\'they don\\\'t care\\\'\\\'\\\' if it\\\'s hypocritical. When Stewart points out that Obama\\\'s inauguration speech (hailed by his supporters as amazing and awesome) was in many ways nearly identical to Bush\\\'s incumbent speech in 2004 (derided by his detractors as warmongering and horrible), the other reporter\\\'s excuse was \\\"Why is melted cheese so delicious on Italian food, but so disgusting on Chinese food? \\\'\\\'It just is\\\'\\\'!\\\"\\\\\\\\
* Irish governments wishing to stay in office ALWAYS promise 2,000 new garda?police), with no explanation as to where the money will come from.\\\\\\\\
** This isn\\\'t that surprising, as promising new cool things (tax cuts from the right, handouts from the left) without any explanation of how to pay for them is pretty much how \\\'\\\'all\\\'\\\' politicians get elected.\\\\\\\\
* Subverted in the UK - major political parties rarely have any policies at all, instead basing their platforms around making the same criticisms of rival parties every five years.\\\\\\\\
** The [[BritishNewspapers newspapers]], however, play it straight as an arrow; the Sun dug its claws into Labour and Lib Dem policy for 2010 while hoping that people forgot they were praising them in 2001 and 2005.\\\\\\\\
* Canadian political parties have plenty of policies, but nobody really pays attention to them. Canadians historically vote for the party they hate the least at that moment. This fact is so universally acknowledged that it\\\'s quoted in university-level political science textbooks. A really good way to lose the election is to run attack ads, which to Canadians don\\\'t just seem desperate but overly American as well - not something you want to do if you want to win.\\\\\\\\
** \\\"Overly American\\\" is an interesting way of putting it, as that \\\'\\\'is\\\'\\\' one of the criticisms Canadian politicians like to sling at each other, and one that seems to be expected. A Canadian political cartoonist pointed out that you don\\\'t really see other countries do this sort of thing, and that an American politician who said something like \\\"That policy sounds awfully \\\'\\\'Mexican\\\'\\\' to me!\\\" would be ending his career. Although, the recent US health-care debate did have many Conservatives criticizing the reform as bring it too close to the Canadian system.\\\\\\\\
*** ...which for the record had many others [[InsultBackfire wondering why that was a bad thing]].\\\\\\\\
*** Accusations of something being like France however remains accepted.\\\\\\\\
*** Actually, in \\\'\\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\'\\\' country outside of the USA, {{Eagleland}} is right next to France in the list of {{Acceptable Target}}s.\\\\\\\\
*** Forget France. The US is the number one acceptable target, about culture, politics, public health and practically \\\'\\\'\\\'everything\\\'\\\'\\\' else. Although it is a little less so with the new guy in charge.\\\\\\\\
* Israel\\\'s largest Right-Wing party (Likud) has been receiving the majority of its votes from the working-class, despite each Right-Wing government so far having consistently introduced \\\"financial reforms\\\" that deliberately widen the gap between rich and poor. This is said to be mainly due to working-class support for right-wing hawkish policies regarding the Palestinians, but Right-Wing governments have also ended up making greater concessions in peace process negotiations than Left-Wing governments. To make matters even more bizarre, the Ogre is even in plain sight: This voting pattern has been ridiculed thoroughly on many satirical and extremely popular television shows over the past few decades, but once the elections roll in people seem to forget the lesson anyway. And yeah, I realize this must be the same exact way in most other democratic countries.\\\\\\\\
** Eh, questionable. There\\\'s a genuine ideological divide, right and left, about what amount of welfare is best for the people. There are benefits for the poor from right policies- aid to get off welfare, business freedom, and challenges to rich unions. Some fraction of the poor disagree with you about what they want, and as such, no amount of TV programs mocking them will change their view. A divide between rich and poor isn\\\'t that important, as long as in absolute terms the poor are getting richer. Lots of left wing parties (Labor say) are regarded as left wing hawkish, but they still don\\\'t win votes.\\\\\\\\
*** The problem is traditional class/party connections. The predominantly blue-collar and Sephardi/Mizrahi Likud voters don\\\'t trust Labor, since Labor is the party of the white-collar Ashkenazi Establishment, whom they think are often a touch out of touch. This doesn\\\'t stop both parties from still being dominated by white-collar Ashkenazis, but that\\\'s just the way things are I suppose.\\\\\\\\
* [[ConspiracyTheorist Conspiracy theorists]] of every flavor rely on this trope. You may or may not have heard them rambling on about how the president is fixin\\\' to declare martial law and put us all in concentration camps \\\'\\\'any minute now\\\'\\\' - which is a rehash of exactly what they claimed the \\\'\\\'last\\\'\\\' president would do. Likewise, those worked up about an ancient prophecy of doom in 2012 would do well to remember the \\\'\\\'last\\\'\\\' time an ancient civilization \\\"predicted\\\" global catastrophe - remember when Planet X was gonna fly by and cause catastrophic devastation in 2003?\\\\\\\\
** Not to mention all those Ancient Prophecies of Doom that were supposed to kick in on 12.00AM January 1st 2000.\\\\\\\\
** Or 6-6-06, because June 6, 2006 was the day of the Devil and Hell was going to open up or somesuch, never mind that nothing exciting went down in the history books on, say, June 6, 666...\\\\\\\\
** Ah, but June 6, 1666 was full of rioting, looting, and fighting in the streets...\\\\\\\\
** Look at how awful the world is today! Surely the Rapture is right around the corner, like it has been for decades.\\\\\\\\
** More GenreSavvy conspiracy theorists rely on this in a different way: they claim that their \\\'\\\'audiences\\\'\\\' have short memories and therefore cannot see the [[ConspiracyPlacement known patterns]] of TheConspiracy\\\'s actions throughout history that are definitely there.\\\\\\\\
** In the US the types of conspiracy theories you\\\'ll hear the most changes based on who is in power. The democrats tend to attract more New World Order theories about the UN taking over the country.\\\\\\\\
*** Well yes, to those in the know, the obvious outcome of Republican policies is TheMatrix, and the obvious outcome of Democrat policies is NineteenEightyFour. Libertarians will leave us with MadMax. The Green party will cause ThePostman. Just pick the party that fits the ApocalypseHow you prefer.\\\\\\\\
* Corrupt televangelist [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Popoff Peter Popoff]] scammed millions of dollars out of viewers claiming he could cause miracles through prayer for anybody who sent him money, using highly deceptive \\\"demonstrations\\\". He was exposed as a fraud, went bankrupt, then managed to get rich \\\'\\\'again\\\'\\\' using the \\\'\\\'exact same scam\\\'\\\' a decade later.\\\\\\\\
* How long\\\'s the time frame between a pyramid scheme gets exposed as a fraud in a newspaper, and the last time it happened? Two, three years?\\\\\\\\
** And never mind that the previous [[strike:snake oil]] herbal remedy salesman was a fraud, this one \\\'\\\'must\\\'\\\' be on to something.\\\\\\\\
* Jochen Kolbe recently \\\"arranged\\\" an indie game bundle that was modeled very closely after wolfire\\\'s Humble Indie Game Bundle. and by \\\"arranged\\\", we mean \\\"advertise with no intent on genuinely following through on your promises in any shape, form, or fashion, and we will keep all the money for ourselves and not donate to charity.\\\" This is also the same Jochen Kolbe that has a lawsuit going against him for the sale of illegally-obtained cd-keys (they were obtained with stolen credit card information) AND was arrested and jailed in 2000 for fraud. Curiously enough, this particular stunt was found out [[http://www.gog.com/en/forum/general/givewhateveryouwant_com_indie_games_casual_games_asf/perm=17/#p_b_17 relatively]] [[http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2010/05/givewhateveryouwant_indie_game.html#comments quickly.]] ]]
** To an extent and modified for regional issues, \\\'\\\'all\\\'\\\' politicians do this, worldwide.\\\\\\\\
* All presidential candidates in the United States promise security, better government, economy and moral values. The result is that American government swings back and forth between Republican and Democratic parties every four to sixteen years, and even though these parties eventually get ZeroPercentApprovalRating, especially since both of them take their policies to their [[strike:logical]] most extreme. It\\\'s a wonder that Americans haven\\\'t just thrown up their hands and choose a new major political party. \\\"Hope and Change\\\" and \\\"Reform, Peace, Prosperity\\\" are OlderThanYouThink.\\\\\\\\
** The whole thing about them going to the most extreme version is actually an example of the trope, both sides accuse each other of this and then both act in almost exactly the same way (centrist with expanding bureaucracy). A running joke on \\\'\\\'TheDailyShow\\\'\\\' is to show clips of the most vocal supporters and opponents of a policy, and then show clips from when the other party was in power. The same people are making the same points with the same arguments, but who is making which point is reversed. If they really went to extremes, the first act of either side as soon as it came back to power would be to repeal all the major changes the last one made. American elections use single member districts instead of proportional representation; it actually forces a two-party system, with change only coming if a party collapses.\\\\\\\\
*** After the most recent election, \\\'\\\'The Daily Show\\\'\\\' not only {{lampshaded}} this... they admitted to doing the same thing themselves, and basically said \\\'\\\'\\\'they don\\\'t care\\\'\\\'\\\' if it\\\'s hypocritical. When Stewart points out that Obama\\\'s inauguration speech (hailed by his supporters as amazing and awesome) was in many ways nearly identical to Bush\\\'s incumbent speech in 2004 (derided by his detractors as warmongering and horrible), the other reporter\\\'s excuse was \\\"Why is melted cheese so delicious on Italian food, but so disgusting on Chinese food? \\\'\\\'It just is\\\'\\\'!\\\"\\\\\\\\
* Irish governments wishing to stay in office ALWAYS promise 2,000 new garda?police), with no explanation as to where the money will come from.\\\\\\\\
** This isn\\\'t that surprising, as promising new cool things (tax cuts from the right, handouts from the left) without any explanation of how to pay for them is pretty much how \\\'\\\'all\\\'\\\' politicians get elected.\\\\\\\\
* Subverted in the UK - major political parties rarely have any policies at all, instead basing their platforms around making the same criticisms of rival parties every five years.\\\\\\\\
** The [[BritishNewspapers newspapers]], however, play it straight as an arrow; the Sun dug its claws into Labour and Lib Dem policy for 2010 while hoping that people forgot they were praising them in 2001 and 2005.\\\\\\\\
* Canadian political parties have plenty of policies, but nobody really pays attention to them. Canadians historically vote for the party they hate the least at that moment. This fact is so universally acknowledged that it\\\'s quoted in university-level political science textbooks. A really good way to lose the election is to run attack ads, which to Canadians don\\\'t just seem desperate but overly American as well - not something you want to do if you want to win.\\\\\\\\
** \\\"Overly American\\\" is an interesting way of putting it, as that \\\'\\\'is\\\'\\\' one of the criticisms Canadian politicians like to sling at each other, and one that seems to be expected. A Canadian political cartoonist pointed out that you don\\\'t really see other countries do this sort of thing, and that an American politician who said something like \\\"That policy sounds awfully \\\'\\\'Mexican\\\'\\\' to me!\\\" would be ending his career. Although, the recent US health-care debate did have many Conservatives criticizing the reform as bring it too close to the Canadian system.\\\\\\\\
*** ...which for the record had many others [[InsultBackfire wondering why that was a bad thing]].\\\\\\\\
*** Accusations of something being like France however remains accepted.\\\\\\\\
*** Actually, in \\\'\\\'\\\'every\\\'\\\'\\\' country outside of the USA, {{Eagleland}} is right next to France in the list of {{Acceptable Target}}s.\\\\\\\\
*** Forget France. The US is the number one acceptable target, about culture, politics, public health and practically \\\'\\\'\\\'everything\\\'\\\'\\\' else. Although it is a little less so with the new guy in charge.\\\\\\\\
* Israel\\\'s largest Right-Wing party (Likud) has been receiving the majority of its votes from the working-class, despite each Right-Wing government so far having consistently introduced \\\"financial reforms\\\" that deliberately widen the gap between rich and poor. This is said to be mainly due to working-class support for right-wing hawkish policies regarding the Palestinians, but Right-Wing governments have also ended up making greater concessions in peace process negotiations than Left-Wing governments. To make matters even more bizarre, the Ogre is even in plain sight: This voting pattern has been ridiculed thoroughly on many satirical and extremely popular television shows over the past few decades, but once the elections roll in people seem to forget the lesson anyway. And yeah, I realize this must be the same exact way in most other democratic countries.\\\\\\\\
** Eh, questionable. There\\\'s a genuine ideological divide, right and left, about what amount of welfare is best for the people. There are benefits for the poor from right policies- aid to get off welfare, business freedom, and challenges to rich unions. Some fraction of the poor disagree with you about what they want, and as such, no amount of TV programs mocking them will change their view. A divide between rich and poor isn\\\'t that important, as long as in absolute terms the poor are getting richer. Lots of left wing parties (Labor say) are regarded as left wing hawkish, but they still don\\\'t win votes.\\\\\\\\
*** The problem is traditional class/party connections. The predominantly blue-collar and Sephardi/Mizrahi Likud voters don\\\'t trust Labor, since Labor is the party of the white-collar Ashkenazi Establishment, whom they think are often a touch out of touch. This doesn\\\'t stop both parties from still being dominated by white-collar Ashkenazis, but that\\\'s just the way things are I suppose.\\\\\\\\
* [[ConspiracyTheorist Conspiracy theorists]] of every flavor rely on this trope. You may or may not have heard them rambling on about how the president is fixin\\\' to declare martial law and put us all in concentration camps \\\'\\\'any minute now\\\'\\\' - which is a rehash of exactly what they claimed the \\\'\\\'last\\\'\\\' president would do. Likewise, those worked up about an ancient prophecy of doom in 2012 would do well to remember the \\\'\\\'last\\\'\\\' time an ancient civilization \\\"predicted\\\" global catastrophe - remember when Planet X was gonna fly by and cause catastrophic devastation in 2003?\\\\\\\\
** Not to mention all those Ancient Prophecies of Doom that were supposed to kick in on 12.00AM January 1st 2000.\\\\\\\\
** Or 6-6-06, because June 6, 2006 was the day of the Devil and Hell was going to open up or somesuch, never mind that nothing exciting went down in the history books on, say, June 6, 666...\\\\\\\\
** Ah, but June 6, 1666 was full of rioting, looting, and fighting in the streets...\\\\\\\\
** Look at how awful the world is today! Surely the Rapture is right around the corner, like it has been for decades.\\\\\\\\
** More GenreSavvy conspiracy theorists rely on this in a different way: they claim that their \\\'\\\'audiences\\\'\\\' have short memories and therefore cannot see the [[ConspiracyPlacement known patterns]] of TheConspiracy\\\'s actions throughout history that are definitely there.\\\\\\\\
** In the US the types of conspiracy theories you\\\'ll hear the most changes based on who is in power. The democrats tend to attract more New World Order theories about the UN taking over the country.\\\\\\\\
*** Well yes, to those in the know, the obvious outcome of Republican policies is TheMatrix, and the obvious outcome of Democrat policies is NineteenEightyFour. Libertarians will leave us with MadMax. The Green party will cause ThePostman. Just pick the party that fits the ApocalypseHow you prefer.\\\\\\\\
* Corrupt televangelist [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Popoff Peter Popoff]] scammed millions of dollars out of viewers claiming he could cause miracles through prayer for anybody who sent him money, using highly deceptive \\\"demonstrations\\\". He was exposed as a fraud, went bankrupt, then managed to get rich \\\'\\\'again\\\'\\\' using the \\\'\\\'exact same scam\\\'\\\' a decade later.\\\\\\\\
* How long\\\'s the time frame between a pyramid scheme gets exposed as a fraud in a newspaper, and the last time it happened? Two, three years?\\\\\\\\
** And never mind that the previous [[strike:snake oil]] herbal remedy salesman was a fraud, this one \\\'\\\'must\\\'\\\' be on to something.\\\\\\\\
* Jochen Kolbe recently \\\"arranged\\\" an indie game bundle that was modeled very closely after wolfire\\\'s Humble Indie Game Bundle. and by \\\"arranged\\\", we mean \\\"advertise with no intent on genuinely following through on your promises in any shape, form, or fashion, and we will keep all the money for ourselves and not donate to charity.\\\" This is also the same Jochen Kolbe that has a lawsuit going against him for the sale of illegally-obtained cd-keys (they were obtained with stolen credit card information) AND was arrested and jailed in 2000 for fraud. Curiously enough, this particular stunt was found out [[http://www.gog.com/en/forum/general/givewhateveryouwant_com_indie_games_casual_games_asf/perm=17/#p_b_17 relatively]] [[http://www.indiegames.com/blog/2010/05/givewhateveryouwant_indie_game.html#comments quickly.]] ]]
