[001]
IdumeanPatriot
Current Version
Changed line(s) 3 from:
n
* Hibari thinks of himself as a boy InUniverse: \
to:
* Hibari thinks of himself as a boy InUniverse: \\\"I am a boy, \\\'\\\'but even so\\\'\\\', I don\\\'t want a kiss that\\\'s fake;\\\" \\\"It should be all right, \\\'\\\'since\\\'\\\' we\\\'re both boys\\\" and the like. (\\\'\\\'Sorya boku otokonoko demo furidakeno kisunante iya\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Iijan otokodoushi nandakara\\\'\\\' respectively.)
* In contrast, he never says he \\\"feels like a girl\\\" or \\\"wishes he were a girl\\\" or any such thing. Far less are any medical procedures ever suggested. From a DeathOfTheAuthor perspective, Beedok is of course right that we may imagine him as thinking of such things offscreen if we want to. But there are no hints of that in the canon.
* Hibari also displays no private discomfort with his male body, but appears perfectly happy being who he is. Far from being conflicted or ashamed of himself, he enjoys teasing and confusing Kosaku with mixed signals.
* DeathOfTheAuthor or not, in this case the author expressly intended to write Hibari as a boy (more specifically, an \\\'\\\'okama\\\'\\\'). And moreover, as Beedok pointed out in the old thread, he probably didn\\\'t know enough about transgenderism at the time to write a transgender character even had he wanted to.
Against these points, there are various subjective interpretations that Hibari\\\'s behavior is characteristic of transgenderism, in that he really likes dressing and posing as a girl. But at least as far as I can tell, none of his behavior goes obviously beyond what would be expected of a WholesomeCrossdresser in a Japanese anime context. It\\\'s very common for this kind of character to crossdress in everyday life like Hibari does, yet identify as male.
Looking back, this debate is probably also due to cultural issues at least in part, since there\\\'s no exact \\\"Western\\\" equivalent of \\\"effeminate\\\" but male identities and character types such as the \\\'\\\'okama\\\'\\\' or the Japanese style WholesomeCrossdresser. So some \\\"Western\\\" readers might want to label them as something else that\\\'s more familiar to them. But since \\\'\\\'Stop!! Hibari-kun!\\\'\\\' is a Japanese work...
I don\\\'t think anyone here objects to people headcanoning Hibari as a transgender person if they want to. And since there are some who do, it should be mentioned on the page, as previously discussed. But it seems wrong to force that subjective interpretation on the work\\\'s entire main page when the InUniverse evidence is unfavorable to it and the author\\\'s intent was demonstrably something different.
* In contrast, he never says he \\\"feels like a girl\\\" or \\\"wishes he were a girl\\\" or any such thing. Far less are any medical procedures ever suggested. From a DeathOfTheAuthor perspective, Beedok is of course right that we may imagine him as thinking of such things offscreen if we want to. But there are no hints of that in the canon.
* Hibari also displays no private discomfort with his male body, but appears perfectly happy being who he is. Far from being conflicted or ashamed of himself, he enjoys teasing and confusing Kosaku with mixed signals.
* DeathOfTheAuthor or not, in this case the author expressly intended to write Hibari as a boy (more specifically, an \\\'\\\'okama\\\'\\\'). And moreover, as Beedok pointed out in the old thread, he probably didn\\\'t know enough about transgenderism at the time to write a transgender character even had he wanted to.
Against these points, there are various subjective interpretations that Hibari\\\'s behavior is characteristic of transgenderism, in that he really likes dressing and posing as a girl. But at least as far as I can tell, none of his behavior goes obviously beyond what would be expected of a WholesomeCrossdresser in a Japanese anime context. It\\\'s very common for this kind of character to crossdress in everyday life like Hibari does, yet identify as male.
Looking back, this debate is probably also due to cultural issues at least in part, since there\\\'s no exact \\\"Western\\\" equivalent of \\\"effeminate\\\" but male identities and character types such as the \\\'\\\'okama\\\'\\\' or the Japanese style WholesomeCrossdresser. So some \\\"Western\\\" readers might want to label them as something else that\\\'s more familiar to them. But since \\\'\\\'Stop!! Hibari-kun!\\\'\\\' is a Japanese work...
I don\\\'t think anyone here objects to people headcanoning Hibari as a transgender person if they want to. And since there are some who do, it should be mentioned on the page, as previously discussed. But it seems wrong to force that subjective interpretation on the work\\\'s entire main page when the InUniverse evidence is unfavorable to it and the author\\\'s intent was demonstrably something different.
