Old Magnificent Bastard thread
Welcome to the Magnificent Bastard proposal thread! This is the thread where new Magnificent Bastard examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential mitigating features will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the MB subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite MB" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from other parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for MB equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, their goals and methodology, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some characters, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
How are they Magnificent?
This is the point where you highlight the character's brilliance. How to they convey their intelligence and charm to the audience? What makes them stand out among the crowd? What are their goals and how do they go about accomplishing them? This part welcomes a lot of creative thinking — not everyone has to be a Machiavellian Diabolical Mastermind to be worth considering here! This is also the time to showcase how the character can think on their feet if it's necessary.
How are they a Bastard? How are they not too bad?
What kinds of moral lines is this character willing to cross for the sake of their goal? Are they willing to let innocents die? Start wars? Commit crimes? The character has to show some kind of unscrupulousness in order to count as a "Bastard". Notably, this character does not necessarily have to be the villain, and an Anti-Hero can cross the line if they're immoral enough, but they have to be immoral somehow.
This is also the section where you then state your case for why they're not too bad. Perhaps their good intentions help mitigate their crimes. Perhaps others are shown to be much worse than them. Perhaps they're prone to Pet the Dog moments or are even fighting on behalf of loved ones. Whatever the case, there are certain lines that an MB can't cross, but as long as their villainy is reasonable for their goal, they can be considered.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:40:56 AM
Really excited to get this one up so allow me a second today. Spoilers to follow.
What's the work?
Scream (2022) is the latest installment of the famously self-aware slasher franchise. We follow new protagonist Sam Carpenter after her estranged younger sister Tara is attacked and nearly killed by a new Ghostface. Coming back to Woodsboro to protect Tara as she recovers in hospital, Sam's plagued by visions of Billy Loomis who makes vague statements as she teams up with heroine Sidney Prescott to stop the latest Ghostface duo. While his living incarnation committed a brutal sexual assault (amongst other things), "hallucination" Billy is all the dark charm with none of the ickiness.
Who is "Billy"? What has he done?
Manifesting as a result of Sam's psychosis, he menacingly pops up to accuse Sam of hiding the "truth" of the new attacks from Tara. This pushes Sam into telling Tara how she learned their mother had an affair with Billy in high school before he was killed and Sam was born as a result of it.
Their mother's drinking tendencies led to this becoming known to the film's killers (Sam's boyfriend Richie and Tara's best friend Amber) who set about making a "legacy" of the '96 killings by drawing back survivors of the original massacre as well as people linked to it, like Sam as Billy's daughter, in the hopes of relaunching the Stab franchise with fresh inspiration after the two loons have decided their favorite horror movies have gone to shit.
After Tara's friends decide based on horror film rules Sam herself is the likely killer, she leaves their meeting in a fury. As she drives back to her motel, Billy appears once more to push her to accept the killer inside herself, look for clues, hunt down the murderers and "cut some fucking throats" to protect herself and her sister.
Accepting herself despite her past, Billy's influence leads Sam to sticking with her family above all else and she unties a captive Tara after she's restrained by Richie and Amber. While her loose sister attacks Amber, Sam ends up facing down against her insane boyfriend. As Richie trains his gun on her, a reflection of Billy in a mirror nods to a knife hidden by a curtain, letting her remind Richie to "Never fuck with the daughter of a serial killer" and brutally stab him to death. Having made it through the night, Billy nods at Sam with pride while emergency services rush into the house and tend to the survivors.
Actions and personality?
Creepy Awesome embodied, he personifies Billy post-reveal and is characterized like the memory of a "real" killer compared to the pathetic, attention-seeking Richie and Amber. Much like the actual version was known for: he's a bad person but he loves his family, real life Billy killing as revenge for his mom, this one steering Sam down a dark path to save his daughter. The film's paying homage to its most iconic killer and love for his family is the emphasized trait, bloodthirsty as the imagined version may be.
Mitigating factors?
Even if he shares a personality with Billy, there are no supernatural elements to indicate he's the original killer's ghost, so the aforementioned disqualifying features of the original version aren't an issue. As is he's a dark Spirit Advisor helping the protagonist stop the Hate Sink villains.
He definitely puts Sam in danger and encourages violence at the drop of a hat but he loves and cares for her. Interestingly his dialogue seems to indicate the feeling extends to Tara as well, since he emphasizes keeping her safe at one point.
Verdict?
Happy yes.
Caesar
Wednesday sounds like she should be an easy keep, as does Billy's ghost lol good work on the creativity thinking of that one, 43!
WHAT A WONDERFUL DAY!
I've been sitting on this one for a while, a little indie horror called Glorious. It's a wacky one to explain.
What is the work?
Glorious is a lovecraftian horror film about a man who finds himself trapped in a Disgusting Public Toilet where he is tormented by an Eldritch Abomination who lives insides a gloryhole, voiced by JK Simmons. No, I am not making that part up.
Something I did notice is that it's possible to view the whole plot as being Through the Eyes of Madness, but it's not that strong (even less clues than something like Total Recall). It's possible, but on its face it's a straightforward Cosmic Horror Story, so that take is more of an Alternative Character Interpretation.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
Ghatanothoa (he doesn't mind if you call him Ghat) is an Eldritch Abomination who was spawned by the hateful, primordial god to wipe out the entire universe. You see, all of reality is the result of this god's first children tearing it open to create the stars and the planets and life from its blood.
One day, a man named Wesley arrives at the rest stop in his car, having apparently had a really bad break-up with his girlfriend Brenda the day before. After getting really drunk and burning half his clothes, Wes stumbles into the bathroom to throw up. Ghat starts to talk to him from one of the stalls, asking him if he's alright and making idle chat. Wes plays along with this until Ghat admits that he is actually a very, very old and very lonely god (or titan, whichever limited term humans prefer). Ghat cannot show Wes his true form, saying that this will inevitably drive him insane. However, he has a favor to ask Wes. After explaining his father's plan to destroy all reality, Ghat states that Wes can help him save it by "satisfying" Ghat's physical form, preventing him from entering the mortal realm fully and sending him back to the ether.
Obviously, Wesley is not on board with this, making various futile attempts to escape. He tries to crawl through the ducts, which sends him right back to the same bathroom. Ghat makes it plain that he really will not take "no" for an answer, even walking into Wes's mind when he tries to zone out. Fortunately or not so fortunately, the property supervisor, Gary, visits the rest stop and Wes manages to draw his attention. Ghat says this is ill-advised, but relents. Gary initially mistakes the two for a couple of cruisers and tells them to find a motel somwhere. However, Ghat will not allow him to leave either. Wes tries to offer Gary in his place, but Ghat rejects this, saying that Wes was chosen by fate and that he has no use for Gary, who is now an active hindrance and has seen too much anyway. After ordering Wes to hide in the other stall, Ghat reveals himself to Gary and eats him alive, spraying the entire room in guts.
Afterwards, Ghat continues to argue with Wes, telling him that life is beautiful despite all its ugliness and Wes cannot allow it to all go away. Wes, who is clearly a very disturbed person, would rather Put Them All Out of My Misery because of his shitty childhood and summons Ghat's father. At the very brink, Ghat finally convinces Wes to satisfy him, only to react with confusion when Wes shoves his penis through the gloryhole. Ghat doesn't want to have sex with Wes, he wants Wes to sacrifice his liver in order to satisfy him. At this late point we also learn why Wes is so messed up: he's a serial killer with erotomaniac tendencies. His massive hangover is because of his guilt over killing Brenda, his latest victim. After giving Ghat his liver, Ghat returns to the ether, bidding farewell to Wes. Wes, who lays dying on the bathroom floor, says he is a hero for saving the universe, but Ghat corrects him. They are both monsters, and deserve to be forgotten.
How are they Magnificent?
Ghat is an elder god who is basically an Anti-Anti-Christ. While his purpose for existing may be to end all life, he does not want to do that anymore, if he ever did. Despite his power, he relies on his charm and manipulation to convince Wes to give him his liver, which Wes has to do willingly for the sacrifice to work. Ghat may use every dirty trick in the book to get Wes to that point, not allowing him to leave, killing anyone who might intervene and even erasing Brenda from his memories to make a point, but his plan nearly fails when Ghat's father starts tearing down the walls of reality and attempts to drag them all into the void.
Also, Ghat is very funny and witty. JK Simmons infuses him with a jovial, friendly personality that is very entertaining to watch.
How are they a Bastard?
He is still a ravenous monstrosity (and admits as much) who will happily eat a man alive, then apologize to Wes for making such a mess afterwards. Despite this, Ghat is still the strongest advocate for mankind, making a sincere effort to befriend Wes (who remember, is a psychotic serial killer with daddy issues) to get him to cooperate and being genuinely remorseful for the sacrifice Wes has to make. The whole "satisfy my physical form" thing is based on a giant misunderstanding. It's not simply that Ghat thinks Rape Is a Special Kind of Evil, he has no interest whatsoever in sexual things.
That said, Ghat's father is clearly much, much worse, making the thing a contest between Evil Versus Oblivion.
Final verdict
I think the gloryhole Eldritch Abomination is a keeper.
Edited by Morgenthaler on Jan 16th 2023 at 11:06:56 AM
You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
The MILF Virus
So I with the thread reopening, now's the chance to propose a candidate I've been sitting on for the longest time and hopefully we can see if this character qualifies. Let's talk about Shadows House and talk about Master Robe.
Setting?
Shadows House is a manga series about the mysterious Shadow House, a prestigious mansion inhabited by the Shadows Family, literally walking Shadows which are said to be the height of nobility. Everytime a Shadow is born, they are given a Living Doll as a servant who cares for them as well as serves them as their face. We follow one of these pairs, the quiet but intelligent Kate, and her happy yet naive Living Doll Emilico. The main focus of the story is the duo learning more about the Shadow House and the many mysteries it hold, as they try to survive the noble politics and many conspiracy set by their fellow denizens, all the while trying to avoid the risk of "disposal".
One of the many mysteries the duo must uncover is the mystery of Master Robe, a robed figure wandering around the mansion suspected to be involve with many incidents involving the Phantoms, monsters made out of soot which Shadows are made out of, which has endanger many of the denizens. With her enemy Edward setting suspicion upon her, Kate must figure out the perpetrator to avoid being wrongfully indicted as well as figure out if this also involve in her own plans of a rebellion against the higher-ups of the Shadow House.
With the help of her friends and companions, the duo are able to uncover that the culprit is their senior and her Living Doll, the flamboyant dance tutor and one of their earliest friends, Maryrose.
Who is Maryrose what does he do?
The Shadow Master of Rosemary and Kate's senior, Maryrose at the surface is the extravagant and flamboyant senior of Kate who loves to dance with her Living Doll Rosemary, to the point Maryrose is the current dance instructor of the children's ward. Secretly one-half of the mysterious figure Master Robe, Maryrose is actually a rebel trying to disrupt the Shadow House after learning its horrifying truths. Learning from her co-conspirator Anthony about the real purpose of Shadow House, which is to unify Shadows with their respective human dolls by sacrificing them and then taking their bodies for themselves, which in turn turns them into aristocrats for the Shadow House.
Realizing the danger she and her servant Rosemary are at, Maryrose decided to work with Anthony to reek havoc upon Shadow House, with Maryrose main purpose is to find an exit so she and Rosemary can escape before she would be called for the Unification which would kill Rosemary. So as the mysterious Master Robe, she and Anthony began investigating the many mysteries of Shadow House, with Maryrose plan being to set-up a potential rebellion, before changing to trying to find an exit for her and Rosemary to escape.
Using her Soot Powers to control Scorches, she began using it to cause disruption within the house in to cause a distraction to further her investigation, ending with her seemingly finding an exit. To her dismay it ended up being a fake and with her time almost up because she was called for the Unification, Maryrose realize drastic time were needed, setting up a big plan while she pretends to be her usual dramatic self.
Working with Rosemary once more, Maryrose had he sneak in a massive number of Soot during a cleaning day to attack the Living Dolls, before she destroys the Coffee that Lord Grandfather had been using to pacify the Living Doll by subtly brainwashing the Belle Twins, framing them. This was to delay the Unification call-up which worked and gives more time for Maryrose to come up with her final scheme. Noticing her protegee Kate was planning a rebellion of her own, she decided to test her expecting her to figure out she was Master Robe, confronting them at night where she revealed her side. Deciding to challenge Kate and John in a fight, she used her Soot powers to control an army of Scorches, outsmarting the many scheme the two planned and even fooling John into using his power to make her stronger. Seemingly victorious after cornering them and immobilizing their Living Dolls, Kate and John manage to beat by switching with their servant after preparing a water trap, defeating them.
In prison, she and Kate then decided to collaborate a final act for Maryrose in a final attempt to stop the Unification and giving them a chance to escape, setting a massive sack of Soot for Maryrose to summon a Phantom in the Grand Hall during the day of her Unification, destroying it and disrupting the Shadow House's system and nearly killing Edward, the loyal servant of Lord Grandfather, had he not use his own power. Despite failing to kill Edward, she was able to destroy his reputation by activating the trap at the Adult Ward placing the blame on him, before she makes a final vow calling out the corrupt system the Shadow House runs, before she and her Living Doll Rosemary jump off the hole in the Grand Hall to their seeming deaths.
Although Kate and Anthony actually prepared a cushion in hopes it'll be enough to save them. Regardless, the duo did in the end manage to escape the Mansion and their action has given Kate the opportunity to set up her rebellion, showing it was not all for naught.
How magnificent?
One of Kate's earliest opponents, Maryrose shows herself to be an intelligent schemer, hiding her Shadow ability and using it in elegant and ellaborate schemes to disrupt the house, from using it with her servant Rosemary to unleash a Scorch invasion before transforming then into a Phantom and then using the chaos to destroy the coffee keeping the Living Dolls subservient by subtly manipulating the Belles, to her countering most of Kate's schemes when they do confront her with a Soot ambush and nearly capturing her and John succeeding had she not been merciful to them, to her final act which destroyed the Great Hall, nearly killing Edward and ruining his good standing with the Lord Grandfather and stopping the process of culling the Dolls and Shadows before making a final defiant speech towards him and jumping out of the mansion with Rosemary to be free.
The effects are also everlasting after her final act, with Kate hatching her own plan to sabotage the coffee which was only possible because of Maryrose's actions which Kate figured she planned out ahead, and John defeating the next antagonist by using the lessons her learned from Maryrose in their battle, showing that her hold still lingers long after her role seemingly ends.
Granted Maryrose admit her big issue was her arrogance since she was one of the few Shadows who was aware of what was happening in the mansion all this time, but despite that it doesn't get in the way of her brilliant scheming and when she did decide to let it go after being impress by Kate, she was able to pull off the final plan that gave Kate the chance to overthrow the Shadow House one day.
Is she too bad?
Now Maryrose is generally one of the friendliest seniors of the Childrens Ward and does genuinely like her friends like Kate and Barbara being an older sister figure to them. That being said Maryrose is still quiet ruthless, considering she endanger the Living Dolls with the Soots and the Phantoms and use the Belles as fall guys by destroying the coffee killing one of them due to the punishment causing one of the sisters to fall into deep depression and starving to death. She was willing to hurt John and Kate when they got in her way, although Kate quickly realize despite her actions, Maryrose did genuinely care about them and her main motivation is to protect her Living Doll Rosemary by stopping the Shadow House's horrid system.
Also compared to her competition, Maryrose is way better, hating what the Shadow House has done by disposing Dolls and Shadows so easily, planning to kill Edward for sacrificing Ed in the Unification, Also considering this is the type of house she's stopping you can see why she went for such extreme measures.
My Verdict:
I say she keeps, which she should considering how fabulous she is. Easily one of my favorite MB so far.
Edited by TheImmortalAngelNewton on Jan 16th 2023 at 11:50:30 PM
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
Caesar
Lmao knew Ghatanothoa would come up as a potential, absolutely think he keeps and good job, Morg!
Edited by Ravok on Jan 16th 2023 at 7:49:18 AM
WHAT A WONDERFUL DAY!
Man in the Yellow Hat
While I do think Wednesday counts, I do feel it's likely best to wait on her. Unlike Fester, her arc is ongoing, and I doubt this is a situation where she's played consistently enough to keep as MB with one season, considering she's called out by the other characters for endangering their lives and does have a false lead for a good chunk of the show, among others.
Anyway, uh...Scream MB that's an anti-heroic hallucination of Billy of all people. A really strange candidate, but sounds like he keeps.
Ghat sounds like he keeps, but why'd he eat Gary?
He/Him
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
I disagree. She counts right now and often times it takes years for Netflix to do new seasons.
Her putting others' life in danger and being called out for itis something that I think actually helps as well as it makes her better for the bastard part and the false lead is again because she has every reason to suspect him and not the other guy. Plus again she bounces back quite well from both of these. I say she is good enough to be discussed and potentially go up now with what we have.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 16th 2023 at 9:56:11 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Gary is actively interfering in Ghat's plan. He only needs Wes. I'll edit to clarify.
You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
Pretty strong list there. That said, I'd like to reserve a spot for the next page, if nobody minds. I have one I need to clear off from a long-pending show, and also one from Whoopie Goldberg of all people. Maybe even a Christopher Reeve
RE: Wednesday, I am 100 percent fine keeping her now after a full season of her being awesome. We have no idea if there'll be a second.
Edited by Lightysnake on Jan 16th 2023 at 7:51:25 AM
I was going to post an EP, but the page quota is suddenly filled. You all move fast.
Deleted votes because I forgot about that particular change. But yeah, all E Ps look good!
Edited by SatoshiBakura on Jan 16th 2023 at 10:55:43 AM
Classy, Refined, Unstable
I've got no issues from what I can tell with the E Ps on this page, good work all!
I'm gonna be a few days behind on Violent Night because I'm gonna be doing my uni hand in so are folks alright if I get my two up for the 20th?
Oh, Mr. Kennedy, you entertain me. To show my appreciation, I will help you awaken from your world of clichés.
Wednesday has no bars to keeping now, likewise good work Morgen.
Goku Black
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Its a bit to early for votes. We can't do that till 24 hours after the ep is posted.
Edit: For Wednesday. I'm fine putting her up for this season. Netflix take years in between seasons so we can just change if something happens in that next season.
Edited by miraculous on Jan 16th 2023 at 7:54:43 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
In the Cleanup thread, Hades from Hadestown was cut for being too evil with the Workers, and it was suggested his concept album version from Hadestown might keep. After thinking all day and all night about album Hades, i came to the conclusion that he doesn't count as an MB either, but for different reasons than Broadway Hades—while Broadway Hades had his love for Persephone and the stuff with the Workers is why he was cut, album Hades' relationship with Persephone is barely there aside from them being married. How Long is the first and only time they interact, and the liner notes don't go into their relationship or why he does what he does, so his plan to make Orpheus fail comes off as purely retaining power, and the old Epic lines about the workers being a Hive Mind ("and a million feet that fell in line/and stepped in time with Hades' step") come off as worse even if their circumstances aren't as explicit. So while the Worker stuff is downplayed, his redeeming qualities are too, and Anais herself mentioned in an interview that she felt she wrote Hades as more of a 2D villain at the time and his depth came later.
Edited by lalalei2001 on Jan 16th 2023 at 10:54:07 AM
The Protomen enhanced my life.
Man in the Yellow Hat
Hm...well, I do suppose there isn't any news on when Season 2 will come, even if it is renewed, and given it seemed to only have started production in December it will take a while, since it will likely involve SFX. I guess with that Wednesday keeps, since she definitely counts right now.
Also, with Ghat, definitely doesn't sound like an issue anymore, especially since he's a god and only kills 2 people, both with reason, to save the universe, so he seems to count. Sounds like an interesting movie.
He/Him
Caesar
More than good with that, Wet!
WHAT A WONDERFUL DAY!
Showtime!
Does someone want to make a pending list like in the CM thread?
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Linked in my sig!
The MILF Virus
No offense, but hopefully my EP doesn't get buried. I don't blame you guys considering Wednesday is here but it's definitely something I'm a little wary of since it has happened before.
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
I think Maryrose will keep at least based on the EP. I don't think anyone is forgetting yours but we just can't vote until the 24 hour limit which limits what we can say especially for easy keepers.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 16th 2023 at 10:29:56 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
I think it's more likely people just don't have questions about it. I understand the concern but we're trying to go in good faith people are doing their bit as voting tropers.
The wifi here sucks
I also think Maryrose is a fairly easy keep and as a result I don't have much to say about her.
Hope your prepared for an unforgettable luncheon
Alright, looks like everything in order here.
Edited by Lightysnake on Jan 16th 2023 at 8:34:21 AM
Lies and Violence!
Glad to be back, everyone! It's only 4 effortposts per page, right?
...Totally not asking just so I can bump to a new page and do one, no siree.
I agree that Namor will probably be an easy keep when voting time comes but that is for later obviously.
Edit: Accidentally page topper. Have a EP as an apology.
What is Wednesday?
Wednesday is a TV adaptation of The Addams Family by Tim Burton and the creators of Smallville and The Shannara Chronicles. It follows Wednesday Addams as she is sent to a school for outcasts called Nevermore and finds herself in the middle of a murder mystery.
Who is Wednesday Addams?
The eldest child of The Addams Family, Wednesday, is introduced by attacking jocks who bully her brother with piranhas. Sent to Nevermore, Wednesday easily catches Thing spying on her and forces him to work for her. Wednesday makes repeated attempts to escape, for example sneaking out of her therapist appointments and a secret plan to have the sheriff's son Tyler into helping her escape, using her roommate Enid as a distraction. After discovering that there is a prophecy tied to her destroying the school and the death and cover up of another student, Wednesday decides to stay and investigate.
Having a vision of the attack on one of her ancestors at the hands of Joseph Crackstone (who founded Jericho where Nevermore is located), Wednesday specifically trades places with Enid so that she can get into Pilgrim World and find a book that holds information on what is happening. She later comes up with a plan to destroy the statue of the outcast hating Crackstone by blowing it up, while she has an alibi due to playing her chello in front of everyone. Continuing her investigation and running circles around the sheriff while doing so, Wednesday starts to suspect that fellow student Xavier Thorpe is behind the killings.
When her parents visit for the weekend and her father is imprisoned for murder, Wednesday figures out that it was her mother who accidentally killed Garrett Gates and helps clear both of their names and discovers that Gates have already died. She later discovers evidence that Gates' sister Laurel is still alive and tricks Enid and Tyler into helping her investigate the Gates' estate, nearly getting both killed. Later teaming up with her Uncle Fester and stealing the diary of the school's founder, Wednesday learns that the creature is called a Hyde and that it has a master. Wednesday still suspecting Xavier is the Hyde and now thinking that her therapist is the master, Wednesday simply plants evidence in Xavier's sack in order to get him arrested after said therapist is murdered.
Discovering that Tyler is actually the Hyde, Wednesday kidnaps him and attempts to torture him for information. Expelled from Nevermore after being caught, Wednesday discovers that Mrs. Thornhill is actually Laurel and teams up with her shape-shifting principal Larissa Weems to trick Laurel into confessing by having Weems pretend to be Tyler. Captured and used to raise Crackstone from beyond the grave, Wednesday is saved by her ancestor, Goody, and fights Crackstone before seemingly killing Laurel.
Is she smart? Charming? Any other issues?
Yes, she is smart. She at several times comes up with very clever plans, be it to escape, blow up a xenophobe's statue while being right in front of everyone, or involving her investigation. I had to summarize a lot, as otherwise this would be too long, but almost every episode has Wednesday come up with a clever scheme or think on her feet when something goes wrong. Charm is easy. She is snarky and everything Wednesday normally is, with Jenna Ortega making the role her own.
Other issues. She's a bit socially awkward, but she has a surprisingly good social life. Tyler gets the best of her for a bit in the last episode, but she quickly bounces back. She goes through a breakdown when Enid moves out, but once again bounces back.
Bitch? Too much?
Wednesday opens the show having piranhas viciously attack a group of kids, frames Xavier for murder, and tries to torture Tyler based on a vision that might or might not be true. However, almost all these can be explained away. The bullies she attacked at the beginning was retaliation for them harming her brother, framing Xavier was because she had every reason to believe he did it, and Tyler was a last resort after he refused to change. Wednesday also has a lot of standards, hating bullies and being against murder for no reason. She also cares about her family, Thing, Enid, and Eugene.
Conclusion?
Unsure. I leave that up to you.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 16th 2023 at 9:33:14 AM
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