Character-Specific Pages (CSPs) are created when individual characters have so many trope examples that they can't reasonably be included on a shared page.
The Administrivia Character-Specific Pages policy details the rules that apply to these pages. All Character-Specific Pages must also follow the basic How to Create a Character Page policy, as well as the wiki's more general policies about spoilers and examples.
This cleanup thread handles the following tasks:
- Reviewing and approving new CSP proposals. All new potential CSPs must be reviewed and, if necessary, cleaned up before they're created.
- Agreeing on page names for new CSPs.
- Ensuring that wicks are updated when a new CSP is created.
- Reviewing existing CSPs if there's a concern that they need cleanup, or if it's believed that the character may no longer qualify for a page.
- Merging existing CSPs into other character pages when necessary.
- Ensuring that wicks are updated when a CSP is removed/merged.
- Creating, updating and cutting redirects, as necessary, to reflect these splits and merges.
Crowners are not normally required but, where appropriate, can be used to formalise decisions on any of these points.
If a character no longer qualifies for a CSP, it's often more practical to turn the CSP into a redirect than to cut the page entirely. This keeps the page history visible to users, and also helps to steer offsite 'inbound' traffic (search engine results) to the right place. With that in mind, cut requests for CSPs may be declined and referred to this thread if they don't have a clear consensus.
Comments linking back to this thread can be added to CSPs when needed - e.g. to confirm their creation was approved, to warn tropers that a cleanup is in progress, or to note the date and outcome of a more recent review.
We also have some more general threads for character page help -
- Character Page Cleanup
: for trope misuse, zero-context examples, spoiler tagging issues etc.
- Are these character tropes?: for queries about whether particular tropes belong on a character page or on the work's page.
This is not a policy discussion thread, it's a cleanup thread — any requests for policy changes need to be raised in Wiki Talk.
Mod update 07 Mar 2024, reflecting new CSP policy, updated again 22 Mar 2024 to mention redirects for removed CSPs
- Other options must have been tried first, like splitting pages into further groups.
- The character's folder is cleaned up beforehand, fixing any Zero-Context Examples and Wall of Text entries and removing any outdated, misused, or non-character tropes.
- A character's folder is at least 6,000 words/40,000 characters (with spaces). Here is a byte counter.note
- The current character page bypasses technical limitations and requires a split up.
- A single character takes up the majority of a page or is disproportionately bigger than other folders.
Splitting a character into their own page is a major change and needs to be run by the community before it is enacted. Even if you believe a character meets these requirements, they should be run through this thread first. Having other tropers take a look can help spot issues you may not notice or believe to be issues.
Per How to Create a Character Page, character-specific pages should only include tropes that describe the character. These tropes should fall under Characterization Tropes or one of its related indexes, unless they're recurring character traits (distinctive things that the character does repeatedly). If you're unsure what counts as a character trope, you can ask the Are these Character Tropes? thread.
If you have concerns with a general character page, they have their own separate cleanup thread, as do the self-demonstrating character pages.
Edited by Mrph1 on Mar 22nd 2024 at 10:22:03 AM
lmao
So after reading of the (new?) character specific page policies, I knew this page would have to be encountered at some point so I did some cleanup of duplicate examples, fleshing out context and other fix-ups. The page in question is Bo Boi Boy Bo Boi Boy Elements. note
To keep in mind: Bo Boi Boy Bo Boi Boy Elements is almost 28,000 characters (currently), and the main character page (BoBoiBoy) is currently around 56,500. Merging back would make above 84,000.
It was around 16,700 characters before, then after my cleanup (and getting mildly carried away with entry-pimping) it's now almost 28,000 characters, still not enough to warrant its own page I'm afraid. Though that was not my intent, I just wanted it to be in a proper enough shape to be merged. I don't doubt my ability to add more examples, but I am due a hiatus of a few months for real life reasons, so I'm fine with it being merged for the time being.
Might it possibly be a good idea if I made a sandbox to copy the page and grow it for later though? Would that be allowed?
Pantheon Wick Cleaning
"The Juice is Loose."
I did the Nebula and Yondu Udonta as redirects.
Also MCU: Hawkeye (37,710 bytes) and MCU: Drax the Destroyer (32,526 bytes) need to be merged back. MCU: Mysterio - Quentin Beck is long enough (66,000 bytes), but MCU: Mysterio is also to short without him (15,000 bytes). He is one of those examples where is technically okay to be a page, but the OG page is to short with out him.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 12:33:47 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I guess add Beck to the main Mysterio page? It's too weird otherwise.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lies and Violence!
What's the byte size requirement for non-character-specific pages? Because these MCU pages all seem unnecessary.
- MCU: Testament Industries (15,075)
- MCU: Roxxon Corporation (10,313)
- MCU: Kree Watch (18,315)
- MCU: The Confederacy (16,101)
- MCU: Cosmic - Lighthouse (16,461)
- MCU: Criminals & Terrorists - Kitchen Irish (15,539)
- MCU: The Framework (14,334)
"The Juice is Loose."
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
there is no limit there, but idealy if you split off a page the one you leave be hind should be more then 15,000 characters.
I've got a few questions:
- How can you tell how many characters a page or character section consists of? (If you're going to set a limit based on word or character numbers, how do tropers check that?)
- Why was 40k the limit set? There's no information, so it looks arbitrary.
- Do removed character pages have to be given a redirect back to the page they've been merged into? Giving it a redirect is effectively hogging the character-specific url, should it become eligible for re-creation at a later date (such as those pages that get merged, but which are only just under the 40k minimum and therefore might hit that boundary in future).
- Is part of undoing the character-specific pages going to include a requirement for cleaning up Related Links and Locked Pages? Most character-specific pages probably won't have many Related Links or Locked Pages issues, so I think this is something the clean-up thread should consider.
I'm not asking because I object to the project, but because I think the information is necessary. However, I will say that the fourth question is the reason I've popped over here. I've just cleaned up the Related Links (nine) and sent an Edit Locked Pages request for an index amendment as a result of a character page that's been merged back into its parent, but which didn't address either of these two issues.
Personally, I don't think the policy should be to just let a redirect do the heavy lifting (which seems to be what's been done in this case) because you're going to find that the number of outdated links across the wiki will stack up over time. I therefore think it's worth considering what the best approach should be here.
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
"The Juice is Loose."
We had a discussion on the Wiki Talk. 40,000 bytes is just 40,000 characters/letters. 40,000 bytes was decided so that people don't just make pages that aren't needed. No they don;t have to be made into redirects. I really don't know but you might want to clear out red links if you. I only talk about locked pages in regards to CM or MB.
MCU: Multiverse has an entry that is 58,000 bytes (Loki 2/Loki Odinson) and MCU: Other Supervillains has one that is 41,000 (Agatha Harkness). Both are long enough with out them 127,000 and 120,000 respectively. Would those be okay to make into pages. Also some one might want to keep an eye on MCU Ronan. He is reaching the need for one.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 1:23:57 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Goku Black
What do we want to call Loki 2's page
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
"The Juice is Loose."
Doesn't he have a variant number? So maybe Variant L1130. Though I don't know how we would format that.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 1:28:32 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
I copy and paste the page source into https://wordcounter.net
"The Juice is Loose."
Seriously how would you format numbers in a character page? My guess is spell out each number. Right?
I took the question on what to call it if we make it to the Loki thread.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 2:01:57 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
I get that. I was just asking why 40k as apposed to 50k or 30k, etc. I think you've answered my question though, it's just an arbitrary number. That's fine, arbitrary doesn't automatically equate to 'bad', so please don't think that's where I'm going with that. I just wanted the clarification.
From that it almost sounds like you're saying people should just fix the Related Links and Locked Pages as and when they find them? That doesn't sound like a good idea to me. A clean-up thread that creates more work for other tropers isn't a good idea. I think you should probably consider how to approach this aspect of undoing character-specific pages. What I did with the Raven Branwen links (nine) is as follows:
- I corrected the Related Links on unlocked pages to the Anima page (six).
- I took one general issue to the Edit Locked Pages thread (getting the index amended — the index had been amended on the unlocked character pages, but no request made on the Edit Locked Pages thread for the locked character page).
- I took one locked CM page to the CM clean-up thread and one locked MB page to the MB clean-up thread.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Works for me.
Edited by Wyldchyld on Jul 22nd 2021 at 8:09:31 PM
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
"The Juice is Loose."
40,000 was the first one suggested and that would be around 7000 words. Which seemed like a good bare minimum. Because at that point it would be larger then the others in theory. So basically it was the first one suggested and most agreed that was a good minimum.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 2:08:41 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Not sure what you mean. Due to the way the wiki software works, page titles need to start with a letter, so pages for works that start with a number need to spell out the number. E.g. Film/{{300}} doesn't work, so the page for the film 300 is at Film.Three Hundred. But if the number isn't at the start, it doesn't need to be spelled out, e.g. VideoGame.Halo 2
"The Juice is Loose."
I did not know that. So Variant L1130, would have to be Variant LOneOneThreeZero?
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 2:18:05 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Manga Brainrot 🦋
No, it'd be MCU: Loki (Variant L1130). You can use numbers for a Namespace as long as it isn't the first text
Edited by KhunRun on Jul 22nd 2021 at 12:23:07 PM
she/her
"The Juice is Loose."
Okay. Good to know.
Do you we know pages have already been checked so we know which ones to move onto?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Twiddler: Issue with just using the page source is potholes would be included. Then again, my way of "select all" and counting that isn't much better ![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
"The Juice is Loose."
There are multiple ways.
No we don't but we could use one.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 3:23:03 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Franchouchou Sponsor
I do hope we're all thinking about other qualifiers outside of character count. As some people have mentioned it doesn't address every page's specifications or issues.
Character Specific Page cleanup
I merged Mysterio Quentin Beck with MCU: Mysterio. I also split off MCU: Agatha Harkness, the original page is long enough without her (over 100k symbols), and her own page is above the limit (over 7k words and over 41k symbols).
Guys, could we please let MCU: Hawkeye stay as it is? It currently has 6,5k words and 37k symbols, and he is the protagonist of his own show that is coming out just in a few months. This means his page will get above 40k symbols in no time. It seems unnecessary to merge it back now only to recreate it very soon.
Edited by Asherinka on Jul 22nd 2021 at 11:45:10 AM
Goku Black
Yeah I'm fine with that.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
"The Juice is Loose."
Yeah. For instance. Power Rangers Tommy Oliver was mostly made for convivence. As he was one character spared around 6 different pages and got hard to navigate.
Hawkeye I would be fine with letting stay.
Edited by Bullman on Jul 22nd 2021 at 3:47:54 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
@ACW I think, because of it conflicting with the Comic Book cleanup, Harley is staying (at the moment)
she/her