Designated Hero/Villain cleanup and maintenance

On Aizawa, again the narrative doesn't really excuse him or paints him as a good teacher. It paints him as a person who cares about his students in his own way and has methods to some of his madnesses, but he's still shown to be a grumpy creep who's super tough on his students, and the narrative doesn't dance around that.

So the only legit one might be All Might.

Edited by WarJay77 on Aug 27th 2021 at 1:46:26 PM

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Any other objections?

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It's late to vote for the last two discussions given that the relevant changes were already made, but I agree with the verdicts. Anyway if nobody has objetions I will put in the cut list NAW and NAR pages in the afternoon (more especifically about the 1: 10).

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine

Does Ferris Bueller really count as a designated hero?

IDK, does he? You gotta bring context to these threads mate, not everyone will know exactly what you're talking about. (Been years since I've seen that movie...)

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

I tried to rewrite the Devil Wears Prada entry. How does it look?

• Designated Villain: The movie tries to frame Christian as being a dick for knowing about the plan to replace Miranda and the whole thing as a Moral Event Horizon for the character. However, as some fans have pointed out, he is not wrong that Miranda is a horrible boss who needs to be replaced (as shown by the next scene where she backstabs her best friend to keep said job). The only genuinely "villainous' thing he does is kiss Andy while he knows she has a boyfriend, which ironically the movie blames Andy for.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread

I like it.

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine

This one in Western Animation needs cleaning up.

• Mabel Pines from Gravity Falls is seen heavily as this by alot of fans. Her actions are entitled and she acts like a massive jerkass sometimes to Dipper and screws him over alot by forcing him to sacrifice major mysteries and discoveries over petty things like a boy. She has the worst of her shown during Dipper and Mabel vs The Future when she selfishly gave the dimensional rift (a dangerous world ending item) to Blendin (who turned out to be actually Bill cipher). Then in Weridmagedon part 2, where she made a version of Dipper in her view, somewhat disrespecting all of Dipper's respect towards her, and also wanting to keep Dipper, Soos, and Wendy into the world with false creations of their desires. By the end of the series, she really doesn't get a karma punishment for her actions.

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Yeah, that sounds more like Unintentionally Unsympathetic.

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Also, the entry has some pretty bad English.

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It was added by Loekman 3.

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall

The show pointed out that some of her actions are wrong even if not punished her, so yeah the entry can go.

EDIT: Also from Fan Works

• In the (now erased) Harry Potter story Doing Hermione a Favour, Harry is most definitely this trope regardless of what the author insists. First he realizes that Tonks is pretending to be Hermione so the latter can run to the store (why she needs to sneak out is never brought up) and tricks Tonks into having sex with him by acting like he and Hermione do all the time. Then Harry tricks Hermione into having sex with him by making her think Tonks promised it. When Hermione and Tonks admit that Tonks has been taking Hermione's place, he acts outraged at "their deceit" and demands a threesome. Finally, after a few weeks of regular sex with Hermione, Harry decides that despite being on birth control for months, Hermione must already be pregnant so he switches out her birth control with sugar pills. Hermione doesn't learn of this for another couple months when she learns she's six weeks pregnant.

I am pretty sure that we can't have entries in any tropes of works that are not aviable, because nobody could confirm if the entries are true, plus even if the work was aviable this doesn't sound like something that the P5 would approve.

Edited by ASghhrv6ub on Sep 13th 2021 at 6:41:54 AM

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine

The YMMV page for World War Hulk lists the Illuminati as both Designated Heroes and as Designated Villains.

I'm pretty sure these are mutually exclusive tropes, so what should be done? Should one be kept and the other cut, or should both be cut? The story's pretty much a Grey-and-Gray Morality conflict.

So YMMV.Lost Judgment has these examples. I'm not certain if they're worded correctly or if they're actual examples at all, so a second opinion on these would be helpful.

• Designated Hero: Dependent on one’s viewpoint, Yagami might come across as this. He condemns Kuwana and his murderous Bully Hunter crusade on the basis that it indirectly led to Sawa’s death. However, that came about from the sheer coincidence that the first person Kuwana gave revenge to, Reiko Kusumoto, just happened to be a high ranking government official that Public Security needed blackmail on. If not for that then the entire story never would have passed. The bullies Kuwana killed were also irredeemable Hate Sink types who escaped the Japanese court of law and thus would’ve been Karma Houdinis if not for Kuwana’s actions.
• Designated Villain:
  • The Motorcycle Prevention Committee in the Motorcycle Side Case. The story frames them as the villains even though the gang Yagami is infiltrating are genuine dangers to the people around them and their races include high speed chases and ramming each other off the road. Especially once Ghost, one of the gang’s main bikers, threatens to attack their children. Their response to this is to trash Ghost’s gang’s bikes, which is hardly unreasonable considering the threat Ghost made. While the story tries to frame them as being radicalized and used as patsies by the Neo-Keihin gang, their actions are still far less heinous than the gang they wish to disband.
  • For at least a few players, Kuwana counts. While the story does portray him as a tragic Anti-Villain whose actions led to Sawa’s death he’s still considered an antagonist who needs to be stopped. However, his victims were Karma Houdini bullies who drove people to suicide then lived their lives afterwards without regret or punishment. Yagami never really comes up with a viable alternative to actually punish those who escape the law’s eyes and thus putting Kawana into a villainous role might seem disagreeable to at least some players.

The examples sound like they could be valid, but I think the parts of "Dependent on one’s viewpoint" and "For at least a few players" are kinda redundant for a YMMV trope, and the part of "might seem disagreeable to at least some players." could be complaining, but I am not sure.

For now I would suggest to hide them until we get the opinion of somebody who have read the comics or one of us read the comic.

Oh, I see, I didn't know about that rule.

Edited by ASghhrv6ub on Oct 13th 2021 at 10:38:54 AM

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine

We only hide ZCEs and notes. We can just cut those and put them on the discussion page or something.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Okay, I moved the World War Hulk entries to the discussion page, and directed people to the thread and the discussion page in my edit reason.

Checked DesignatedHero.Western Animation

• Many fans of My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic feel that Princess Celestia is this, though this can be debated. She's usually portrayed as a loving, benevolent ruler who is kind to her subjects and extremely forgiving even by pony standards (while most reformed villains are Easily Forgiven, only Celestia and Fluttershy were willing to give Discord a chance, and even after redemption the others only forgave him after he helped them defeat Tirek following a temporary betrayal). But while some fans see her this way, as she is clearly meant to be, others have called her out for the following:
  • Many think she was too harsh in banishing Nightmare Moon for a thousand years, when, as Luna, she only turned against her because she didn't get the same love that Celestia got. This can be countered that Nightmare Moon declared her intent to murder Celestia, and that Word of God says that Celestia released Nightmare Moon so that the Mane 6 could purify her back to Luna - though this itself has sparked talk that this was no different from what Discord did in Season 9.
  • She makes no attempt to save Rarity when she has her Icarus moment and nearly falls to her death, though the Wonderbolts did attempt this immediately and by the time Rarity accidentally knocked them out, only Rainbow Dash, with her Sonic Rainboom, was barely able to save them.
  • She has Twilight make some friends, who share a powerful bond. This seems all well and good and had some wonderful results, but this, and everything Twilight goes through, eventually sets her up to become not only an alicorn princess, but the next ruler of Equestria so she could retire - without asking Twilight if she wanted to. Many fans feel Twilight was not ready based on the later episode A Trivial Pursuit; furthermore, she was freaking out so hard about this despite her friends' best attempts to help that Discord impersonated legendary villain Grogar, revived King Sombra, and united Chrysalis, Tirek, and Cozy Glow as his legion to try to improve Twilight's confidence by having her defeat them - which went horribly wrong and nearly ended in disaster. While it is true that, after the battle with Sombra, she decided to let Twilight wait until she felt she was ready, and she seemed to know that Twilight would find a way to still be able to hang out with her friends, in the series finale, the other Mane 5 show signs of age where Twilight doesn't, and is the same size as Celestia with a flowing mane and tail, implying that Twilight is now immortal and will have to watch her friends die of old age and spend an eternity without them, after Celestia had her become friends with them in the first place. However, there are even ways around this; Alicorns may be long-lived rather than immortal (Word of God has said they don't know how long Twilight will live for), and, though more in relevance to Granny Smith, "nopony lives forever"; Discord may revive the other Mane 5 repeatedly like he did with Sombra; and Twilight has the freedom to retire when she wants to, as Celestia and Luna did.
  • In the process, Celestia let Twilight fight all the villains that threatened Equestria as part of her training (even going as far as "testing" Twilight against Equestria's most evil and dangerous enemy, King Sombra, counting on her making the right decisions and putting the fate of Equestria before her test results, which, admittedly, she did, and could simply be a symbol of Celestia's immense faith in Twilight, but Luna was iffy about it all the same); the only time she actively intervened was against Chrysalis, likely out of anger that she had deceived her into turning against Twilight, though she did decorrupt Twilight when it seemed Discord had won, allowing her to do the same to her friends. Some have compared all this to Discord's actions in Season 9, and called her a hypocrite for calling him out for it.
  • Many were also uncomfortable with the fact that she basically executed a filly, Cozy Glow, by permanently turning her to stone. Others have countered, however, that Cozy Glow may not have deserved special treatment for her age on account of being a murderous, manipulative, unrepentant psychopath every bit as evil and dangerous as Chrysalis and Tirek; furthermore, Word of God has said she is actually older than she physically appears, and even if she isn't, given her sadistic grin at planning to murder the other Mane 5 and Spike (which is G1 Tirek levels of villainy) and actually attempting to do the same to Twilight on more than one occasion, it is speculated the reason her parents do not appear is because she killed them, though others speculate that, given her origins are unknown, she may have had a tragic backstory that Celestia didn't bother to explore before throwing her in Tartarus the first time.

I feel that there's a bit of Ron the Death Eater here. It sure can be trimmed down, too,

Edited by CyberController on Oct 18th 2021 at 11:21:06 AM

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I haven't seen MLP in a long time, but the entry itself has various mistakes, first of all some of that things look like Alternate Character Interpretation, but again I haven't seen most part of the show and they could be legit and the entry only make them sound like ACI, but while somebody most familiarized with the show gives the opinion I can say that it needs a rewritte, first of all most of it if not all of it should be put in one only entry, second Examples Are Not Arguable so the part of "can be debated" should be cut, if we want to make clear that is not an near-universal opinion we can just put Some fans consider that Celestia is one given that while" or something like it at the beginning of the entry, the first part explains itself as wrong, it can go, the second could be legit, the third souds like a case where her actions are recognized as wrong, and the last part looks to be based in Fridge Horror, the fourth could be legit but IMO this part "likely out of anger that she had deceived her into turning against Twilight, though she did decorrupt Twilight when it seemed Discord had won, allowing her to do the same to her friends." can go, about the fifth, about three quarters of that are arguing with itself all this "thers have countered, however, that Cozy Glow may not have deserved special treatment for her age on account of being a murderous, manipulative, unrepentant psychopath every bit as evil and dangerous as Chrysalis and Tirek; furthermore, Word of God has said she is actually older than she physically appears, and even if she isn't, given her sadistic grin at planning to murder the other Mane 5 and Spike (which is G1 Tirek levels of villainy) and actually attempting to do the same to Twilight on more than one occasion, it is speculated the reason her parents do not appear is because she killed them, though others speculate that, given her origins are unknown, she may have had a tragic backstory that Celestia didn't bother to explore before throwing her in Tartarus the first time." possibly can go, I don't thik we need to say the counter and have some cases of fridge horror, ACI, and fan-teories.

Also, somebody have opinions about the Harry Potter fanfic example?

Edited by ASghhrv6ub on Oct 19th 2021 at 4:02:31 AM

I am the one, I am the one, the godlike terror train, superior artificial brain, feel free to call me Blaine

That is one of the most confusing entries I've ever read.

Just cut it.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."

This is on YMMV/The Wizard of Oz:

• Designated Villain: The Wicked Witch of the East. We never find out what exactly she does that is so evil, just that everyone calls her "Wicked" and the Munchkins are happy when she dies.

While there's evidence of her being a villain, there is no evidence about her being good.

It appears people really don't like Sanji... After being removed from Base-Breaking Character in virtue of being extremely popular due to consistenly ranking higher in polls (and having a very complainy entry), a Designated Hero entry was added to him:

• Designated Hero: Sanji can usually be this when it comes to his pervy attachment towards women, despite him being written as a gentleman kind of character. From what we've seen of Sanji whenever he has moments of being a perv, he's never really regretful of those moments unless if he gets punished for it and he never learns his lesson from those moments either, and he gets mad at or punishes those who do the same things that he does to women. One moment in the series in particular that shows how shameless and hypocritical he is when it comes to being a pervert is in the Thriller Bark arc where he is mad at Absalom for eating the Suke Suke no Mi before he could, (a devil fruit that turns the eater invisible) all because he wanted to peep on women and get away with it. Sanji then beats on Absalom after the latter calls him a jealous pervert, saying that he has no right to call him that, even though that's exactly what Sanji is upon realizing the devil fruit has already been eaten. This shows that if Sanji did have the power to peep on women and get no comeuppances for it, he would do it and not be shameful about it (to be fair Absalom is far worse than Sanji, but he still has no right to complain being called pervert even if it's coming from someone even more pervert than him). That's not even getting into the blatant double standard when it comes to his treatment of men and women, with him always treating women with extreme kind whilst usually treating men like crap, looking out for Nami and Robin's safety more than the rest of the crew's security (including Chopper who is a kid) and generally agreeing with anything Nami says or does just because he is in love with her.

The lenght alone shows someone needed to vent his/her dislike for the character (which is fine, I believe it's better to let things out rather than keeeping everything inside) buut the entry complains about his negative traits because, unlike what the entry says, his perverted traits are criticized In-Universe and generally gets punished; heck, he spends 2 years training in an Ironic Hell based around his perviness. The Absalom part, aside of Absalom being worse (something it's later added as you can see) there are two characters who In-Universe comments that Sanji's an Hypocrite for criticizing Absalom's perviness (and still, Sanji would never forces himself on a woman unlike Absalom)

The Double Standard part, as agreed in the base breaking discussion (here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=15191965060A89849000&page=34) it's exaggerated because ìSanji cares for his male crewmembers and helped them multiple times, while the moments he blatantly treats well Nami and Robin but mistreat Zoro (he's the male crewmember he usually mistreats but the feeling is mutual cuz they're like shonen rivals) is for comedic harmless scenes

And still, the entry is completely ignoring the good side of the character; in a nutshell, is saying "I don't like Sanji because he's a pervert"

There isn't an impossible dream, there are only people who give up

Not into OP but I'd say cut that

Also

That's what blogs are for, not our YMMV pages

Listen to my podcast

Yes, I agree. I just meant to say that I understand why would someone write it, not that it's ok to write it there (otherwise I wouldn't have brought the entry here)

There isn't an impossible dream, there are only people who give up

Hey, I was on the the My Hero Academia page and I saw these two entries were just recently added under Designated Hero.

• Endeavor, as all his heroic actions are less being motivated to help people and more about bringing glory to himself, he's an asshole to pretty much everyone even in casual conversation and he's so obsessed by beating All Might that he abused his wife and children, just so he could breed a perfect heir who would surpass him. For many, his attempts to change for the better are too little, too late.
• All Might can fall into this despite being the Big Good of the series, namely because of how extreme of a Sink or Swim Mentor he is. His training with Midoriya is harsh (because Midoriya has to work hard for his body to catch up with his Quirk, whereas most people have had their Quirks since they were toddlers), but his brutal regime has put Midoriya in the infirmary several times - All Might once beat Midoriya and Bakugou so violently in their Exams that he nearly broke Midoriya's back and hit Bakugou so hard in the stomach he vomited. Recovery Girl outright called him out on how needlessly brutal he was being. Then there's how All Might's favouritism towards Midoriya has lead him to neglect Bakugou several times over the series despite being Bakugou's hero too - he failed to save Bakugou from villains twice, once during the Sludge Villain incident (because he didn't want to risk exposing his secret and only snapped out of it when Midoriya tried to intervene instead) and then again during the Hideout Raid arc, and he also sat back and did nothing about it when Bakugou's mother outright blamed Bakugou for being kidnapped by supervillains. His failure to notice Bakugou's guilt and emotional anguish over the situation resulted in Bakugou having a complete mental breakdown and fighting Midoriya because of his self-loathing over being the reason All Might lost his powers. All Might even lampshades this when he reassures Bakugou it was not his fault by remarking in his internal monologue he should have done more for him and forgot that Bakugou is still a child because of his talent and proud personality.

These are the exact entries mentioned earlier on this thread so I'm guessing they were both cut as a result, but this user added them back. And no, no explanation was given on the history page (the troper in question appears to be in a bad habit of that looking through the history page).

Edited by GenericGuy2000 on Dec 13th 2021 at 7:34:44 AM

I’m gonna put some Gloom in your eye.