Base Breaking Character Cleanup

I was nosing around the Persona 5 Strikers YMMV and came across this:

• Base-Breaking Character: Depending on who you ask, the Final Boss EMMA/the Demiurge is either a lazy rehash of the Final Boss of the original Persona 5, or their origins, developments within the story and social commentary on AI and smartphone addiction are unique enough to set them apart.

Not a huge fan of Strikers (It’s an okay game imo) but I’ve never seen people have issues with the Final Boss EMMA.

Edited by Superdude96 on Mar 28th 2024 at 2:38:06 AM

I came across this in A Sign of Affection:

• Base-Breaking Character: Oushi is either liked for being a Tsundere Childhood Friends second male lead for Yuki, or hated because his attempt at kindness comes across as dictating and infantilizing Yuki without respecting her autonomy as a grown person despite her disability.

I don't think there's enough of a vocal fanbase in favour of the character to keep him. The manga has been out for several years, but the show has only been airing for a few months.

Permission to remove this entry from Party Crashers? I ask this because it doenst really say why some fans hate them, and it’s about real people

• Base-Breaking Character: All four members are somewhat contentious to some degree, which was bound to happen given that all four of them are quite beloved for varying reasons, as they all have drastically different personalities and styles of editing and humor, on top of the fact that there are typically multiple perspectives on a single Mario Party session. And if any fans of a certain member watches a Mario Party video uploaded by another member of the gang, either because they're the only one to upload said video or to simply check out their edit of the session, you can bet that they won't be rooting for the original uploader.

So remove it?

So I found this on YMMV.Ahsoka:

• Base-Breaking Character: Sabine Wren's portrayal in this show is quite controversial among fans. There are those who empathize with her difficult life post-Rebels, having lost so many people she considered family, and see her depressed, self-aggrandizing personality as a reflection of that. Others however see her as a rebellious, irresponsible and selfish woman who dooms the entire galaxy to be reunited with one man, is unnecessarily snappish towards Ahsoka throughout the series, and the fact that her attitude towards her (un-official) foster brother gives the impression of being more romantic (sometimes bordering on obsession) than sisterly.

I feel like she counts but my question is the part I highlighted and that isn't her dynamic with Ezra more an Alternative Character Interpretation than a Broken Base. Especially since it only mentions how some see it as romantic but doesn't mention those who don't.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread

Remove that bit and add something regarding the series revealing her to be force sensative or make that point an entry for Broken Base

From Miraculous Ladybug:

• Kagami Tsurugi has been getting divided reactions from the fanbase ever since she was revealed, and it only increased when she made her debut in the show. Fans either see her as a cruel, heartless bitch who's mean to Marinette and doesn't deserve Adrien, or as the best love interest for Adrien at this point because she's the only one willing to be relatively civil with her romantic rivals. Her appearances in season 3 only served to dump gasoline on the fire, between her getting the Dragon Miraculous and overall getting closer to Adrien (to the point that they all but hooked up in the finale).
• While he was an Ensemble Dark Horse when he first appeared, Luka Couffaine has become this. His fans love him for his laidback, kind nature, the sympathetic reasons for his getting akumatized, and status as an alternate love interest for Marinette; his detractors view him as little more than a Flat Character and Satellite Love Interest who only exists to overcomplicate the already-complicated Love Square. Similar to Kagami, his getting a Miraculous and all but hooking up with Marinette in the third season finale did little to help him.

These two examples do not appear to have been updated since the end of the third season, so I have no idea if these two characters are still base-breakers or not.

• Zoé Lee became contentious pretty much the second she was leaked, and the base surrounding her only broke more after her debut in "Sole Crusher". Some fans feel she's a great addition to the show as a Good Counterpart to Chloé and a worthy successor to the Bee Miraculous; other fans see her as a shallow Replacement Scrappy for Chloé made solely as an excuse to not give the Alpha Bitch a redemption arc; and a third camp has taken the middle ground, liking Zoé as a character but hating that the writers are refusing to give her more characterization outside of being "the anti-Chloé", doing both characters a disservice.
  • Another point of contention is the amount of screen time she's been getting in season 5. Her supporters enjoy that the plot is giving her more relevance beyond being Chloé's antithesis, while her detractors hate that said plot relevance is coming at the expense of screen time and relevance for characters who've been around longer than her (e.g. her temporarily wielding the Cat Miraculous in the "The Kwamis' Choice" two-parter; several fans argued that it should have gone to Nino instead, given that he's Adrien's best friend and that his girlfriend Alya was the temporary Ladybug wielder).

This example reads very similarly to the Replacement Scrappy example that was cut from Miraculous Ladybug last week, to the point that I'm almost certain it was written by the same person. So I'm wondering exactly how split is the base around her. The fact that the example feels the need to count a third camp in this base suggests that someone really wants her to come off as divisive.

Edited by StrixObscuro on Apr 7th 2024 at 9:45:22 AM

By now, it should be clear to all except the most dense of us that sheep are secretly conspiring to kill us all and steal our pants.

Miraculous is kind of a show where you could make an argument for pretty much every character with a decent amount of screen time being a Base-Breaking Character. Pretty much every one of them has their fans and haters and there's a lot of arguments over them and the more prominent the character, the worse it is. So I think they can all still stay, though maybe with some rewrites?

For Kagami and Luka, I think some of the initial Die for Our Ship reactions to their characters have calmed down a bit since they broke up with Adrien and Marinette, respectively, though some other unrelated reasons have popped up since as well. For Luka, there was a lot of controversy over him learning both Adrien and Marinette's superhero identities and choosing to become a Secret Secret-Keeper for both since it was felt that it could potentially be dangerous if he got akumatized and the show doesn't really properly justify his reasons for choosing not to tell Marinette that he knows. For Kagami, there was division over her choosing to tell Felix Marinette's identity as Ladybug.

They still have their fans and defenders, though, so I think they'd still qualify. I'll admit I stopped watching partway through season 5 so I'm a bit less knowledgable about the issues surrounding Kagami since it happened after a I stopped and this is moreso just information I've heard from the fandom. Same with Zoe, though I know she's been divisive since she first appeared and a lot of it ties into the general Broken Base surrounding Chloe that's a big issue in the fandom.

"Let’s see who’s stronger: someone that has something to protect, or someone that has nothing to lose."

I would say keep the write-up as they are now. As said on the top Ladybug is a show where people would either love or hate that character in particular which would lead to mix bags about that character as far as I can tell or how the fanbase talks for the show itself.

Max was recently added back to the Base-Breaking Character page for Pokemon when I thought it wa previously determined was in the limbo of too hated to be Base Breaking but not hated enough to be The Scrappy:

• Max. On one hand, his Bratty Half-Pint personality can be entertaining, and his tendency to call out others on their stupidity is welcome, alongside him being the Hoenn group's designated "stop Brock from flirting" guy, quips and all. However, detractors find his brattiness and smug know-it-all nature rather aggravating, and he tends to be overly harsh towards Ash (and May to a lesser extent). And since he's not a trainer himself, his role in episodes is typically limited besides occasional special focus, and it makes it harder to take his training criticisms seriously when he's chiding Ash about something he himself doesn't have any experience in.

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Personally I'm a Max fan but I'm just wondering Max was recently added to the Base-Breaking Character page, when I thought he was in the limbo of too hated to be Base Breaking but not hated enough to be The Scrappy:

• Max. On one hand, his Bratty Half-Pint personality can be entertaining, and his tendency to call out others on their stupidity is welcome, alongside him being the Hoenn group's designated "stop Brock from flirting" guy, quips and all. However, detractors find his brattiness and smug know-it-all nature rather aggravating, and he tends to be overly harsh towards Ash (and May to a lesser extent). And since he's not a trainer himself, his role in episodes is typically limited besides occasional special focus, and it makes it harder to take his training criticisms seriously when he's chiding Ash about something he himself doesn't have any experience in.

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Personally I'm a Max fan but I'm just wondering if you guys felt he has enough fans to remain on the page if you guys felt he has enough fans to remain on the page. After all the original entry from a couple years ago (by me) was poorly made and I have seen more max fans though I don’t know if it’s 50/50

YMMV.Street Fighter IV

• Base-Breaking Character: Decapre. Within seconds of her reveal as the mysterious fifth character she became one of the most controversial characters in the game. As shown in this steam reaction, she garnered a huge amount of hate due to her being not only a perceived Moveset Clone of Cammy, but also being one of Bison's dolls who looks just like her albeit wearing a mask, especially since Bison in the trailer defeated the more requested Rainbow Mika and Retsu. Over time, however, Decapre herself garnered a growing fanbase among the game's players, many of whom found her moveset quite enjoyable to play and some who find the character herself to be one of the more tragic characters, being a literal clone of Cammy with fleeting memories of her traumatic past.

Does this sound more like Character Perception Evolution to you guys?

Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!

Alright, I had this one on the backburner, but I'd like to discuss Yuni from Goddess of Victory: NIKKE, and while I unambiguously agree that she is controversial, her entry had a bit of a changes. Here's the first one when it was initially created on February 10th, 2024:

• Yuni has reached this status as of chapter 25. Her allowing the deaths of citizens in the ark by raptures because of Syuen's earlier actions of mind wiping Mihara allowed her mental state to reach unhealthy status. Even worse is that Syuen refused to mind wipe Matis and never punished them for similar mistakes Mihara made..

And this was edit to her entry added on the same date:

• Yuni has reached this status as of chapter 25. Crow manipulates a heart-broken Yuni into letting humans die by rapture. During the Ark's lockdown she informed civilians in the ark that it was safe to come out of their shelters while raptures were nearby. This lie results in the death of several humans. The reason for the controversy is because Yuni's mental health was never checked after Mihara got mindwiped for a mistake but when Matis made a similar error, Syuen moved Heaven and Earth to ensure they didn't get wind wiped at any cost resulting in Yuni seeking vengeance. Another point for the controversy is because she did this of her own free will. Yuni lost her NIMPH and chose to lie to innocents to punish Syuen. Due to losing her NIMPH she delivers a beat down on Syuen that results with Syuen needing dire medical intervention..intervention]].

However, the changes were later somewhat reverted in February 27, 2024, leading to the current entry today:

• Yuni has reached this status as of chapter 25. Crow manipulates a heart-broken Yuni into letting humans die by rapture when they invade the ark. Instead of forcing her to do this, Yuni CHOOSES to let people die due to no longer being stopped by her NIMPH and depression of losing her best friend..

If anything, this just makes it even more clunky. All of these were done by the same editor by the way. I suggest a rewrite is in order, and better explains why she is controversial.

Here's my rewrite for the example above:

• Yuni was initially popular, but her actions in Chapter 25 caused her fanbase to splinter. The main issue is whether her actions to comply herself with Crow's actions is justified or not. Defenders of her justify it as a rage against her superior Syuen's actions, which left her lover Mihara amnesiac and distant towards Yuni, causing her to side with Crow when it becomes clear that the old Mihara would not come back. Opponents of her, however, say the countless lives lost by her complicity in the terrorist attacks caused by Crow does not justify the means, especially when it almost resulted in the destruction of one of the last bastions of humanity, and pointed out that Syuen rightfully needed to punished for her actions, this was going way too far.

What do you all think of my rewrite?

Edited by Siegfried1337 on Apr 12th 2024 at 9:41:08 AM

MB Pending | MB Drafts | MB Dates

Bumping.

MB Pending | MB Drafts | MB Dates

This entry has been hidden for a long time, so I want to ask if the example bellow counts as a Base-Breaking Character

Ochaco Uraraka has grown to be quite divisive over time. Those who like her find her kind-hearted and bubbly persona enjoyable, and at same time she has plenty of badass moments, like putting up a great fight against Bakugo in the Sports Festival, or pinning Himiko Toga to the ground with her bare hands. In particular, the key role she played in bringing Midoriya back to U.A. is often praised. Those who don't like her see her as an annoying airhead, who lacks a proper Character Development, even by the series' low standards for female characters. The majority of detractors hate her specifically for her Ship Tease with Izuku, accusing her of being obsessed with him at the detriment of her characterization, which is supported by their nearly-similar worldview and morals.

From YMMV.Yu Gi Oh Arc V:

• Yuya was well-received by fans at first, but as the series went on more and more fans turned against him for various reasons. Some of the more common complaints are his frequent use of Action Cards (a reliable method of saving himself without situational effects or a cheap bail-out for not planning ahead) and his devotion to making everyone smile through his Entertainment Dueling (charming or cheesy, especially when it induces Heel-Face Turns too easily). By the series' conclusion, he'd reached the same level of divisiveness as ZEXAL's Yuma.
• Yuzu. Many people weren't sold on her due to her cliche Tsundere tendencies, her taking too long to learn basic Fusion Summoning, and the fact that her initial plot-importance was due to her simply looking like someone else. On the other hand, many people adore her Character Development, enjoyable relationship with Yuya, general dueling skill, and fantastic rematch against Masumi. Most fans agree that she was severely shafted in Seasons 2 and (especially) 3.

Is Yuzu actually that contentious? Not that I've never seen hate for her, but I feel like I mostly just see people liking her overall and bemoaning how she was treated later in the series.

Also the Yuya entry is in desperate need of a rewrite, but I'm once again wondering if it counts only because I feel like it ties into the debate of whether people who are fans of a franchise of a whole but not fans of a specific entry count as "fans" of it or not. Since usually in YGO, how much people like the protagonist ties into how much people like the show as a whole and is directly connected to the massive Broken Base over which series is the best since they're all generally they're own thing.

"Let’s see who’s stronger: someone that has something to protect, or someone that has nothing to lose."

I feel that entry is fine

Can someone further confirm it, because I know myself she’s rather divisive nowadays

Also, can I ask a question: if character is base breaking they’re no longer an Ensemble Dark Horse, right?

Coreect

Can't historical examples count if they were an Ensemble Dark Horse for some time, then became Base-Breaking Character for whatever reason (perhaps partly due to their popularity)?

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Personally I think characters that became divise over time for whatever understandable reason no longer an Ensemble Dark Horse. But that’s just my opinion

From Spy X Family:

• Anya is the most popular and beloved character in the series, but is disliked by some people (mostly non-fans) who find her to be an annoying Kid-Appeal Character; the single "Rotten" review listed on Rotten Tomatoes for SPY×FAMILY CODE: White cites her as a low point of the movie and as getting in the way of the movie's spy elements.

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If it's mainly from people who aren't fans does it really count?

Most likely not. Doesn’t seem like the character triggers massive, heated fights in the fandom to me. Might as well cut.

Edited by Superdude96 on Apr 23rd 2024 at 7:07:07 AM

Yeah I don’t see her as base breaking if anything. I rarely see any hate of her. Cut

Base-Breaking Character - Hilda

• Anders, Hilda's Disappeared Dad, immediately became even more controversial character than Frida. Some like him for being a a decent Nice Guy and a pretty funny Bumbling Dad. Other fans hate him for not being present for Hilda for nearly her entire life, seemingly choosing adventures over her, as well as his tendency to get into trouble like Hilda. There's also a third party that doesn't hate Anders, but feel that he has not fleshed out enough as character because of the final season's short length.

Does the example count?