A Single Unified LGBT Character Thread

That would be misogyny, because his feminine appearance would be the cause of the hypothetical "wussiness"

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

Plausibly both misandrist and misogynist, so 'sexist' would cover it.

It's interesting how many forms of oppression and marginalization are rooted in misogyny. Trans-men are deemed "not man enough" or simply "not men", while trans women are deemed "sick" because they've essentially "chosen" womanhood over manhood (which doesn't make sense to misogyny). Non-binary people get caught in the crossfire, while agender people are simply regarded as nonexistent.

I don't like it, of course, but I understand where it comes from. So, even the crap trans-men often go through is rooted in disdain for femininity/femaleness.

I don't know if you've seen the movie Boys Don't Cry (which is probably hella problematic) but the way the cis-dudes react to the trans-guy in the story is very much rooted in misogyny, not misandry.

Speaking of movies, has anyone seen The Danish Girl (I haven't)?

edited 11th Apr '16 10:55:02 PM by nekomoon14

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

I've heard The Danish Girl is really stereotypical and actually a fairly bad movie. But take my words with a pinch of salt, it's just hearsay.

The Danish Girl is good as a movie, but as far as LGBTQ rights go:

• It features a stereotypical "feminise the guy into a woman" perspective on transgender women (including being forced to crossdress as a form of humiliation).
• Ignores the alleged main character's transition in favour of "how hard it is" on everyone else (a recurring complaint in transgender related media).
• It erases the fact that the protagonist's wife was very likely bisexual (this is a serious problem for non-LG sexualities).
• It treats protagonist "becoming" a woman as her wife's punishment for feminising her (where do I even start with this?).
• It's yet another movie where a straight white cismale was praised as "brave" for playing a transgender woman (instead of an actual transgender actress). He subsequently started claiming credit for the entire transgender rights movement.

TV Tropes's No. 1 bread themed lesbian. she/her, fae/faer

How... what... WHY?! Let me cry with you in that corner, please.

That reminds me of an aimed-at-children show, The New Adventures of Peter Pan. At one point, a new (male) villain takes over the all-male pirate crew (where the only actually evil guy is Captain Hook, and all his henchmen are bullied by him into carrying out his evil plans). The new villain promptly forced the henchmen to... do a ballet for him, in stereotypical pink ballet dresses.

It's meant to show how awful the new villain is, but it shows the idea that males wearing pink ballet dresses is an outright punishment. That 'pink' and 'ballet' are 'feminine' things that men should never want to do.

Non-LG? What does DnD alignment have to do with this?

edited 12th Apr '16 4:23:37 AM by hellomoto

I thought that was what Jake and the Neverland Pirates was.

Fresh-eyed movie blog

The rebooted Powerpuff Girls recently aired an episode that was CLEARLY focused on transgender identity, and they either really, really dropped the ball or were purposefully trying to offend transgender people and show children that transition is negative. It's really cringe-worthy. I haven't seen it because I hate this reboot (I gave it two chances and everything feels off, from the art style to the voice actors to the personality changes, ugh).

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

Yeah I heard about that, saw the screen shots it was really cringe-worthy. So um if you are going to do a transgender metaphor maybe start by not going with biological essentialism, or maybe do it outright and don't bother with a metaphor. Oh and consult with some transgender people or just like maybe actually consider them?

Right tho? I mean, I can't believe I'm saying it, but even Family Guy did a better job with Ida. Few shows are more offensive than frickin' Family Guy!

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

Yeah really and it's really bad when it's a kid's show.

I've decided Declan is lowkey bisexual. Like, really lowkey bisexual. He'll mention some guy he liked as a teenager. Once. And then he'll go back to complaining and comfort eating and generally being fat, grumpy, and very Irish.

edited 12th Apr '16 8:06:59 PM by trashconverters

Stand up against pinkwashing, don't fall for propoganda

Oh the thing you are making, I was wondering why you were using decides for a headcanon with that much backing.

I could use some help/feedback on an LGBT character I'm writing for a high fantasy story.

She is a closeted lesbian. I have asked around in some lgbt communities on what is good and what is bad in a character like that, already. From what I've gathered, there are so many different kinds of lesbians that as long as she isn't just a bland, empty, walking stereotype, I should be good. She could fit in a few stereotype groupings but doesn't everybody? Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason, right?

I mean if she wears nothing but flannel, doesn't wear makeup, has short hair, drives a Subaru, hates any and all men, and the list goes on, and that's all there is to her character, that's a problem. But (in my case at least) the only stereotype she fits into is that she doesn't wear super feminine clothes and makeup unless she has to because, and I quote, she "Can't move around in a dress, anything with heels are the spawn of hell, and makeup is plain irritating. I'm not trying to impress anyone so what's the bloody point?" Beyond that, there's MUCH more to her character that doesn't even pertain to her sexuality in the slightest.

Is that okay? Is that a good way to write a character like that?

Also, when asking around before this, I got one thing said to me by one person that stuck with me and I didn't hear it at all outside of her. She said something along the lines of "We queer people are sick and tired of guessing a characters sexuality based on subtext. We want to know what side she's on from the word go." Could someone back her up on that? because in my case, it's never explicitly stated until almost the halfway point. I don't want to annoy anyone reading my stuff because I'm not being explicit enough.

The above post should be taken with a good amount of salt. 126% of whatever comes out of my mouth is intended sarcasm, humor, or hyperbole.

Many, many women IRL of all sexual orientations who feel this way. Absolutely nothing wrong with this. Why would it be wrong anyway?!

Other queer people are sick and tired of having LGBT character being Token LGB Ts who exist purely to make political statements on LGBT acceptance, and just want LGBT sexual orientations/sexualities to be treated as normal.

So don't go bashing people over the head with the "OMG SHES LESBIAN SO SPECIAL RESPECT HER", which could happen if you go out of your way to explicitly tell the readers she's lesbian. But also don't go the other extreme to hide her lesbianess. She can have a girlfriend, you don't have to hide the fact the girlfriend's female. Is the focus of your story on how she's closeted, or something else? How much Gayngst would you like in your story?

edited 13th Apr '16 5:49:27 AM by hellomoto

Alright, so here's the deal with this character, who she is, and why I might have to do exactly that. She's the daughter of a high ranking political figure, in a society that sees homosexuality as barbaric and shameful. That's the primary reason she's closeted. She can't really let anyone know, lest it get out and "shame the family" or whatever.

Maybe I could do something along the lines of her checking out another girl, denying the advances of a male character and be clearly uninterested, and other stuff like that to kind of state it but not really, as to not bash people over the head with it.

Not really. Like... Not at all... The main, overarching plot of this story involves hell's armies invading the mortal world and humanity's fight for survival. Her sexuality kind of falls by the wayside when that kind of stuff is involved. As for gayngst, (I'm guessing that's angst involving gay stuff. Never heard the term before. :/) there isn't a whole lot, to be honest. the worst it gets is her saying goodbye to her girlfriend around the midway point and it's kind of tearful because there's a chance they may never see each other again.

side note: (and this is in general. real life and all that. not just writing.) What's a better term girl/boyfriend or partner? Or are they more or less interchangeable?

The above post should be taken with a good amount of salt. 126% of whatever comes out of my mouth is intended sarcasm, humor, or hyperbole.

I'd say you're well on the right track. I never know what people mean when they say things like "bashing over the head"; I feel like every show or movie I watch bashes me over the head with the characters' cis-hetero-normativity, so singling out "queer" works annoys me. I love the advice "show, don't tell", especially with subject matter as important as this.

If something is important, meaning that it establishes a character or advances the plot, detailed exploration of scenes is called for. I'd show her lesbian status by having her interact with men and women as you suggested.

"Masculinity" has nothing to do with sexual orientation or gender identity; as long as you keep that in mind, your character is less likely to read as a flat stereotype.

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

Personally? Partner. The term "girl/boyfriend" is just awkward.

edited 14th Apr '16 1:21:24 AM by hellomoto

I've been thinking about why homophobia exists and I came up with a theory.

a) scapegoats are a natural desire of any society (no judgment)

b) human beings are naturally aggressive (no judgment)

c) persecuting gays, particularly the males, carries very little risk for the wider society when they need a and b.

This explains why you never see a society decide that straight men are evil, for example, or why you never find a civilization that thinks all women should be perpetual virgins. That actually is existentially risky.

Or at least this is how one of my main characters, a submissive gay man in bed, is going to settling on the practice of persecuting gay men in his society.

edited 14th Apr '16 8:14:44 AM by garridob

Great men are almost never good men, they say. One wonders what philosopher of the good would value the impotence of his disciples.

Perhaps you meant to write, a reason why homophobia exists?

yey

Yep, sorry. Though why homosexuality exists is also an interesting question.

edited 14th Apr '16 8:15:08 AM by garridob

Great men are almost never good men, they say. One wonders what philosopher of the good would value the impotence of his disciples.

I have a hypothesis but I don't know how to collect data to prove or "disprove" it. It's a synthesis of everything I think I know about history. To summarize in one sentence: homophobia comes from cultures living in extremely inhospitable environments that require them to ensure the propagation of the community by penalizing non-reproductive sexual behaviors.

I do know that there are a number of other animals that are bi/pansexual and a few that can have exclusively homosexual specimens.

edited 14th Apr '16 1:32:55 PM by nekomoon14

Level 3 Social Justice Necromancer. Chaotic Good.

Or maybe it's just an in-group and out-group thing, which can be applied to pretty much any form of discrimination?

edited 14th Apr '16 11:07:51 PM by hellomoto

I think people just hate/are made uncomfortable by things they don't understand/aren't familiar with unless they are educated out of the habit.

Yeah pretty much.