What to do now.: Troper Tales.Fetish Fuel

I oppose the decision, for what it's worth.

^ And why?

Well, wait a second, hold on. Fetish Fuel is a valid trope. I have no issue getting rid of the Tales section, but there are a ton of works that deliberately attempt to invoke Fetish Fuel, successfully or not, as a trope. What are the grounds for getting rid of it as an entire page, given that it it's a valid trope?

I'm thinking that if a work invoked it intentionally, then it's either fanservice or Author Appeal.

It's an audience reaction instead of a trope, but as reactions can cause tropes, it still counts as a page in that way (like fanservice can come from knowing what is fetish fuel).

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:06:08 PM by DragonQuestZ

To make it short, since I know nothing I say will change it so it's useless to argue for any actual lenght, I think it's always a bad sign when we start cutting corners of personal expression in the interests of ultimately vague, nebulous and subjective definitions of self-comfortability.

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:06:24 PM by NapoleonDeCheese

So what's the current decision here? I'm all for removing the Troper Tales section of Fetish Fuel (and other tropes, but that's another discussion); there's no need for it. But TV Tropes hasn't shied away from categorizing Sex Tropes or hentai material, so it seems odd that we'd axe Fetish Fuel.

I suppose the debate comes down to: is the attempt to pander to a variety of fetishes, and/or the attempt to create sexually attractive characters, a trope in and of itself, or is it People Sit In Chairs? That's the only question I can see having an effect on whether we axe the main page or not.

(Of course, I'm not an admin, so take my suggestions as you will, but...)

I don't think anything about this is 'reasonable.' Frankly, I find the whole business highly disturbing! Judging something as 'creepy' and deleting it to 'protect the children' ... that's a slippery slope indeed.

The vote shouldn't be called so quickly: it's only been up for one day and these are popular pages.

If the Fetish Fuel pages must go, please host them on a new 'Troper Tales.com' site or SOMETHING. Sure, some people might be squicked, but look at all the people who contributed to those pages! They're not going to be happy if it up and vanishes because a couple people clicked something labeled 'Fetish Fuel,' read something naughty (!!!) and got mad.

• goes back to saving the pages to my desktop*

I'm all up for removing the real life examples, BTW.

But if we start cutting everything that can be potentially offensive to someone, where do we stop? Hostal? Saw? Uwe Boll? The Teletubbies?

No offence auntzelda, but please get off your soapbox. This has nothing to do with "protecting the innocence of children".

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:22:31 PM by RocketScience

Well, protecting the innocence of adults then. Same difference.

Frankly, I find the whole business highly disturbing! Judging something as 'creepy' and deleting it to protect the children ... that's a slippery slope indeed.

Where was that ever said?

The vote shouldn't be called so quickly: it's only been up for one day and these are popular pages.

Fast Eddie's said he's going to cut it quite a while back in an earlier thread, he just hasn't yet.

Fortunately he did agree to allow an example-less page, which is what I proposed in the OP. So the thing is that if someone wants to make another site to list these, be my guest.

^^^ That was never the point of this discussion.

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:28:36 PM by RocketScience

One thing that I have gathered from Fast Eddie's posts: If it's moved offsite, it will be to someone else's site entirely, the same way the IJBM was moved. Not using the TV Tropes name, not on the TV Tropes server bill, not using TV Tropes manpower as such (although that's not to say that tropers can't also supply manpower wherever it's moved to — only that it will be an individual decision), not associated with TV Tropes at all.

Which raises the question: what's going to make this new site any different from any of the other millions of fetish boards that are out there for the looking-for?

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:34:03 PM by Madrugada

Well those tend to be specific, while this would be general, and it would still be about stuff on shows/movies/books/games/etc. that turn you on instead of just any fetish.

Oh, and I personally would want it to stay PG-13, despite the content.

Also, where is the new IJBM site?

If it is moved off-site, would the links still link back to tvtropes? (Like, wherever they said the name of a show or another trope?)

Oooo, we could call it 'tvtropes After Dark' or something!

here.

And I guess what I'm asking is, why do you think that fetishists are going to choose a generalist site over a fetish-specific one?

Aunt Zelda, the point of getting rid of it is to get rid of it. Attaching the TV Tropes name undercuts that purpose.

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:41:28 PM by Madrugada

Alright, could someone in slow, small words explain why we're getting rid of it then? Preferably none of the "getting rid of it to get rid of it" wording; circular logic, to paraphrase, only makes me dizzy....

• Also, wait, is the IJBM lot cut too now? (O_O)

edited 2nd Feb '11 7:51:57 PM by Hushabyebye

Well then that's not the solution we want if examples are kept.

[And I guess what I'm asking is, why do you think that fetishists are going to choose a generalist site over a fetish-specific one?]

Well, everybody who contributes to the Fetish Fuel pages now, for a start.

[Aunt Zelda, the point of getting rid of it is to get rid of it. Attaching the TV Tropes name undercuts that purpose.]

So ... tvtropes is worried about its image? Really? The Other Wiki's got pictures of naked people, uncensored, no warnings. We've got ... people typing "It was hot when so-and-so got tied up" and "oh yeah, I agree, then there was that time in episode 17 with the cake batter ... yum!" I'm still confused as to why the Fetish Fuel pages are considered so squicky. If you don't want to read about people's kinks, don't click something called 'Fetish Fuel.' I don't want to read about video games, so I don't click 'Video Games.'

Ostracizing people for having different interests isn't something I expected from my favorite website.

edited 2nd Feb '11 8:08:26 PM by auntzelda

~/If you don't want to read about people's kinks, don't click something called 'Fetish Fuel.'/~

This.

edited 2nd Feb '11 8:04:28 PM by Hushabyebye

No person is being ostracized. Plus the google ad terms of service a while ago means that all the pages take up bandwidth without giving revenue, which a site this popular needs.

...What do you mean "without giving revenue"? I honestly don't know what you mean here. Do ones like Idiot Ball and Girl On Girl Is Hot bring revenue?

edited 2nd Feb '11 8:37:01 PM by Hushabyebye

Any pages deemed to be for "mature audiences" are placed in a part of the site that receives ads syndicated by Casale, not Google, which generate less money.

edited 2nd Feb '11 8:42:43 PM by AnonymousUser

Thumped by the Sneaky Post Ninja

edited 2nd Feb '11 8:43:36 PM by RocketScience

I noticed the subpages I looked at are all locked. Prelude to a cut?

edited 2nd Feb '11 10:12:13 PM by AnonymousUser