Splitting the examples of the Yays

I already mentioned it in the appropriate TRS thread, but no one reads a thread that's decision was already executed, and given that it involves dozens of subpages, it might fit here better, anyways:

The Ho Yay, Foe Yay, and Incest Yay pages were split into X Yay, and X Yay Shipping variations, the former for sexual teasing in the story, and the latter for the shipping audience reactions.

Currently, the descriptions reflect that, but the wicks still all lead to the old X Yays, and the examples are all on those pages. The following examples need to be moved:

• Statements about how a fandom has a certain shipping community, and what this group believes.
• Generic statements that x and y characters had "lots of chemistry", without pointing out any specific fact.

The following needs to stay:

• Scenes and facts that have romantic, or sexual implications (but no textual relationship) for the "couple", including jokes, fanservice, and lampshade hangings.

Please change at least some of the wicks as well. There are thousands of them, and an unknown percentage of them should direct to the new shipping tropes. It might be impossible to fix all of them for the few of us, but at least if the gereral public would notice that the new pages exist, that would help a lot.

I suggest the first thing we do is put a small note at the top of both pages regarding the recent split and that if the wick they got from wasn't the right type, can they please fix it.

This was already noted on the bottom of both the old, and the new pages.

From the fact that you didn't know that either, I suspect that the problem is that people simply don't feel that it's necessary to re-read old tropes of legend, so they don't even click on the wicks any more.

Huh.

This project evidently needs manpower less lazy than I am.

I volunteer for this.I don't like people misinterpretating those two.I am starting with Puella Magi Madoka Magica.

edited 11th Mar '11 9:27:55 PM by FallenLegend

Oh oh I call World Of Warcraft and House and maybe Pokemon.

I'm sorry, but I must protest against the decision on removing the Les Yay tropes from Madoka (especially since it happened to be the first example named). The whole splitting seems to be based on "Author intent" vs. "Audience perception". However, the Kyouko/Sayaka example was backed up by the authors going out of their way to have their climactic scene be an obvious reference to the first famous Yuri show (Revolutionary Girl Utena). Not to mention that Homura's love for Madoka is canon (although you can still debate whether it's romantic or platonic love).

If that doesn't count as author intent, then we might as well hereby declare every non- Official Couple pair to be just audience perception and cancel the Ho Yay page altogether.

edited 12th Mar '11 1:21:35 AM by MareltEkiran

There wasn't anything in that episode to suggest that. I have never seen that other amine so it isn't obvious by itself.

1. Not obvious by itself = not this trope.
2. A Shout-Out = \\ = this trope. just because it was an homage doesn't mean there was a gay subtext here .

Not to mention the fact that Sayaka had little contact ( besides fighting) with kyoko before becoming a witch. kyoko explicitly said that she tried to save her because she ( Sayaka)remembered her why she became a Puella magi in the first place( episode 9). Plus the fact that Sayaka was heartbroken because of a boy ( the violinist, basically abandoned her) and too crazy in her process of becoming a witch to care for Kyoko. Gay subtext between the two is highly unlikely at best.

Even tough Homura and Madoka do love each other. keep in mind that Not all love is Eros, that love could very well be Phileal too

Post the Word of God saying it was eros love and I will put it back. Otherwise There are no objective reasons to put it back.

edited 12th Mar '11 8:06:10 AM by FallenLegend

I conveniently have at hand a link for the gayest bit of symbolism ever:

Madoka spoilers! (ignore the weird music)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnIjyGqvrUc

Both Kyouko/Sayaka and Homura/Madoka fit. They are one sided, but they fit.

And seriously, if Word of God is your standard, then like, 95% of Ho Yay needs to go to Ho Yay Shipping

edited 12th Mar '11 8:59:52 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

It was decided in the crowner that it needs Word of God, being akcwoledged by the characters or being blantantly obvious gay subtext were the only objetive uses of this trope.

Never payed attention to that scene.You have just proved there was lesyay there (sayaka/kyoko).I will put it back, this means I was wrong.

Now Homura/Madokaa still needs to be proven it isn't phileal

edited 12th Mar '11 10:02:54 AM by FallenLegend

Neither the crowner, nor the current page description asked for Word of God or Lampshade Hanging proof, only for specific scenes instead of generic statements about how too characters seem to be in love with each other/ shipped together.

The latter would be natter bait, therefore YMMV, because it would result in people starting to debate their pairing theories. With the former, anything that is narrowed down to a particular scene could be reasonably expected to be intentional, and it's less argument-invoking, as it is not shipping, (like claiming that they should be a couple), instead it can also be sexy fanservice, or humor, or symbolism.

Witht his interpretation, even without the video, only the Madoka/Homura example would be bad, as it relies on their basic roles in the plot, but Madoka/Sayaka is about a hug, and for Sayaka/Kyoko, a fight scene.

edited 12th Mar '11 10:13:43 AM by EternalSeptember

that's what I was told about the requirements in the trope repair shop thread I madeclick here. Tough it seems that I was wrong again

Regardless I already put back the kyoko and Sayaka example.

I apologise for the inconvenience.

edited 12th Mar '11 10:41:25 AM by FallenLegend

That youtube link actually was the Revolutionary Girl Utena reference that I mentioned earlier.

That being said, I like the requirement for specific scenes, rather than general tendency much better. It's far more clear cut. I see your point about leaving out Homura/Madoka for now, though. We'll see if later episodes add anything more conclusive.