Professional Wrestling

No one wants to be post 101 huh? Well I already like Castle the hardy peacock and the swamp monster. IWC has a decent crowd present too.

Edit: The latter must be from Chikara huh? A youtube comment pointed out soldier ant's grenade I think.

edited 14th Jan '13 5:25:03 PM by Cider

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

{nods} There's some crossover. Colin Delaney is a steady part of the IWC roster currently after a brief tenure in WWE and some work in Chikara.

I was trying to describe the style of wrestling with IWC to a freind and it's kind of a middle ground between WWE and Chikara. A good half of the wrestlers have a gimmick, but it's a stage persona rather than a reality for most of them (i.e. W.A.R. dress up as rock band members, but they don't pretend that they're actually rock band members who happened to walk in and get into a wrestling contract. Compare that to Chikara or the old WWF where the wrestling dentist claimed to actually be a dentist).

Incidentally, the next event is January 26th, Payback, again in Elizabeth.

Payback is tomorrow and I'm psyched. The full lineup can be viewed at the prior link, but Delaney is back. I don't recognize their guest star, Michael Elgin, but apparently he was a Ring of Honor wrestler and is now wrestling with Pro Wrestling Guerrillas if I can believe Wikipedia.

Elgin's still part of ROH as far as I know and, as somebody who's seen a lot of his matches, is pretty damn good.

My thoughts on the night's events?

Overall, it was a very entertaining night. Once again, I got front-row seats, close enough to get high-fives from the wrestlers, for a very reasonable price of $20. The pageantry of the wrestlers continues to be good overall, although there was a bit more dead air tonight between matches. I don't know whether there were pacing problems or what. Also, it may seem a bit odd to mention, but two things jumped out at me. A) There seemed to be more vulgar language from the wrestlers. Not over the microphones, but on landings, I heard a lot of quiet "f*ck me" or "aw, sh*t" either during or after moves. I honestly couldn't tell if it was the wrestlers or their personae using the language. B) There was a lot of declaration of the rules during the match with the referees reminding wrestlers "no hair" or "get him out of the corner". I know that when I watched Winner Takes All, I was thoroughly confused over some aspects of what was going on, and posted as much on their Facebook page. I wonder whether they noticed similar confusion from other new fans and figured they'd clarify.

We opened with a three-way between Alex Reynolds, Mike Rayne, and a debuting Shane Strickland. Honestly, I think this was one of the best matches of the night. All three athletes demonstrated considerable athletic skill, and the action was believable. The difficulties of handling three people at once was nicely covered by first Alex Reynolds waiting outside the ring with a shit-eating grin watching the others wear themselves out and later one person or another lying outside of the ring ostensibly recovering. There were some very impressive moves being pulled out, and I never found myself sitting there, waiting for the action to continue, or inwardly groaning as one wrestler tried to maneuver himself into the right place for his opponent to land their signature move. I look forward to seeing more from Shane.

Second match was Blue Collar Slaughterhouse versus Jon Bolen and... some guy. Apparently HD Cannon was out with pneumonia (no idea whether it was a matter of the actual wrestler having pneumonia), so Bolen put out a call for a partner for the match, and some guy volunteered for it. I'm pulling the names off of the official cards, so I have no idea who the guy was. Prior to the guy showing up, Bolen had the microphone and made some comment about how he's been described as a man of few words, but he was trying to change. Honestly, I think fewer words is better for him. It was kind of painful with him completely failing to find good insults and obviously hoping the audience would yell out something he could use (eventually going with a yelled suggestion of "Brokeback Outhouse" for the other team). The match itself was a bit of a mess. Apparently BCS are seen as heels in the promotion and we were supposed to be rooting against them, but I got the impression that Jon Bolen was similarly a heel (or maybe they were aiming for antihero) and Bolen and whoever he was teamed up with basically spent the match beating on BCS in or out of the ring whether or not they were the valid partner in the ring. What really bugged me about that, is that last event, BCS impressed me with how they stayed entirely inside of the rules for tags, not entering the ring unless tagged in. This match, they deviated from it a bit, but were largely honorable. So... are we saying that following the rules is bad and should get you cheered against? This is an overall issue with this promotion in my opinion, albeit also with wrestling in general these days. If you're just going to shrug when teams break the rules about only one person in the ring at a time, why bother having the rules?

I think it was between these two matches that former owner Norm Roberts and current owner Chuck Kuzniewski had their spot. At the last event, while Chuck was out tending to Facade, who'd been injured, Norm scheduled the match where Mc Chesney got the IWC Indy title off of Logan Shulo and also announced that, due to a contract loophole, he now owned IWC. Things were mildly explained. Apparently, there was an option for Norm Roberts to buy at the end of three years, but only if Chuck consented to the buy, which he refused to do. Some grievances were aired, with Norm feeling that Chuck only ever contacted him when he wanted something done, Chuck countering that Norm always said to call when he needed help and that he's put his life into the company, Norm saying that Chuck cared too much about the bottom line and not enough about the fans... long and short of it, Chuck is still the owner, Norm extended the hand of friendship and had it slapped away, and after Norm said that he planned to keep showing up if he had to buy a ticket, Chuck said that's the only way that Norm would get in.

I think it was the third match of the night which was W.A.R. (We Are Rockstars) versus Team Big League (currently composed of Jimmy Nutts and Joseph Brooks, Team Big League being sort of a stable, I think). It was a fun match. Jimmy Nutts lived up to his name and W.A.R. were their usual well-choreographed and acrobatic selfs. I think that Team Big League won near the end due to some tag team chicanery involving the off tag partner beating up a fallen opponent while the other guy distracted the ref. Honestly, W.A.R. wasn't much better about respecting the tag team rules. I did like how Aiden Vale starting things off with a nicely flashy backflip splash. It gave us an idea of what we were in for.

I think it was after that that Elgin and John Mc Chesney had their match for the IWC Indy Championship belt. Outside of the drama, it was a certainty that the belt wasn't going to change hands to someone who was in for a guest spot, but they had to find a way to show Elgin's prowess as a guest. Elgin did a good job of selling being the big guy who was largely unstoppable and John Mc Chesney is, I think, at his best when he's selling hits. He makes getting thrown across the ring look good. Team Big League showed up for some good old-fashioned interference whenever it seemed like the referee was looking the other direction. Bit by bit, Mc Chesney wore Elgin down. There was one odd bit where Elgin held Mc Chesney up in a vertical suplex position as everyone counted (it went up to sixty-four, although Elgin and Mc Chesney were visibly trembling holding it there. Funniest bit was seeing how much of the audience stumbled in their counting when it hit 30 or so. Insert a joke about Pennsylvania's educational system). A little bit of delay would add some drama, I suppose, but it seemed a bit gratuitous. Ultimately, Mc Chesney smashed Elgin in the face with the belt, securing a DQ, which meant Elgin won, but the title didn't change hands.

I want to say that there were only four matches in the first half, but I know that Andrew Palace had his match against Justin Idol... I may have gotten some matches out of order. Anyhow, it was an amusing match. Palace is an enjoyable heel. There was a lot of emphasis on hair, including Palace accusing Idol of being jealous of Palace's lustrous locks, while Idol is obviously going bald. Ultimately, while Palace prevailed for a decent amount of the match, he lost after one too many times of forgoing a chance for a pin to instead taunt his opponent, despite the exhortations from his partner and his valet to just finish the match. This was one of the cases where the end was kind of a foregone conclusion because Idol's storyline involves him having to maintain a certain win ratio to keep his contract, and losing this one would have meant they'd need to find a way to sell him still being there. One other thing about the match, Andrew Palace does the best ragdolling I have ever seen in a match. The guy must be hyper-flexible, because every time he got knocked around, his limbs fell into positions that looked actively painful. Honestly, it did a lot to sell his fights, because he looked like he was genuinely getting knocked silly.

After intermission, Norm Roberts returned with ticket in hand, punctuating his movements with a whistle to emphasize that he was back as a paying customer. He wound up in a few different locations as he worked the crowd.

The match between the returning Gambino Brothers and the new tag team of Kevin Haught and Colin Delaney was a disappointment for me. I first saw Delaney and Haught at the last event, and they came off as cheerful idealistic guys who were trying their best to win under the rules, and almost succeeded despite their opponents, The Founding Fathers, having to cheat to win. This match, they were... well, honestly, kind of pathetic. I'm kind of wondering if maybe too many people expressed sympathy for them last event, and the people scripting the matches wanted to try to keep anyone from thinking they were valid competitors. After a squash match, The Founding Fathers proved themselves to be sore about nearly getting beaten last time, and proceeded to curb stomp the fallen underdogs before sweeping out in a huff.

Between the last match and the next one, there was an interview by Justin Plummer of Anthony Nese, who was annoyed at Plummer's attempts to ask anything substantive, and insisted that the only important thing was his upcoming match with Logan Shulo. Cheap heat was secured by Nese by him accusing Plummer and the IWC fans of being idiots for caring about anything but Nese's "perfect athlete physique". Also, Norm Roberts wound up on my side of the arena and I invited him to move from his second row seat to the empty first row seat beside me. He paid more attention to his cell phone than to the match, but was able to explain an aspect of the Castle/Fish match that I missed.

Bobby Fish versus Dalton Castle was very amusing. Bobby Fish came off as a "Stop Having Fun" Guys persona with him being annoyed with Castle's hyperactive Cloudcuckoolander entrance as "The Party Peacock". The match itself was probably my second-favorite of the night. Refreshingly, Fish was shown to have a point, as Dalton's somewhat spastic fighting style left him visibly winded by the end of the match, and Dalton frequently walked right into Fish's attacks. Ultimately, it all came down to a situation where Fish put Dalton in a figure-four leglock and they rolled over and... there was a three-count and Dalton was declared the winner. Norm explained to me that the leglock had failed and, despite all appearances, Fish had his shoulders pinned down in the process. Honestly, it was a confusing end to the match for me. Shortly after that, Norm left again, whistling to show his progress.

The final match of the night was the Shulo/Nese one. It was good. Both wrestlers obviously knew their stuff and the moves transitioned pretty seamlessly with it looking believable that one side was prevailing at any given point or time. There was one hilariously mistimed maneuver where Nese clotheslined himself a good three inches before Shulo's arm, but overall, it was good. Near the end, the lights went out, a whistle was blown, the light went back up, and Facade leapt into the ring, spitting red mist into Shulo's eyes. Whistle, lights go out, then back up again. Nese secures a win while Shulo is blinded. Afterwards, Shulo confronts Norm, who's ringside (and no longer carrying the whistle...) and punches him out, and proceeds to assault Chuck as well, shouting that he's done "everything Chuck asked" and still he gets treated like this. I think that the intent is to paint Chuck as having engineered a lot more shady deals in the past. One minor oddity was that, when Nese was giving his speech about winning the title, there were three different people clustered around Shulo, splashing water on his face and dabbing away at his eyes, which makes me wonder if maybe something didn't quote go right, and Logan had been genuinely hurt (I also noticed that Shulo's eyes were funny after about halfway through the match, when he took a nasty hit on the head, so unless he's really good at acting injury, he might have been mildly concussed). The night ended with Norm stalking off, threatening to sue, and Shulo apparently ready to start a vendetta against Chuck and Norm.

Overall, I enjoyed myself again. I probably looked a proper rube, cheering and shouting as if it were a real fight (my favorite moment of the night was where Joseph Brooks was executing some sort of weird rear bearhug attempt on one of the members of W.A.R., I shouted something about him trying to hug his opponent to death and Jimmy Nutts, in his corner, turns and says in a very aggrieved voice, "It's a very aggressive hug"), and there's a part of me that keeps thinking that the shenanigans people pull in the ring would have resulted in disqualification not so long ago if seen by the ref (I suspect it's not much different from the people who complain about the NBA changing the rules to allow a few steps without dribbling in preparation for a dunk), not to mention how cheating is no longer the province of heels. I'm planning on trying to attend the March 9th event, also in Elizabeth.

Edit: The "new guy" in the Bolen / BCS match was Brian Mc Dowell, who apparently debuted in July 2012. Further Edit: It wasn't Facade who punked Shulo. It was Jason Gory. I saw the hooded costume and the blonde dreadlocks and assumed.

edited 27th Jan '13 9:03:28 AM by FuzzyBoots

Cena Wins

edited 28th Jan '13 4:56:30 AM by Cider

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

Saw it coming.

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great

So, last night's Royal Rumble was my introduction to professional wrestling. Are things always that predictable?

Thank you

Not always but the current WWE bookers rarely deviate from their formula too much. Unpredictability is not always a good thing anyway.

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

In WWE they often are. Watch Ring Of Honor sometime. You might enjoy it more. I do.

Oh no, in this case predictability is very bad.

This time it means that we're getting Cena vs. Rock 2. That story should have ended with Rocky getting the win in the first match and the two never wrestling again. I, for one, do not want to see John Cena "overcome the odds" and win another world title, but that's what's going to happen. (And don't get me started about how idiotic it is that WWE still wants us to think that Cena is an underdog when he never, ever loses cleanly and kicked out of multiple finishers in a recent match against Dolph Ziggler.)

This time it means that instead of getting something like Cena vs. Underaker at Mania—which might actually be interesting because it would be two irresistable forces colliding—we're most likely going to see Punk vs. 'Taker. Or to put it another way: we're going to see the guy who has won 20 Wrestle Mania matches in a row taking on a guy who he's beaten multiple times before and who just lost, making him look weaker than he has in ages.

(And yes, I know that Cena vs. 'Taker would create the possibility of Cena being the one to finally break the streak, but I'd consider that the lesser of two evils.)

There's a reason why the Invincible Hero trope used to be called "Boring Invincible Hero". It's because heroes like that are boring. And that's why I don't watch WWE any more apart from the occasional You Tube video, because I'm tired of that shit.

edited 28th Jan '13 10:15:56 PM by KilgoreTrout

There is another IWC show on March 9th, Uncivil War in Elizabeth, PA. Looks like Delaney and Haught will have a rematch against The Founding Fathers. Goodness knows if The Founding Fathers will feel the need to fight three against two again. I won't be able to attend this one.

More exciting for fans of mainstream performances, I suspect, is the upcoming Night of the Superstars 2 in Meadville, PA on Saturday April 13th, 2013, which will feature "Rowdy" Roddy Piper, Colt Toombs, Vader, Goldust, and Kid Kash.

Oh, and the IWC Aftershock shows will be delayed for a bit due to the birth of the first son of the host, Justin Plummer.

Discuss.

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

Well, Kurt Angle's on Team Sheikie; his response was only less incomprehensible.

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great

Well, he's is going to kick an IOC official's ass if he gets the chance because wrestling was in the original Olympic games. It would be like removing long jump or boxing(wchat them do it).

edited 16th Feb '13 3:52:58 PM by Cider

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I hope for Sheik's sake that he's putting on an act when he says stuff like this. These crazy rants are what made him relevant again, after all, so if he wants to keep on being famous then he has a reason for continuing to rant crazily.

If he isn't putting on an act, then he's senile as fuck, or he's got Alzheimer's, or something else I'd rather not be wrong with him.

The man really was a great promo though his English was always kind of broken.

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So, having read a recap of Raw, it looks like they want to give Cena a clean win over Punk on his way to his clean win over Rocky.

Thereby making sure that everybody who says that Punk is better than Cena will shut up, because they want the people who say Punk is better than Cena to shut up and admit that Cena is the GREATEST OF ALL TIME, and making sure that Cena/Rocky II is going to be the same match as last year except with a different ending.

As opposed to something which would be more interesting and maybe fun, like a triple threat with Punk involved.

edited 19th Feb '13 8:55:02 AM by KilgoreTrout

Orrrrr, it could just be that Punk, being the cocky, sore-loser type heel he's playing right now, is getting his comeuppance. Need I remind you that Cena's about 2-5 against Punk, and Punk DID just have one of the longest title reigns in company history.

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great

Right, he is something like 2-5 against Cena, and that was a refreshing change. Seeing Cena getting beaten more or less clean starting at MITB 2011 without getting his wins back later on. Even if Punk owes his post Face–Heel Turn victories to things like Show interfering, he was still able to beat Cena in a straight up wrestling match on more than one occasion.

But now they're going to have Cena become a Boring Invincible Hero again by letting him go over Punk on the way to going over Rocky, right? This after making Ziggler look bad after Dolph hit him with multiple finishers and he kicked out of all of them.

I never see a problem with Cena being the Invincible Hero. He's not part of why I watch wrestling, so I don't really pay attention to him. Besides, I mostly watch Smackdown, so I don't worry about him bothering me. But really, how is this any different than the Hulkster? Or Stone Cold? Hell, Austin wouldn't even bother with getting his wins back, he'd beat up his opponents backstage so he wouldn't have to fight them.

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great

That his matches are highly formulaic and not very competitive? That WWE is incapable of simply dropping him down the card for a while and running the main event without him? That they are so slow to remove his custom WWE title long after the gimmick associated with has been forgotten?

I do not watch Raw either, I just understand why people are sick of him and I can say that as a John Cena fan. WWE's booking, writing, their direction with John Cena is apotheosis of all their problems. What, Hogan was worse? That is irrelevant, we are not in the Rock N' Wrestling era anymore. About Stone Cold Steve Austin? The Attitude Era is dead and gone.

Think of all the people who could have done something new and interesting had WWE just moved John Cena's card position. Kofi Kingston, Wade Barret, MVP, Shelton Benjamin, Elija Burke, John Morrison, Shad Gaspard, Cody Rhodes, think about all the different things John Cena could have been doing. Maybe a run in the tag team division could have helped spread his appeal to someone else? A real tag team run, like Hell No's, the Usos, the Prime Tyme players. Maybe that could have given Kaval something to do besides the job? John Cena could have had a feud with Antonio Cesario over the United States title.

edited 19th Feb '13 11:22:59 AM by Cider

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

I actually think that a tag team run like you mentioned would be the best use of him right now. He could help create a new star by tagging with him and, hopefully, letting the younger guy get the pinfall more often than not.

Meanwhile, do a few jobs. Put some guys over who will be with the company after you retire, which will probably happen sometime in the next five years. Clean jobs—not letting Punk beat you because you were distracted, or letting Punk beat you again because you had your foot on the ropes but the ref didn't see it, or having Sheamus beat you because you slipped and fell through a table, or enter a six man tag with a rising star like Ryback in which you don't get pinned and Ryback is the one who loses the match for the team.

Honestly, I may very well be wrong about this and be forgetting somebody, but off the top of my head I can only name two guys who have beaten Cena entirely clean over the last few years. Rocky, and HHH on one episode of Raw.

The thing about wrestling is that it's the only medium of fiction I can think of where instead of the villains having the advantage, it's usually the heroes.

Cena has been booked as this generation's Hulk Hogan. If I had bothered to watch more wrestling as a kid during the height of Hogan's popularity, I might have loved him just as much as kids in this era love Cena.

But when I was a little kid, all I cared about was seeing the good guys win. I didn't care if winning for them was easy or difficult. I didn't care if they faced an Ineffectual Sympathetic Villain or a Worthy Opponent, so long as whoever they faced got beaten.

When I got older, I started being bored by stories where the good guys just curb-stomped the bad guys.

If Luke had arrived at Cloud City and proceeded to just kick Vader's ass, The Empire Strikes Back would not have been anywhere near as good as it was.

And I think that's the root of the IWC's problem. It's not so much that the product's changed, it's just we've changed. Add to that the Internet's wealth of free information, and the anonymity of places like /wooo/ and the Craphole, and that's how we get the stereotypical "Smart Mark who watches just to complain, even if his suggestions would actually hurt WWE".

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great

Thing is I do not watch Raw anymore. I still watch Smackdown but it has always been more tolerable than Raw. If I wanted to watch something just to complain I might post this video...

...and then say behold the greatest referee of all time! The wrestlers are pretty good though so you should probably watch part two and three. If they get on Raw I might start watching again. Truth is I watched Raw for years before realizing it was not getting better. The only way I would watch it now is for the sake of new talent I would feel the need to support but I doubt much in the way of new talent can really grow with John Cena around.

Or maybe if Kofi Kingston challenged for a new title but apparently he has done everything he can possibly do.

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack

He's no Bryce Rembsberg, that's for sure.

Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great