| 1 | Please note that, due to the NintendoHard nature of the game, [[LastLousyPoint sadistic completion requirements]], and plethora of [[FakeDifficulty player-perceived bullshit]]. "That One Level" and "That One Achievement" have their own pages, linked below. |
| 2 | ---- |
| 3 | !!! Subpages: |
| 4 | * [[ThatOneAchievement/Payday2 That One Achievement]] |
| 5 | * [[ThatOneLevel/Payday2 That One Level]] |
| 6 | ---- |
| 7 | |
| 8 | [[foldercontrol]] |
| 9 | |
| 10 | [[folder:A-M]] |
| 11 | * AbridgedArenaArray: Before patches were made to discourage the trope, Ukrainian Job and Nightclub since both levels are extremely short when done right, thus players can quickly farm cards at the end of a game to get weapon and mask mods quickly. Four Stores is also another popular choice for card farming if someone has a [=OVE9000=] saw since they can cut open ATM machines to quickly get the money and go past the required $15,000 for the objectives. Patches were made to introduce Titan safes in Ukrainian Job (can't be blown up with C4 or have their locks picked) and more rooms were added in Nightclub where two safes can spawn in random locations and they can either hold money (needed to finish the level) or coke (extra loot). Four Stores also had its ATM removed for Death Wish[[note]]before the Housewarming party update introduced Mayhem[[/note]] difficulty. |
| 12 | ** Around the time that the patch was released, players began to grind the Rats heist by blowing up the lab in day 1 so they didn't have to cook meth, blow up the safe in day 2 to reach the intel in the safe without having to do the meth trade, and then ignoring the money on the bus in day 3. Rats gave the most experience points and since it was so easy to speedrun it, 99% of Rats games were for grinding EXP and it was somewhat difficult to find lobbies for other heists. The Death Wish update [[AntiGrinding countered the grinding by introducing a new EXP system where playing the same heists over and over again reduces EXP gained while playing different heists can create EXP bonuses]]. Rats was also changed to have the van not appear at all until you blow up the lab or cook 3 bags of meth and the driver still needs a few minutes to arrive in either scenario. If the lab explodes on the Death Wish difficulty, ''the entire map is set on fire'', which downs everyone instantly. Also, the only way for the van to spawn on this difficulty is to cook 3 bags, so even if someone self-revives themself, blowing up the lab without cooking enough bags causes the mission to be unbeatable. |
| 13 | ** For stealth bonuses, people rushed Diamond Store on Normal as it provided a 30% bonus for just a single day job. And since the door to the camera room outside always spawns, the mission is much easier. When the Gage Assault Pack DLC came out, the update reduced EXP bonuses across the board since the EXP system itself got revamped. However, Diamond Store was accidentally boosted to 50% for stealth bonus, so players would quickly clear the level and then use the bonus on a high EXP paying heist to level up even faster. The bug was quickly fixed and Diamond Store dropped to a 5% bonus. |
| 14 | ** Currently, there's a good chance that a third of the lobbies open at any time will be for Hoxton Breakout. This heist combines great EXP with a high payout and is generally pub-friendly since it's a very straightforward loud heist that isn't paid DLC. It has supplanted Rats as the level-grind heist of choice, not only because of its greater rewards but because it's significantly faster, being a two day job with no possibility for escapes compared to Rats being a three day job with two possibilities for escapes and [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking not having to move so many bags]]. |
| 15 | ** Shadow Raid is a very popular level-grinding heist due to its substantial EXP payout, large cash reward, and the fact a decently-coordinated crew can ECM-rush the whole heist in three minutes even at low levels. Even with the maximum EXP penalty for repetition it gives more cash and EXP per minute than any other heist when rushed. With Infamy 2.0 having 25 levels to grind up through, this has made Shadow Raid one of the most-run heists in the game...until the EXP system was revamped again where experience gained was based on bags secured, and Shadow Raid was somehow nerfed into oblivion. |
| 16 | ** Most of Vlad's non-Ukrainian Job heists are similarly well-liked because of some combination of being quick, easy, and/or having a high payout and experience reward. Mallcrasher and Four Stores are probably the most popular because of extremely quick gameplay and a good chance for extra loot. Aftershock, added in Crimefest 2015, is also rather popular as, while it's much slower than Vlad's other heists (owing to having to move a minimum of four heavy safes all over the map) it has an insane cash payout on higher difficulties (over two million just in spending cash on Overkill difficulty). |
| 17 | * AlternateCharacterInterpretation: |
| 18 | ** Is Bain ''really'' the brains of the group, or is he just a hack who manipulates others to do his work for him? His tendency to get the wrong ingredient for meth in Rats doesn't help. |
| 19 | *** Furthermore, is Bain truly a criminal mastermind, or does he secretly like to help people, as evident in the GO Bank and First World Bank? [[EvenEvilHasStandards It could even support as to why he would prefer if civilians were left unharmed, besides other obvious reasons]]. |
| 20 | *** On the other end of the extremes, many people claim that Bain is the true BigBad, and is conspiring against the crew. |
| 21 | ** Gen-Sec and the FBI. Are they actually as honest and as "against crime" as they claim to be? The fact that the FBI representative told [[spoiler:Hector]] that the Mendoza cartel were on their payroll definitely doesn't help their likeability as far as in-universe reputation goes. For all we know, despite the gang's evil tendencies, the FBI and Gen-Sec could actually be the actual villains of the Payday universe due to the destruction that they will gladly cause just to stop four men in clown masks (see them smashing up Wilson's house in Counterfeit), with the likes of Commissioner Solomon Garrett being the OnlySaneMan among the ranks that is actually aware of some of the sociopathic tendencies that creeps up in the ranks, if the FBI files on his own units says anything. |
| 22 | ** Similarly, the Payday Gang themselves. Are they utter monsters of criminals who only care about the possibility of cash lining their pockets, or are they the [[AntiVillain Anti-Villains]] with Gen-Sec, the FBI and the government being the {{Greater Scope Villain}}s due to their decisions that have a chance to affect the public in a negative way? Are they incidentally helping others, or is there an ulterior motive involved? |
| 23 | %% |
| 24 | %% Do not add And The Fandom Rejoiced, the page for which even says not to link to it. It is for in-universe examples only. |
| 25 | %% |
| 26 | * AlasPoorScrappy: While Bain may be constantly annoying due to his nagging, [[spoiler: after the events of the ''Reservoir Dogs'' heist, along with his current condition and subsequent death as a result, one can't help but feel sympathetic towards him. His last words really hammers the point home. Good thing that wasn't the true ending]]. |
| 27 | ---> '''Bain''': [[spoiler: You... did it guys. Y-you pulled it off, the damn White House. [[SoProudOfYou I'm proud of you, damn proud]]. Now you're free, free to- *Groan* Is- is this? Oh my...]] |
| 28 | * AluminumChristmasTrees: Sniper enemies armed with bolt action M4 rifles may seem like an error or lazy recycling of game assets, but [[http://www.ruger.com/products/precisionRifle/models.html there is actually such a weapon.]] |
| 29 | * AnnoyingVideoGameHelper: Bain will constantly nag you to grab the thermal drill when you play the Harvest & Trustee Bank heist contracted by him[[note]]Hector offers the heist as Day 3 of Firestarter[[/note]]. He will not shut up until you grab the drill. If you go loud on the 3rd day of Framing Frame, Bain will never shut up about how you can hack the senator's computer to slander his reputation, even if you're ''in the middle'' of hacking it. Bain's nagging is cranked up to eleven for day 2 of the Hotline Miami heist where he will be borderline ''screaming'' at you to hurry up because you need to kill the Commissar so that the Dentist will keep his word in helping you break out Old Hoxton and to reach the Commissar in time before he can completely trash all of the coke (meaning less profits for you[[note]]Note that Crime Spree discounts all optional loot[[/note]]). He tends to lapse into this habit in the Alesso Heist and Golden Grin Casino mission as well. [[LampshadeHanging Hoxton calls this habit 'yapping like a needy dog']] in-universe, showing that yes, Bain really does do that, and yes, it irritates the crew as much as the players. |
| 30 | * AntiClimaxBoss: You finally get to take down the rat that betrayed Hoxton. [[spoiler:Turns out the rat is Hector and he's only armed with the Izhma shotgun. Despite being fully armored if you get to him with the heist in loud, he goes down ''very'' fast as if he was just a regular mook.]] |
| 31 | * AudienceAlienatingEra: 2015 was a very divisive period for the game, to the point that it'd be shorter to list the updates that ''didn't'' result in a BrokenBase. Between a massive number of crossovers (before 2015, the Payday series had only had four, with the first game having one with ''VideoGame/Left4Dead'' and the second getting ones with ''Franchise/JohnWick'', ''VideoGame/HotlineMiami'', and a melee weapon in reference to a ''ComicBook/TheWalkingDead'' game that Starbreeze had just announced; 2015 had six in that year alone), a pair of highly controversial events with the Hype Train and Crimefest 2015, the addition skins with stat boosts that required opening safes to get, as well as broken promises that they'd never add mictransactions, which resulted in large-scale uproar (including review bombing that knocked well over 15% off the game's Steam User review score), to the point where the Steam Community moderators for the game made headlines when they went on strike in protest of the game's direction, only relenting when they were given a public interview with the game's Community Manager to voice the fanbase's concerns. After a rocky start to 2016 (which saw a largely unpopular crossover with VideoGame/GoatSimulator and a Perk Deck rebalance which was widely considered to make the game's balance problems worse), however, the game managed to WinBackTheCrowd in the Spring, with some well-received updates (including a free crossover with Film/HardcoreHenry that was received nearly as well as the Hotline Miami DLC and a rerelease of the first game's Wolf Pack DLC that was free to players who owned the original), attempts to better listen to community feedback (including lengthy open betas for new balance changes), and, most significantly, "freeing up" the microtransaction system (by removing the drills and letting players just open any safes they get for free) as part of Update #100. Update #200 made skins drop from heists and are now treated as common rewards. |
| 32 | * AuthorsSavingThrow: As of about Spring 2016, the developers seem to have taken notice of some of the fandom's more vocal complaints, and measures are being taken to address matters: |
| 33 | ** The introduction of microtransactions, allowing players with the money to buy drills for the safes (and possibly rewarding them with weapons that had better stats and attachments than what they could get normally), obliterated the fanbase, with the game losing players in droves. After a set of circumstances, the microtransactions are now gone, and Overkill is on the path to mending the relationship with their fanbase. |
| 34 | ** The Completely Overkill pack, priced at $20, was a one-time deal that went on during the Hype-train event, which gave four mega masks of the original gang, and promised a future reward. Said reward was all the DLC released between the Game of the Year edition content, to the content before Crimefest 2015. This left a lot of people displeased, especially those who had already bought the DLC prior to this. Overkill Studios had since responded to their loyal fans by promising something better by making mega versions of existing masks at their requests, and even some exclusive masks to make up for this. Further more, they insist on keeping this a one time deal, allowing only said people who bought the Completely Overkill pack access to these masks. |
| 35 | ** Bain has drawn a lot of ire over the game's long life, due to his repetitive lines, chewing out players for killing civilians repeatedly, and apparently having TookALevelInJerkass since the first game (where, for one thing, he'd apologize and [[ItsAllMyFault blame himself]] if the crew wiped and the heist failed). He also [[ScrappyMechanic tends to get the meth ingredients wrong and can lead to certain heists failing]], ''actually'' making it his fault. Some later patches have toned down his repetitiveness, reduced the frequency with which he'll berate you for killing civilians, and now he's back to taking the blame and apologizing if the heist fails. Some people have seen it as a start to getting the old Bain back. |
| 36 | *** The meth lab instructions got changed, too, so now he'll always catch and correct himself after a few seconds if he says the wrong thing. It's gone from possibly having him ruin the heist due to bad instructions unless players compare what he says across clients, to a lab explosion being the players' fault for not bothering to wait a few extra seconds for him to confirm it. |
| 37 | ** Hoxton got some flak on his return due to being far more hostile and foul-mouthed to the rest of the crew. As time has passed, he's gotten more like his old self, with his lines being more relaxed and occasionally snarky, his lines for helping up teammates being more genuine and caring, and much less rage and swearing. [[BerserkButton Except towards civilians, Houston, and broken drills, at least]], and most players can sympathize with his anger at civilians and drills. |
| 38 | ** Flashbangs were a long-time ScrappyMechanic for many players, which was not helped by Bo Andersson's hostile defense over said mechanic. Initially, at seemingly random times, flashbangs would spawn directly under players' feet and almost instantly detonate, despite Anderson's insistence that it is suppose to be an anti-camp mechanic. After update 100, flashbangs now give off a beeping noise and a red aura before going off, granting players a small window to avoid getting blinded. |
| 39 | ** The downloadable content has been the subject of constant complaints, with many stating that the game has too much DLC. Arguments aside, as of June 8th, 2017, the game now comes in an Ultimate Edition for $45, with owners of the game and some of the DLC getting a permanent, massive discount (equivalent to the usual 75% off during sales) to pick up what they don't own to upgrade to the Ultimate Edition. Plus, all future DLC packs will be free from now on (with exceptions including the Completely Overkill Pack[[labelnote:*]]It was a one time deal, and Overkill Studios insisted on maintaining their loyalty to players that purchased this[[/labelnote]], and two future character packs [[note]]and even then, there will still be free character packs alongside them, as seen with the free Duke pack coming out around the same time as the paid WebVideo/{{h3h3|productions}} one[[/note]]). |
| 40 | ** Update 130 gave players the option to mute contractors in-game, addressing long-running player complaints about contractors' insistence on reminding players to go get the thermal drill for the fortieth time. They will still say critical information, but most of the repetitive chatter is silenced with the option on. |
| 41 | ** Update 220 added an infamy pool system, in which you gain XP from completing heists that allows you to infamy up without losing your hard-earned skills or weapons. This pleased ''many'' people, who hated the antiquated respec system, and while the grind is a little longer to compensate, it has motivated more people to level up more. |
| 42 | * SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic: The [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK-neZkunpE various]] [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0gJgH1HGyY catchy]] [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWkqvRaR8hk tracks]] played during police assaults slowly dig into your mind as you spend more time playing. Getting up to eleven lately: the The Dentist trailer has an (awesome) [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcMDJ1jEou8 original track]] and the Big Bank trailer introduced an ''opera'' [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul0YbD1AIeE soundtrack]] which plays in the heist itself and with the chorus starting during police assaults' climaxes. With the Big Fat Music Update, one can configure the soundtracks to one's preference, often resulting in ''Ode to Greed'' playing everywhere. |
| 43 | * BaseBreakingCharacter: |
| 44 | ** Surprisingly, John Wick. He has fans and haters alike. Some of the haters went as far as to use "Kick the Wick" mods back in the day to prevent him from showing up during a game, while there are many fans who play as him on a regular basis. |
| 45 | ** Jiro. Some say his [[GratuitousJapanese Japanese-only dialogue]] is a deal breaker while others state that, with proper nouns (such as heister names and enemy names) kept intact, there's no problem and this distinction helps give him uniqueness. |
| 46 | ** [[WebVideo/H3H3Productions Ethan and Hila]]. To be clear, most hate the characters, not the real life people portraying them. Some fans like the inclusion of them as it means that they can play as their favourite Youtubers, while others didn't like this as the voice acting was terrible. Ethan has the problem of his assault lines not being shoutey enough, making it sound like he's ''trying to shout'', but can't quite do it, whereas Hila sounds genuinely enthusiastic, but stilted in her performance. The promise of the couple having a backstory that would make sense in the canon of Payday 2 was also broken, as their background in-game is basically that they're playing exaggerated versions of themselves (Online Video personalities recruited by Bain [[RealLifeWritesThePlot specifically to help them fight off a lawsuit.]]). In fact, the only notable change is Hila's mandatory army draft, which was expanded upon here as Hila actually doing time in the Army. [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking Also, it isn't part of Ultimate Edition]], and is a DLC pack, and thus requires a separate purchase [[note]] It's only fair to point out that Overkill and Starbreeze make '''''[[DoingItForTheArt zero money from this packs' sales]]'''''. 70% of the money goes to Ethan and Hila, with the remaining percentage going to Valve, as part of their mandatory sales cut[[/note]] |
| 47 | * BestLevelEver: |
| 48 | ** For Loud heists: Big Bank, First World Bank, Hotline Miami, Reservoir Dogs, Scarface Mansion, Stealing Xmas, and Hoxton Breakout are widely considered to be the best heists in the game, since they're large scale, offer intense and fast paced action, have a respectable cash and exp yield, and are still simple enough that relatively inexperienced players can complete them. |
| 49 | ** For Stealth: |
| 50 | *** Shadow Raid gets a lot of love for its very non-linear design (to the point where the map's main objective, stealing UsefulNotes/OdaNobunaga's armor, is completely optional), vast piles of loot to collect, and for being accommodating to players of all skill levels. |
| 51 | *** The Yacht Heist is widely considered to be the best stealth map the game has to offer. Unlike other stealth offerings, you don't have to worry about cameras spotting you, and only deal with civilians and guards. You can pocket quite a lot of side-loot, such as vases and artifacts, and the map is symmetrical on both sides, meaning if one way is blocked by a guard, you can hop over to the other side to pass them. |
| 52 | * BreatherLevel: In Hoxton Breakout Day 2 one of the possible tasks involve going to the director's office and authorizing clearance for Hoxton. This is by far the easiest task one can get that day as it requires no doors to be breached (thus requiring a keycard, C4, a drill, or lockpicking) and only requires a few button presses. Hoxton lampshades this by saying the director's got an easy job. |
| 53 | ** Also, on Normal difficulty, Boiling Point. The Russians do very little damage to you and you get an abnormally large amount of money for a normal heist if you choose to scan all the bodies. |
| 54 | ** On any difficulty, Ukrainian Job, provided you know how to do stealth on that heist. This is mostly because the camera room is always in the same, easy-to-reach place and the tiara will always be in one of the safes, preventing you from alerting civilians. |
| 55 | * BrokenBase: [[BrokenBase/{{PAYDAY2}} Too many to list here]]. |
| 56 | * BigLippedAlligatorMoment: A few. |
| 57 | ** Starting is the Halloween heists, all three. "Prison Nightmare", "Safehouse Nightmare", and, probably the biggest, "Lab Rats". It helps a little that it's implied they're AllJustADream. "Lab Rats" has one inside one, as a GiantSpider shows up. |
| 58 | ** The "Film/HardcoreHenry" pack is a major one, as it ties into a very fantastical action movie, with the crew as actual good guys for once. And if the FreezeFrameBonus in the film has anything to say, it's completely canon. Also, [[Administrivia/TropesAreTools it's ridiculously funny and rather well-designed]]. |
| 59 | ** The VideoGame/GoatSimulator-inspired heist with the crew literally finding goats with cocaine [[AssShove shoved up their...]] yeah. |
| 60 | --> '''Bain''': [[LampshadeHanging This is gonna be a ''weird one'', gang.]] |
| 61 | * CasualCompetitiveConflict: Despite the game being purely co-op, there's breakdowns between people over how the game should be: |
| 62 | ** The tactic of players chaining ECM use so that they can kill the guards and complete all the objectives in stealth before the jammers expire has been debated for quite some time. Some people believe ECM chaining is extremely cheap and that it's not "real" stealth while the defenders say that the tactic is fair game. |
| 63 | *** Shaped charges also went through a similar debate before the developers created counters that punished people for relying on shaped charges too much. In certain levels, one or two people with shaped charges can easily bypass drilling or lockpicking safes and can beat the mission faster this way. One side felt the shaped charges were too cheap and the other side saw no problem with the charges. |
| 64 | ** The direction of the game's difficulty is also hotly debated after the developers made several patches that beefed up the difficulty overall. Casual players feel the Cloaker is too powerful due to him being able to knock people down in one hit and they also dislike the changes to stealth that made it harder overall. The more hardcore players say the Cloakers are fine and that the old version of stealth was just too easy and not challenging. |
| 65 | ** The way the game is set up to discourage players from trying to level grind as fast as possible, by giving temporary experience reductions on a heist for playing it repeatedly, is a heavy topic for many. People that defend the game's level grinding discouragement believe it's the way it should be so that people can play something other than Rats over and over again without having to host a game themselves. The other side of the debate believes they're being punished for playing their favorite heists or for trying to level up with the least amount of pain. |
| 66 | ** Which weapons should people use? The ones that everyone uses because of [[TheMunchkin stats]], or ones they feel comfortable with? The Chicago Typewriter is a prime example of this. |
| 67 | * CreatorsPet: Bain. Pretty much everyone hates him in this game to the point where they install mods and codes for muting him so that he can't repeat his lines over and over again, yet Overkill always has him on standby for voice acting (most likely due to Bain's voice actor, Creator/SimonViklund, being the lead composer for the game and can be on standby to record new lines at any time) and pretty much has PlotArmor... [[spoiler:until the ''Film/ReservoirDogs'' Heist]]. |
| 68 | * CriticalDissonance: Critics praise the game for expanding upon old mechanics from the previous game and introducing new elements that keeps the game feeling fresh on every playthrough. Most fans are far more divisive on many topics. |
| 69 | * ComplacentGamingSyndrome: Seems to be new ones introduced after some patch goes live: |
| 70 | ** For a long time, people that played the Rats heist ''always'' blew up the lab because doing so and then ignoring the money on the bus on the 3rd day made the heist go by very fast. Since Rats gave a ton of experience points, nearly everyone played the heist just to speedrun it and level up very fast and it also resulted in many high-level players who had no clue on what to do when other people actually wanted to cook the meth. Although a few changes were made to discourage speedrunning Rats, many people still attempt to do it anyway. |
| 71 | ** Big Bank has several means of escape you can pick from before starting the heist. Everyone always chooses the bus escape route since it's next to the vault (and with luck, you can get the vault directly across from the bus escape) and provides good cover when moving the loot. |
| 72 | *** For stealth runs, everyone picks the poisoned cake, which incapacitates several guards in one half of the playable area, and places it in the canteen so the guards in the front areas are affected, since stealthing past a full compliment of guards ''and'' civilians out in the front is far more difficult than stealthing past just guards just outside the vault. |
| 73 | ** Hotline Miami has only a few preplanning assets compared to Big Bank, so everyone picks the delayed police response on Day 1. |
| 74 | ** Several heists have no preplanning, instead having a list of buyable assets. The Doctor's Bag and Ammo Bag assets are available to all players, cost very little compared to the payout of the heists, and can prove to be a useful backup if low on meds or ammo. This means that just about everyone buys these assets before a heist begins. |
| 75 | ** For a long time, it was pretty difficult to have an effective dodge stat, which meant most people went with heavy armor. When Overkill introduced a perk deck that boosted dodge rates, a new skill that also boosted dodge based on having low concealment, and indirectly nerfing armor by having everything but the suit have zero dodge, people quickly ditched armor in favor of having a super-high dodge stat. This was somewhat distilled by the Crook perk deck, which enabled additional dodge on ballistic vests, alongside a skill that increases the concealment of vests to the same level as a two-piece suit, making a mix of armor and dodge viable. |
| 76 | ** In the early game, just about everyone used the CAR-4 assault rifle and Locomotive 12G shotgun, with the occasional Thanatos and HE Shotgun (or akimbo pistols for dodge builds). The CAR-4 is particularly common for stealth runs, as it has one of the highest potential Concealment stats in the Primary weapons slot while still being an automatic with a decently-sized capacity (anything that can go lower is usually single-shot with a pitiful amount of ammo). With the introduction of the Judge shotgun, which can be suppressed and still get a higher concealment than the Locomotive, it is now just about the only secondary anybody ever uses; failing that, most players playing in loud will gravitate towards the China Puff 40mm from the Wolf Pack due to its great utility against nearly any enemy and the fact, unlike the similarly-useful [=GL40=] from one of Gage's weapon packs, it both carries more than one round per magazine and is a secondary weapon. |
| 77 | ** ECM rushing, which involves everyone playing a heist in stealth throwing down an ECM, do the objectives as quickly as possible, throw down another jammer, rinse and repeat. This method is usually the easiest way to stealth maps, though [[BrokenBase there's a major divide over whether or not ECM rushing removes all challenge]]. |
| 78 | ** Dodge builds. Particularly, perk decks and skill trees that focus on boosting the user's dodge stat. With a high dodge rating, you basically manipulate RNG in your favor and [[NoSell avoid taking damage]] frequently. Players use dodge focused builds frequently because wearing armor slows you down and the extra defense means nothing when a high detection risk from wearing heavy armor means the enemies are able to more accurately hit you from longer distances. On Death Wish and ''especially'' on Death Sentence, expect to see people only in suits, as due to the massive damage ramp-up, even the heaviest armor will go down in about 2-3 hits, while dodge builds can conceivably tank a few dozen before taking actual health damage. |
| 79 | ** Players often use the Grinder deck, even after it was nerfed (it allows health regeneration upon attacking enemies as long as the player wears light armor). |
| 80 | ** The Anarchist perk deck seems designed for this. When maxed out it halves your health but gives you twice the lost health as armor, which regenerates. It also changes armor regeneration so it functions in combat, though it's slower, but one kill every second and a half allows you to instantly regenerate a bit. Combined with an ICTV and the right perks (specifically Underdog, Frenzy, and Berserker, all aced) you can have over 400 armor with ~35% damage reduction and 115% more damage output, [[GameBreaker rendering you virtually immortal]] on any difficulty below Mayhem and, in skilled hands, hard to bring down even on Mayhem, Death Wish and Death Sentence. |
| 81 | ** In a meta example, the developers themselves seem to absolutely ''adore'' the concept of an SMG with high damage and only one or two magazines in reserve, as we have several clones of both the base Krinkov (weapons with two extra mags and decent base accuracy and stability, the [=CR 805B=] and Jackal) ''and'' Armored Transport's Swedish K (weapons with a higher magazine capacity but only one extra mag, middling accuracy and stability, and typically no fire-mode selector, the Tatonka and [=MP40=]). |
| 82 | * DemonicSpiders: All the special SWAT units: |
| 83 | ** [[ColdSniper Snipers]]: Tend to stay far away as usual, but can tear through your armor levels in a single shot, and as the difficulty increases they take a bigger chunk out of your health underneath that as well. On an open rooftop surrounded by them, you won't last long. [[ThatOneLevel We're looking at you, Hotline Miami.]] |
| 84 | ** [[GlassCannon Cloakers]]: Blends in with the rest of the SWAT team, save for his [[HighlyVisibleNinja glowing green optics]] at a distance. Average firepower, but can [[LeParkour run off the walls]] to reach you and can also [[OneHitKO instantly knock you down regardless of how much health and armor you have left]]. A single Cloaker can wipe out an entire team if they decide to not [[BeatingADeadPlayer beat down the first guy they knock over]]. They're even worse in this game; they don't have their optics on unless they're going for a takedown, making it even harder to pick them out among the rest of the SWAT until they're close enough that they decide to feed you your teeth. |
| 85 | ** Tasers: Bulky armored SWAT units with bright yellow stripes on its shoulder pads. Can paralyze you with its taser which also [[InterfaceScrew shakes the screen]] and forces you to fire your weapon, making you waste ammo and probably hit people you didn't want to hit, especially if you've got it set on full-auto. Tasers will not only stand in one place and tase you until you go down or someone staggers or kills the Taser, but will sometimes do a 'drive-by' tasing that stuns you for a second or two while the taser runs behind cover. They're also somewhat infamous for tasing players through tiny gaps in fences or railings where the player being tased often can't even see them, [[HitboxDissonance let alone shoot them back]], though a patch eventually did something to combat this. |
| 86 | ** Bulldozers: Heavily armored SWAT unit that has a powerful shotgun which can down you in two hits in close range. Only its face is the weak spot and despite its big size, it can run pretty fast when it needs to. They may also appear in pairs, threes, or even fours on higher difficulty levels. |
| 87 | *** "Saiga 'Dozers", or Bulldozers that have black suits and semi-automatic shotguns. They also can shrug off a C4 charge, which is the only way to reliably one-shot a regular Bulldozer. |
| 88 | *** Overkill, in their time-honored tradition of making things even harder, added another Bulldozer with a skull decal on their facemask in the new Death Wish difficulty, known as the Skulldozer. In addition to being even more heavily armored, they also come packing a light machine gun, making them dangerous at long range as well. |
| 89 | *** And during Halloween events, it gets even more ridiculous with the Headless Dozer. Armed with either [[DoubleWeapon two Titan safes on a pole]], or the same LMG as a Skulldozer, he doesn't even have a head to shoot, and a riot shield mounted on his back, removing both methods of killing them quickly. |
| 90 | ** Shields: An upper level SWAT unit armed with a riot shield that can withstand everything short of an explosion, fire, sniper rifle shots, or a high level Enforcer's melee attack (assuming they took the skill). They always spawn in groups of three or four on average and tend to stay somewhat together, often letting them block fire from multiple directions, and they're very fond of standing in doorways to block you from escaping. What's particularly annoying is that if they are fixated on you, they will always point their shield towards you, necessitating another player to flank it. If you're playing with only AI, you're in for a pretty bad situation. It doesn't help that the police can shoot through it while you can't shoot back [[HitboxDissonance even when you can clearly hit part of their arm]]. Or the fact that they are ''the'' most common special SWAT unit, in particular being one of only two (next to the Taser) that will even spawn below Very Hard difficulty. |
| 91 | ** The tan FBI units[[note]]Maximum Force Responders[[/note]], which operate in a similar manner to the Heavy SWAT from the last game. Unlike the heavies, the tans are completely ''immune'' to shots made against the torso and, due to the [[HitboxDissonance wonky hitbox system]], are also immune to being shot in the legs. The only way to kill a tan FBI unit is through [[BoomHeadshot headshots]] or [[InTheBack shooting them in the back]], but good luck doing either action if the tan units come in groups or are paired up with special SWAT. |
| 92 | ** Patch 13 introduced street cops wielding the [[HandCannon Bronco .44]]. The Bronco cops can instantly destroy your armor in one shot no matter what type of armor you wear and can instantly down you on the second shot if your armor hasn't regenerated yet. Yes, you have normal cops that can deal as much damage as a Sniper. The only upside is that it was much, much worse right before - this is a toned-down version of a bug where ''every'' street cop could do this to you. |
| 93 | *** On par with these cops are SWAT units and cops with shotguns (who can apparently deal large doses of damage from ''any'' range), and the Hostage Rescue Team, GlassCannon cops who wield high-damage [=SMGs=] or assault rifles, often travel in groups of three, and spawn in between waves when the regular cops back off. |
| 94 | ** SWAT Turrets, automated and stationary gun turrets that drive up on certain missions when things go loud. They're basically [[VideoGame/TeamFortress2 the Engineer's Sentry Guns]] MadeOfIron, with ''several times more health than a Dozer of the same difficulty'', firing 1000 rounds per second, with laser-point accuracy. The only practical ways of destroying them are weapons available through DLC, such as the Thanatos sniper rifle or the RPG, and/or using [=ECMs=] to shut them down for a time. You can also slap an ECM anywhere and the turret itself will temporarily fight for you... but only if you're lucky enough for it to spawn within the heist's zone wall. If not, you have to take it down the hard way. |
| 95 | ** '''Anything''' in stealth runs, particularly ones with a lot of activity in the map. One single guard or civilian alerted in the wrong place is an instant loss, or close enough to it. The worst of these is the guards on Shadow Raid, which have SWAT-level stats and armor, making them hard to subdue if they're alerted to your presence (which is often, considering they usually make turns around tight corners). Worst still is that they have one of the loudest guns in the game, and there are so many of them that you could waste all four of your pagers and still see the compound swarming with them.[[note]]Mind you as well, in every stealth-possible heist, more security will almost invariably show up if you do use up all 4 pagers.[[/note]] |
| 96 | ** Taken to the next level with the ZEAL Team on [[HarderThanHard Death Sentence difficulty]], in which all of the units are {{Lightning Bruiser}}s (with the exception of Snipers) and can [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill instantly mow down]] the entire crew in a few hits if they're not careful enough. Someone admitted that using the ICTV without the Anarchist Perk Deck (and some damage reduction skills such as Underdog aced or Frenzy) will result your entire armor getting depleted in 3 hits. |
| 97 | * DesignatedHero: The web series portrays the Payday crew as a bunch of guys frustrated at how banks [[KarmaHoudini can get away with]] pretty much stealing people's money. They see themselves as modern day Robin Hoods fighting against a corrupt banking system, despite the fact that they're still cold-hearted criminals... and then, during the British Hoxton live-action breakout, they mercilessly cap some FBI guys just doing their job. |
| 98 | * DifficultySpike: Some heists are unlocked after you reached a certain rep level. Around level 30, you unlock jobs given by the Elephant, which are very difficult for first timers due to the heists encouraging stealth and having SWAT swarm in from many spots if the stealth fails; other heists have levels that are more straightforward with cops coming in from predictable locations. |
| 99 | ** Heists released after the game launched tend to be harder than 'stock' ones despite having equal or lower official difficulty ratings, almost always due to absence of good cover. |
| 100 | ** Death Sentence. Enemies have the same health as on Death Wish, but hit thrice as hard. Also, Minigun Dozers, [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Bulldozers with miniguns and a '''massive health pool!''']], spawn on Death Wish and above, with Medic Dozers[[note]]A unit with the Bulldozers durability, crossed with the Medics healing powers[[/note]] spawning on Death Sentence. A modifier was also added for all difficulties called "One Down", where players can only be incapacitated and revived a single time before they go into police custody, as the name suggests. One Down was replaced, with Death Sentence taking its place. |
| 101 | * DoNotDoThisCoolThing: Cooking meth. [[spoiler:The recipe used is actually for salt water, because the devs knew players at home would try making it themselves. The chemicals used are still highly corrosive, so Overkill still discourages people from actually trying it.]] |
| 102 | * DracoInLeatherPants: ''Everyone'' gets this treatment in a certain part of the fanart. Also, the PAYDAY Gang is usually portrayed as [[ButtMonkey unlucky robbers who always screw up]] during their heists. Even the [[https://56.media.tumblr.com/13ebe984d3b7321fbdab626a7219bfdf/tumblr_inline_o3i4p0HAuJ1qgcw83_540.png notorious]] [[http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/422566032108096856/E0D37E98386237021B25244E4166A9E0FEB55D43/ Cloaker]] and the [[http://static1.fjcdn.com/comments/Dozers+take+breaks+too+_9ed966ac766b1633c19130e5c7dfb601.png Bulldozer]] fall into this as well! |
| 103 | * EnsembleDarkhorse: |
| 104 | ** Old/British Hoxton from the original ''PAYDAY'', who had some popularity in his debut. Once ''PAYDAY 2'' was made and revealed that the new Hoxton character (now Houston) was now a new American character, fans cried foul and immediately created a petition to reinstate the old Hoxton character. Overkill eventually responded by releasing a Christmas soundtrack that had British Hoxton singing the lyrics (while also noting about the petition made for him) and also hinted that he may return if he [[spoiler:can break out of prison]]. The soundtrack won British Hoxton fans over quickly. |
| 105 | ** Of course the Cloaker is one of [[TheScrappy most hated characters in the series]], but he does have some love by a certain part of the fanbase. |
| 106 | ** A trailer showcasing a new contractor for the crew reveals he wants Old Hoxton released (arrested under the alias Jim Hoxworth) as much as the crew does and he has plans for the crew to stage a prison breakout. |
| 107 | ** Bobblehead Bob the Civilian from the Big Bank trailer gained some popularity, due to him reviving Dallas when he got shot by the SWAT units and Dallas [[PetTheDog giving Bob some money as a token of thanks]]. There's even an achievement for leading Bob to the vault. Bob's bobblehead Bulldozers make another appearance in the Hotline Miami trailer in marked shipping boxes, showing that he was finally able to start producing his product. He then makes another cameo in the Hoxton Breakout trailer, showing that he survived the fall he took at the Benevolent Bank, though still recovering. Bob made a full recovery and has become so successful that he's in charge of the [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-Af3Zvnp6s PAYDAY merchandise products]]. When the new Safehouse was introduced in 2016, upgrading Jimmy's Bar unlocks him as a barkeeper. |
| 108 | ** [[AwesomeAussie Sydney]] is pretty much like this, as some of the commmunity claim that she looks much more appealing than Clover and Bonnie. The fact she dominates most fan art helps too. |
| 109 | ** Locke. It's pretty easy to forget that in the beginning, he was introduced as a relatively minor villainous contractor who was clearly being set up to turn on the gang in the future. His fun AmoralAfrikaner personality and voice work quickly caused fans to latch on to him, and it created a BreakoutCharacter who played a major role in the game's story to the extent where he pretty much replaces Bain as the crew's MissionControl in most later heists, and gets the bulk of new dialogue in the post-2018 content. The fact that he isn't considered a ReplacementScrappy in spite of being Bain's replacement is no easy feat, and proves how much of a fan favorite he was. |
| 110 | * FanNickname: |
| 111 | ** To avoid confusion between both Hoxtons, a number of players had taken to calling Payday 2's Hoxton "Houston", as not only does it suggest a link between him and his brother Dallas, but it also sounds fairly similar. This was then made into New Hoxton's actual codename, since Bain thought the same thing, while letting Old Hoxton keep his codename. |
| 112 | --->'''Old Hoxton:''' You call yourself Hoxton, right? More like Houston... because you've got a fucking problem! |
| 113 | ** "Goldfish" for Bain, since he seems to have the attention span of one, judging from his frequent radio chatter. |
| 114 | ** "Walking Cop Alarms" for civilians. |
| 115 | ** "Minikits", "Candy" or "Cupcakes" for First Aid Kits, ''not'' Doctor Bags. |
| 116 | * FandomHeresy: So much as suggest that either stealth or loud is better in any way and expect trouble. If skeptical, feel free to join a stealth heist lobby in full armor (or vice versa) and count how long it takes for you to be kicked -- chances are you'll be assumed as the "wrong" loadout and booted [[WhyFandomCantHaveNiceThings for not changing equipment before the actual equipment selection screen]]. |
| 117 | ** Saying you don't care about Old Hoxton is a surefire way to get yourself branded as someone who isn't a true fan or someone that only jumped on the game after it got popular. |
| 118 | *** Likewise, preferring New Hoxton before the Old Hoxton Breakout heist was added was practically outlawed. |
| 119 | ** Just discussions about the DLC packs in general or Overkill's practices in the game's development is a surefire way to get people angry with each other. Saying you think the DLC prices are fair, reminding people that all DLC is voluntary yet supports Overkill (i.e. people don't need to buy the $5 weapon packs), or even suggesting Overkill hasn't done anything wrong in any way will get at least a dozen people calling you a white knight or some other variant. |
| 120 | |
| 121 | * SugarWiki/FunnyMoments: Yeah, they rob banks, kill cops, and cause chaos, [[Funny/PAYDAY2 but who can say they can't have a few laughs?]] |
| 122 | * GameplayDerailment: The Rats heist where, on the first day, you are supposed to brew meth in order to trade it for intel on day 2 plus extra money if you bring more. If you botch the cooking, the lab explodes. After Overkill tweaked the game to have multi-day heists give more experience points, people botched the meth cooking on purpose in order to speedrun the Rats heist and get a lot of experience points in a short amount of time. |
| 123 | ** Somewhat fixed in the Death Wish update where the van only arrives several minutes after you blow up the lab or cook up 3 bags of meth, though people still opt to blow up the lab anyway. Completely averted for playing Rats on Death Wish, since blowing up the lab engulfs ''the entire map'' in flames, making the heist an instant failure. For non-Death Wish difficulties, it's still much faster to simply blow up the lab, but you lose your best defensive position for the ensuing wait. |
| 124 | *** Fixed further with patch 35 that revamped EXP rewards across the board by making most heists give as much EXP as Rats. |
| 125 | *** And even more diluted when it turned out Hoxton Breakout yields even more EXP! |
| 126 | ** Election Day has one for those who want to avoid the warehouse intentionally; simply tag the wrong truck (one of the trucks with duplicate names), cover one's tracks with an ECM rush, and it's a straight road to the bank level. |
| 127 | ** An inversion of Rats occurs in the Hotline Miami DLC, where cooking meth gets you a straight $1.35m per bag on Overkill, with achievements for cooking six bags in one run. It's also easier to tell the order: [[spoiler:the order is written on a whiteboard in the same room instead of Bain feeding it to you, sometimes outright lying]], averting the ScrappyMechanic in Rats. Cue people running around for 20 minutes looking [[LastLousyPoint for that last bag of caustic soda.]] |
| 128 | * GoddamnBats: Civilians. Most players disregard the custody penalty and cash fee just to prevent them from alerting others or calling the police. |
| 129 | * GoodBadBugs: |
| 130 | ** One glitch involving reviving downed players lets you pick up a friend ''through a wall'' if they are close enough to you. The developers decided to [[ThrowItIn keep it for the sequel]], though they were later forced to patch out after realizing the same code let players grab objective bags through walls. |
| 131 | *** Amusingly, shows up in the Hoxton Breakout trailer when Old Hoxton expects the rescue to happen with slightly different timing. |
| 132 | ** The beta had a pro job (rare heists) sometimes pop up in the contract list, though the game would crash if the player tried to access it. This was due to a glitch, as the pro job wasn't supposed to appear in the beta. |
| 133 | *** The beta also had objective triggers in certain heists appearing when they weren't supposed to, such as a safe appearing inside a wall in Jewelry Store and burning money with cameras in Bank Heist. WildMassGuessing ensued and many people speculated that they found secrets in the game, but they were quickly {{jossed}} after WordOfGod stated that the events were supposed to be objective triggers for different heists in the same map and they glitched out. |
| 134 | ** One can spend as much spendable money as possible on spare weapons before upgrading to Infamy status (as well as giving up every skill for even more spendable money), and then after upgrading, sell said weapons. An easy way to not be broke upon becoming infamous. |
| 135 | ** The pointer used to detect a player, dead bodies, or hostages is apparently focused on the head of the model. If the character model's head clips into an object or level geometry, civilians and cops will completely ignore it since they can't see it. Can be quite hilarious to have a dead body lying next to a wall with its head inside the wall as people just walk right by it. |
| 136 | ** The Sniper Pack update added ziplines to Payday, and they came in two forms: A zipline for the heisters to use and a bag zipline, the first of which appeared on Framing Frame day 3. This resulted in players being permitted to secure gold bags if the heist goes loud after opening the vault. However, if the heist goes loud and ''then'' a bag of gold is secured, the heist mission logic gets messed up and permits you to constantly begin the hacking sequence even if the power boxes were hit by the cops and haven't been reset (which is normally required). The only downside is that Bain '''will not shut up'''. |
| 137 | ** The final Firestarter mission features a glitch that can result in one or more players clipping into the vault, letting them begin to work on burning the cash without any police interference. Combined with the aforementioned wall interaction glitch, the clippers can actually set the drill up to get out from inside, too! |
| 138 | ** Usable items can be duplicated when picked up by players at the same time. Most often done with thermal paste and keycards (particularly on Shadow Raid and Hoxton Breakout), but can be done with crowbars too. Not very game-breaking as having more of these items than intended isn't that much of a bonus (and in some cases, has no benefit whatsoever). |
| 139 | ** There's a bug involving drills that can cause guards to freeze in place. Whenever a non-silent drill is placed, a randomly chosen guard will come to investigate. However, if the guard's pathfinding AI can't reach the drill, the guard will instead permanently freeze in place. This particular bug is often used in the Big Bank and Train Heist in particular, due to the ease of blocking the guards' movements in those maps. |
| 140 | ** Bots will frequently engage a SWAT Van turret if they can see it, but obviously cannot actually do anything since their weapons are inadequate (and that's assuming the turret doesn't stunlock them in their staggering animations). This causes them to stand in place and get shot to death. However, because bots have a lot more health (several times) than a human player, they can reasonably tank the SWAT turret for a while, maybe even cause it to run out of ammo. If you also have Inspire, you can continuously revive the Bot to effectively take the turret out of the picture, since bots can't go into custody due to being downed too many times. |
| 141 | ** The amount of cops that spawn are scaled to the amount of players in the game. Until the Henchmen AI update in 2017, friendly bots did not count as players. Cue [[spoiler:Tabula Rasa being completed alone with bots]]. |
| 142 | ** Crimefest 2015 added the Lion Bipod attachment for machine guns, allowing players to deploy their guns for perfect stability in return for being unable to move and having a limited firing arc. Normally, the player is forced to un-deploy the gun in question when reloading - but for a long while, it was possible to ''re''-deploy the bipod ''during'' the actual reloading animation, which would cause the character model's hands to shift back to their normal positions (firing hand on the grip, off hand over the stock) while the top cover and ammo belt moved to complete the animation entirely on their own. Alas, this was eventually removed in an effort to combat a similar glitch that allowed one to deploy the bipod while switching from a machine gun to your other weapon, which would [[GameBreakingBug crash the game]]. |
| 143 | * HarsherInHindsight: At the end of Rats, Hector suggests that the crew visit Colombia sometime. [[spoiler:In Hoxton Revenge, Hector is the traitor and is put down. The trip will never be a reality (unless the gang decide to go after Hector's organization as penance for Hector's actions), and considering he was working against the team the entire time, it was never going to be.]] |
| 144 | ** One of [[spoiler:Hector's post-mission messages "Thank you for being forthright."]] becomes much, ''much'' darker when you realize that [[spoiler:almost everything he said in the time the crew knew him was a lie.]] |
| 145 | ** The mission name for [[spoiler:Rats and Watchdogs]] becomes a whole lot darker with the knowledge that [[spoiler:the latter was a setup, and that Hector was a rat for the entire game up until his death.]] |
| 146 | ** Part of Wolf's biography involves him previously being a successful business-man, until the economy left him with one client, who had cold feet and refused to pay for his efforts, driving him out of business. Bear in mind that Wolf's character is based off of Ulf Andersson, the CEO of Overkill, this is similar to how its predecessor GRIN eventually closed: Creator/SquareEnix commissioned GRIN for a Franchise/FinalFantasy spin-off, only for them to back out and refuse to compensate GRIN for any of their efforts. |
| 147 | ** From a meta standpoint, the Alesso heist became a fair bit less enjoyable following the Manchester Arena bombing in May 2017. |
| 148 | ** In the trailer for the Search for Kento event, Jiro states that he hopes that Kento will be able to forgive him. [[spoiler:[[BetrayalByOffspring Then we learn Kento is part of Murkywater]]. Suffice to say, there was never a chance of forgiveness to begin with. And ''then'' Bain kills him.]] |
| 149 | ** Only a few weeks after Payday 2's story ended, Starbreeze (the company who owns Overkill and published the game) was raided by police as part of an investigation into insider trading on the part of at least one employee. LifeImitatesArt, much? |
| 150 | ** Election Day, where you rig an election on behalf of a Republican politician, may just be a bit uncomfortable after the allegations by Donald Trump of electoral fraud in the 2020 Presidential Election and the capitol riots. |
| 151 | * HilariousInHindsight: |
| 152 | ** People hated the original incarnation of Crime.net where they couldn't choose what level they wanted to play. The system eventually got updated where players could buy levels if they really wanted to play them, which caused people to farm the Rats heist to easily gain experience points and level up quickly. The result of all the farming caused other people to demand that something should be done about the heist to prevent farming. The hilarity comes from the original Crime.net system being created to counter farming in the first place. |
| 153 | ** After fixing a jammed drill, Houston may sometimes say "We need a bigger drill!" The Big Bank heist upped the ante of drilling into vaults by introducing an industrial drill (nicknamed The Beast) so large that you have to carry it in three separate bags. The Golden Grin heist introduces an even ''larger'' drill that the developers called the "Mother of the Beast" in previews and the "Big Fucking Drill" once it was released... and even they have a chance to break down! |
| 154 | ** The "Framing Frame" job involves the crew trying to ruin the reputation of a corrupt Democrat. If the crew can't break into his vault, then Plan B is to hack into his server and release details of his corrupt dealings to the public, where it's revealed that one of his crimes was gun trafficking. In 2014, Democrat Senator (and anti-video game activist) Leland Yee was arrested for gun trafficking and was sentenced to 5 years in prison. |
| 155 | ** The "Hoxton Revenge" job shows that the FBI believe Vlad to be an honest citizen. The next heist released, Meltdown, has the gang [[spoiler:steal ''nuclear warheads'' for Vlad.]] |
| 156 | ** One of the lines from the SWAT units is "[[MemeticMutation This is a colossal goat fuck!]]" Cut ahead to a few years later and the Goat Simulator Heist is released. Colossal goat fuck indeed. |
| 157 | ** Sokol, a professional hockey player turned heister, was introduced (and played an important role) with the Golden Grin Casino, set in Las Vegas. Just over a year after that DLC's release, the National Hockey League announced a new expansion team, playing out of Las Vegas, the first time the league had expanded in sixteen years. |
| 158 | * ItsEasySoItSucks: Everyone complained about the overall difficulty in ''PAYDAY 2'' being lowered after people originally complained that the game was too difficult. While the game isn't brutally difficult as the first game was, it's nowhere near a cakewalk unless your whole team is very skilled. Likewise, the fact that the levels and other systems in the sequel are significantly different in setup makes a direct comparison hard. |
| 159 | * ItsPopularNowItSucks: ''PAYDAY 2'' was a massive success, which caused many veteran players of the first game to declare the sequel horrible after believing the success brought in clueless newbies who had no idea how the game is supposed to be played. |
| 160 | * LowTierLetdown: |
| 161 | ** The Flak Jacket is often considered the worst armor to use in the game, because it neither provides any dodge bonuses (the Ballistic Vests can provide a bit of dodge with the Crook deck, even the heaviest one), provides only some armor (compared to more armor from the Combined Tactical Vests), and with Die Hard aced the Heavy Ballistic Vest protects you just as well as the Flak Jacket but with more movement speed. Anyone who uses the Flak Jacket may get themselves called a noob by peers due to this. |
| 162 | ** The same applies to the Hitman deck, which has the dubious distinction of being the only deck with a significant ''penalty''. Especially now that dual-wielding pistols no longer requires the Hitman deck or a specific skill, ''nobody'' ever uses it anymore. |
| 163 | ** Hardly anyone invested points in the Technician Tree, since it doesn't contribute to supporting supplies (like the Mastermind's Doctor Bag, Enforcer's Ammo Bag, or Fugitive's First Aid Kit), nor does it have many benefits over what the Fugitive and Ghost tree provide in stealth. It doesn't help that the Sentry Gun is another tier-induced scrappy. That said, it was RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap with the addition of the "Jack of All Trades" skill, which normally lets you place and interact with deployables twice as fast as normal (which especially stacks well with the Mastermind's boosts to deployment speed for first-aid kits and doctor bags), and when aced allows you to carry a ''secondary'' deployable, with half as many instances as you'd get if it were a primary one (e.g. only one body bag case even if you have the skill to carry two). |
| 164 | ** ''No one'' uses the Armor Bag. As it uses up the equipment slot usually reserved for supply bags or an ECM jammer, the explanation is obvious. Even with the above "Jack of All Trades" skill, nobody uses it when they can just as well carry around a single extra ammo bag or ECM. |
| 165 | ** And, finally, melee. Out of over a hundred different weapons and counting with ''every'' update, only five are even barely useful without significant skill investment; the four status effect weapons, which either tase or poison on hit, and the ice pick, which has top stats in every respect except charge time. Even with skills, some of which are actively detrimental, there are still a few dozen or so knives, five machetes, three hammers, and a variety of gimmick weapons ranging from a chainsaw to a medieval buckler to an ''improvised Aamerican flag spear'' that all have no special functions or even uniqueness to them beyond cosmetic differences, and were all pretty much a waste of time to use until a couple perk decks got an unexpectedly insane multiplier to melee damage. |
| 166 | * MagnificentBastard: |
| 167 | ** [[VillainWithGoodPublicity John Henry Simmons]], known on CRIME.NET as "[[CorruptPolitician The Elephant]]", is an ambitious politician aiming to become Senate and willing to pull plenty of strings to do so. Hiring the titular gang, he has them do a number of heists to increase his good publicity, with objectives ranging from rigging ballots to framing rivals, himself aiding by warning the gang of police assets ahead of time. Consistently giving them hefty rewards for their heists, he uses his power to assist the gang if needed, being responsible for Hoxton being transported to a less secure prison so that the gang can bust him out. Being exposed by the same AncientConspiracy he was involved with, he uses his various connections to bail himself out, promptly using his knowledge of the conspiracy to have the gang steal an ancient artifact and rescue Bain from them. Using the publicity from the failed exposure, he becomes a figurehead for anti corruption, [[KarmaHoudini thus gaining more power than he had before and ending the game on his own terms]]. |
| 168 | ** [[MorallyAmbiguousDoctorate Dr. Helmann]], aka "[[DepravedDentist the Dentist]]", is the mysterious leader of The Kataku masquerading as a simple dentist. Contacting the Payday gang via replacing Dallas's dentist, he reveals that he has the connections to help free imprisoned member Hoxton, having them do some heists for him in exchange for his assistance. The heists showing his planning skills, he uses his various connections to make the job easier. Eventually betraying the gang, he supplies Commissioner Garret with Bain's location, promising to supply dirt on politician the Elephant in exchange for Bain for themselves, framing Locke for Helmann's betrayal. Even after the gang recover and find Bain's holding location, The Dentist reveals to Murkywater that they're sneaking into Hell's Island, alerting the guards to their presence. He also had Bain infected with a virus that'll slowly kill him, which indeed does in the Bad Ending. In the True Ending, after the gang discover a secret device that's implied to have reincarnated Helmann numerous times, he confronts them himself, holding Bain and Locke at gunpoint, with Helmann's death [[LoadBearingBoss triggering the cave to collapse on itself]], nearly killing the gang. |
| 169 | ** [[AmoralAfrikaner Vernon Locke]] is the Murkywater cyber task force leader who hacks into CRIME.NET and threatens to destroy it if the Payday gang doesn't work with him. Bain accepts the offer and Locke helps him plan out their first two heists together. Locke later fakes betrayal to keep Murkywater's trust however later reveals his [[UndyingLoyalty loyalty]] to the gang by coming back to help them find Bain after he has been captured. Locke sends the gang to various locations to retrieve useful items for Bain's escape, successfully organizing his rescue from Hell's Island, a maximum security Murkywater prison. After finding out that Bain has a virus, he helps Bain plan the most ambitious heist yet on the White House, successfully getting the gang twenty four presidential pardons and either mourning Bain's death in the Bad Ending or managing to have Bain reincarnated in the True Ending before winding down and celebrating with the gang. Despite initially seeming antagonistic towards the gang, he ultimately proves himself to be a worthy successor to Bain as the Payday gang's main contractor. |
| 170 | ** [[Film/HardcoreHenry Jimmy]] is as charismatic and clever as ever. After the Payday gang get hired by Akan, Jimmy manages to kidnap some members in order to negotiate a deal for them to work for him, eventually winning them over after some complications he manages to overcome. Jimmy then organizes two separate heists, first having the gang secretly infiltrate a Murkywater base for EMP bomb parts, then dropping the bomb onto Akan's base so that the gang can raid it, with Jimmy himself supplying the gang with what they need. Eventually, through his Cokehead clone, he joins the gang proper, being able to perform the same tasks as the others while being willing to put himself in harm's way to benefit the gang. [[SparedByTheAdaptation Implied to have survived in this version]], Jimmy proves to be a loyal member of the gang. |
| 171 | ** ''The Web Series'': [[DiabolicalMastermind Bain]] is once again the host of Crime.Net, and is as brilliant, [[AdaptationalVillainy if more ruthless]], as ever. Organizing a successful heist on the First World Bank, he then pulls strings to deal with the resulting publicity from it, hiring assassins and contracts to kill anyone who could threaten his operation. When one cop tries to bust Crime.Net, he has a mole infiltrate the police department to keep her in check, discovering that she has a GPS tracker for Vlad and warning him of her in advance, resulting in him threatening her into dropping her investigation. Having the right connections for the job, Bain ends the series victorious, [[KarmaHoudini having gotten away with his crimes and seeking to continue them]]. |
| 172 | * MemeticBadass: In the Big Bank level, almost every time a player climbs up the crane to drop the Beast parts, there will be a regular policeman on the street taking ridiculously-accurate revolver potshots at the player. Many players joke that this one policeman is actually Franchise/RoboCop. |
| 173 | * MemeticLoser: The PAYDAY Gang. |
| 174 | ** Taken up to eleven with Dallas regarding the "I NEED A MEDIC BAAAG!" meme, though. |
| 175 | * MemeticMolester/[[MemeticPsychopath Psychopath]]: The Cloaker. |
| 176 | * MemeticMutation: [[Memes/PAYDAY2 Tons of them.]] |
| 177 | * SugarWiki/MostWonderfulSound: Whenever one of your teammate's characters says something along the lines of "The police are retreating!", signifying that the police assault is about to end, giving you some breather room to complete objectives and/or patch yourself up. |
| 178 | ** The quiet, easy-to-miss whooshing noise that indicates that your armor has regenerated and that you can get back in the fight. |
| 179 | ** The fanfare and cheering that indicates you've unlocked a Trophy / completed a Side Job, though the effect gets lessened somewhat when [[GoodBadBugs it triggers for no discernable reason]] after some random kill or another. |
| 180 | ** The metallic clank that plays when you acquire a safe from a Payday. |
| 181 | [[/folder]] |
| 182 | |
| 183 | [[folder:N-Z]] |
| 184 | * NeverLiveItDown: |
| 185 | ** Flashbang grenades are a ScrappyMechanic for many players with the major complaint being they happen too frequently and can appear out of thin air at random. Bo Andersson, the CEO of Starbreeze (who owns Overkill), gave the infamous "Your opinion, my choice" rebuttal against the complaints. Just mentioning flashbangs will have the community bring up the quote as snark towards Bo. |
| 186 | ** Crimefest 2015 was a major PR disaster for Overkill due to them implementing microtransactions for weapon skins that may sometimes have stat boosts on them, even though the devs said they wouldn't add microtransactions. While Overkill did basically fudge up their promise and have tried to make things right since then (primarily by removing the drills [i.e. keys] and making safes added after Update #100 free to open), you'd be led to believe Overkill are nothing but greedy con men looking for more ways to get more money according to what the community says about them. The Crimefest event became so tarnished that, when the annual event came around the following year, they dropped the Crimefest name entirely, instead naming the event around one of the major features of that event (although the Fall 2017 event would later reuse the Crimefest name). |
| 187 | * PlayerPreferredPattern: |
| 188 | ** For stealth in general: |
| 189 | *** If that portion is botched, players simply restart rather than deal with the mission loud likely because they aren't equipped for it, as stealth-focused weapons more often than not sacrifice power and accuracy for silence and concealability. Overkill has attempted to avert this somewhat with the addition of the Armor Case drop, which allows a single player to go from two-piece suit to any armor they decide to pack along... but it means that the heister won't have any other, much more valuable drops, like a doctor bag or ammo bag, which means it doesn't see much use. |
| 190 | *** In the 3rd day of Framing Frame, nearly everyone insists on stealthing the level so they can grab the gold and escape with little resistance, as getting spotted and having to go to Plan B is long, loud, dangerous, and doesn't pay out nearly as much. |
| 191 | *** Election Day during the warehouse computer hacking job also has a similar problem where people will demand a restart if stealth fails due to hacking taking longer in a loud heist and an extra security hacking job you're forced to do before you can escape, as well as the loss of bonus gold loot if the alarm is raised. |
| 192 | *** In general, expect every stealthable heist on Death Sentance to be a stealth run, ''especially'' (and rather counter-intuitively) if the "One Down" modifier is enabled. (there are, of course exceptions; some people really at that masochistic). Part of this can be explained in that Death Sentance stealth missions are not that different from beyond Overkill difficulty; the only changes are the Titan-ization of the cameras and safes to make them indestructible and only drillable, respectively (and the former is ''outright beneficial''). Loud missions over Mayhem difficulty are accompanied by swarms of bullet-sponge [=GenSec=] SWAT units, swarms of DemonicSpider level enemies, and require intimate knowledge of the map as well as very specific setups and preparation. There are some stealth missions, such as Big Bank, GO Bank and Election Day that are even [[HarderThanHard worse than that]], however. |
| 193 | ** Every class tree has several abilities that everyone nearly goes for: |
| 194 | *** Mastermind: Dominator (essential to have if you want to make hostages when there is no civilians around, so much so that the skill rebalance made it a default part of the game), Combat Doctor (lets you carry 2 doctor bags and acing it lets you use them 4 times each), and Inspire (shout at people to boost their speed and acing the skill lets you yell at downed players to revive them). Less prominent examples are Endurance (increases movement stamina) and Forced Friendship (more cable ties). |
| 195 | *** Enforcer: Transporter (move faster when carrying bags and acing it lets you throw bags farther), Stun Resistance (lowers the effects of Flashbangs, later became an aced version of Resilience), Die Hard (use main weapon while in bleedout; this too was made a default part of the game), Extra Lead (carry 2 ammo bags, with higher capacity when Aced), Portable Saw (lets you use the saw as a secondary, with aced giving you an extra sawblade and less wear when sawing), Iron Man (increases armor value by %30 and acing it unlocks the top tier body armor), and Fully Loaded (increases total ammo capacity). Less prominent examples are Underdog (increases damage output and decreases damage taken against multiple enemies) and Shotgun CQB (faster shotgun reloads). |
| 196 | *** Technician: Hardware Expert (fix the drill faster and acing it gives the drill a chance to restart itself), Drill Sawgeant (drill takes less time to finish and acing it makes it even faster), Silent Drilling (decreases noise from drilling; its effects were later merged with Hardware Expert in Update #100), Shaped Charge (acing it lets you convert your trip mines to C4 to blow up doors and safes[[note]]Update #100 made this an inherent part of the game, where taking trip mines also gives you a separate cache of C4; now the skill is More Firepower, which gives you more tripmines and C4[[/note]]), and Bulletproof (greatly increases the durability of your armor, and if aced makes your whole team's armor regenerate faster). |
| 197 | *** Ghost: Fast Hands (lets you pick up bags faster and acing it boosts it further), Chameleon (lets you mark guards and cameras in casing mode and reduces your visibility in casing mode), Sprinter (decreases Stamina recharge time and increases Stamina recharge rate, as well as sprinting movement and dodge rate), Shinobi (increases general movement speed and enables near-silent kills[; again, made a default feature), and Cleaner (gives a damage bonus to special mooks, buy the body bag asset, and acing the skill lets you carry 3 body bags[[note]]Update #100 moved the 2 body bags to the basic version, while the damage bonus to special mooks was moved to basic High Value Target (while also affecting normal enemies) and the body bag asset was moved to Aced Sixth Sense[[/note]]), and for dedicated Ghosts, ECM Specialist (lets you carry a second ECM, Acing it makes the ECM jam not only cameras and calls, but also delay pager responses from downed guards), ECM Overdrive (increases ECM duration, and Acing it lets you use an ECM to open doors that normally require a keycard), and Lockpick Expert (increases lockpicking speed, and when Aced lets you pick the locks on normal safes, which can save a lot of time, and be done completely silent, unlike C4)[[note]]Lockpick Expert was merged with the Camera Loop skill to make Nimble, and its aced version adds the faster lockpicking including on safes[[/note]]. |
| 198 | *** Fugitive: Thick Skin Aced (increases ballistic vests armor by 20, later moved to the aced version of the Enforcer's Die Hard as of Update #100), Run and Gun (movement speed increased, later became the basic version of the Ghost's Parkour), Sixth Sense (staying still highlights civilians as well as guards, and acing it allows one to pick up items in casing mode), Duck and Cover (increased dodge when crouching), and Swan Song (allows a player to fight back shortly before being downed, with aced granting more time and BottomlessMagazines during its effect). Low Blow (gives a chance to do headshot damage on body shots based on concealment) and Sneaky Bastard (gives dodge based on concealment) are also exceptionally popular and are considered vital for Dodge-oriented builds. |
| 199 | *** Regardless of build or preference, nearly every veteran player will have Enforcer's Transporter Aced (throw bags further and slightly reducing the movement penalty) and Ghost's Fast Hands Aced (pack up and grab bags 75% faster in total) due to the sheer number of missions that involve moving bags. Fast Hands' Aced ability was even made an integral game mechanic with Update #100's skill overhaul. |
| 200 | * PortingDisaster: The game has had a rather bad history with consoles. |
| 201 | ** The Xbox 360 and [=PlayStation=] 3 ports. Besides a few major, free updates, the console versions seriously trailed behind in a way that parallels the ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' console fiasco.[[note]][=TF2=] on PC is ''still'' being updated more than a decade after it first came out. The most recent [=TF2=] console update was for the Xbox 360 in '''2009''', and that was a full year after its '''three''' updates in 2008.[[/note]] 360 users were told it was an issue of Microsoft's ExecutiveMeddling regarding patches and how big they can be, as seen with [=TF2=]'s frequent-yet-sizeable updates; [=PS3=] users were told they would be up to date come early 2014, which turned into [[ShrugOfGod "when it's ready"]]. |
| 202 | ** Made worse following developments in mid-2014: [=PS3=] users - and ''only'' [=PS3=] users - received the "Armored Transport" DLC '''six months''' later than promised, making them up-to-date with the PC port circa November 2013. |
| 203 | ** The shit officially hit the fan after Overkill announced that the Gage Weapon packs and Armored Transport would be the end of the DLC for [=PS3=] and 360 players in favor of shifting console focus onto the [=PS4=] and Xbox One's [[UpdatedRerelease "Crime Wave" version]]. While many last-gen gamers began to suspect this due to the constant delays and lack of updates, many who were waiting since the beginning have no end of contempt and rage for Overkill at their respective systems getting the shaft. The fact that the DLC heists are widely considered to be some of the best in the series has only rubbed more salt into an already giant wound. |
| 204 | ** Things didn't get much better on next-gen consoles even with Sony and Microsoft easing up on patch requirements. The "Crimewave Edition" on [=PS4=] and Xbox One, at one point, went over '''400 days''' without a patch, and when they finally got updated, it was only for the content released up to 2015... which, at the time of release, still put the console versions more than six months behind the PC version. |
| 205 | ** Roughly a week before the Switch port was released in February 2018, [[https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoSwitch/comments/7yv8gr/please_do_not_buy_payday_2_for_switch_its_a/ it was revealed that the port was wildly out of date]], '''nearly two years behind the PC version at release''' (the Switch port was made around the time of the "Most Wanted" edition, which had content up to the PC's Update #100 in June 2016, and it apparently never got updated with new content at any point between then and its release). To add insult to injury, this meant that the Switch port was even further behind the most recent [=PS4=] and Xbox One versions at the time of its release (the "Master Plan Edition"), which was itself several months out of date by that point (containing all of the updates up to May 2017, nine months behind the PC content), and only getting a single update the first day after release. On top of that, the Switch version is missing a fair amount of content that the PC version had even ''before'' Update 100. For one, not only were achievements nixed, but side jobs as well, meaning all weapon modifications must now be obtained through card drops (aside from Mod Courier Pack mods). And if that wasn't bad enough, it runs horribly, with the game constantly dipping below 30fps, especially on more intensive heists like Golden Grin or Alesso. But hey, at least you got exclusive access to Joy... well, for about six months. OVERKILL [[http://www.overkillsoftware.com/winds-of-change-consoles-edition/ later admitted]] that a lot of this was down to the Switch port being a third-party affair, and that further updates for it are incredibly unlikely as a result. |
| 206 | * ReplacementScrappy: The entire crew, except for Wolf, were initially intended to be replaced by new characters using the same names and backgrounds as the previous characters in the first game. Fans ''loathed'' the replacement characters, though the original Dallas was able to return for his role. Houston, who was named Hoxton at first, got the worst of it all as he is hated by fans for not being British like the previous Hoxton nor having the same wit and charm. Averted for the new Chains, where most fans have come to prefer him over the original Chains. |
| 207 | ** Also invoked by British Hoxton himself in the Christmas soundtrack for ''PAYDAY 2'' where he is upset that another person has replaced him by stealing his name and mask. |
| 208 | * RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap: The Art Gallery was released during Crimefest as a standalone mission from Framing Frame. While the gameplay in Art Gallery was identical to Framing Frame's version (save for a heightened requirement in paintings), the exp and monetary payout was very poor. Since the experience revamp that relied on the number of bags retrieved, the mission's payout has increased significantly. |
| 209 | * RewatchBonus: After the release of Hoxton Revenge, it became apparent how many little hints there were that [[spoiler:Hector was working with the police the entire time during his missions. The entirety of Watchdogs was a setup to capture the PAYDAY gang, explaining how the FBI knew where to strike on both days; Hector learned about the FBI having info on the Mendoza cash stash because he was working with them, and while arranging the assassination of the Mendozas during Rats was against the FBI's orders, his intel came directly from the feds.]] |
| 210 | * RonTheDeathEater: While there probably haven't been many fanfics of Payday yet, some people suspect the Cloaker of being a child molester/rapist or at least an excessively RabidCop due to his [[DemonicSpider playstyle]], despite technically working for the police, and (ironically) [[AxCrazy being as bloodthirsty as the PAYDAY gang.]] [[http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/92724928158706474/89106512302D744EE829592639DF371CC95D37B5/ Here's an (thankfully censored but still NSFW) example.]] |
| 211 | ** A [[https://modworkshop.net/mydownloads.php?action=view_down&did=12752 modification]] inspired by ''VideoGame/WolfensteinTheNewOrder'' turns the PAYDAY Gang into the [[LaResistance Resistance]] while [[HeroAntagonist the cops]] [[AdaptationalVillainy got demonized into]] [[UsefulNotes/NaziGermany Nazis]], under the command of [[BigBad Wilhelm Strasse.]] This becomes a bit of HilariousInHindsight regarding the development of VideoGame/RAIDWorldWarII, which is just like PAYDAY 2 but involving stealing gold from the Nazis. |
| 212 | * TheScrappy: The pager operator. Many stealth runs get ruined because of people not being able to answer him in time, or having to answer him while something else that triggers the alarm goes on, such as another guard right behind the one you were just forced to kill who decides to just shoot the instant he pulls his gun. Not to mention he's an unlikeable character in general, being condescending and nosy (even if he's got a legitimate reason for the latter - it's his job). |
| 213 | ** Hillary or Jen at [=GenSec=] during the GO Bank or Big Bank job, for their tendency to call the phone and screw up a stealth run. |
| 214 | ** The civilians to a certain part of the fanbase, mostly [[TooDumbToLive due to running into the crossfire]] and getting themselves killed, as well as the female civilian's screaming. |
| 215 | ** While the Cloaker still has his defenders, some players admit that the [[PsychoElectro Taser]] is [[FromBadToWorse even more psychotic.]] Not only being slightly more durable than the Cloaker, but the Taser is also hated for [[GameBreakingBug having his stunning attack bugged]], [[TheComputerIsACheatingBastard giving him the advantage to stun players behind doors, walls and etc.]] After Hoxton's Housewarming Party updates, his spawnrate has been drastically increased in exchange for the Cloaker's lowered spawn rate. |
| 216 | ** Rust. Many people expect the badass senior biker portrayed by Creator/RonPerlman would be a natural fit, given he'd already played Clay in ''Series/SonsOfAnarchy''. Apparently not, as what they got was a grumpy old biker, who drops swears liberally to the point of sounding ''incredibly monotonous''. Not helping matters is that [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2u9mcun7KQ Rust has such a low vocal range]], it sounds like as if he's ''bored'' of heisting and wants to do literally anything else. What didn't help matters is that on his [[https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/72ucal/sup_muthafuckas_ron_perlman_here_dont_be_shy_ask/dnlha4x/?context=1 Reddit AMA]], Perlman more or less confirmed that he [[MoneyDearBoy only took up the role for a paycheck]]. |
| 217 | * SelfFanservice: The game has five total female characters; Clover, Bonnie, Sydney, Hila and Joy. Clover is flirty, Bonnie is a thug, Sydney does drop a fair few sex references, Hila... well, she exists, and Joy is peppy and a {{Keet}}. Out of all of them however, Clover has the second-most fanart of her, partially because she was the ''first'' female character, only being beaten out by Sydney. Stranger still, fan artists tend to flip-flop on keeping her [[ButterFace intentionally ugly mug]], or redesigning it with prettier features. Bonnie keeps her ButterFace, with Sydney, Hila and Joy averting this. |
| 218 | * ScrappyMechanic: Plenty of them: |
| 219 | ** The "custody penalty" that kicks in if you finish a heist in custody, where you lose a sizable chunk of the [=XP=] you could have earned. This is very punishing on heists that can give a lot of [=XP=] to begin with, since these obviously tend to be the harder jobs, and lead to a lot of dislike until Update 25.1 where, while you are still penalised, it's approximately 10% less [=XP=] than if you had not been in custody. |
| 220 | ** Stealth bonus [=XP=], where you get a booster that applies to your next job if you complete a heist in stealth. Many people tend to restart if stealth is botched just to get the bonus. |
| 221 | ** Equipping weapon mods to your guns costs money which has to be repaid every time the mod is added, even if it was previously attached and removed. This makes it tricky to experiment with different loadouts or to change pieces on a job-by-job basis (except by buying a second copy of the gun and modifying it for a different purpose, which gets ''even more'' expensive) until you get a significant amount of spending cash. Somewhat lessened with the Gage Courier Pack DLC, which requires you to collect packages in the levels to get the attachments, but they can be attached without cost once you have them, allowing you to swap one between several different weapons per heist if the need arises. |
| 222 | ** Civilian AI is just dodgy, to put it mildly. If it isn't bad enough that they can get brave and try to call the cops, but the wonky coding pf the civilian AI means they can ignore shouts to get down if they've started calling, requiring you to melee or shoot them for a good nagging and get a fine for killing them. There are even player mods that change the warning text to ''"Walking Cop Alarm Exterminated - Pay $X for Bain's Therapy"''. |
| 223 | ** Flashbangs. They make you deaf and blind you for a good several seconds. Flashbangs spawn out of thin air with very little warning and it's possible (though rare) to get blinded multiple times in a row. Looking away from the flashbang can reduce the duration of the effect. A dev went on to say that flashbangs only occur if SWAT are near you and if players are camping. The issue is that, as an anti-camping measure, there are some heists that '''force you to camp''' in order to survive (Rats, Cookoff, Panic Room, just to name a few), which means you get to enjoy going blind every few seconds for daring to play the heist how it's supposed to be played. Thankfully, several updates made dealing with them easier, by putting the stun resistance ability as the aced version of the Resilience skill, and making flashbangs an actual entity with an animation and delay before detonation, including adding audible beeps and visible flashing light, and making them destructible without setting them off, making for a considerably fairer experience. |
| 224 | ** Clients using player models, more specifically their heads as mentioned in GoodBadBugs above, for detection rather than the player camera/viewpoint like the host does. This can cause a lot of seemingly unfair scenarios where clients get spotted in places where the host is completely obscured due to their character model poking out of cover for the guard to spot. This is further compounded by the occasional desync the game occasionally suffers from time to time. |
| 225 | ** The driving physics is every heist that features vehicles are a scrappy mechanic for many. Not only is it an UnexpectedGameplayChange, the steering is stiff, and the physics are floaty, regardless of the vehicle, making it very easy to spin out, crash in an awkward way, or even flip the vehicle over (and the one exception to this -- golf carts -- have the inverse to these problems). Combine that with wonky physics, and keyboard and controller smashing by players ensues. |
| 226 | ** The game takes up almost 80GB of storage space, and it needs a few GB more to unpack any new archives the game downloads in any given update, meaning the game size goes to about 86GB until an update finishes, no matter how small the update is due to how many files an update may change. In fairness to Overkill here, they have attempted several attempts at alleviating this by changing how updates get handled, but nothing has helped. |
| 227 | * SpecialEffectFailure: |
| 228 | ** The AI and other characters can smoke a cigarette before the heist starts. Since all characters share this animation, gangsters in day 2 of "Rats" can be seen smoking cigarettes ''through their face rags''. |
| 229 | ** Like the first game, ever since the initial release in 2013 to the present day, the game ''lacks facial animations'', something that was standard even in ''Videogame/HalfLife2'', which came out 9 years before PAYDAY 2's initial release. The reason for this is likely due to time constraints. However, characters can be seen blinking and moving their mouth in the Big Bank trailer, something which was never implemented into the game. |
| 230 | ** Teammate bots may stand in the exact same position as each other when in casing mode. |
| 231 | ** Clover's hair goes all over the place when she moves around due to the way NVIDIA PhysX works (the technology used to have its hair effects), which is especially noticeable when you're sitting behind her in the Longfellow car. And if you're thinking the console or Linux ports are safe, then you'd be wrong as it has the opposite problem (those ports lack PhysX support, but because there's no checks in place, the hair goes crazy anyway). It's likely for these reasons that the other female heisters have [[NoFlowInCGI much shorter hair]]. |
| 232 | ** There is only one third-person reload animation (swapping detachable box magazines), and until a much later update the character didn't actually swap the magazine. They also still do the same motion even if their weapon doesn't use a box mag. There is also only one animation for holding long guns (right hand on the grip, left hand gripping the barrel) no matter what mods (like foregrips) are on the gun. As above, a later update fixed the part about magazines not detaching during reloads, but added the possibility of an extra magazine model getting stuck to a character's left hand and clipping through the gun while they hold it. Melee attacks also only use one animation regardless of whether the weapon is a knife, hammer, axe, or spear. |
| 233 | ** Due to possibly being rushed for release, the female guard/FBI agents in the ''Hoxton Breakout'' heist had ''male'' voices. |
| 234 | * ThatOneBoss: While there aren't many bosses outside the EliteMooks in the game, they still put up a hell of a fight. Any inexperienced group won't have a pleasant time. |
| 235 | ** The Commissar on higher difficulties, the FinalBoss in the Hotline Miami heist, packs a [[{{BFG}} light machine gun]], a weapon normally reserved for the Death Wish-exclusive Skulldozers. If he isn't eliminated quickly, he'll more than likely down the crew a few times. This is somewhat mitigated in that if you don't aggro him after the vault opens and simply hang back, the police will kill him for you. |
| 236 | ** The boss of Hoxton Revenge, [[spoiler:Hector]], doesn't pack as much of a punch due to only using an IZHMA shotgun like the black Bulldozer, but to make up for that, he has a lot of health on par with a regular Bulldozer except the massive headshot multiplier. That is, of course, if the crew decides to fight him in loud; if they deal with him in stealth, he goes down in a single hit from the weakest weapon. |
| 237 | ** Captain Winters is a more prevalent example. Upon his arrival, the assault turns endless, enemies become stronger (damage resistance up to 50%), and his team will ''never'' budge from their position. While explosives and sniper rifles make engaging him much easier, anyone who lacks any sort of DLC will find him nigh-unstoppable, and those with DLC can have significant issues even getting near him. His Phalanx units always rotate against the attacker, making outflanking them difficult, and they each boast 3000 health, comparable to a ''Bulldozer''. Some of the locations his team gets stationed are easily some of the worst imaginable; in Hoxton Breakout Day 2 and Big Bank, he stays at the front entrance, which tends to be choked tightly (making it much harder to outflank him), or out in a lot of sniper fire. Although in the former level, as outflanking him horizontally is more difficult, outflanking him ''[[DeathFromAbove vertically]]'' is much easier, due to the way the room is designed. |
| 238 | ** While not a "boss" in and of itself, there is one enemy that towers amongst all others in terms of sheer annoyance; the Minigun Dozer. These abominations can soak a lot of damage, have as much health as one, are laser accurate out to a surprisingly long range and in certain heists can spawn in places where their sluggish speed is no hinderance to them. Originally resticted to high-level Crime Sprees, Overkill thought it would be just swell to place them into the main difficulty levels, specifically Death Wish (where they spawn rarely) and Death Sentence (where they spawn ''constantly''). |
| 239 | * TaintedByThePreview: The public beta test caused a lot of people to write off the game as horribly broken, buggy, and lacking in content - never mind that was, well, ''a public beta test.'' |
| 240 | * TakeThatScrappy: New Hoxton/Houston/Dallas' younger brother wasn't well liked by the fan base due to being a ReplacementScrappy. Overkill took notice and made old Hoxton despise and loathe Houston in many ways during the Hoxton Breakout trailer. Once Hoxton and Houston finally meet, Hoxton demands to have his old mask back, insults Houston, tells Houston that [[StealthInsult he isn't totally useless in a gun fight]], and then busts Houston's chops further by showing that he had a mask prepared anyway, which causes Houston to call Hoxton a twat under his breath. |
| 241 | ** When calling a heister over, other heisters call them by nickname. When Old Hoxton calls Houston over, [[SirSwearsALot he uses a variety of colorful insults instead of the latter's nickname]]. |
| 242 | ** Hoxton also comments that in prison, he didn't have Bain yapping in his ear like a needy dog. |
| 243 | ** [[spoiler:Hector badmouths Bain when his panic room is being assaulted in Hoxton Revenge. Some players can't help but think that [[StrawmanHasAPoint he's got a point]]]]. |
| 244 | ** Jacket's introduction video, the Wild West, and Chivalry DLC have the Cloakers being the subject of TheWorfEffect. Meanwhile, in the Reservoir Dogs heist trailer, Wolf gets to recreate the torture scene from the movie (complete with him switching music tracks until he finds one that sounds similar to "Stuck In The Middle With You") with a Cloaker being the victim. |
| 245 | * TheyChangedItNowItSucks: |
| 246 | ** The web series teaser trailer for ''Payday 2'' generated complaints of Houston (formerly named Hoxton) not looking or sounding like he does in the actual game. Similar complaints were made for the rest of the crew. |
| 247 | *** More complaining ensued when it was confirmed that [[https://twitter.com/locust9/status/347669714346057730 most of the characters from the first game will have new voice actors based on the web series]], [[ReplacementScrappy something that the community heavily disliked]]. One of the developers couldn't go into detail on why they had to use a new set of voice actors other than "it's a long story". It was also confirmed that New Hoxton is a new character (Dallas' younger brother) using the old alias, while Old Hoxton was left behind after a job went bad and was arrested. While the fanbase had warmed up to the new Dallas and Chains a little bit, everyone ''hated'' New Hoxton[[note]]now Houston[[/note]] having an American accent instead of a British one. |
| 248 | *** Dallas later got his old voice-actor back, though he still has the model of the new version. |
| 249 | ** Nerfing the Cable Guy skill, which gives players 5 cable ties (5 hostages essentially) instead of the original 10 cable ties used during the beta. People then complained that stealthing was pointless without a mass amount of ties to use. Overkill listened and buffed the skill to include 6 ties instead, with a later update allowing you to occasionally get more ties from ammo boxes for a maximum of 9. |
| 250 | ** Patch 11 made the Bulldozer more durable and spawn more often than he should have, broke all armor's defensive values (even the Improved Combined Tactical Vest only provided as much protection as the two-piece suit), ''and'' made gangsters and blue SWAT deal triple damage, causing massive complaints from people saying the game is too hard. |
| 251 | *** Patch 12 fixed what patch 11 broke. The result was people who liked the broken difficulty complaining that the game is now too easy thanks to the "casuals" complaining. This eventually lead to the addition of the rare beat cop with a Bronco .44 revolver, who was as durable as other cops but dealt much more damage, in remembrance of the damage bug. |
| 252 | *** Similarly, a hotfix for patch 13 dialed back the amount of Shield units that spawned since they were spawning in groups of 6 or more at a time. Players complained about the fix, saying Overkill took away the only challenge the game had. |
| 253 | ** The Death Wish update changed how experience points are gained; instead of all heists giving a flat rate of EXP, you now gain less and less EXP if you play the same heist repeatedly. If you play a new heist after finishing the previous heist, including one with a contract boost, you gain extra EXP for playing a different heist. Naturally, everyone complained that they could no longer grind Rats for quick and easy EXP. |
| 254 | *** The same update also changed stealth mechanics by adding cameras that can't be destroyed and adding extra guards in certain heists, making complete stealth much more difficult. Many people hated the change not just because it changed stealth, but said changes applied to all difficulty levels. Bagging dead bodies was also changed to be capped at 2 bodies per player, making stealth much harder for many. Overkill responded by saying it wasn't necessary to bag every body, but plenty people have objected strongly. |
| 255 | *** Rats on Death Wish also got a big change regarding the cooking; not only do you have to wait for the van to show up before you can move the meth, but if you blow up the lab, the explosion covers ''the entire map'', effectively killing everyone. While the idea was made to stop people from speedrunning Rats for easy EXP grinding, many people hated the change because of it. |
| 256 | *** Patch 25 changed Smooth Talker into Spotter, which, when Aced, allows the user to buy the Spotter asset so they can have an NPC spot guards for them. The Smooth Talker skill itself became a default feature, but dominating a guard during stealth still sets off his pager, which must be answered. While people were glad that Smooth Talker would be free, they were ''not'' happy with the gigantic nerf in taking guards hostage in stealth. |
| 257 | ** After stealth bonuses were introduced, Overkill quickly removed the stealth bonus and the body bag asset from day 1 of Firestarter, insisting that the level is not supposed to be stealthed - now alerting the patrolling Mendozas instantly sets everyone else on alert.[[note]]Being able to move several heavy bags of weapons to the van without resistance puts the method into near GameBreaker territory.[[/note]] People who were able to stealth the heist in the past were visibly upset by the changes. |
| 258 | ** Previews of the sequel had generated complaints of the HUD looking ugly compared to the one in the first game. When it was announced that the sequel would also completely omit team AI in order to focus on the co-op experience, many people hated the idea of being forced to play with others and that single player mode will become a OneManArmy trope. The complaints quickly died down once Overkill addressed the complaints and changed things to settle the complaining. |
| 259 | ** When the Perk Decks were introduced armor dodge rates were all set to zero, if not negative (save for the suit). It was next to impossible to dodge with anything but the suit at the time. People weren't pleased to know that anything between the light vest and the CTV were now rendered obsolete. This was later averted when the Fugitive tree and Crook decks were introduced, making them viable once more. |
| 260 | ** After Update #103, many players were upset [[https://i.imgur.com/zusrtUX.jpg about the new heister models having a different look compared to the old ones]]. [[VideoGame/HotlineMiami Jacket]]'s face recieved a makeover to resemble how he would look if he was alive after the events of VideoGame/HotlineMiami (assuming ''Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number'' is non-canon), which some considered a massive downgrade. Even Sokol now looks slightly older compared to his previous appearance. |
| 261 | *** Some fans, however [[UglyCute actually LOVED his new face]], since he currently has a [[https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/102851052177025960/0FE390407C7FC027FFFDC23B0C6A6CD4406D3182/ strong resemblance]] to the late Music/DavidBowie. And they claimed that before the update, [[http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/938/305/b5d.jpg Jacket originally looked like]] UsefulNotes/VladimirPutin or the "feels bro" man. |
| 262 | ** Update #228 has Overkill claim to have "removed" cloud saving support on [=PC=] when playing the Windows and Linux (and Steam Deck) versions [[https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/218620?emclan=103582791433980119&emgid=3290465838274755717 with the developers stating that they wanted to "ensure stability of saves between OS's"]], which is an odd reason to give as the steam cloud functionality has worked fine since the port released in 2016, [[https://steamcommunity.com/app/218620/discussions/search/?q=save&gidforum=364039531219417817&include_deleted=1&p=1 the steam forums have very few complaints about such issues occurring out in the wild]], and the save files between the ports are identical in every way (which is ''unusual'' among native Linux ports; saves are usually incompatible because their files are different code-wise), so their reasoning comes off as flimsy, and appears to be an excuse to enforce port segregation. [[https://modworkshop.net/mod/39730 Manually moving saves is still possible]], now it's just made more convoluted for those who dual-boot or have a Steam Deck, as the Linux Port now uses Linux specific saves meant for Steam Deck backups, not the save used by Windows that it otherwise used to use. |
| 263 | ** Update 237. The main meat of the update was [=EOS=] integration, with the idea being simple (even agreeable) on the surface; matchmaking between the Epic Games Store and Steam versions, ala ''VideoGame/RocketLeague'', ''VideoGame/{{Paladins}}'' and ''VideoGame/FallGuys'' -- the game even went free on the former store on the 8th June, 2023 to promote this functionality. However, the system was over-designed, the matchmaking was (and remains) very buggy, the game has no proper offline functionality anymore, and the player has to make do with a friends list system that felt rushed together. The games' insistence on requiring friend codes to add people from outside of Steam (which is entirely unnecessary, as a feature of [=EOS=] allows games to merge friends lists, ''regardless of platform'') also did not go down well. Players naturally compared the backlash to Crimefest 2015, and the icing on the cake was that Linux support (a port that was ''already'' about to be locked out of the Crude Awakening heist due to issues Overkill had announced ahead of time) was ''completely'' dropped, which even Windows players found to be a ruthless decision on their part. While Overkill did address this almost a week later, the issues with matchmaking still persist, making players wary of the company, and [[https://www.overkillsoftware.com/news/2023/06/payday-2-matchmaking-crude-awakening-heist-delay/ their reasoning for breaking Linux support]] came off as [[CrypticallyUnhelpfulAnswer vague and unhelpful]]. |
| 264 | * ToughActToFollow: |
| 265 | ** Big Bank, Hotline Miami, and Hoxton Breakout jobs are widely considered to be the best jobs in the game and all three came out back to back. The next job, White Xmas, was released for free so it dodged most of the heat (on top of having a potentially ''very'' high payout), but when the next paid DLC, The Diamond, came out, it was quickly blasted for not living up to the epic scale of the other three, being derided as 'too easy' and 'not worth the price.' |
| 266 | ** An inverted case with Car Shop. It was released just before the much-anticipated Hoxton Revenge, which would finish the story arc started by Hoxton Breakout. Car Shop itself was hyped up due to the ability to actually drive and steal cars. When it was released however, it was found that the driving mechanic was difficult at best, there was a time limit on the driving portion, and the overall payout was minuscule for the amount of effort (similar to the Art Gallery). This actually dampened some of the expectations for Hoxton Revenge, which while not having as big of a payout as its predecessor, was still considered a decent heist, especially compared to Car Shop. |
| 267 | ** Update #157 tweaked Car Shop to make it somewhat more bearable; the computer hacking only take a minute, a vent was added to the upper office, guards will no longer patrol the offices nor will they move towards the office to investigate a computer in progress of hacking, and the one outside the manager's office on higher difficulties was removed. |
| 268 | ** The Border Crossing heist isn't looked upon favorably in comparison to other heists. While the heist being made was understandable from a financial viewpoint[[note]]''VideoGame/RaidWorldWarII'' being a flop, the aftermath of the investigations on Starbreeze, ''and'' the failure of ''VideoGame/OverkillsTheWalkingDead'', all of which lead Overkill to make more content for Payday to keep the company afloat.[[/note]], Border Crossing was heavily criticized for being mostly a rehash of many previous assets (the American side was using assets borrowed from Big Oil and Rats, and the Mexican side was very obviously using assets from both Firestarter and Optimal-Day 2 of Big Oil in every inch of the map). This didn't stop some from buying the new DLC in hopes of Overkill improving their financial situation, and while the San Martin Bank Heist still has ''some'' reused assets (from Big Bank, the same computers are used, along with the vault, and even the Beast drill being reused), it was significantly less noticeable (assets were retextured for a start) and was mostly agreed to be a drastic improvement in terms of level originality and the fun factor, with the only main complaint being the poor performance. |
| 269 | * TrollingCreator: When responding to fanmail and Q&A's, Almir Listo has a habit of responding to certain questions with ";)" [[TeasingCreator simply to rile up the community.]] |
| 270 | * UnintentionalUncannyValley: Despite the character models being more realistic than in VideoGame/PAYDAYTheHeist, some characters, [[https://i.ytimg.com/vi/vei_btofEqs/maxresdefault.jpg especially the bank tellers, look like reanimated corpses]] with their [[ThousandYardStare blank stares.]] |
| 271 | * WinBackTheCrowd: Crimefest 2015 left a huge black mark on Overkill due to the introduction of microtransactions after promising they would not put them in the game and then not responding to the initial outrage. Several months later, Overkill apologized for making a huge mistake and not communicating properly with its fans while promising to make up for their mistakes. No one believed them at first, but Overkill had taken action on their word. To date, Overkill had done the following, which has won over many disgruntled fans: |
| 272 | ** Added more developers to the forums to keep an open communication between the dev team and the players. |
| 273 | ** Made all drills and skins after the release of the Bodhi safe completely free (all drills and safes before that still require drills and are still on the Steam market). |
| 274 | ** Released a heist that lets you drive motorcycles and rob a train. Rust was introduced as a new playable character and is voiced by Creator/RonPerlman. |
| 275 | ** Released modding tools allowing players to create custom gun skins and share them online as well as add Steam Workshop for weapon skins. |
| 276 | ** Remade the skill trees so that players could get more desirable skills instead of having to [[EmptyLevels take garbage skills to reach the more favorable ones]]. |
| 277 | ** Rebalanced all the guns. |
| 278 | ** Updated the visuals on all of the player characters to give them a cleaner and sharper look. |
| 279 | ** Added more advanced graphics options in-game for players to use, with some features being things players always asked for, and some features other players wanted to turn off. |
| 280 | ** Added more community weapons that can be used for free instead being gated behind paid DLC. |
| 281 | ** Made the 2016 Crimefest (Hoxton's Housewarming Party) without any challenges or unlocks, opting to just release pure free content for everyone. Said content includes new guns, new masks, the return of the Panic Room heist, the customizeable safehouse they'd been promising for three years at that point, more difficulty levels, a new enemy type, and more. Future Spring and Crimefest events have more or less followed the same model by simply releasing free content without challenges or unlocks.[[note]]With the exception of optional riddles during the 2017 Crimefest to get mostly-cosmetic-only "Reinforced Frames" for several weapons for free before they could be unlocked at the end of a heist or bought with Continental Coins.[[/note]] |
| 282 | ** Removed the DLC packs in favour of releasing the (much cheaper) Ultimate Edition, which includes every DLC for Payday 2 except for two upcoming character packs, including the [[WebVideo/{{h3h3productions}} Ethan and Hila]] one. |
| 283 | ** Added a free grenade launcher comparable to the [=GL40=] (a secondary weapon) as a Christmas gift for 2017. |
| 284 | [[/folder]] |
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