This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
From YKTTW Working Title: Sensible Heroes Skimpy Villains
Machiavellienne: Rather than constantly editing back and forth, why not find a better picture? That one is a poor demonstration of the trope anyway. Nobody is going to look at a picture of two smiling children in a brightly lit field and say "Oh yes, they're obviously the heroes because they're dressed sensibly." I vote for a side by side comparison of Rinoa and Ultimecia.
Dragon Quest Z: I couldn't find a better picture of the heroes that fit the trope, but I'm not sure Rinoa fits the sensible part as well as others might.
Duckay: The edit war is getting a bit ridiculous. Consider this picture
◊ of Rinoa and this picture
◊ of Ultimecia. Rinoa is far from prudish, but her outfit is still considerably less skimpy than Ultimecia's. It's a much better example than the kids in the meadow(?).
Machiavellienne: Agreed. Also, if Rinoa/Ultimecia isn't a good example of this trope then Final Fantasy should be pulled from the list of examples. Frankly, given that this is a visual trope, its a little strange that there is any difficulty at all finding a picture that everyone can agree on.
Dragon Quest Z: I'll see what I can do, but the picture stays up until I make a new one.
Machiavellienne: Well, I won't delete it, but there's not much you can do to stop anyone else from removing it.
Dragon Quest Z: I'd put it back. That's what I meant. And the reason isn't the picture as much as trogga pretending there is an image guideline that isn't there.
Jack Slack: What about this?
◊. And this
◊? Pretty textbook, I'd argue.
Duckay: I've subbed out the old picture for a new one of Rinoa and Ultimecia. If you really don't like it, you can change it back.
Machiavellienne: Yay, problem solved, lets all go to bed.
Dragon Quest Z: Not quite. I feel the best picture for comparison would be a full body pic of rinoa, preferably a concept art, but I can't seem to find one. Can anyone show me where I can use one for this?
Machiavellienne: I have put the Final Fantasy picture back. Its one thing to want to replace it with a better one, but why remove it entirely while you're searching? Thats just odd.
Seriously Dragon Quest Z, what is your deal? That picture caused an edit war. Multiple people agreed that it was a poor choice. A better alternative was provided, which you have a tiny quibble with. Why would you use a picture that caused an edit war as a placeholder when there is an alternative that several people agree on?
Dragon Quest Z: The replacement was poor. It was zoomed out of ultimecia, so it didn't really get the skimpy part across. The point is to illustrate the trope, not just show two characters. Now the picture I put up shows the relevant parts of the characters' clothes related to the trope. See what I mean?
Machiavellienne: My beef wasn't with your decision to change Duckay's picture, it was with your decision to put your original picture back while you found one of your own. Duckay's could have stayed in the meantime- it was unnecessarily rude to remove the picture like that, when the main reason the picture was to be changed was because your original picture was embroiled in an edit war. And changing a picture one time with a valid reason is not 'trying to start an edit war'.
Dragon Quest Z: No, an edit war is not a reason to change a picture. If those who want a new picture have a more valid reason to change it, that is a reason, not the edit war itself. I changed it because it didn't quite get the sensible part down right, but the replacement didn't get either across. It was actually worse. That's why I put it back. If it was a better replacement, I would have left it alone and been glad I didn't have to keep searching for a good Rinoa pic.
Machiavellienne: The reasons for changing the picture were more extensive than simply the edit issue, and are discussed above, and were agreed on by multiple people. This is a wiki. It is supposed to be based on building a consensus, and the consensus was that Duckay's picture was a better demonstration of the trope than your picture. Its beginning to feel like you don't want other people making edits to your trope.
Duckay: Alright. The current FF 8 pic is an improvement over the original page picture, so I suggest we drop it now.
Dragon Quest Z: "and the consensus was that Duckay's picture was a better demonstration of the trope than your picture" Wrong. The consensus was just to change. Only you were insisting the new picture was better. Duckay even wrote that I could change it back if I didn't like it. And I didn't like it because it didn't show the trope well. If it did, I would have left it.
