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Discussion History VideoGame / FableI

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[006] ading Current Version
16th Jun '11 at 09:08:48 AM
Changed line(s) 5 from:
n
1.The character must personally commit actions that are truly heinous by the standards of the story, which makes no attempt to gloss these over or present them in a positive light. Offstage Villainy doesn\'t count; the story has to show the actions, not imply them. Actions that become inconsequential through Negative Continuity don\'t count either. A Complete Monster is implied to have crossed the Moral Event Horizon either during the story or long before it, but a character can cross the Moral Event Horizon without necessarily being a Complete Monster.
to:
1. The character must personally commit actions that are truly heinous by the standards of the story, which makes no attempt to gloss them over or present them in a positive light. OffstageVillainy doesn\\\'t count; the story has to show the actions, not imply them. Actions that become inconsequential through Negative Continuity don\\\'t count either. A Complete Monster is implied to have crossed the MoralEventHorizon either during the story or long before it, but a character can cross the MoralEventHorizon without necessarily being a Complete Monster.
Changed line(s) 7 from:
n
Well, she steals Ariel voice, hoping that she will fail to get her man and become part of her collection so she can bargin her for the trident to rule the ocean. That all sounds CompleteMonster-ish on paper yes. But remember that she \'\'never actually does\'\' any of this stuff. A CompleteMonster needs to walk into a story. I\'m going to vote no on this one.
to:
Well, she steals Ariel voice, hoping that she will fail to get her man and become part of her collection so she can bargain her for the trident to rule the ocean. That all sounds CompleteMonster-ish on paper yes. But remember that she \\\'\\\'never actually does\\\'\\\' any of this stuff. A CompleteMonster needs to walk into a story. I\\\'m going to vote no on this one.
Changed line(s) 9 from:
n
2.The character\'s terribleness must be played seriously at all times, evoking fear, revulsion and/or hatred from the other characters in the story. If there are other villains around who aren\'t this trope, they are afraid of/dislike this person, too — Even Evil Has Standards, after all (and in particularly disturbing stories with particularly evil villains, even lesser Complete Monsters may fear such a character). If they\'re Played for Laughs, the character is usually just Evilly Affable at worst, but can still be one if done right. If the character is not taken seriously at all, they fail to qualify.
to:
2. The character\\\'s terribleness must be played seriously at all times, evoking fear, revulsion and/or hatred from the other characters in the story. If there are other villains around who aren\\\'t this trope, they are afraid of/dislike this person, too — EvenEvilHasStandards, after all (and in particularly disturbing stories with particularly evil villains, even lesser {{Complete Monster}}s may fear such a character). If they\\\'re PlayedForLaughs, the character is usually just EvillyAffable at worst, but can still be one if done right. If the character is not taken seriously at all, they fail to qualify.
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT {{Complete Monster}}s. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Flotsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT {{Complete Monster}}s. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo has a song, but it is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor Unfortunate Souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Flotsam and Jetsam\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a KarmaHoudini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a HappyEnding is a KarmicDeath, a FateWorseThanDeath, or at the very least removal from the story. A HeelFaceTurn, even of the RedemptionEqualsDeath variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do the other two later.
[005] ading
1st Jun '11 at 06:23:45 PM
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT {{Complete Monster}}s. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo\\\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor unfortuneate souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Floatsam and Jetsem\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a Karma Houdini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a Happy Ending is a Karmic Death, a Fate Worse than Death or at the very least removal from the story. A Heel Face Turn, even of the Redemption Equals Death variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do ther other two later
[004] Slicer37
30th May '11 at 08:02:08 AM
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo\\\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor unfortuneate souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Floatsam and Jetsem\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a Karma Houdini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a Happy Ending is a Karmic Death, a Fate Worse than Death or at the very least removal from the story. A Heel Face Turn, even of the Redemption Equals Death variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do ther other two later
[003] Slicer37
29th May '11 at 02:24:42 PM
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her to. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo\\\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor unfortuneate souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Floatsam and Jetsem\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a Karma Houdini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a Happy Ending is a Karmic Death, a Fate Worse than Death or at the very least removal from the story. A Heel Face Turn, even of the Redemption Equals Death variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do ther other two later.
[002] Slicer37
29th May '11 at 02:23:53 PM
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her to. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her too. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo\\\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor unfortuneate souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Floatsam and Jetsem\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a Karma Houdini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a Happy Ending is a Karmic Death, a Fate Worse than Death or at the very least removal from the story. A Heel Face Turn, even of the Redemption Equals Death variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do ther other two later.
[001] Slicer37
29th May '11 at 02:23:08 PM
Changed line(s) 11 from:
n
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her to. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\'s \'\'comical\'\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\'s. Frollo\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actuallt scared of \
to:
Again, at first she seems to qualify. But remeber the Reason Shan-yu was taken off this page. If there are other villians around, they must dislike her to. Floatsam and Jetsam are definatly NOT CompleteMonsters. Yet they respect her. Plus, she\\\'s \\\'\\\'comical\\\'\\\'. Look at the villian songs, in paticular Frollo\\\'s. Frollo\\\'s has a song, but is dark, heavy, and terrifiying. Was anyone over the age of 8 actually scared of \\\"Poor unfortuneate souls\\\"? No. It\\\'s funny. No Check.

There is no adequate justification or Freudian Excuse to balance out the misdeeds. That is to say, while there may be a sad backstory present, it must in no way be able to excuse the heinous evil deeds the character commits.

Check.

Characters that fit this trope must be completely devoid of altruistic qualities. By the same token, they must show no regret for their crimes regardless of how horrible they may be. It is more fitting for the CM to enjoy the devastation created by their actions but complete indifference toward it will suffice.

Remeber Ursala\\\'s VillianiousBreakdown? It happened directly after Floatsam and Jetsem\\\'s death. She showed sadness and regret that they died. No check.

Most importantly, the character must have no chance of redemption, at least not without being considered a Karma Houdini. The only way the story could come to anything resembling a Happy Ending is a Karmic Death, a Fate Worse than Death or at the very least removal from the story. A Heel Face Turn, even of the Redemption Equals Death variety, is out of the question, and nobody would believe it if it happened.

She could have done one, but it would have been really stupid and fake-sounding. Check.

2/5. Ursala is NOT a CompleteMonster.

I\\\'ll do ther other two later.

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