Constellation related magic system two: Electric boogaloo

Okay I have a constellation thing that is related to a novel I'm currently writing (and not the Astratherion setting WIP which was the reason I made a similar thread long ago)

Ahem, I want to group some constellations into nice even parts of 11 each for a magic system, that's loosely inspired by Final Fantasy XIV's Astralogian job. Focusing on all the Earth constellations in the from of metallic cards.

The cards are organized in 8 decks of 11 each plus a special twelfth card. These decks correspond to an element (Fire, Ice, Lightning, Earth,, Wind, Water Light and Darkness) and a not-quite counterpart of the Solar Systems planets excluding Earth but including Pluto. Also included is a special twelve card that is universal and correpsodns to a cosntelaltion the user is attuned with, and a Wild Card used in case their native deck is the one drawn for the day.

I make the thread to ask what constellations seem to the closest to one of the eight planets, or their namesake gods in terms of flavor or symbolism. One deck is already made by way of necessity. The list currently goes as

• Lightning ("Jupiter"): Sagittarius, Saggita, Aquila, Cygnus, Lyra, Lepus, Retciculum, Crux, Hercules, Lacerta, Norma,
• Fire ("Mars"): Aries, Ursa Major, Ursa Minor, Draco, Phoenix, Fornax, Scutum, Cepheus, Auriga, Ara, Canes Venatici,
• Earth ("Saturn"): Capricorn, Ophiuchus, Serpens, Musca, Orion, Puppis, Mensa, Indus, Sculptor, Coma Berneces, Bootes,
• Ice ("Mercury"): Gemini, Virgo, Hydra, Sextans, Perseus, Equuleus, Grus, Cassiopeia, Triangulum Australe, Pyxis, Vulpecula,
• Water ("Neptune"): Aquarius, Leo, Leo Minor, Eridanus, Dorado, Hydrus, Carina, Triangulum, Tucana, Microscopium, Andromeda,
• Wind ("Uranus"): Cancer, Pisces, Piscis Austrinus, Caelum, Vela, Indus, Pegasus, Horolorgium, Canus Major, Canus Minor, Antila,
• Light ("Venus"): Taurus, Libra, Chamaeleon, Columba, Monoceros, Pictor, Corona Borelais, Octans, Pavo, Telescopium,
• Darkness ("Pluto"): Scorpio, Cetus, Corona Australis, Delphinus, Lupus, Corvus, Lynx, Crater, Crcinus, Camelopardalis, Apus,

(FTR the zodiac ones were derived from the Domiciles (specifially the old ones). The basis of the post can be seen as applying the idea to all the constellations instead of just the Zodiac) The Sun and Moon are excluded here and had been replaced with Uranus and Neptune. I had also included most paired constellations with their partner ones for simplicity's sake, which means that Leo/Leo minor, Pisces/Piscis Austrinus, Sagitta{rius}, Ursa Major/Minor, Canis Major/Minor (Canes Venatici will be the exception) and Ophiuchus/Serpens will be lumped in their respective cohorts.

The last thing to note is that I also also slotted in Ursa Major and Crux as well as the two Parazodiac Constellations Ophiuchus and Cetus with the zodiac ones for a even staring number of 2 per element each (this is important the sixteen signs determines which deck you get for the day and I wanted two per deck for consistency's sake) Most of the list is in flux, but the ones set in stone are the zodiac and related cosntelaltions (by precedent), Ophiuchus, Crux, the Bears and Cetus (by necessity), Musca (character related reasons), and Lyra and Recticulum (story related reasons.

The teal deer is that I'm trying to conjure up a 8 lists of 11 constellations each that thematically fit a given element or planet and need help with that.

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Dec 20th 2023 at 7:19:57 AM

Hmm...

A meta-thought: could you not perhaps compile a list of constellations, and then go through them one-by-one, assigning them as seems fitting? Then, should the split be uneven, rework a few to get your desired numbers?

Otherwise, I have two questions:

First, why is Mercury associated with ice? It is, after all, one of the hottest of the planets in the solar system.

And second, why is Draco associated with lightning? A quick look at the Wikipedia page on it doesn't suggest such an association to me. Rather, being a dragon I might think of fire, or—from one of the stories about the sign—perhaps ice.

Finally, some thoughts towards Orion's inclusion:

On the one hand, Orion was associated by the Egyptians with Osiris, a deity of the underworld. Thus perhaps Orion might fit into either the "Darkness" or "Earth" deck.

On the other hand, to the Greeks he was a mighty hunter; perhaps then he might fit into either the "Earth" or "Fire" deck.

So, between the two, let me suggest "Earth" for Orion.

I had to fit Ice into soemthing and Mercury and Neptune were the only planets that seem associated with water even if mostly off the back of Sailor Moon

Though that does have me thinking I should look into the JP names of the planets as I'm pretty sure that language used "Element+Star" as the naming convention.

I had added Draco to fire and Orion to Earth. among other things if you want to check the edited OP. (including separating the Argonavis parts)

EDIT: found a possible source Apparently Mercury is named "Water Star" in Japan because it allegedly has ice on its surface.

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Dec 17th 2023 at 9:56:32 AM

I think you should shift alignments of "Fire" and "Ice" between "Mercury" and "Mars".

Mercury is almost literally burning hot as hellfire in its position.

While there is actual ice on Mars and ice itself can "burn" through frostbite in its own way.

I just think this change would make it fit better for those two.

There a few issues (even disregarding what I had found and added in the edit of my previous post.)

• I mainly work on either classical or Japanese associations depending on which makes the appropriate holes for the element pegs. While switching the two would not get in the way of that there are other issues.
• Mars is named after the god of war, and warfare brings to mind images of fury, wrath and tempers that fits the fire imagery more (also its red, something that is more typically associated with flame then grey or blue despite blue flames being hotter)
• You can argue that I should be more literal here but that runs into a redundancy issue as Neptune also lays claim to the element of water (king of the seas remember) and while Hermes here is more associated with wind...so is Uranus
• BUT...What is the sky if not out space, and what is space is not stereotyped as a freezing void despite what the science says? I'll consider looking into switching Mercury and Uranus's elements here.

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Dec 17th 2023 at 10:09:04 AM

Doesn't ice symbolize "hatred" since hatred is cold as ice and can consume us if not controlled?

Also, Mercury is gray on the surface which is closer to ash than ice, from the looks of it.

Edited by Trainbarrel on Dec 17th 2023 at 7:18:08 PM

Okay, I managed to make a preliminary list. 8 sublists, 11 different cosntelaltiosn each. The OP is now edited with those lists. Feel free to scrutinize

Ah, fair enough. That is, perhaps, one of the potential pitfalls of connecting two systems like this: they might not match all that well, and some shoehorning may be called for. As I said, fair enough.

Good good! ^_^

Well done on getting so much done! ^_^

Hmm... Based on a quick look, why are Cancer and Pisces associated with Wind? They're both water-signs, and moreover depict aquatic creatures, after all.

A thought: Why not swap the elemental associations of Uranus and Mercury?

After all, Mercury is associated with fairly airy things—speed, communication, etc, and associated with a deity who bore wings.

Conversely, Uranus the actual planet is placed far out in the chilly reaches of the solar system. And indeed, according to Wikipedia, "The planet's atmosphere has a complex layered cloud structure and has the lowest minimum temperature of 49 K (−224 °C; −371 °F) out of all the Solar System's planets".

[edit] I might also suggest that Telescopium better fits under Light than Wind.

Edited by ArsThaumaturgis on Dec 17th 2023 at 10:06:12 PM

As mentioned before I am considering the option.

I want to keep it under Uranus for now more so for what the deity is and what the purpose of the telescopes are. You use the things to look at the sky, and Uranus is named after the titan of the sky. At least that is the reasoning.

Also wanted to have one deck have at least one of the "mundane object" La Bayle constellations

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Dec 17th 2023 at 1:15:30 AM

Fixed the typo in the thread title.

Ah, sorry, I may have missed that! ^^;

Fair enough, then! Consider my suggestion as support for the idea!

Hmm... But you're not really associating it with the sky—at least not the stellar parts thereof—but (currently) with "Wind"—i.e. the specifically-atmospheric parts of the sky.

And I'd argue that even in looking at celestial bodies, a telescope does so by magnifying light.

I mean, it can still be included, just under a different planet.

Perhaps you could swap it with Horologium, under the logic that time is a thing that flows like the wind.

I'll look into those later. Thanks for your suggestions

Bumping to say I switched the telescope and clock as per your suggestion.

Good good! I'm glad if I helped! ^_^